The Pagan Origin Of Christmas: Jesus Was Not Born On December 25th But Some Pagan Gods were!

reply to post by DataWraith


Friday is from Frigg- Frigg day
Sunday from the sun, and monday from the moon.

reply to post by octotom

Why do people think it's such a big thing to "debunk" Christ's being born on December 25th? There is virtually no church that teaches that.

Come on now Tom, a few years ago I could have taken a video camera to almost every school,sunday school ,church chapel etc across this country and record little children being "Taught" that Jesus was born on xmas day 25th December.

I was myself brainwashed in this manner, millions of kids across the nation "Lied" to by priests, vicars ,nuns, pastors bishops and teachers.

This is the beginning of the lie that is xtianity and there's no getting away with it, we believed that jesus ws born on the 2th of December because that is what we were told to believe.

Some of us grew up and woke up many still haven't, there was no error no misunderstanding just a downright lie.

reply to post by x2Strongx


This is not really a conspiracy, Most aspects of christianity have alot to do wth Greek Gods. Even Sunday, which is considered to be the christian holy day, Was the day of the Sun God, Apollo.

Interesting but I wouldnt consider it a conspiracy.

I have heard the theory before of the difference between Christ's Birth, and the day of December 25th (As well as how the Catholic church allegedly combined dates in order to sweep the "Pagan" Holiday under the rug, or encourage "Pagan" conversion and acceptance), but the fact remains that no one can factually state that Jesus was not born on that date.

I will always worship Christmas as Jesus' Birth, and whoever this "Nimrod" character is, is honestly of no consequence to me.

Nice find, and an interesting read nonetheless.

reply to post by buds84

I like your use of the Bible here, however, most Christians that I know of don't know anything about Nimrod, nor do they worship him.

I think it's all in what you make of it. A tree can be used for many things. For one, people don't worship the tree. They don't worship Nimrod.

As for the OP, Jesus was likely born around Sept 25-29. These dates are based on the service being performed at the temple by the husband of Elizabeth, who was a cousin of Mary, and who was pregnant with John the Baptist. We can derive a time of year based on that tradition. The tending of the sheep, often used to date the birth in Spring, could easily have been in the Summer or Fall, also.

It's Christmas, so let's just have some fun with it. Every year people pick on the little stuff. Let's quit being so picky, and just enjoy the season. Merry Christmas to you all, even the ones that say it's Xmas.
You know, the people who also write X-tians, etc.

Be nice.

Merry Christmas, moocowman.



[edit on 12/11/2009 by Jim Scott]

Well, I did learn one thing from this thread, and that's what pagan means, I always thought it was something completely different like an old celtic thing.

They never taught jesus' birthday was on the 25th dec in my catholic school, we celebrated it, yes, but as a sort of tradition, nothing else.

reply to post by DaddyBare



I hear you, DaddyBare, I don't like the term either, and I don't care for witch either, it bespeaks too many bad memories for some. We are the Other People. You know, when Adam and Eve's children went out into the world they went to live with the Other People, and that's us. We are those who do not wish to be saved, nor do we wish to join any religious cult. We acknowledge the spirituality of our home planet, and give credence to the four elements which make up most of our human bodies. We know that we are Spirits, that we live in a body, but are not the body, and we live on Earth, but are not of it. We follow the Old Ways because they feel comfortable to us. Why do people label everything anyway? Once the label is applied, the people see only the label, and not the person under the label.

On the Allanah Myles "Beyond" show they were basically saying that the idea of a "santa claus" first started with the Mesopotamian god "Marduk". The god that people used to make child sacrifices too (im no expert by the way in ancient mythologies). She went on to say that eventually Roman culture consumed the Marduk/Chronos worshipping Mesopotamian and Greek cultures and that the Romans later replaced those older gods with Saturn. And she mentioned the Saturnian 3 month festival as well. Make a long story short, when the so called "barbarians" started sacking and invading Rome they brought with them Oden, and soon Oden replaced Saturn and than came St. Nick...and Than Santa Claus. Allanah said over time the image of the chubby bearded man was softened and made pallatable by corporate advertising campaigns (coca cola etc..), the ancient image of Marduk the baby eater was all but forgotten by the 19th century.
Anyways, it was an interesting program. I found it interesting that "Marduk" is supposedly the same god that Alex Jones claims the Bohemian grovers worship during their Cremation of Care ceremonies.

[edit on 11-12-2009 by Inquiring Mind]

It wasn't until A.D. 440 that the church officially proclaimed December 25 as the birth of Christ. This was not based on any religious evidence but on a pagan feast. Saturnalia was a tradition inherited by the Roman pagans from an earlier Babylonian priesthood. December 25 was used as a celebration of the birthday of the sun god. It was observed near the winter solstice.

Yet the Sun gets to its lowest point on December 21st and starts to rise again on December 24th. So, Christ was not born on December 25th, and if it were the birth of the new Sun then Christmas would be the 24th December. So we can see that the Gregorian calendar (Invented by Pope Gregory XIII 24/Feb/1582AD) is not the correct astrological calendar and that our record and perception of time itself has been manipulated for thousands of years.

The names and dates are wrong, we all live a lie and even the common man still thinks that Monday is the start of the week when in fact its actually Sunday but realistically speaking its all a bunch of lies and there really is no concept of time.

Calling yourself a Christian OR a pagan is stupid. Why? Because BOTH religions/cults trace back to Babylon. If your calling yourself a pagan OR a Christian, then you are calling yourself a Babylonian, a follower of Nimrod.

That means you follow Nimrod, and so do the Global elite, why? Because Nimrod was demonic, you are all living a lie. You are all against the New World Order, but you call yourself Christian or Pagan and worship Nimrod with a different name. Strange, very strange.

Life is laughable when you think about it.

[edit on 11/12/2009 by the_denv]

reply to post by x2Strongx


December 25 was Mithras' birthday before it was Jesus'.

Mithras was said to be able to perform miracles and be bourn of a virgin, sound similar??

Also Mithras' had as many followers as did Christianity by 325AD.

Originally posted by andy1033
The only pagan god born on christmas day was the sun, and thats all it is.

You cannot tell me anything before you where born is truth unless you know for sure with these things.

You DO recognize you did exactly what you told him not to do, right?



I think it's a well-known historical fact that December 25th was stolen from the pagan religions. Just another one of the many falsities Christians don't talk about.

Originally posted by valiant

They never taught jesus' birthday was on the 25th dec in my catholic school, we celebrated it, yes, but as a sort of tradition, nothing else.

When you're a kid and you celebrate someone's birthday - - you do assume its their "birth day".

I don't remember any intent to instruct us otherwise.

reply to post by Annee


I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say to me? I simply stated we were not taught it like it actually was his birthday, we were told otherwise, but still celebrated it out of tradition.

I just don't see the point in your post? did I say anything wrong?





[edit on 12-12-2009 by valiant]

[edit on 12-12-2009 by valiant]

Originally posted by octotom
Why do people think it's such a big thing to "debunk" Christ's being born on December 25th? There is virtually no church that teaches that. It doesn't even mention say it in the Bible. Jesus' birthday is not in anyway integral to Christian doctrine, practice, or life.

Agreed, however most churches teach of Christ's birth at Christmas simply because it is easier than saying 'Christmas is the day the church fathers picked as the day to celebrate the birth of Christ, thus converting a major pagan holiday to a Christian one.'

If you want a culture/people/nation to convert, do you allow them to continue their pagan celebrations or do you inject their new found religion into their existing holidays? It made sense for them to do this 2000 years ago...Not the first time, not the last time. Similarly I found it interesting when I became a Christian how many similarities there are between pagan and other religions and Catholicism...kneeling to icons and statues, prayer beads, holy water and candles, an altar containing a chalice, candles, and incense. They just chose to include things that were familiar to people at the time...no biggy IMO

One quick funny side note, one time in a chapel service at the Christian university I attended, they asked us to write prayers or something down on a piece of paper and then burn them over a candle...I laughed and told them that before I was Christian I studied Wicca for a short time and remember a spell or method of casting spells very similar to this

reply to post by oliveoil


Interesting that you quote from the 'King James Bible' (a version still used in many churches today) ... as he was the man who re-wrote complete passages of said bible, in an effort to condone his various political/private passions.

The most damning stroke of the quill - as far as his Pagan subjects were concerned - was the passage that previously had read;

'Never suffer a murderer to live'

He changed it to read;

'Never suffer a witch or a murderer to live'.
(I believe this can be found in the Book of Matthew).

Why did he make such a blatent change ?

To condone the barbaric and frenzied witch-hunts that had reached their peak during his reign !

Woody

I understood the word 'pagan' to mean 'someone from the country' or 'farmers' or similar. I rather like the word and since I live in the country, grow much of our own food and generally enjoy our village life style I can call myself quite happily 'Pagan'.

As a child, I was also taught that christmas was Jesus' birthday and Easter was his death. Now, after much research and readings I know that both were instituted by the early church 'fathers' and are false.

I wonder too if instead of Son of God, this should read 'Sun of God'. This term appears to have come down to us from the Egyptioan culture in which the god Horus was murdered and rose again.

OOhhh ... it's confusing when there are so many who think they've got the answer .. but have they?

hello, Roman soldiers worshiped Mithras, and December the 25th was kept as the day to celebrate that god.(I Googled this). others say that Bachus was celebrated on that day, with so many nations and gods, I expect other gods were/are worshiped on that day too.

Originally posted by the_denv




Calling yourself a Christian OR a pagan is stupid. Why? Because BOTH religions/cults trace back to Babylon. If your calling yourself a pagan OR a Christian, then you are calling yourself a Babylonian, a follower of Nimrod.

That means you follow Nimrod, and so do the Global elite, why? Because Nimrod was demonic, you are all living a lie. You are all against the New World Order, but you call yourself Christian or Pagan and worship Nimrod with a different name. Strange, very strange.



[edit on 11/12/2009 by the_denv]

I've contention to the quoted.

you want to get your facts straight about the etymology of pagan.

Not all demons are of negative polarity, dark.

In much the same manner the wise serpents, the knowledgeable ones, were changed to evil snakes representative of the devil by monotheism, daemons were misperceived as all evil as well, both serpents and daemons being knowledgeable ones.

We don't throw babies out with bathwater, that's what monotheism does.

I rather think you've read or seen some trot which seemed to make sense to you and taken it aboard as fact.

When repeating the knowledge of others, it would serve you better to check to see whether they are in fact correct.

Babylon is not the source of every religion nor pantheon though in derision of us pagans as well as the Solar Christians you suggest this is so, certainly not the Celtic pantheon nor many others.

Go back a bit to Sumer, there's certain commonalities there but that was a cradle, not Babylon, ancient Babel or later.

Not having a go but you seem to merely want to disrespect both camps in one foul swoop to seem superior in your knowledge and what you say may sound correct to some, but it isn't.

Very good point about the Gregorian calender, though, to Druidics and Celt mystics etc, it makes little difference if you learn what the nature of our traditions and practises are, for they transcend outside what is simply a perception of time created for agriculture and manages the lives for modern humans, a calculus for our convenience nothing else, temporal dynamics do not recognise calanders.

It's the cosmological cycles as much as the spiritual componants involved which have no temporal lock which are important, whatever calander one chooses to work from, the cosmic cycle is immutable, the cultured spiritual energies may be free from temporal bonds as much as spacial.

May the goddess guide you to a greater wisdom.

Peace.


[edit on 12-12-2009 by DeltaPan]

reply to post by bluebird2


Wow, I've always thought it should be 'Sun of God' too ... it makes so much more sense.

But if you think about it, it all becomes understandable when you consider the 'chinese whisper effect', where ancient text (including the bible) are concerned.

This is why I always have difficulty understanding how some people take the bible literally ... surely all ancient writings were best written symbolically, so that they would stand the test of time through generations. (just seems practical to me).

Woody

reply to post by woodwytch


Spot on

This is how I think about it aswell, makes the most sense to me this way.