Atheists to protect ATS - Fight the Fundies!

Originally posted by zaiger
reply to post by lordtyp0

 

You asked for an example of christians doing it. Not for any sort of justification of anything.
Separate note though: If saying "You are wrong, and more over anti-thesis of all that is good" is not cramming beliefs down throat.. what constitutes that for you?

Ahhh and here we go...
Man is seperated from animals by his intelligence, creatiuvity, ability to create the arts, language among other things. With those things come freedom of choice and the recognition of.
You feed a gold fish and he will eat, he will eat untill he dies.
You train a dog well enough you can get it to run into traffic.
A person will stop eating and tell you to go ____ yourself if you were to tell him to run into traffic. So what does this have to do with forcing beliefs down other's throats? Free choice, you have it (i do not think it is just a god given thing). If you are feeling like the words on your screen are "forcing" anything on you then i question your mental ability. You do have a choice in what you read what you respond to and the trolls you feed. If the thread you linked to is "forcing" anything on you then how is anythread on here NOT forcing something on someone?
The fact is Athiests have their own double standards for things
Free Speech: I should be allowed to say whatever i want because i am free But on the other hand we should regulate what christians say and where they can say it
Education: We should teach children about everything in the world around them But on the other hand when christians do it it is called brain washing so we will decide what they learn.
Mass Murder: Christians have killed many people in their religious battles But on the other hand atheists leaders tend to be communists and kill by the millions but it is just an odd coincidence when you take the leaders of the world for the past 500 years and seperate the mass murders their tend to be more athiests on one side.

I don't really care for the tit-for-tats going around. I simply asked how you defined 'shoving beliefs down peoples throats" as you indicated the link I showed you-was simply someone expressing oppinion. Are you able to define it or not?

reply to post by lordtyp0


It is someone putting forth an opinion. If you think it is forcing then every athiest thread would be guilty of the same unless you are going to apply the athiest double standard.

Originally posted by zaiger
reply to post by lordtyp0

 

It is someone putting forth an opinion. If you think it is forcing then every athiest thread would be guilty of the same unless you are going to apply the athiest double standard.

Again I do not care about double standards. Had you spent a couple seconds reading my previous posts in this thread you would find I am of the opinion that all are guilty to an extent. You asked for an example of Christians doing the 'cramming down throat' thing. I gave one. You claimed it was innocent even though ti gave the classic signs.

I am simply asking how you define "opinion" vs: "Cramming down throat". You definition of what I can infer is very selective to the point of cherry picking.

I am curious for your definition is all, instead you supply deflection.

It is an interesting exchange so far.

Originally posted by muggl3z
reply to post by Parallex

 

Atheism is definitely has some religious aspects, especially lately in the last few years.

Atheists have been acting just like fundamentalists. Acting like THEY KNOW IT ALL. It's impossible they might not know everything!

That sounded pretty bigoted IMNSHO.

We pride ourselves on what we do know, and pride ourselves that we do not know it all!

But my anger grows hulk like as I try to get the &*^*& new Lie to Me Episode to play on hulu!!!! ARGGGHH!!!!

Atheism is as much a religion as bald is a hair colour.

Atheism is as much a religion as an old persons local bingo community.

We just don't believe in a higher power, (well maybe bad wording) a AO being that is all knowing and all whatever.

And we're discriminated more against than any other group, people actually believe that 'Angels' burned that AA founder and family.... yeah, not buying that.



Not but five minutes and i'm getting foes lol

[edit on 1-12-2009 by Republican08]

reply to post by AshleyD


You have to look at it from the atheists' point of view.

You have to understand that christians are an overwhelming majority in the United States (where most of us are living). In the last 8 years, under Bush, we've seen a lot of disturbing anti-science and anti-intellectual trends develop -- everything from "the jurry's out on evolution" (Our freaking president said that), to, of course, creationism being pushed into public schools, to the bigotry of religious inspired gay-bashing, to actual laws banning gay marriage -- and before that, a proposed constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage, which was quite possibly one of the saddest displays of ignorance bigotry and hate ever endorsed by a political party.

30 years ago we were doing the same thing to black people. Well I guess nobody learned their lesson -- because not even a dream as admirable as Martin Luther King's stood a chance in the face of the infallible bible, as millions of free-black men and women marched to the voting booth to strip rights away from people who are different from them.


I think we atheists are just sick of it, at this point. Not only the prejudice, but the irrationality. You can't argue with someone who thinks the earth is 5000 years old. Or proclaims Noa's ark is a true story.

We're suppose to "deny ignorance" here, and nothing could be more ignorant than embracing a belief without evidence, yet this is a virtue of christianity, called faith. I would say, if anything, ATS is incompatible with christianity, and most of the people who like to stick religion where it doesn't belong are lucky to have gotten away with it for as long as they have.

reply to post by lordtyp0

I am simply asking how you define "opinion" vs: "Cramming down throat". You definition of what I can infer is very selective to the point of cherry picking.

I think forcing is when someone does not have an option not to say no or walk away. Kinda like when you force a woman to have sex with you it is called rape, she has no option or say so in the matter. If you were to be in a situation where people are holding you against your will and preaching their ideas to you while not letting you leave then yes they are forcing something on you.
But if threads and posts are forcing anything on you (not just you) then you must see that you are also saying that they are making you read their posts and threads. So by stating that some online post is forcing you, you are saying that someone else is capable of controlling your actions via the internet.
Generally my religion is not accepted by many and i have been called all sorts of things over it. When i see a thread that is clearly against my religion in the title i just do not click it, nobody is forcing me to.

reply to post by lordtyp0


I don't think you are really in a good place to accuse others of cherry-picking.
I mean, I appreciated the U2U conceding the point I made counter to your assertion that I only see this argument the way I do because I am a believer, but as I told you earlier, I am not a believer.

It wouldn't be a big deal if some others didn't bother to even read what I said and attack me following your lead that because I disagree I must be a "believer."

Come on, try a little honesty here (in general, not to you specifically)

Originally posted by zaiger
reply to post by lordtyp0

 

I am simply asking how you define "opinion" vs: "Cramming down throat". You definition of what I can infer is very selective to the point of cherry picking.

I think forcing is when someone does not have an option not to say no or walk away. Kinda like when you force a woman to have sex with you it is called rape, she has no option or say so in the matter. If you were to be in a situation where people are holding you against your will and preaching their ideas to you while not letting you leave then yes they are forcing something on you.
But if threads and posts are forcing anything on you (not just you) then you must see that you are also saying that they are making you read their posts and threads. So by stating that some online post is forcing you, you are saying that someone else is capable of controlling your actions via the internet.
Generally my religion is not accepted by many and i have been called all sorts of things over it. When i see a thread that is clearly against my religion in the title i just do not click it, nobody is forcing me to.

Am I interpreting correctly then that you are saying unless a Mod is threatening banning: One cannot have views forced on them in this forum? Please consider the following:

You indicated "Generally my religion is not accepted by many and i have been called all sorts of things over it. When i see a thread that is clearly against my religion in the title i just do not click it, nobody is forcing me to".

If you were in a situation where you were constantly exposed to those links which you chose to ignore on here. And on Television (can choose to watch something else), Radio, Magazines, other sites. How long before you would feel that they were in fact being forced on you? The two groups who are left in this country who are seemingly accepted to harass and attack are the Homosexual groups, and Atheists. Both are labeled as the evil plague by the majority religion who do things like: threaten to pull all soup kitchens in NY because they were talking about giving benefits to gay couples-ie: threatening to hurt a very vulnerable group in the population by throwing a temper tantrum.
If you were the target of such hostiility on a day to day basis. How long before you felt that each post was in fact being shoved down your throat.

Either way, thank you for clarifying.

Originally posted by JayinAR
reply to post by lordtyp0

 

I don't think you are really in a good place to accuse others of cherry-picking.
I mean, I appreciated the U2U conceding the point I made counter to your assertion that I only see this argument the way I do because I am a believer, but as I told you earlier, I am not a believer.

It wouldn't be a big deal if some others didn't bother to even read what I said and attack me following your lead that because I disagree I must be a "believer."

Come on, try a little honesty here (in general, not to you specifically)

Presumed post from awhile ago:

These types of threads absolutely infuriate me. The only dark-spot I see on these boards in regards to religion are threads such as this.
Is the OP so insecure in his knowledge that he actually feels *threatened* by a person who abandons reason for faith? Surely if there are enough people like him on these boards they should be able to easily determine who's participation in the threads lacks reason and just sorta' shrug them off. On the other hand, once you start censorship, it has a habit of snowballing. This is why ATS continually battles with itself over the drug-use topics.

This thread is nothing more than a bully-pulpit for an insecure mind.
And I say this as a man who lacks faith.

I asked if it was possible that you were just not seeing the opposite side.
I made no statements of your faith or lack thereof nor did you clarify your standing at the time I wrote the reply.
I think you are confusing posts and/or posters.
The U2U was me explaining that I was basing my following reply off your first sentence. I did it in U2U because I did not want to clutter the DB feeds. However since you have alluded to it being some sort of weird secret confession here is what I sent:

Hey, didn't want to flood the databases with a re just to say:

I read: "These types of threads absolutely infuriate me. The only dark-spot I see on these boards in regards to religion are threads such as this."

As being more "anti-religious" threads.
But yeah, I agree, this sectarian verbal war that seems to always erupt is stupid. Everyone needs to tone down their rhetoric.

So please, explain how I was cherry picking or being at all hypocritical instead of treating you with respect.

(edited to add quote boxes and the line aboe the second quote box)

[edit on 2-12-2009 by lordtyp0]

reply to post by lordtyp0

Am I interpreting correctly then that you are saying unless a Mod is threatening banning: One cannot have views forced on them in this forum?

Yes, i have freedom of choice in what i read.

If you were in a situation where you were constantly exposed to those links which you chose to ignore on here.

I am in that situation the only thing i see are the titles i have seen and heard enough in my day that im pretty sure i know what the thread is about so i do not read them.

How long before you would feel that they were in fact being forced on you? The two groups who are left in this country who are seemingly accepted to harass and attack are the Homosexual groups, and Atheists. Both are labeled as the evil plague by the majority religion who do things like: threaten to pull all soup kitchens in NY because they were talking about giving benefits to gay couples-ie: threatening to hurt a very vulnerable group in the population by throwing a temper tantrum.
If you were the target of such hostiility on a day to day basis. How long before you felt that each post was in fact being shoved down your throat.

I guess it will be a while because i see it everyday and in person almost every weekend before i feel that biggots and hate groups can have any effect upon me.

reply to post by zaiger


Fair enough I suppose. May you never be drug down as far as some. That way is only jaded cynicism.

reply to post by lordtyp0


Due to the minimum posting rules i just have to go on an on till i get to the second line only to ssay
agreed

Originally posted by onlylonely
funny you should post this. I am pagan but am shocked that thread owner in this thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

was banned and my source says without warning or reason. This appears to be because it questioned faith. When trying to question it my post was removed. As an open minded pagan I believe ATS is without doubt under seige. It might be time to move on. please u2u me your email address so I can be in touch after you get banned from this thread.

There's a distinct difference between "questioning faith" and "being condescending toward all people who think differently".

That guy was just trying to find excuses to poke fun at people and call them idiots for what they believe in. I'm not religious at all, I guess I'd fit the label agnostic, but what that poster did was just wrong.

Besides which, the research provided is a joke. It doesn't take a scientist to tell you how a person thinks. Anyone down the street could reach the same conclusion as he did, without the elaborate research and wasted funds.

Besides, a few atheists like to look to scientists for answers in life, regardless of if their research is completely bunk. reasonable was one such example of that person.

Oh well. Give it a few years and atheists will be killing people for their own beliefs. The irony of it all...

[edit on 2-12-2009 by Whine Flu]

Originally posted by onlylonely
funny you should post this. I am pagan but am shocked that thread owner in this thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

was banned and my source says without warning or reason. This appears to be because it questioned faith. When trying to question it my post was removed. As an open minded pagan I believe ATS is without doubt under seige. It might be time to move on. please u2u me your email address so I can be in touch after you get banned from this thread.

I am appalled that Reasonable was banned in this thread, it appears he was given no warning in the thread so it's difficult not to conclude that he was shut down.

If any thing this situation would only appear to validate the claim that his threads (or my own even) are relevant in exposing the conspiracy of religion .

It would appear (unless the mods position is clarified and Reasonable's banning justified) that somebody doesn't like the big lie that is xtianity being exposed.

Flicking back through the posts I personally don't see so far where Reasonable was ill mannered, although the term seems to be as vague as the bibles themselves.

If xtians see threads like "god proved to be imaginary --" or whatever I cannot for the life of me understand why they choose to get involved when they get offended so easily.

I would also question whether moderators of an xtian bent should be allowed to continue to contribute to threads that bring their religion into question.
We have to bear in mind that we are dealing with a group of people, who many of them would have Blasphemy laws reintroduced if they could, which is the height of censorship.

Some have complained of what they claim to be "endless" threads keeping religions feet to the coals, yet they are often the first to jump right into the ring for a fight. If their faith was so strong then logically they would conclude that their jeusyahwhe god is a big boy and can fend for himself.

They also seem to overlook the fact that there are endless threads on aliens,ufos,911,nwo and so on adnauseum, hey who the hell is complaining we all have an off button.

If it is a case that there is an element of zealot infiltration and censorship, well then this would only appear to expose xtian paranoia and lack of real faith.
According to them, the uprising of atheist et al and the denial of their jesuyahwehgod is prophesied, so what the hell are they complaining about ?
One would expect them to be getting the party hats out and ensuring they haven't trod on any cracks in the pavement because jesus is coming, not working their bollocks off to to suppress the apostasy that jesusyahweh planned.

Smells like somebody doesn't really believe what they preach.

reply to post by Whine Flu

That guy was just trying to find excuses to poke fun at people and call them idiots for what they believe in.

But he didn't actually call anyone an idiot did he ? If he presents a case which has the possibility of making one look foolish perhaps we should consider how we inter prate things.

Pointing out that there is no evidence of tin foil hats doing what they are claimed to do is not calling the wear a dork. Needless to say we can think he's a dork if we choose.

Whatever the case he does not appear to have been warned and a posting ban seems to be extreme.

reply to post by moocowman



you mean to tell me he's been post banned?

Wow now that is something, i just got off another thread where the OP got banned by a christian moderator.

So two members who both oppose religion have both been banned?

Well thats never happened before has it, people getting silenced for questioning the almighty?


Listen the fact of the matter is believing in some high and mighty asslord in the sky who does it seems do NOTHING for humans at all except provide a massive comfort blanket for the closed minded.

The fact of the matter is logical,rational people can see religion for what it is

Retarded.

There i said it bring forth the almighty banhammer of the lord

Morning guys and gals.

Again, it looks like a lot of people have TOTALLY missed the point of this thread. As usual, because of the Christian Mafia, it has turned into a "How dare you touch my religion story", full of accusations of 'censorship' this and 'censorship' that.

I think the moderator who participated has made a faux-pas by not using the 'I'm contributing but not as a mod' button.

I will reiterate my position.

I would like to see religion removed from discussion and debate on ATS - in its' application. By all means reference religion as a subjective input, but please leave the "This is MY GOD and you shall not question him" type comments out of it. These comments are causing great harm to ATS.

Please understand this thread is NOT about censorship, as you fundies would like to make out, it is about seeking the truth behind any conspiracy, in a proper and effective format.

I haven't seen ONE of you, consider the position that you are wrong to bring your despicable religion onto these forums. Why is that? Because you're the Christian mafia on ATS and the resident fundies.

Many of you have tried to goad me into getting angry / insulting to your kind, so that you can get me banned / warned or this thread shut down. Well it just isn't going to happen. Your opinions about atheists are wrong, and your moral standpoint undefendable.

Last but not least, the point of this thread was to ask atheists to stand up, be counted, and fight back. It shows how dire the situation is when very few of them are brave enough to come onto this thread - perhaps they have something to fear from certain people with forum powers? I don't know - the question does need to be asked.

I will ask again - I believe there is a fundamentalist Christian agenda, designed to drown threads critical of religion or Christianity on these forums. So far, I have been proved right by the behaviour of most of the posters in this thread. Come on people, debate the subject properly instead of just hurling insults - follow the forum rules please!

The Para.

reply to post by Reading

The fact of the matter is logical,rational people can see religion for what it is Retarded.

careful you could get banned for insinuating religion causes retardation.

reply to post by Parallex


Humanity incorporates enough division/intolerance already without threads promoting it even more. We need to evolve and include higher consciousness values of love, acceptance and tolerance for ALL with differing beliefs/customs to ensure a ' truly free society'. I consider atheism just another 'religion' in itself. I believe people should be free to believe what they choose. Do not impose 'your cause' on others.

Furthermore, just because somebody believes in Christ, it does not signify they are all 'religious' and 'fundies' blindly following all doctines/dogmas outlined by organised religion. Blanket/generalist statements and opinions only signify ignorance-and causes based on ignorance should never be supported. Peace.

reply to post by moocowman


Guys, whilst I appreciate your support in this matter, don't lower yourself to insults etc.

We don't need to do that to prove the Christian / Religious folks are wrong in their fascist ways.

The Para.