Ask what you would like about the bible and christianity

I am making this thread to answer questions i see all the time

These questions require very little research but somehow people just ask them and ask them whenever attempting to discredit Christianity even though they are easily answered

Therefore, feel free to ask anything you want and i answer your questions

this is not a thread to debate religion and science...just ask what you think the bible and christianity cannot explain and i will show you how it can

why isnt slavery ok now?
it clearly was back when god was talking to people...but it isnt now. i want to know why god changed his mind.

reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest


this is from a very good site that can help to answer a lot of biblical questions

gracethrufaith.com

"He was more likely referring to Hebrew slaves of Biblical times. Slavery was condoned in Israel as a means of working off debt. There were a number of humanitarian restrictions on how they were treated, and no one could be enslaved for more than 7 years. After that the slave holder had to consider the debt paid in full, set them free and provide a generous stake to help them get started again. Families who fell into slavery together had to be kept together.

Some slaves were so well treated by their masters that at the end of their time they requested to remain life long servants in their master’s household. These slaves were called bond-servants and were trusted and highly regarded members of the household. Exodus 21:2-11 and Leviticus 25:39-55 are good references.

The slavery practiced in the US and other countries during the 16-1800’s in no way approximated Biblical slavery and was a blemish on human history."

that information is backed up historically and biblically

Originally posted by resonance
reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest

 

this is from a very good site that can help to answer a lot of biblical questions

gracethrufaith.com

it can answer them.


with lies

"He was more likely referring to Hebrew slaves of Biblical times. Slavery was condoned in Israel as a means of working off debt. There were a number of humanitarian restrictions on how they were treated, and no one could be enslaved for more than 7 years.

unless a wife was found for him.
exodus 21:7-11
If you buy a Hebrew servant, he is to serve you for six years. But in the seventh year, he shall go free, without paying anything. 3 If he comes alone, he is to go free alone; but if he has a wife when he comes, she is to go with him. 4 If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the woman and her children shall belong to her master, and only the man shall go free.

After that the slave holder had to consider the debt paid in full, set them free and provide a generous stake to help them get started again. Families who fell into slavery together had to be kept together.

Leviticus 25:44
'Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves."


buying slaves doesnt not sound like having someone be a slave to pay off their debt.

Some slaves were so well treated by their masters that at the end of their time they requested to remain life long servants in their master’s household. These slaves were called bond-servants and were trusted and highly regarded members of the household. Exodus 21:2-11 and Leviticus 25:39-55 are good references.

you seem to have missed Exodus 21:5-6. if a slave master gave him a wife she had to stay.
"But if the servant declares, 'I love my master and my wife and children and do not want to go free,' then his master must take him before the judges. He shall take him to the door or the doorpost and pierce his ear with an awl. Then he will be his servant for life."

if a man was set free his family often was not. he could choose to stay with them, if he did he has an awl driven through his ear marking him as a slave forever.


"That servant who knows his master's will and does not get ready or does not do what his master wants will be beaten with many blows."
Luke 12:47

nothing says being treated well like being beaten with many blows.

and heres a fun one about selling your daughter.

exodus 21:7-11
"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as menservants do. 8 If she does not please the master who has selected her for himself, [a] he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to

foreigners, because he has broken faith with her. 9 If he selects her for his son, he must grant her the rights of a daughter. 10 If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and marital rights. 11 If he does not provide her with these three things, she is to go free, without any payment of money.

seems like a nice stake she is given at the end to help her get started.

all of this is supported by the bible. its in there directly.

read your bible, not some sham website.

[edit on 8-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]

its clear you dont know what youre doing. my assumption is youre just looking up whatever questions are proposed. if youll notice, half of the stuff i got about MIStreating slaves came from the section you provided as "a good source"

[edit on 8-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]

Please expound on Romans 9 and explain to me why the majority of Christianity continues to believe in freedom (Independence - aka free will - aka Chaos) rather than what is clearly being taught here (freedom through Unity with God's (OrderCharity - Judges 6:24/1 John 4:8) will through faith which is from a gift and produces a secure hope for a future.)?

Please explain what Christmas is and justify to me why it is godly to celebrate it when it was not given to celebrate in the scripture, and is historically a Pagan holiday rehashed as a "Christian" holiday in order to bring the Empire of it's day into subjection. Why is this not proof that Christianity is the "whore" of "mystery babylon" which extends to this day as a tool of Pride and Chaos? How much like former Empires does our culture need to be for division to cease regarding prophecy?

What does it mean when Christ answered accusations of blasphemy (His claim of being the Son of God and therefore God) by telling his accusers that they are "elohim," which is also the name of God (John 10)? Please reference the prayer of Christ in John 17 in which Christ refers to future faithful as One. Please also reference this with John 8:12 and the correlating verse Matt 5:14.


I might have some more questions if you are able to answer wisely, but this is fine for now to enable me to know whether you are "apt to teach."



Sorry for the skepticism, there are few teachers around who can even deal with this "milk." My following questions will be far more hard to deal with, so I'd appreciate your honesty in whether or not you can answer "meatier" questions.

reply to post by resonance

Therefore, feel free to ask anything you want and i answer your questions

Be careful or you will quickly find yourself in over your head.

reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest


the verses you added just helped to show more of the laws given by the lord

all of what you said were parts of the law handed down on mt.sinai...

all debts were wiped clean after six years..jews kept track of sabbatical years..every 7 they would all be cleared of all debts and all borrowed land or anything was returned..

if the master gives a slave a wife..she does not belong to the slave once his seven years are up..she belongs to the master..this is why she did not leave with the slave..but if a slave came in with a wife she left with him..

but yes if he wanted to stay with his wife he had to remain a slave..she was the property of his master and to stay married to her he had to be a slave too..in marriage they say you become one flesh

and the beatings..if they were not obeying their masters, they had to be justly punished..they were not fulfilling their part of the agreement..

"If a man sells his daughter as a servant, she is not to go free as menservants do. 8 If she does not please the master who has selected her for himself, [a] he must let her be redeemed. He has no right to sell her to foreigners, because he has broken faith with her. 9 If he selects her for his son, he must grant her the rights of a daughter. 10 If he marries another woman, he must not deprive the first one of her food, clothing and marital rights. 11 If he does not provide her with these three things, she is to go free, without any payment of money.

ok so in the KJV the word selected is betrothed..now if she does not please him he is supposed to let her be redeemed (paid off)..so she is then free..he cant sell her away.. he has to just let her go..pretty good i think..if he marrys her to his son he has to treat her like a daughter and she is no longer a slave..if he takes another wife than her he has to treat her exactly the same..and if he doesnt do these things he has to let her go..but he doesnt give her anything because she did not serve him..

its very simple..you just have to understand the culture of the time..and the fact that slavery was a means of debt..and slaves were called bond-servants..they were not looked upon as inferior as with the slave trades of the modern world..

reply to post by PSUSA


i am very adept at bible study now days..if i dont know an answer..ill go find it and it will be a good learning opportunity for me..thanks for your concern

reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest


Gal 3:23-24
But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Mat 22:36-40
"Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?"
Jesus said to him, "'You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.' "This is the first and great commandment. "And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' "On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."


While I agree that the above exegesis of the Old Testament is accurate on all sides here, it is unfair for people to ignore how it relates to the people our time who are far more civilized and are SUPPOSED to have a greater understanding of spiritual things.

The Law was given for the preserving of an uncivilized yet spiritual group of animals. Now that the declarations of God are made manifest more evidently through the history of Christ and the Church, we should know better now and understand why the Law was important and also why we should be and have progressed beyond old concepts such as this.

However, our current economic crisis is a reaping of what we have sown, which is a poor understanding of Order and Charity regarding economic concepts and the interfacing with our neighbors. Due to this lack of understanding, we do not deserve to "graduate" beyond the "schoolmaster" and we fool ourselves if we think we are more civilized. Unless you do understand and properly interface with your neighbor as God interfaces with us who is OrderCharity, not Pride and Chaos.

reply to post by resonance


At the end of your post you started to touch on what is important for you to communicate. The Law as a whole is to be dealt with the same by those who understand. Unfortunately, too many do not understand what that means. Please take a look at what I posted above.

reply to post by resonance


yes. words of the lord. did you think i was unaware that i was quoting from the bible?

you are still not getting that it justifies owning slaves. nothing in there sounds like "good treatment" to me.

and THE WOMAN ISNT EVER SET FREE AND NEITHER ARE THE CHILDREN
you said it yourself. and if the man doesnt want to completely abandon them he must become a slave forever.

sounds perfectly fair.

i dont care how you respond to the "sell your daughter" thing.

IT STILL PROMOTES SELLING YOUR DAUGHTER.

how is slavery in any way moral?

just know the culture?

so the culture decides what is moral.

reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest


I gave you an appropriate answer, please address my answer with the same harshness. While I am not confident we will agree, I am confident that my answer to you tends to the problems which you are generally pointing at. I hope you are able to connect the dots I am laying out.

Originally posted by resonance
I am making this thread to answer questions i see all the time

These questions require very little research but somehow people just ask them and ask them whenever attempting to discredit Christianity even though they are easily answered

Therefore, feel free to ask anything you want and i answer your questions

this is not a thread to debate religion and science...just ask what you think the bible and christianity cannot explain and i will show you how it can

I appreciate your zeal and also your wanting to help people answer questions they may have but you're in for many debates because the people who have questions are not truly wanting answers but rather seeking controversy for the sake of controversy.

Also, I mean no offense here but you come off rather cocky and many take that as a pissing contest for challengers.

Originally posted by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest
just know the culture?

so the culture decides what is moral.

Yes, for a time. Until understanding AND compassion grows.

Please do not pretend that we did not come from a very brutal and harsh past. We are very weak AND very strong. It is a difficult balance to find and our current cultural paradigm is a good example of how we are very hypocritical in judgment of things like slavery.

Do credit companies allow you voluntary servitude for a time in order to obtain freedom? What if they offer you a wife and you do not take her? You are free. What if they offer you financial freedom along with a mate and all other things that are good? Would you consider working for them your whole life?

The term "slavery" is given too much power. If you do not understand, you are a slave regardless of false morality. We live in a time in which slavery is more pervasive and more condemned than ever.

[edit on 11/8/2009 by Dasher]

reply to post by TangoVooDoo


If he can wisely answer my first questions, I have VERY honest questions about Angels and Demons (not the book) and other very difficult subjects (despite those who are overly mystic suggesting otherwise).

reply to post by Dasher


gahh i just had to type this twice because i accidentally deleted it..

ok first i love these questions i did not know them immediately and had to do some research because i mainly focus on prophecy and history so this was fun

romans 9..this chapter's purpose is to show that the will of God is absolute and that his promises to israel will stand and be fulfilled..the reference to jacob and esau is used to show this..www.unionchurch.com... page explains it very well..as does this one www.desiringgod.org... it shows how someone had his whole world view changed..

now christmas..it is completely unbiblical..jesus christ was not born on christmas..the celebration of christmas on the 25th was chosen by the catholic church to help convert pagans..this is in no way a folly of God but of man and does not hurt the bible or christianity at all..i am not claiming it was right what they did, it was just a political move...and yes i disagree with much of what is taught in mainstream christianity today..especially in the catholic church

in john 10:34 jesus is quoting psalm 82 where the judges are referred to as "gods"..this page.. www.ronrhodes.org... it all very simply..

reply to post by TangoVooDoo


i did not want to seem cocky at all..i would just like to see how much i know..help others..and learn more if i need to search for an answer

reply to post by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest


If the creator of the whole universe says it is ok to own a slave as his payment for a debt..id say that makes it ok..

and yes..they arent free..because if the master gives the woman to the slave to bring forth offspring..she is not the slaves..he leaves with what he came in with except for money to start out again..

the culture was not the same as ours..that is what im saying..and the slavery was in no way the same..study history..

reply to post by Dasher


see i know more about angels,demons,prophecy,and some history than i do about issues you laid out earlier...the spiritual part of the whole thing really interest me so i study it more..ive just recently really got in to science a lot..physics, some astronomy, biology..to learn more..so go ahead and ask..i hope i answered the other questions right..its out of my comfort zone but i tried haha..

although it was fun..i love to learn so..i welcome the challenge to answer somethin i knew nothing about

[edit on 8-11-2009 by resonance]

reply to post by resonance


wow. first time in a while ive ever heard someone say slavery is good.

you still havent explained
Leviticus 25:44 "And as for your male and female slaves whom you may have-from the nations that are around you, from them you may buy male and female slaves."

and then this

When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21

YAY for loving slavery.

i dont care how you try to spin it, slavery in no way was moral or friendly.


also...
try justifying this
2 Kings 2:23-24

"23And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.

24And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the LORD. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them."

how can a group of children say ANYTHING that would merit them getting torn asunder by angry bears?