NorthEast IntelNet documentary: Morality of violent punishment~

reply to post by groingrinder


Jesus was a new covenant man.
Low blow. cheap shot.

We must make fun of christians in the thread, becaue if we don't then they will not have been made fun of.

That's how i understand it anyways.

Me: Weak stomach
Thing I'm not going to do: Watch the clips

I get the idea tho and it seems horrible. However, as Sumgai said it or whatever, since the States have trained people and those people have chosen to use that training for genocide without consent then I guess these extremists should be allowed to chop off people's heads

This thread is not focused on the war, or it's reasons. It seems the purpose of this thread was to show just what happens in a beheading. For educational purposes. Now, some say it's propaganda...ok, show some proof. Is this not what happens there in a beheading?


Honestly, I'm not going to say that they should stop, if that is their way. What did the men in video do exactly? If its over petty crimes, it seems like a lot of force for such minor crap.

reply to post by ADVISOR


Yes, you are right. We did them wrong. The thing is, they believe this is how they are supposed to behave due to their religion. They believe that they have the right, and duty, to force this religion upon any and everyone, and the penalty for refusing to go along with it is beheading. That is how they handle the infidel.

We are all infidels, and the only reason *they* accepted our help and funding in the first place was because they felt *they* had something to gain. In the end, as soon as whatever factors changed the relationship post Soviet defeat, they would have turned on us when we quit being productive to them. I think this is perhaps the one point that people usually miss.

We just one upped them by digging the knife in the back first. Had the realtionship continued, they may have perhaps even further infiltrated the US, and we would have been even further up that creek than we already are.

When will it end? It won't until one side or the other is eradicated or brought to submission. You should know this from being over there. The radicals are not going to go away into submission.

Even if we withdrew all our troops and ceased everything, this would not stop. It would not have stopped had we not started all this after 9/11. It will not stop.

The radicals are not going to go away into submission.

Should we?

reply to post by ADVISOR
Explanation:

1stly you state and I quote " This is not fear mongering propaganda, it is real Islamic law being carried out, brutal punishment for crimes less than violent in nature.".

And I totally agree that the video of the executions is not fear mongering propaganda and is real Islamic law being carried out. But you, by using the articles clearly biased POV in your post shows that you had an agenda to push as otherwise the need to say its wasn't propaganda would have been a moot point! Apparently the video is on several other websites [the original sources?] and yet you link to this one in isolation.

Way to go in attacking the ethos of the executioners and tar them as terrorists! Also way to go and inflame the pathos of the ATS demographic with this Ideologically biased trash!

2ndly IMO this thread contravenes several ATS T&C's...specifically,

1] 1a) Offensive Content: You will not post links to images or use avatars and signatures that are offensive, abusive, distruptive and/or hateful. You will not use images, avatars or link to images or domains that contain gore, mutilation, pornography or illegal(2e) content. Doing so will result in removal of your post(s) and immediate termination of your account.

I offer the following as Evidence of such a T&C breach....

exhibit A] The title of this thread pretty much sums it up!

exhibit B] The 2 instances of weblinks to "http://homelandsecurityus.com" and I note that it isn't a .gov but a .com.

1). Posting: You will not post any material that is knowingly false, misleading, or inaccurate. You will not solicit personal information from any member. You will not use information gathered form this website to harass, abuse or harm other people.

I offer the following as Evidence of such a T&C breach....

exhibit C] By linking to a biased site and then posting that its not agitprop whilst continuing the biased slant by further linking to an article that supposedly supports the profile that both you and the " homelandsecurityus.com..." are trying to pigeon hole, not as judicially authorized executioners but, as terrorists, CLEARLY shows that this thread is misleading! The article you linked to was about an ILLEGAL beheading taking place upon US soil as opposed to say linking to a site showing how many people are LEGALLY executed in the US every year for various crimes. :shk:

1g.) Political Baiting: You will not engage in politically-charged rhetoric, politically-inspired name-calling, and related right-versus-left political bickering while posting in any topical forum or discussion thread on AboveTopSecret.com. You will not alter political candidate names or party affiliations in order to insult or deride the opposition.

I offer the above exhibits as Evidence of such a T&C breach....

Is this thread about the moral minefield of current legal executions where ever they occur and regardless of jurisdiction or methods?

OR is it a blatant attempt to tarnish the reputation of those that it has clearly and wrongly profiled as terrorists and who have been doing this from nearly time immemorial? If this is a case of the later, then I would suggest that this is not current!

1j.) Video links/embeds: You will not embed or post a link to a video without a reasonable description of its content and why it interests you, is germane to the topics discussed on ATS or the topic of an existing thread should you post it in a reply to an existing thread.

I offer the following exhibits as Evidence of such a T&C breach....

exhibit D] 26 October 2009: A little over five years ago, this web site was the first legitimate site to publish the actual videos of men and women being beheaded by Islamic terrorists. [Sourced direct from "http://homelandsecurityus.com"]

This is not a current issue, except for "http://homelandsecurityus.com" and the OP bringing it up again, and I ask where is the conspiracy?

Oh that's right..I had to hunt down where "http://homelandsecurityus.com" got its MSM debut ....."I found out about your website today as I was watching Neil Cavuto on Fox News."

RE: "This is not fear mongering propaganda,"....:shk: EPIC FAIL!

Personal Disclosure: I have made an official complaint! Now I have some concerns regarding the OP, who is a supermod of ATS, who IMO should have been quite well aware of ATS's T&C's!

Will the OP disclose on whether they will moderate this thread and/or the complaints made about it and/or members posts to it?

Will the other representatives of the message board also disclose whether they feel this thread breaches their sense of poor taste and is therefor objectionable and/or deemed offensive?

If the answer to the question directly above is yes, will the OP 404 this thread themselves in line with the T&C's......

5b) Cooperation: You will, if asked by myself or a moderator, cease posting any content, and/or links to content, deemed offensive, objectionable, or in poor taste by the representatives of the message board.

???

P.S. This is the basic premise of the post that I redacted above. But its now complete and also edited for greater clarity and to remove any personal bias and /or errors that had crept in. I apologize for any confusion that I may have caused!

reply to post by OmegaLogos


No, I will not take any other staff action other than the ones previously taken. Ititiating a complaint (on your behalf against myself), mentioned in your original redacted reply, that I replied to and also redacted due to your redactment.



So, this we leave for further staff review and, hopefully the issue of my alleged infraction/s won't disrupt the participiation of this topic, that I feel should be addressed in a public awareness capacity.

There are those that do things to deserve punishment, and there are those that punish others because they are zealots.
What I saw is barbaric to say the least.
As judgmental as that sounds, who am I to judge anyone?
What were their crimes?
Who gave the punishers their authority?

Lord GOD almighty, please help us understand ourselves, because we haven't been able to for the last 2 million years.
No one wants to be a victim or recipient of such punishment.
I have said this a million times, EVERYONE KEEPS FORGETTING THAT WE ARE ALL HUMAN!!!

Those that murder, those that rape, those that harm, have Forgotten who their victims are, fellow Humans.
They have forgotten who they are.
They view their victims as less than human, and they themselves are no longer such.
They are now abominations.
So what does that make those who punish them?
Human?

"Some say a comet will fall from the sky, followed by meteor showers and tidal waves"...........................................................................

reply to post by OmegaLogos


very good job
i wonder what their staff are waiting for to delete this #

reply to post by ADVISOR
Explanation: St*r for your prompt and explicit reply!

Personal Disclosure: I myself have no issues with the graphic nature of the video linked and I do admit without reservation that the thread was clearly marked as extremely graphic in nature. I'm just seeking clarity on this issue as it appears to me to be highly incongruent with what I am aware the ATS T&C's imply. I'm all for having ignorance denied concerning the issues this thread alludes to but not at the cost of ambigiuity over the ATS T&C's.

P.S. Notice to All members. Please feel free to continue with your participation in this thread. I feel I've "done my bit" for now concerning the issues I have with it and I feel I have so far recieved appropriate action and service with regards my complaints. Carry ON!

mww a homeland sec. video......nice propaganda ..
i wonder how much the payed them for it....

on you tube was once a vid how coalition troops beheaded a iraqi woman...

do'nt fall for it... its all setup propaganda...

Originally posted by LordBaskettIV
That was messed up. To be honest, i thought that they beheaded people differently. Why wouldn't they use a bigger blade or something? I'm more shocked than anything....

And believe me that video in the OP is an old one. There are far more horrendous videos out there. Nepalese Taliban Beheading. Google will point people to some of the most nightmarish godawful acts of pure evil imaginable.

But of chourse, it's all the Wests fault as mentioned by certain members in this thread. We made them do this to their own people and anyone who ventures into their lands....

Originally posted by silo13
It's their country, their belief system, their law. Leave them to it.

I agree. So long as we know that's what goes on however, and it's not all proud tribal warriors valiantly protecting their lands...

Anyone who believes the war in Afghanistan is all about saving lives has their head so buried in the sand it’s beyond comprehension.

Well it certainly is easier to bury your head in the sand, when it's CUT OFF.

I love how people can look beyond the atrocities and still find blame elsewhere. These beheadings were not against combatants. They were against their own people.

Argh... why bother..

reply to post by ADVISOR


Can't talk about drugs and legislation relating to drugs but we can post incredibly graphic videos of people having their heads sawn off. Good to know.

The taliban are terrible. Ok yes so the invasion of Afghanistan by our forces has lead to civilians being killed but at least those were accidents. The way they kill these people is utterly horrific. I hope every single one of these taliban scumbags gets wiped out. I'm not really sure of what else can be said other than we need a massive push in Afghanistan. The problem is, where do we get the troops for it?

For whom it concerns, staff has discussed the issue and the direct link to the video has been removed.

Site containing linked video still falls under the warning attached, no graphic material is visable on linked website. How ever video link can be accessed from the site.

Linked video has been removed from Opening Post of this thread, after review by staff.

Originally posted by heyo
since the States have trained people and those people have chosen to use that training for genocide without consent then I guess these extremists should be allowed to chop off people's heads

What training does one require in order for 4 or 5 men to hold the body of a bound a blindfolded man down, while one uses a short dull knife to hack into the neck and eventually twist the blade into the spinal chord of the profusely bleeding and wheezing victim?

This is not about training to fight. This is about barbarians and their backward methods of executing people that they believe have committed an offense against them. Often just because they think someone is colluding with someone else, is enough justification for this ritualistic garbage.

And as LibertyGal says, there are many many many more videos of this behaviour out there, against Koreans, Japanese, British, American, Canadians, Iraqi's, Afghanis, Nepalese, etc..

Originally posted by ImaginaryReality1984
reply to post by ADVISOR

 

Can't talk about drugs and legislation relating to drugs but we can post incredibly graphic videos

Not exactly, and after the previous incident I have re-reviewed the site policy and will do so routinely to remind myself what exactly it does pertain to.

The statement you made above is in refernce to the following, but is as I understand it, an incorrect interpretation, intentionally done or inoccently, it doesn't matter what does follows:

2e.) Illicit Activity: Discussion of illicit activities; specifically the use of mind-altering drugs & substances, engaging in computer hacking, promoting criminal hate, dicussing sexual relations with minors, and furtherance of financial schemes and scams are strictly forbidden. You will also not link to sites or online content that contains discussion or advocacy of such material. Any post mentioning or advocating personal use of illicit mind-altering drugs will result in immediate account termination.

2e.i) Narcotics and illicit mind-altering substances: Due to abuse of the subject matter by some (promoting various aspects of personal use, and discussing actual personal use), no new topics on this subject are allowed in any form.


As it was understood, that means no drug stories, but yes members can discuss the illegal activities of the drug trade and the conspiracy theories surrounding said actities.

Now please, if you must conduct an inquisition against my activites, please do so via the right channels, aka file a complaint. (which has been done, and a decision reached, move on)

But I insist on posters to remain on topic.

I didn't watch the videos because I can imagine chopping off heads is nasty business but reading thru these replies I kind of got a sense of the ol' "us Americans vs those evil satanic terrorists" mentality.

Did "us Americans" forget about the 3000 people who were blown to pieces on 9/11/2001 and that "us Americans" are still supporting political leaders who are covering up for the ex political leaders who orchestrated one of the worst massacres in history?

How about "us Americans" turning a blind eye to the over 4000 military personal we allowed to be sent off to the slaughter house in a war for profit?

Anway, nothing like a few heads rolling to get "us Americans" fired up to wanna go and kill some evil wicked terrorists in the name of......

Originally posted by Aeonsattention onto you as well.

But so long as we fear to stare down the monsters amoungst us, they have power. There remains a fine line between seeing and acknowledging what they do, and becoming them.

Steel yourself, be brave, be compassionate, and do not fall into the trap of becoming what they are while examining them.

amen to that brother.

For anybody who thinks the US led Invasion of Afghanistan was to stop the barbarism of the Taliban on the people of Afghanistan or to search and destroy Bin Laden and Al Queda I would ask you to consider this:

Following 9/11, the “Bush doctrine” was put in place, which called for “a unilateral and exclusive right to preemptive attack, any time, anywhere, unfettered by any international agreements, to ensure that US forces will be strong enough to dissuade potential adversaries from pursuing a military build-up in hope of surpassing, or equaling, the power of the United States’.”[40]

NATO undertook its first ground invasion of any nation in its entire history, with the October 2001 invasion and occupation of Afghanistan. The Afghan war was in fact, planned prior to the events of 9/11, with the breakdown of major pipeline deals between major western oil companies and the Taliban. The war itself was planned over the summer of 2001 with the operational plan to go to war by mid-October.[41]

Afghanistan is extremely significant in geopolitical terms, as, “Transporting all the Caspian basin's fossil fuel through Russia or Azerbaijan would greatly enhance Russia's political and economic control over the central Asian republics, which is precisely what the west has spent 10 years trying to prevent. Piping it through Iran would enrich a regime which the US has been seeking to isolate. Sending it the long way round through China, quite aside from the strategic considerations, would be prohibitively expensive. But pipelines through Afghanistan would allow the US both to pursue its aim of ‘diversifying energy supply’ and to penetrate the world's most lucrative markets.”[42]

[40] Ellen Wood, Empire of Capital. Verso, 2003: page 160

[41] Andrew G. Marshall, Origins of Afghan War. Geopolitical Monitor: September 14, 2008:
www.geopoliticalmonitor.com...

[42] George Monbiot, America's pipe dream. The Guardian: October 23, 2001:
www.guardian.co.uk...

The above is an excerpt from a fascinating essay (with references) which can be found here:

www.globalresearch.ca...

I really recommend you guys read this,

PEACE,
RK

reply to post by honkusbobo


Excellent observation ! Islam will rot from the inside ! I've been pondering this idea for a while ! Here in the West I can see this happening ! Not fast enough !
You got to wonder why the MSM dosn't run with this !

Watching a video like this, leaves me depressed. Humankind seems to be able to commit every atrocity imaginable.

Violence always breeds more violence, but remember barbaric practices cannot only been found in the Islamic world. If you can stomach more horrible practices, you can watch this antiwar video from the paradigmshift. Viewing this video should be mandatory for all supporters of the war(s). - warning graphic!
www.youtube.com...

But contrary to the beheadings shown in the Taliban video, we share some responsibility for these crimes, because it is paid from our taxes.

“I object to violence because when it appears to do good, the good is only temporary; the evil it does is permanent.” - Mahatma Ghandi

[edit on 1-11-2009 by Drunkenshrew]