How would you convince non-believers?

I dnt know if anyone has mentioned it but at least 5 countries have declassified a ton of UFO files in the past year.............
Chile, Brazil,Denmark, The UK and Russia off the top of my head. That's another strong opener.

reply to post by Belgiannewbie


First, you'd have to study the mind and how beliefs are created. Beliefs are created by mental conditioning. A course in hypnosis is a good start. But make it clinical hypnosis, not stage hypnosis or from a person that deals with those claiming to have been abducted by aliens. Also, if you can, speak with cult deprogrammers, they know the power of mental conditioning.

A believer could never convince a non-believer of anything for a believer does not require evidence, falling back on hearsay and accepting hearsay and, therefore, not being able to support his/hers beliefs.

A "non-believer" doesn't necessarily have to be a skeptic or a debunker. A "non-believer" is simply a person that has not been mentally-conditioned to believe what has been drummed into his/her (subconscious) mind. Look up the cult of Jim Jones.

If you can't support a claim with evidence, the claim has no standing.

Here is my question: "Why is it necessary to convince non-believers?"

If ETs are coming here, they alone are the responsible cover-uppers.

If ETs are coming here, I think they're rather rude not to introduce themselves.

[edit on 16-10-2009 by mbkennel]

people have thier mind made up you cant. unless you give them 100% real proof

I think you should show them the Disclosure Project. I was still sitting on the fence, trying to decided if UFOs were real or not when I came across this. If in fact these witness are telling the truth, or even if just one is telling the truth, it becomes undeniable that there exists a known alien presence here on earth.

I particularly like the credibility of the witnesses, they have nothing to gain by this and everything to lose, including quite possibly their jobs. I think it is quite easy to dismiss Conspiracy Theorists with terribly made videos, that quite often included clearly fake footage, but it is quite difficult to completely dismiss 400 credible military witnesses.

The "Disclosure" Project is being used as a panacea for all things associated with UFOs and aliens. I got news for you, while the people you've seen speak at the main get-together may sound like they know what they're talking about as far as aliens, they fall short of the mark. Those speaking may have witnessed UFOs and that's all for not a single one of them has ever seen an alien. Trust me.

So, to speak to anyone about UFOs is one thing for there is overwhelming evidence of their reality and even simple research will reward you with plenty of acceptable cases after separating the wheat from the chaff. But don't embarrass yourself as far aliens for you won't be able to provide one iota of evidence. And you don't want to come across as someone who just passes on tales or hearsay. Your students will respect you more if you tell them that, so far, all there is are claims regarding aliens. But not a single claim can be substantiated with evidence. Give your students the truth, they'll appreciate you for it.

You could bring an alien into the room, let everyone talk to it and the non believer would still not believe it. In their mind, it would be some sort of trick.

But when I began to openly talk to my friends or other people about aliens, ufo's and the possibilities, I usually start off with the aliens that visit the backwood rednecks and then move on to other hoaxers to get the laughing out of the way first.

Once that's done, I begin to talk about the small percentage of cases where the military has documented chases and such.

Usually, by this time, the smiles are gone and there's a look of serious thought on their faces.

If allowed in your talk, allow questions from the audience, but steer away from those who want to continue to make jokes. Because I'm willing to guarantee that there will be a small percentage of people who will want to know more.

If no questions are forthcoming, mention some of the questions you had when you began wondering.

And be open to discussing the topic after the class. I've had people who I never thought would believe tell me stories of sighting they've had once the crowd was gone.

Be sure to let us know how it turns out.

Don

There's no way to convince people of an extra-terrestrial phenomenon, because there's no hard evidence for it.

I can convince people of UFO's. Unidentified Flying Objects. That's as far as my convincing goes.

Option A) Provide real evidence to your claims. Real evidence, not circumstantial evidence. Bear in mind virtually no one contests that UFOs exist or that extraterrestrial life is probable, but asking someone to believe that UFOs are piloted by intelligent extraterrestrials who are visiting us is a different story.

Option B) Give them a full frontal lobotomy and then ask them to believe what you believe based on your word alone, and hope reducing them to sub-animal levels of intelligence is enough to have that work.

they want evidence/proof

the presidential ones should be convincing.

Originally posted by phlie
I think you should show them the Disclosure Project. I was still sitting on the fence, trying to decided if UFOs were real or not when I came across this. If in fact these witness are telling the truth, or even if just one is telling the truth, it becomes undeniable that there exists a known alien presence here on earth.

I particularly like the credibility of the witnesses, they have nothing to gain by this and everything to lose, including quite possibly their jobs. I think it is quite easy to dismiss Conspiracy Theorists with terribly made videos, that quite often included clearly fake footage, but it is quite difficult to completely dismiss 400 credible military witnesses.

They have quite a lot to gain (as well as quite a lot to lose in the case of the non-retired people), but yes, the disclosure project has a lot of solid cases. Proof? No. Strong evidence? No. Good evidence? Yes.

reply to post by paraclete1


I will definatly tell the ATS members how it went, but it'll take a while seeing my presentation will be held in may next year :d

I have to write about 70 pages about my subject and that's quite challenging, i have a lot that i can write ( in my paper ) and talk ( in my presentation ) about.

I'm always open to new cases and encounters, documentaries etc that i haven't seen yet that i can watch to utilize in my project.

Please let me know what you, and the other members that are reading this definatly would put in there information wize, as in significant undeniable encounters etc or studies

I don't know about the extra-terrestrial (or extra-dimensional) hypothesis but theres quite a lot of evidence to suggest the actual UFO phenomenon exists - there's credible government documentary evidence, credible radar/sonar evidence, credible electromagnetic interference evidence, credible ground trace evidence and credible (circumstantial) evidence in the form of sworn eyewitness testimony from 1000s of credible individuals.

I'd also say there are credible grounds to beleive that many United States Air Force 'explanations' for specific UFO incidents are deliberately concocted falsehoods -see here.


Other links:

Government Documentary evidence


Pilot Reports


Police Reports


USO Reports


Reports from Nuclear/Atomic Installations.


56 UFO Incidents involving electromagnetic effects


Statements made on the UFO subject



Theres also the NICAP Evidence files which are well worth a read:

www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...
www.nicap.org...

Good luck with the project for your finals.
Cheers.

Originally posted by platipus
they want evidence/proof

the presidential ones should be convincing.

you mean the carter incident etc?

Originally posted by andy1033
Personally i would not bother, you either believe in aliens and ufos or you do not. How people think we are alone in this universe is bizarre. But they are conditioned to think people are great when most of the human race are not.

Waste of time turning skeptics. Do not waste your breath with them on this, there are plenty who will listen though.

I would not go that far. I am considered a skeptic, but I am also open minded. What will it take to convince me? Real and Pure Evidence.

I have seen some videos recently on here of some zig zagging UFO's that Mufon released that really caught my attention. Their flight Pattern was not anything I have seen before and really made me think. Was it overly convincing? No, but it really opened my eyes and I want to see more.

There is so much junk out there. There are so many self proclaimed experts all trying to get into the spotlight. There are also many who will lie and try to manipulate just like many claim the Governments are doing.

I will even come out and say it is a large percentage of the believers who actually make me more of a skeptic. What I would like to see is people talk over and evaluate the evidence that gets presented. I want to see people not jump on band wagons. I want to see people automatically get suspicious of self proclaimed prophets who make extraordinary claims, all the while having book and television deals waiting in the wings. To me they are salesmen, simply looking for easy sales.

Be Suspicious of not just the powers that be, but also of those who want to be in that position.

By proof, you would prove the beliefs you have to be true to unbelievers WHEN you actually show artifacts ACTUALLY WORKING, like "scratching" an unknown rock allie on hardened Sapphire leaving a visible mark.

show actual wounds on body supposedly left by laser or beam attacks.

let people carefully inspect the evidence.

Have clear, non foggy pictures or videos that are mind numbing clear of ships, aliens.

Capture an alien and show him to media. Or rescue a young person formally in cages or chains from Dulce base.

REal Proof. Not talk.

Fair enough?

Reverse engineered technology .


- holographic image / cloaking

- optic fibre / nanotech

Have them take a look at the Drake equation. The Drake equation should be enough to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, with sheer statistical force, that there must be intelligent ETs. Drake Equation here is a calculator for the Drake Equation

reply to post by Belgiannewbie


I have some very convincing methods if necessary. I'm not from this planet and was brought to earth. I was placed inside a human body at the age of 30 of your earth years that I still occupy until now. I have been in this body for more than 20 of your earth years, I will not give my exact age other than to say the human body I occupy is over 50 of your earth years. I could share more but will only do so when given full access. Whether anyone believes a word I write or not makes no difference to me, I am more than aware of the details on this planet. Most of the humans on earth are in a deep sleep and in great denial of many things. Most of you have been programmed this way and can only be awoken through, I can say nothing further at this time.

Originally posted by JScytale
Option A) Provide real evidence to your claims. Real evidence, not circumstantial evidence. Bear in mind virtually no one contests that UFOs exist or that extraterrestrial life is probable, but asking someone to believe that UFOs are piloted by intelligent extraterrestrials who are visiting us is a different story.

jkrog's advice is good, present what evidence there is of the Belgian case and a couple of others. Proving UFOs exist is easy because as JScytale says, no one contests the existence of UFOs. 95% of sightings are attributable to known causes but that still leaves 5% of sightings that can't be explained.

Then pose some possibilities for what they could be and let people decide from themselves.I disagree with the poster who said if you rule out all the manmade causes they must be aliens, for example, how does he know they're not, say, time travelers for example? And there could be other explanations for non-manmade sightings besides aliens, or time travelers too. Nobody really knows what they are, that's why they are called "unidentified" (apparently some people think they know what they are but there's a lot of speculation and guesswork going on).