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Changes in the Apparent Speed of Objects
In addition to affecting the apparent distance between objects, changes in camera-to-subject distance and changes in lens focal length influence the apparent speed of objects moving toward or away from the camera.
Moving away from the subject matter and using a long focal length lens (or a zoom lens used at its maximum focal length), slows down the apparent speed of objects moving toward or away from the camera.
Filmmakers often use this technique to good effect. For instance, in The Graduate, Dustin Hoffman runs down a street toward a church to try to stop a wedding. The camera with a very long focal length lens conveys what he's feeling: although he's running as fast as he can, it seems as if he's hardly moving. Both he and the audience fear he won't make it to the church on time to save the girl he loves, thus, increasing the dramatic tension in the story.
Conversely, moving close to the subject matter with a wide-angle lens increases (exaggerates) the apparent speed of objects moving toward or away from the camera.
You can easily visualize why. If you were standing on a distant hilltop watching someone run around a track or, perhaps, traffic on a distant roadway, they would seem to be hardly moving. It would be like watching with a long focal length lens. But stand right next to the track or roadway (using your visual wide-angle perspective), the person or traffic would seem to whiz by.
Together, these two traits of wide-angle perspective exaggerate apparent depth
* Objects at different distances from the camera appear to shrink in size much faster than they do in the real world.
* The distance between these objects seems much greater than normal.
In the actual world where the shot is taped, she covers a certain distance to reach the front person, regardless of the lens used. But in the wide-angle shot the distance traveled appears four times as great as in the telephoto shot. Since she covers the distance in the same time in both shots, the wide-angle lens makes her seem to be moving four times as fast.
That is why wide-angle lenses are routinely used for chase and fight scenes--and why directors try to stage the action in depth. By increasing apparent distance, they make movement appear more dynamic and exciting.
Originally posted by LightWonder
CGI planes is a far out conspiracy, i wouldnt buy into it for the sake of the truth movement please. Although while reviewing the website when he talks about the news crew filming pot holes then conveniently seeing the planes hit the towers is a little iffy, i got the same feeling when i first saw that clip. It was staged, don't get me wrong.. just CGI planes, and false-tapes are toooooo far out there for LOGIC, TPTB wouldn't make a mistake like that when they could fly the real planes into the buildings.
jmo
Originally posted by talisman
reply to post by JPhish
Right but one of the best mentalists around, Derrin Brown found out that his tricks were less successful on the "street" of New York.
Chriss Angel would let you know if there was a "trick."
You ever see someone try and pull a fast one at Yankee Stadium?
not really, 9-11 was carried out the same way a magic trick is. If you are a magician or are knowledgeable on the subject you should instantly know what I mean.
IF indeed, you start to suggest such a thing, then you must understand the slippery slope that you have engaged on.
With that logic, one could start arguing that 9/11 was "fake" that none of it really happened etc and etc.
There were planes.
tell that to the TR3B’s flying around all over the place.
No military in the world is going to plan an operation where all it would take is one single camera filming to expose their actions.
why would you need to? You’re getting overwhelmed by the intent of the trick and missing the sleight of hand.
The military can't tell where everyone in New York City is filming, neither can they dominate all amateur footage.
watch some magic videos . . . I’m not going to spell it out for you, until you at least try.
If they had that power, then why on earth is anyone allowed to talk of the matter?
not at all . . . many people claimed to have only saw/heard an explosion. Some of them were news reporters. So you obviously haven’t done your homework.
IF people staring at the Towers only saw an explosion, then on the news they saw planes, there would be a riot---much, much larger then that of Rodney King.
I don't believe they used just "real planes"
I never said there weren’t.
tell that to the TR3B’s flying around all over the place.
why would you need to? You’re getting overwhelmed by the intent of the trick and missing the sleight of hand.
watch some magic videos . . . I’m not going to spell it out for you, until you at least try.
not at all . . . many people claimed to have only saw/heard an explosion. Some of them were news reporters. So you obviously haven’t done your homework.
Originally posted by talisman
reply to post by JPhish
The point about Derrin brown, is that you can't fool all of the people all of the time especially with magic tricks, especially those who are "street-wise."
On Chriss Angel. He is a master illusionist who is well aware of tv-fakery, if there was so much of a 'hint' that something like that happened, I am sure he could detect the "bull." Derrin Brown would be another one.
Yankee Stadium?
I have seen some close calls and some pretty shady Ump calls, the people of New York is a motley crew and Yankee Stadium is a good example.
In simple terms, the people are not gullible.
On Magicians. You speak of having knowledge of the subject. So where is the list of magicians and illusionists who have bought into such a theory?
David Copperfield? Chriss Angel? Derrin Brown? Cryill from Japan?
You said the following.
“I don't believe they used just "real planes"
then you said
“I never said there weren’t.”
By saying the Planes aren't "real" you are saying there wasn't Planes.
You have any proof that is going to tell where all the amateur footage is? Or do you only have conjecture?
Moreover, how would they know the instant someone decides to pick up a camera and upload or save the images, so that they are online before they get a chance to "take the footage??"
IF the Military is that powerful, why are you allowed to talk?
No, I am not. The point is this. The Military could easily be exposed, by ONE CAMERA. No-one is going to pull and operation like that.
You do realize that it is possible that the Russians or other nations might have been "monitoring" the events as well? It just isn't the people of New York. That is too high a risk.
What does that have to do with anything?
appeal to authority (1) & an appeal to consequences (2)
Like I said, I don't see any major names supporting such a theory. In fact, I am sure if you went and contacted Derrin Brown he would think that such a theory is crazy. I am sure Chriss Angel would say the same thing.
Also, this isn't just a Video.
There is eyewitness testimony from people inside the buildings.
There is eyewitness testimony from EMP
There ie eyewitness testimony from people on the ground and beyond.
That is strongly corroborated eyewitness testimony.
STOP right there, you said that if people claimed to have experienced something other than what others saw on TV there would be riots. There weren’t riots and you just admitted that people are in disagreement over what happened.
No you didn't do your homework on eyewitness testimony. It is well known that people differ on certain things-
-and it is perfectly obvious why some people might "miss" the plane if they are looking at the wrong angle.
But the MAJORITY TESTIMONY BY FAR speaks volumes.
Most people didn’t see a damned thing, so no.
Not only that, but if the People of New York saw with their eyes something different, there would be a Riot bigger then Rodney King.
Originally posted by talisman
reply to post by JPhish
Any theory you have or hold to, must be able to stand up under its own skepticism lest it die a self-refuting death.
Let me illustrate:
YOu have implied "fake planes"
You have discounted "corroborated testimony"
You have discounted "video evidence"
Now, logically what are you left with to know 9/11 was a real event?
Using the same method, one can argue the whole thing was an illusion! If the whole thing was an illusion, then 9/11 never really happened! This is literally self-refuting.
On the other hand, arguments from authority are an important part of informal logic. Since we cannot have expert knowledge of many subjects, we often rely on the judgments of those who do. There is no fallacy involved in simply arguing that the assertion made by an authority is true. The fallacy only arises when it is claimed or implied that the authority is infallible in principle and can hence be exempted from criticism.
As an amateur magician who has pulled off NLP tricks such as Derrin Browns when there is only a .003 percent chance of success randomly . . . I can assure you that people are VERY gullible AND suggestible.
Where did I say there weren’t real planes? You need to read more carefully.
“I don't believe they used just "real planes" or just "cgi"
Where did I say there weren’t real planes? You need to read more carefully.
There are loads of video evidence and eyewitness accounts that Criss Angel walks on water and floats on air. It doesn’t mean that he really did.
STOP right there, you said that if people claimed to have experienced something other than what others saw on TV there would be riots. There weren’t riots and you just admitted that people are in disagreement over what happened.
Miss a 757 in Manhattan flying at 500 mph at an altitude of less than 1000 feet? You could miss seeing it, but do you realize how loud that would be?
appeal to the majority(3) your logic is failing.
Ha, I’m not trying to convince anyone of anything; I don’t claim to know exactly what happened that day but I know what didn’t happen. I also believe to know the manner in which it happened.
No I haven’t
“I don't believe they used just "real planes" or just "cgi"
I have not discounted corroborated testimony because corroborated insinuates the testimonies represent the truth. I discount the testimonies of a large audience of people who were duped by a magic trick.
What video evidence have I discounted???
Of course, 9-11 is a day, it happened, but what happened on that day is disputable.
For the sake of this debate we both agree that we exist, and that there is a reality in which the event “9-11” happened. There is no need to digress any further down my VALID “slippery slop”.
Originally posted by talisman
reply to post by JPhish
I am not claiming that anyone is infaliable, but, I am offering sound reasonable reasons to conclude something. That is not an appeal to authority. Often, we try and find experts in a field to see what their opinion is. A crash site investigator on crash sites etc.
how about, a 757 doesn’t fit into the hole created at the pentagon?
What I am offering is a sound reason to reject any suggestion that any "magic trick" or "lllusion" occured on 9/11, the sort that involve *no planes* and or *cgi*
It is merely suggesting *Good reasons* for supposing something.
there is no proof those people were ever on those flights, in fact, there is more proof that they weren’t.
There is also the case where we know of *real* people who happened to be on the flights.
there weren’t loads of people documenting anything; people were running away, not trying to catch a glimpse of Armageddon.
That is not the same thing. This is in the middle of New York City in broad daylight with loads of amateur's documenting the event on camera/video/visual's and with their own eyes.
So take your theory(edit:if you not your theory the idea of) to www.themagiccafe.com...
Post it under the forum's where NPL Proffesional Experts chat, and tell me the number of those experts who will agree with you and the possibility that 9/11 was an illusion or magic trick.
You said the following:
“I don't believe they used just "real planes" or just "cgi"
now you say...
Where did I say there weren’t real planes? You need to read more carefully.
-- all propositions p, it is impossible for both p and not p
Either the Planes were *REAL* or they *WEREN'T*
I can't say for example that "I don't believe you are just a real person" then afirm your personhood.
Perhaps, you would like to clarify what position you are holding?
Under very controlled conditions. Not with amateur camera people allowed to film from any angle.
No. Your misrepresenting what I am saying. For example, many years ago I was a witness to a car accident near the free-way I lived near. 3 people, including myself missed seeing the car leave the free-way and crash through the guard rail, but we witnessed the explosion. 6 or 7 others approx, witnessed the whole event.
There is nothing inconsistent with our reporting and the events. It is obvious, that we just happened to have missed the car at that moment go through the rail while others had a better angle to watch the whole thing.
this is a false analogy; sorry . . . the two events are not even comparable.
People missing the planes on 9-11 is like you missing the car drive away after your accident.
many of them are, what you just said is a blatant lie.
So people, who saw the explosions are not protesting that there were NO PLANES.
yes there are, again, a blatant lie.
There is no mass of people doing such.
YOUR also misrepresenting my point on eyewitness testimony and what is corroborated evidence.
if what is my position???
This further refutes anything you are also saying(if that is your position).
what counter testimony are you speaking of? Regardless of the testimonies you are speaking of, the answer should be obvious.
If the MEDIA is in on this *MAGIC TRICK* then please explain why they would allow "COUNTER TESTIMONY?"
ITs obvious, that no one was hiding what people reported or saw.
It is obvious that the majority of EMP and WTC workers with the lay person on the ground saw the planes crash into the buildings.
you just agreed with me, but didn’t answer the question of why no one heard a 757 flying at lower than 1000 feet at 500 mph.
You could be on the wrong angle for a visual, or just coming out of a building, there are many skyscrapers in New York City as well, if your close enough they will obstruct your view. That really is no surprise.
Incorrect. When one builds a circumstantial case, they rely on eyewitness testimony that is corroborated. That is what our Court System does on a daily basis.