Brave student defies the Supreme Leader of Iran

reply to post by budski


The point of the OP was that the detention and dissappearance of those brave enough to stand up to the harsh rule of the Ayatollah has precedent. You call it spin? I point you to Al-Jazeera's own words:

english.aljazeera.net...

As I stated before, I'm sick and tired of people derailing threads because they insist on going-off topic in an attempt to say that because other countries do questionable things, no one has a right to voice an opinion. Your assertion that what happens in Tehran is no better or no worse than what happens in a lot of western countries is at best, misguided (I don't recall hundreds of people being detained during the Tea Party protests), but moreover has absolutely nothing to do with the OP which dealt exclusively with one student and the Grand Ayatollah. The fact that similar actions have, in the past, led to the disappearance and/ or harsh treatment of such individuals is fact, not propagandist "spin" of the MSM.

I applaud this brave young man. He was able to discern that, having won a distinguished mathematics olympiad, he was in a slightly higher position to give his two cents than was the rest of the audience 'that generally shows their devotion'.

His points were met with applause so maybe they (the leaders) listened to him?

Brave student defies the Supreme Leader of Iran

ANYWAY....

Back on topic.

I applaud the young mans stance.
Foolish? Maybe

It does show that not everything is perfect in the Paradise called Iran.

reply to post by Legion2112


I care not a jot what you're sick and tired of.

And I stand by my assertion, as I stand by my assertion of western crimes aginst people who stand up to tyranny - after all aboslutely NO protesters died this year, did they?

Don't like it?

Don't reply to it.

Simple

IMO we should be fighting against ALL examples of tyranny - not just those we find to be a convenient outlet for barely disguised islamaphobia.

For the information of all here, these kind of protests have been going on for YEARS by the young people of Iran and especially students, which is one of the reasons why Ahmadinejad has urged the islamic council on more than one occasion to take a more moderate approach, and has himself become more moderate.

Thanks everyone for your replies
Please let me point out something:

I've shared this news because just because i admire braveness, regardless the brave's in question nationality, skin color, religion, sexual orientation: i find it extremely ignorant to limit the contents that one shares to what only supports one side, no matter the side.

I don't fall easy into propaganda's traps, regardless it's from some western or eastern country: i'm from Italy and i've often shared news about scandals happened to my country, so i don't think that anyone could believe that i'm spreading some western propaganda, doing it purposely: it's news, it has happened, it's interesting, it could actually be the start of some important process (we still DON'T know its consequences), then i've shared it.

If freedom of speech was somehing warranted in the country in question (in this case, just by coincidence, Iran) then how comes that it NEVER happened before, despite many people in that country are in strong disagreement with Khamenei?

Freedom of speech, or the freedom of expression, is recognized in international and regional human rights law. The right is enshrined in Article 19 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, Article 10 of the European Convention on Human Rights, Article 13 of the American Convention on Human Rights and Article 9 of the African Charter on Human and Peoples' Rights.

The freedom of speech can be found in early human rights documents, such as Declaration of the Rights of Man and of the Citizen (1789), a key document of the French Revolution. The Declaration provides for freedom of expression in Article 11, which states that:

"The free communication of ideas and opinions is one of the most precious of the rights of man. Every citizen may, accordingly, speak, write, and print with freedom, but shall be responsible for such abuses of this freedom as shall be defined by law."

To negate freedom of speech as Iran systematically does, IS an enduring action of brutality, which doesn't even make the news anymore not because it doesn't happen, but because people are scared, controlled, beaten arrested whenever they try to say anything against that man: since this was some live covered event, of course they couldn't shot him at point-blank, but you can bet that those 24 hours have been the worse ones of his life.

BTW:

as i've previously pointed out, i've found the news saying that he returned home within the comment section: the arrest is being reported even by news agencies, example in italian but so far i've read about him being free only on some five lines comment below some news.

It was his braveness the news, just his braveness and his courage to express his view whithout even caring about the possible consequences.
That's all.

reply to post by internos


Showing my ignorance of the finer details of Iranian system of Government. Is there any built in mechanism to change or contribute to an alternate direction of the Government from peaceful means?


Or is simply just follow the directive from the top down?


[edit on 31-10-2009 by SLAYER69]

reply to post by SLAYER69


One thing that many overlook, or don't know at all, is the presence of people apparently unrelated to the regime, but they are actually informers, mixed together with the other people: since litterally everyone can be one of them, imagine the fear that they prove to share even just some thought with some guy whatsoever. This apparently meaningless detail, works like some invisible weapon potentially aimed at everyone. The consequence is the paradox that ordinary people limit their freedom of speech themselves for first. We could call it "fear strategy": the only places in which this strategy doesn't work very well are schools, especially universities: first, because there's an higher average culture, second because after some time they know who to trust in. The student in question is some math genius, he has probably some strong leadership within the students community, so maybe he felt in duty to talk in behalf of some dosens of thousands students, but this is just a guess o' mine.
While one can be opponent to the regime, to do what the guy did to the Ayatollah is some huge no-no.

reply to post by budski


In many respects I completely agree with you and it has been something I have noticed as well. For instance, the American MSM demonizes American protesters while at the same time portraying Iranian protesters as freedom fighters against an oppressive regime. I do have a suspicion this is done to garner American support for an encounter with Iran. In other words, to get us to be sympathetic towards the Iranian people and encourage action against the Iranian government. If you will, a way of programming us to do it 'for the people.'

Had you phrased it like that, I would have been in full agreement. However, you really seemed to have completely ignored what happened with this young man and were more interested in speaking of 'judge not' and pointing the finger towards subjects most of us would agree were unacceptable (like the tazing incident). So that did seem like deflection, especially considering the fact most of us feel the same way concerning oppressive governments abusing the people.

All this incident really boils down to, though, is one man's stand against such a system. It does nauseate me, though, how the MSM makes American protesters out to be villains and nutcases for expressing their opinion while the Iranian protester is 'brave.'

But please don't take the MSM's hypocrisy out on us because most ATSers see right through it.

It occurs to me that with the growing number of incidents like this, where one person can garner applause at questioning the tactics of the Ayatollah, that the Iranian government's hand may soon be forced. I think the situation has gone beyond their ability to simply silence it by arrests, detainment and dissappearance - for the good of their country I hope they can actually listen to the people that are calling for change. I think right now the government in Tehran is at somewhat of a loss - after 1979, no one would've dared question the ruling Mullahs. Now, even the Grand Ayatollah isn't immune and since having the Revolutionary Guard mow through crowds on motorcycles isn't having the intended effect, I don't think they know how to handle it.

reply to post by AshleyD


Fair enough, and you are right that I could have worded it better.

This kind of protest though, has been going on for some time - it seems almost a tradition or custom for students to speak out against the government, and it happens on a regular basis.

With that in mind, how brave is it really?

Now, don't get me wrong, it's still a brave act, but if this is a traditional way of young people expressing dissatisfaction, then the press have got hold of the wrong end of the stick.

I speak of this not through personal experience, but via the word of an Iranian pen pal who I knew at college.

This is why I state that it has perhaps been made more of than it should have been.

I applaud this young man for his bravery and chutzpah!

I do hope we get some followup on what happened to him during his questioning period and then what happens as time goes by. It might not be over for him just yet.

In terms of questioning absolute leaders, Iran is indeed in a delicate position. Remember Tiennenman? Push too hard, too fast, and the retaliation will likely be all out of proportion from the dictatorship.

I hope this brave young man sees many tomorrows of chipping away at the problems in his country.

Originally posted by budski
These people hate being criticised?

How quickly we forget.

"Don't taze me Bro!"

Look it up, then get sanctimonious.

Talk about hypocrisy and double standards

So you support and approve of the Iranian leadership and the way they treat their people? You must? Why?

Originally posted by budski
reply to post by AshleyD

 

With that in mind, how brave is it really?

Brave enough to risk his own life. Seems brave to me? Why are you so critical? If you are a supporter of the Iranian government, why not just say so?

4 days to go till the day when khamenei will wish he had never woken up from his coma!!!

reply to post by budski

The guys has actually been freed now, unharmed, so where's the story about the big, bad mullahs and the brutality of the regime?

With that in mind, how brave is it really?

So it's ok for the revolutionary guards to harrass and arrest him over criticism of Khamenei?

There's no disputing the brutality of the regime anymore, except in the minds of the ignorant. All of the brutal torturing, beatings, murdering are obvious to all who care.

Don't you get it yet?

The regime are scared of the repercussions of more mass arrests and executions! 4th November is the next big opposition rally. It's better for the opposition to choose days where the regime have their own rallies, so the security forces cannot arrest opposition supporters when they're busy joining the pro-regime rally.

This was why on Quds Day there weren't any arrests! Wake up and see what's really happening! The opposition movement are the people themselves, especially the students. The regime know this themselves, and so torturing one or two students won't help them, it will only make the situation worse for them. So in fact, this student was very brave, and took a calculated risk that the regime wouldn't dare torture or execute him - and that makes him clever as well as extremely brave!

The regime's in its dying days, and 4th November would be the perfect day for it to collapse altogether. Khamenei will wish he never woke up from his coma!

I see people here slate MSM for demonising Iran, yet what is actually happening is the MSM is reactive and often too literal analysis'. For example, they expect a revolution to happen right away, or if protests have stopped for a few weeks, that means it's over! The green revolution was never finished, and it will be victorious! Even the regime thugs - the basij, have either had enough, or the remaining loyal revolutionary guards are not numerous enough to both rally for the regime, and police the opposition protests in large enough numbers to dare even arrest one opposition supporter. Arresting them would only quicken the regime's own demise.

The new posters and slogans in Iran are all about that guy being a hero, and that is exactly why the regime loses whatever they do because this can only lead to a full blown revolution.

[edit on 31-10-2009 by john124]

reply to post by john124


Forgive my ignorance.

What is occurring in four days???

Originally posted by john124
4 days to go till the day when khamenei will wish he had never woken up from his coma!!!

Not sure what this means, is it a reference to the Nov. 4th rally?

Iranian opposition leader Mir Hossein Musavi appeared to urge his supporters on October 31 to take part in rallies on November 4 marking the 30th anniversary of the student seizure of the U.S. embassy in Tehran.

link

[edit on 31-10-2009 by LadySkadi]

reply to post by mrmonsoon


On 4 Nov 1979, Iranian militants stormed the United States Embassy in Tehran and took 71 hostages... in truth it was some 11 months before that a revolution led by the Islamic fundamentalist Ayatollah Ruholla Khomeini had overthrown Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, the shah of Iran... but Nov 4th is marked at the date they bumped heads with America and became a reborn country

reply to post by DaddyBare


So it's the anniversary of when the Iran terrorists kidnapped Americans and tortured them for months.

Perhaps soon, they will get their payback.

reply to post by mrmonsoon


in a way it's an anniversary for me too... you see on Nov 4th 79 I had been in the Marine Corps a total of 13 months... by weeks end I was sailing in the straits of Hormuz awaiting orders to mount a rescue... of course that rescue didn't work out so well... I was one scared Private first class out on my first mission..