Avatar, Great Achievement, or a Liberal/Communist Indoctrination Campaign?

BTW, why do you have part of Hitler's Mein Kampf as your signature?

Do you agree with it?..


[edit on 22-12-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Well thats where we diverge-

Money is power, power is not money

Have the elite not amassed capital, to create more capital which only consolidate the power created thru such holdings?

These fortunes of the elites you speak of have been amassed by using their capital to gain more capital. I some cases centuries, thru imperialism and the very constructs of our system, mass production, absorbing more assets which in turn provides a larger portion of control to these elites. I see a very different reality... You can trace these fortunes to the industrial era and the wars created to generate more business. I do not see the practical merits in communism, however I do not see the modern fortunes being born of socialism.
If this were true would you not protest the elites protection and utilization of corporate shadows? The very tool that has allowed for such consolidation of power is the unbridled ability to AMASS as much capital as humanly possible, not a tenet of socialism. Only in a capitalist world can an individual or family earn and consolidate the resources possible to overtake the producing power of whole nations of individuals.

So I am confused as to the logic - on many fronts EU

answer me this with a yes or no

Do you think the elites became elite using socialist mechanisms?

I don't think you can, while maintaining intellectual honesty.

The capitalist system can be perverted just like any system and if you maintain this system was flawed in the early part of last century why back a system that has been so perverted? And if this country is on the march to socialism why does the US consistently remove socialist governments, with Black or funding of subversive armies?
Like I said why, knock out so many receptive comrades...

I think man is perverted myself, I think America is meant to be a constant struggle, without such we are doomed to walk off a cliff mandated by the bills of corporate robber barons or the limitations of a blotted government.



[edit on 22-12-2009 by Janky Red]

[edit on 22-12-2009 by Janky Red]

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
BTW, why do you have part of Hitler's Mein Kampf as your signature?

Do you agree with it?..


[edit on 22-12-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

". But as in economic life, the able men cannot be appointed from above, but must struggle through for themselves…"
"The main plank in the Nationalist Socialist program is to abolish the liberalistic concept of the individual and the Marxist concept of humanity and to substitute for them the folk community, rooted in the soil and bound together by the bond of its common blood."

So it is in peoples faces, sort of like the movie you are querying about

Nope I would have been on the line, then and there, dead on many counts

do you?


[edit on 22-12-2009 by Janky Red]

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Me? An Obama supporter?



By the way... what do you think of labor laws or anti-trust laws? More importantly, what about the success of the worker cooperative, such as the Indian Coffee Houses, Suma Wholefoods, etc?

If anyones been on youtube today youll see this

www.youtube.com...


its alex jones talking about the movie, and its one of the few times i disagree with him. I dont think he realises that we as a species are arseholes. were predatory creatures and being that as well as how evolved we are, we take what we want and leave. Sure, i see what hes saying and how hes proving it with all the docuemnts. But i think its pretty un-justified to be pulling it on for the movie.

I found it interesting that we referred to the natives as savages and they referred to us as infants or child like.

I saw no commy ideas in the movie, I did see the struggle between modern civilization and tribal lifestyles. possible the growing green movement vs industrialization.

Very good movie first movie in a long time that lives upto the hype.

Originally posted by gdeed

And will it be you that runs it properly?

Communism is a fool’s game. Humans will never treat each other equally and to believe otherwise is naive to say the very least.
Who will create and build things if there is no incentive, no payback? Who will do the dirty and hard work?

How do you know ? Everything is possible

If you are greedy , selfish capitalist it doesn't mean that whole world is like that.

Originally posted by PunksNotDead

Originally posted by gdeed

And will it be you that runs it properly?

Communism is a fool’s game. Humans will never treat each other equally and to believe otherwise is naive to say the very least.
Who will create and build things if there is no incentive, no payback? Who will do the dirty and hard work?

How do you know ? Everything is possible

If you are greedy , selfish capitalist it doesn't mean that whole world is like that.

The whole world is not like that but the communist certainly are greedy, selfish, lazy, killers, and destroyers of freedom. No political system has killed more people cause more misery and heartache, than Communism. It's all in the history books, the books that the lefties haven't been able to rewrite "yet".

Oh jeebuz cripes riding a tricked out big wheel!

Is there ANY person or group alive that conservatives disagree with that ISN'T a Nazi or a Communist?

I'm thinking that Avatar is an implementation of the technology hinted at with this recent mind control related interview. 216.18.197.202...

I don't view it as a bad thing at all. Avatar is a hint at reality that the bad bad guys have actively suppressed for generation. It's a step towards removing the brainwashing.

I'm not gonna read ten pages to post my views, so here they are:

Avatar promotes a new look at the evils of Capitalism and the rediculousness of war. PERFECT timing in our changing world; I think this movie alone could change the mind of an entire generation to be more compassionate and start making steps to reduce war and greed.

My new favorite movie

This movie is pure propaganda and nothing but. Why? Because the entire movie would be over in a new york second if the story setup was politically and militarily accurate. Notice how every darn one of you jumped at the agreement that the movie “highlights the evils of Corporate Greed.” What a bunch of hogwash.

If China wanted the resources of the planet they would not have spent years of research trying to infiltrate the colony. Instead, they would have gassed the entire colony with various chemicals and then sprayed the area with Agent Orange, DDT, and Periquat from space. The so called "Tribal's" would all be dead in a matter of minuets or days. In less than a week, the minerals harvesting platforms (pre-built for the site) would be lowered in place. There would be no movie at all except watching a bunch of blue things dying all over the planet.

If unadulterated corporate greed were in charge of the operation then they would have released multiple biological viruses in the area until they found a strain that worked for about 80 percent of the population. Then, once the survivors regrouped and contained themselves in a much smaller targetable area then multiple chemical gas attacks would be used that would again eliminate another 90 percent of the survivors. The ten or so remaining survivors be systematically eliminated one by one by orbiting automated laser platforms.

The point is that these little blue creatures wouldn't have a chance in hell if this setup were real. From space, they would have been entirely eliminated in less than a week. This movie is nothing but pure propaganda on another world in order to garner sentiment for a pullout from the other occupied "Traibal" areas of Iraq and Afghanistan. They want you to feel sorry for the people and places that the U.S. (White Man) run military is “Forcibly occupying”. But instead of coming out and saying, “We want to leave Iraq and Afganistan” they instead try to instill feelings of “Awww those poor people” in you by trickery, slight of hand, and loose associations. They want you clamoring to leave Iraq in order to give them the political "capital" to spend in doing so.

Are you fools? “Corporate Greed is bad”. Are you listening to yourselves? There is no such thing as corporate greed. There is only “Your” greed. That's right, you. Corporations fulfill “Your” wants. “You” want to drive a car to work because its too far away from where “You” choose to live. “You” want to be able to buy a car with what you can afford to spend (which isn't a lot). Are you over 500 dollars in Credit card debt? Then guess what, corporations do what they do because of “You”.

Do you want to save the poor tribals? Then give up your home, your electricity, your car and become a tribal yourself and then there will not be corporations out there to screw over other tribal's to fulfill “Your” wants, not needs, "Wants".

The corporation in this case sacraficed hundreds of human beings lives in order to "relocate" these tribals. This is generally called a humanitarian mission. Do you for one second think that a true "Militaristic Communist" or "Greedy Global Capitalist" would for one second waste thier time "moving" someone when they could more easily eliminate them? Of course not!

Don't be fooled with the lie. This movie is pure propaganda designed to garner your support in "feeling sorry" for the "Tribal" people of Afganistan and Iraq, who after years of telling us, "Please don't go" somehow by default immediatly want us to leave thier countries. Wake up people! The government and party politics is manipulating you through cleverly designed movies and television. Did you honestly think that the biggest budget movie of the year would not be about govenment, money, and politics?

[edit on 24-12-2009 by Hot_Wings]

Ya know I must say I took my 11 year old to see this and not one, during the movie, did I think of Afghanistan or the Green Conspiracy. Artisist (for lack of a better term) absorb what is around them when they create so have no doubt lots of this stuff was relevant when Cameron was making this but, in all honesty, we have heard of this film for the pat ten years and the script has not changed all that much to account for the Afghanistan stuff or Al Gore.

I tend to think that Cameron had Buck Rodgers and Pocahantas in mind when he wrote this way more than he did Iraq orwhatever.

Sometimes a movie is just a movie.

Hmmm, James Cameron himself believes in AGW, and seems like a bit of a douche, but Avatar was AWESOME, and I totally agree with the message for the most part.

Originally posted by Hot_Wings
This movie is pure propaganda and nothing but. Why? Because the entire movie would be over in a new york second if the story setup was politically and militarily accurate. Notice how every darn one of you jumped at the agreement that the movie “highlights the evils of Corporate Greed.” What a bunch of hogwash.

Like Vietnam was the past. Avatar is the future.
A movie only made by a man who payed close attention.
By trial and error we learn.
But we have to learn sometime..

By the time similar things like in the Avatar movie are close to happen we will have already become Corporate Earth, not simply Corporate [insert country name here].
What? I hear some people say, but the Apocalypse will happen first, or the end of the world will come, or 2012, or whatever.
People can't help but to think the easy way out, always.
I ques we still have a loooong way to.

That time were Blue giants at their own planet kicking the humans out.
How deep. How ironic.
We might have become what we once hated.
Another polluted civilization is what we are.
Nobody knows where this chain will brake for the good of us all.
So many things out there and nobody has a damn clue of what is happening, who and where we really are.

[edit on 24-12-2009 by spacebot]

I've seen alot of opinions posted on political blogs and facebook on how the movie should be boycotted by conservatives because the main character is a traitor who kills fellow humans and even worse, kills fellow American soldiers all for some blue smurf tail he started banging. Couple that with the tree-hugger "one with nature" (literally) vibe & it's a pro neo-liberal conservative's nightmare propaganda film. I even saw one post saying that this movie encourages young American soldiers who doubt our mission in Iraq and Afghanistan to join the Muslim insurgents. They miss the fact that the insurgents blow themselves up killing mostly other Muslims and do not have ultra sexy blue elven looking women who walk around half naked and who are awesome warrior-maidens. If they had those, American soldiers would be deserting by the hundreds to join the Taliban. lol

But... on the other hand, I've heard other libertarian leaning conservatives who are more the Montana/Texas rancher types and avid fishermen and hunters who in fact very much loved the film's pro-environment theme and they believe that it represents anti-big government/big corporation. They also thought that it ultimately represents freedom loving people who will fight to the death to defend freedom, their way of life, and their God given natural resources (even if it is some nature Godess).

So I find it fascinating personally how various types of conservatives interpret such a film and in fact I appreciate the diversity amongst conservatives for this reason.
Also anyone who says this film is a "pacifist" film is out of their mind. The amazing battle scene at the end is a glorious battle worthy of the best war movies. There is nothing pacifist about this film. It's all about using violence to fight to the death for a worthy cause using an ancient storytelling template found in all cultures. That is the Messiah story.
For that reason, while not original, the story works for most people and cultures. Also the idiots who say the film is racist because some of the characters have dreadlocks are stupid beyond stupid. They need to go look up the history of dreadlocks.
en.wikipedia.org...

The Spartans for example were famous for having dreadlocks but the first known example was with the Egyptians. It's simply a very cool hair style.
The Native American thing is yeah...kinda obvious in their language and war whoops and hollering (and one with the earth noble savage vibe), but I doubt you'll find too many Native Americans complaining about the film. Hell I saw the movie "Wind Talkers" praised heavily at a regional pow-wow even though I thought it was one of the most horrible films depicting native Americans that I've ever seen. If it's in any way pro-enviornment, pro-indigenous land rights, they'll give it a big thumbs up.

So what it comes down to is that I guess the movie will tell you and others alot about yourself depending on how you feel about it regardless if you are liberal or conservative.

No on to the military parts... the giant main dragon gunship was freak'n amazing. The scene of the ex-Marine Colonel dropping out of it through the flaming wreckege in his mech suit ranked a solid 10 in pure bad-assness. The formations used looked believable with a mech squad leader quipping for soldiers to maintain better spacing and moving soldiers into a line formation upon contact. Even if it's science fiction, I like to see good military tactics used in a film depicting battles as such things will never change as long as humans are going to war with each other or other things.
So all in all I thought it was a great movie for people who like both military stuff and sci-fi.
But if you hate tree-huggers, new age nature worship stuff, and are more the TEAM AMERICA God fearing Christian type, then, yeah you will probably hate this movie with a passion and see it as a sign of America's morale collapse caused by the anti-christ known as Obama and the Clinto minions.

I'm pretty sure it was just a crap movie, and not much else

Look.

There is little difference between capitalism and communism:
- both are imperialistic
- both are elitist (small group of people at the top) and hierarchical
- both are using money
- both use propaganda machines to indoctrinate people
- both use military power to invade, occupy and exploit
- both use human labor for achieving their imperialistic goals.

Edited to add the following:
I am absolutely against these type of movies because:
- they market violence and conflict as inevitable and DO NOT teach to bridge differences between tribes, civilizations and different life forms
- they market monetary and profit system as inevitable part of the future - there will be no money in future - money is a sign of poverty
- they program to see technology as a tool for destruction - not as a tool for the betterment of society.

=================

I want to cry when I see those messages.


[edit on 2-1-2010 by FIFIGI]

History has proven the dominant culture will always subjugate the weaker.
War is eminent on earth as long as there are different cultures, religions, and political powers that rule them.In the end one world power will rule,tell then war will rule.

Originally posted by flyingfish
History has proven the dominant culture will always subjugate the weaker.
War is eminent on earth as long as there are different cultures, religions, and political powers that rule them.In the end one world power will rule,tell then war will rule.

This is called a selection for power. That is true - this has shaped the history of humanity.

However humans have other capacities that are surpressed:
- creativity - invention can be another option if there is a need for power
- love unconditional - instead of focusing on Self human beeings are capable to prioratise and care about others
- cooperation - instead of individualism (capitalism, free market...). When cooperating anmd teamworking, people can achieve more than in isolation

=================

If people would be trained to use these capabilities and not see themselves in fractions (idelogical, religious, racial, eceonmic, nationalistic...), but as One race... as connected deeply to all living things, then the future will be different from what you are saying.