Seeking the advice and input of ATS members on an important issue...

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
[The point im trying to make is precisely that ATS SIZE communities certainly DONT need this kind of crappy third party advertising streams.

How can you possibly make such a statement?

Are you aware that, under the current wording of Boucher's proposed legislation, any ad not delivered from the "abovetopsecret.com" domain would be considered a third-party ad?

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


To expand upon that SO:

If ads are required to run on ATS domain servers then ATS would have to shell out an enormous amount of money to run ads on ATS using abovetopsecret.com servers. This means that ATS would have to price itself out and no one would advertise with ATS, the next step would be a paid membership to the site that I am sure no one really wants to do.

It would spell the end of ATS, and in short order, other ATS sized websites.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Come on honestly, all the means is that you would be required to hire an advertising sales agent (1 person) and a graphic designer (1 person part time freelance), or probably just an agency that would spring up to fufill that function. To have direct speciality created links for this site made linking to another site or approrpiate sales site. It would be a bit bumpy making the transition, but this site has a lot of bells and whistles that are nice but probably werent fiscally necessary if you rely so heavily on third party ad houses.

This site in particular gets massive amounts of hits per day, its valuable advertising at a direct slice of target markets, come on you know thats true, people pay good money for that, the question is you guys sourcing the people willing to pay that money isnt it ?

And I will say again that I think partially people should understand the internets are not free, I dont know what the active member count for the site is, but what about everyone paying 2 dollars a month for membership privalages for an add free site ? Would that be enough to cover your current cash from the ads if you got say a 50% conversion rate of current membership willing to do that. You could still let people read the content for free, just pay for the right to post, or maybe to get access to the "community forums" as well as the "serious topic forums". Youve grown to a very successful point, but I think there are other options you could explore if you had the mind to, that could potentially give the site more freedom (if your worried about google ad policies or something i dont know), or even make the site more money.

I worked for a company called Jagex which was initially founded purely off the money made from direct advertising on their website, sure they have adopted the easy route for their advertising now (mostly but not always) because they now get the majority of their income from sources other than advertising, but as they dabble in direct advertising still, I know its more than enough to pay for basic operations of quite serious server loads plus something a bit more than a skeleton crew of staff and always has been.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Count me in Sir......

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by SkepticOverlord

 

To expand upon that SO:

If ads are required to run on ATS domain servers then ATS would have to shell out an enormous amount of money to run ads on ATS using abovetopsecret.com servers.

*Looks at ATS media. then imagines a gif with a link attached to it*

Ok then.

/shrug I dont want a fight. I honestly feel ATS could fund itself in more productive ways, at least to get rid of the ads or make them paranoia free (which I understand they are trying to do anyway)

As for the little guy, theres a lot of crap on the web, a personal website doesnt cost a lot to run, a bigger websites need either advertisers or other forms of investment, but there are different ways to find that, if you have a quality product that you manage to get 'out there' youll find advertisers wanting to work with you.

Originally posted by gYvMessanger
Come on honestly, all the means is that you would be required to hire an advertising sales agent

Given the scale required for the number of ads that run on ATS, such a task is well-beyond our means... and beyond the means of any online-only media company with less than ten million monthly visitors.

The time and effort to forge relationships with advertisers and ad agencies requires a team of people, not one person. It's quite impossible at our scale.

reply to post by gYvMessanger


I think part of my frustration with such a proposed bill is that everywhere the government is-the prices go up until only the big boys get to play.

Take the computer industry for instance. Power and capability goes up and prices have steadily declined over the years. No government intervention.

Everywhere the government is, however, food, fuel, homes..etc, the prices go up stifling competition, and creating monopolies. We don't need that on the internet.

[edit on 29-11-2009 by projectvxn]

The completed site, with petition and the ability to send letters to congress, will be up and running tomorrow.

Stay tuned.

Originally posted by projectvxn
This is just so infantile. You people want to be able to post to ATS or not? Just because you can't discuss drugs and all that goes with that? I find it ridiculous that you people just don't get the point. This isn't about ATS's bottom line, but the bottom line of all ATS sized web communities that rely on ad revenue to survive.

You don't like it, fine, stop posting we're better without you and your whining.

unfortunately in your line of thinking you are failing to see the point

i have not read anywhere on here that people are requesting the ability or "privilege" to discuss drugs

what people on here are saying is they would like the opportunity to pass on information about medication, just like they can with other medications, and not be censored or stifled in doing so

i have not seen anyone advocate changing the rules to allow anyone to speak about how fun it is to blow lines

this is not about wanting to speak about drugs

this is about a form of censorship no matter what word you wish to use to describe it

if you took the time to read the posts, especially mine with a open mind you would clearly see no advocation of drug use or drug discussion

you will only see me advocating the sharing of medical information and types of treatments that are possible


what i am proposing is no different then any of us starting a thread discussing chemotherapy or any other type of cancer treatment

search ats for cancer treatments, you will find all kinds of things, mostly crap (no offense but it is)

what you wont find on ats are any types of discussions regarding how medical marijuana can help alleviate negative side effects of a chemotherapy or radiation regimen that cancer patients must go through

you wont find any thread discussing that its medical use (not childish abuse which occurs with all prescription drugs) may slow cancer growth

you wont find any mature reasonable medical discussion regarding the medical legality of this potential cure/treatment

yet you do find that regarding many other cancer "home remedies, devices" and so on


in my previous post i said it would be my last, but it was obvious by your reply that my intentions were not clear

so to be clear this is not about drug discussion, it is about medical discussion that could improve the lives of millions of cancer patients around the world

(not only cancer patients, aids, ms, long term pain, depression, etc i could make this list over 100 things long but i will not as you should be able to get the point)



to the owners and mods i appreciate you not yet deleting my posts, hopefully that means you are least considering things, no matter what your ultimate decision may be, it is appreciated that you at least consider a change in policy that could truly help many now that the obama administration has announced their new policy and stance regarding medical marijuana

[edit on 29-11-2009 by Dramey]

reply to post by Dramey


www.abovetopsecret.com...

haha thanks for the link

but more importantly

thank you to the ats owners and staff

words can not express the gratitude the medical marijuana community feels towards this opportunity

allowing this area of ats does more then words can explain in terms of coverage and the amount of people who will now have the opportunity to come together and share incredibly valuable information from the world over

with this new stance by ats, there is not a single thing i can say bad about ats

as far as i know that was one of the only things that was being "censored" until now

with that no longer being censored, i can truly feel this is a open news website where we can maturely discuss everything taking place and harming this world


i truly applaud ats and the owners for this

i am grateful beyond words

reply to post by gYvMessanger


Ummm no...

All great ideas but not realistic in the slightest for a UGC site, not realistic at all.

Springer...

Put me down in favor of the petition, I'm in.
Hump

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

The free and independent Internet is at risk..

U.S. Subcommittee on Communications, Technology, and the Internet (and who is backed by a long-list of big-media dollars) is proposing legislation that will effectively eliminate third-party ad networks as an option for small to mid-sized websites. Our contacts in the industry fear that, due to his hotly contested re-election efforts, the proposed legislation will reach the house floor before the end of the year.

The essence of his proposal is to require websites such as ATS to first ask your permission before using any third-party cookies.

And what is wrong with your website asking us if ads with cookies are ok? I think that is a very good step in a positive direction. I would prefer no ads altogether.

I am tired of emptying my virus vault with all the ridiculous cookies that I get.

There is no valid reason, in my small warped mind at least, as to WHY we should tolerate unwanted cookies.

If all websites asked first, then there would be no reason for regulation. (How are they going to regulate foreign websites that are not subject to our laws?)

BTW - you can have ads that DON'T have cookies associated with them.

If cookied ads are your only source of revenue, then I think you may want to start thinking of a more reliable source of income. The ad well will surely dry up soon.

I never agreed with tracking cookies to begin with. It's an invasion of my privacy.

-EII

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Hell yes i'll support you on that. I'm from the UK, why does that guy think he should prevent everyone else in the world enjoying the content like we do.

If this does get passed, would moving your servers to europe get past this, afterall its no longer a US concern if they are over here !

Yes, I will support (and sign).
Sites like this is important keep as they are.
A place for free discussions.

Originally posted by EyesII
BTW - you can have ads that DON'T have cookies associated with them.

Could you explain how a wide variety of ads from dozens of advertisers could be delivered without the use of cookies to identify unique users?

We definitely need to hammer Congress on this. Too many items on the agenda are being rushed through to the floor because incumbants are afraid of being ousted in the next election.

I'm definitely in.

As a Canadian I support any and all ATS efforts to stop censorship and governmental control of the internet.

This is probably a good time for ATS to begin planning its own alternative to the internet platform we currently use -- that seems doomed from a variety of directions.

I would think as entrepeneurs and lovers of the free exchange of ideas ATS is an excellent agent for the development of an alternative Web of some sort.

Are you as shocked as I am to see this extraordinary legislative free-for-all and Executive power grab under the Democrat Party's 'watch'. It is stunning to observe from a distance. If I did not know better, I would think the entire USA had been drugged into mind-numbed submission.

The petition/information site is complete... more information coming shortly.



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