To Hell with the Health Insurance Companies

reply to post by Southern Guardian

The healthcare industry doesnt give a damn, and quiet frankly if nothing is done those insurance companies will continue to work in cooperation to raise costs and ration healthcare. Everything folks accuse of government healthcare, all the fears can exactly be attributed to the current healthcare insurance industry. Costs will continue to rise, people will continue to be stepped all over so long as these wealthy elite thugs have a monopoly on the healthcare of americans.

You're right. One thing no one asks....

Where are the CEO's and stock holders of the health care industry that care so much for the AMERICAN PEOPLE?? I don't see them on television explaining why they DENIED COVERAGE TO SOMEONE WITH CANCER OR ANY OTHER LIFE THREATENING DISEASE!!!

People need to drop the politics on this! It's about life and well being! I just can't believe people defend the insurance companies...it's dumbfounding.

Originally posted by David9176
reply to post by mental modulator

 

I SEE that all business is not equal , this business is different; Healthcare is not a luxury, it is a necessity.

Absolutely! I'm all for people starting businesses and growing...but healthcare is different. It's LIFE and DEATH. I don't get it. Everyone is worried that the government will tax them.....yet they are basically TAXED by the health insurance industry as they profit from them by DENYING CARE.

It doesn't make sense. GOD i hope things change and people start to see things differently.

When you are on your deathbed...you won't care where the treatment comes from or how much it costs as long as you get it......although people seem to say that they don't want it regardless.

yeah right. When you are screaming in pain you'll do it. Hell, I remember 3 years ago i had a horrible ear infection. I didn't sleep for days it hurt so bad...but unfortunately...i lost my job because my former company relocated to Mexico...THANKS NAFTA!!!!!!!!!!! Anyway...no insurance...so I suffered. Could have gotten medicine...but nope...no job...no money...no insurance. Luckily it didn't get much worse than it did...hell...maybe it scrambled my brains a bit...who knows!!

You know what us poor folk do when we are out coverage???

Go to a fish store where there is a small selection of antibiotics, good for
ear, throat and upper respiratory infections



Seriously D, I have gone to a FISH STORE to treat myself

This place is back assed!

all men created equal... to a Carp or Crappy

reply to post by desert

Corporations, not govt, have encouraged unhealthy lifestyles that only feed the health care beast.

You nailed it in that statement. The same corporate garbage that promotes us to be unhealthy are the same ones that have a stake into making money off of us being unhealthy.

It's all complete BS!!

I'm tired of paying....aren't you? It's time for them to pay. It's not right...and it's certainly not anything close to being FAIR AND EQUAL...you know...this nation is supposed to preach equality.

WTF happened to that? I guess that doesn't apply when money is involved.

Lol....maybe it's just me...everything seems to tick me off lately!

reply to post by mental modulator

Seriously D, I have gone to a FISH STORE to treat myself

Lol. What did you get? Leech treatment? You could have gotten the same thing from the health insurance industry!!!

The country is ass backwards. What ticks me off is that people who consider themselves "conservatives" will flat out ignore this thread. I thought conservatives were about their country and protecting it's people..I guess that only applies when it COSTS TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN AN UNJUST AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL WAR IN IRAQ WHILE WHERE SOLDIERS AND INNOCENTS DIE....yet....

WE CAN"T EVEN GIVE THE PEOPLE HERE ADEQUATE HEALTH CARE!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I should have titled this thread....

Obama not an American citizen! Birth Certificiciciciate not real!

reply to post by Southern Guardian

Are people going to continue to deny until they or a loved one of theirs becomes yet another victim to the broken profiteering healthcare industry? Something needs to be done, and it doesnt necessarily mean you need to support the current public option bills. By the least speak out as loud about the need to fix this broken system of healthcare as you do in disagreement of the public option. I have not once seen anybody here or among those protesters do so.

I meant to add this in my last post to you but I'm drank a few so I apologize. Some of the people on ATS are nothing but propaganda spewers...as you certainly know.

Others though...I think are just misled. Many people who are protesting are actually hurting...they just don't know why and they are looking for someone to blame. I don't think they are all racists like much of the media is proclaiming...although definitely some are racist. You can see it here on ATS as well and I've been criticized for calling them out.

Eventually, SG, everything will have to come to a finality. It's my belief that Republicans will gain seats in the next election and will no longer be able to sit and just criticize everything under the sun. Then, I think, people will become more aware of what is happening because Republicans have no intention of doing what is best for the common man. They have destroyed what good was in the Ron Paul movement and morphed it into something else as most RP supporters actually believed in something.

Republicans don't believe in anything.

Originally posted by David9176
I made just under 30,000 last year. 1500 dollars is a lot of money for me.

I think John Edwards, even with all his millions, understood what it meant to live on your income. I think the Obamas know this, too. The rest either don't want to admit they understand, are truly clueless, or are truly hard hearted. They will call you "middle class", when you and I know damn well it bares little resemblance to America's late, great middle class. How dare they call you a thief, a classwarfareterrorist, an ingrate, when you ask that the middle class wealth be returned to you and others like you!

How dare they! How dare they? Because they think you will believe you are a thief, a classwarfareterrorist, ingrate and return to your life of submission as a good corporate citizen. The chains that keep people submissive are the ones they themselves put on.

With that said, I must add that the struggle, the fight, to take back this great country from its corporate handlers, will, unfortunately, be a protracted battle. The disappointment for some is that this war will not involve weapons, or hiding out. Rather it will be one of minds and will, acting collectively, organizing for the good of the country not the corporation. We are born with the greatest weapon man has for species survival, the mind. It truly is a terrible thing to waste.

Originally posted by David9176
reply to post by desert

 

Corporations, not govt, have encouraged unhealthy lifestyles that only feed the health care beast.

You nailed it in that statement. The same corporate garbage that promotes us to be unhealthy are the same ones that have a stake into making money off of us being unhealthy.

It's all complete BS!!

Well this is the side of "Liberty" where we do have the choice...

I would think that all the strict capitalists would recognize that there is plenty of money to be made, more money than we can comprehend. Is the whole world LESS this one industry not enough? I think it is!

I mean a whole lot of the arguments against some kind of change are based on fear and theoreticals. This goes hand in hand with the whole game - people are directed from talking about healthcare to talking against healthcare or arguing things that have nothing to do with healthcare. That is the point I guess...

[edit on 19-9-2009 by mental modulator]

Originally posted by David9176
reply to post by mental modulator

 

Seriously D, I have gone to a FISH STORE to treat myself

Lol. What did you get? Leech treatment? You could have gotten the same thing from the health insurance industry!!!

The country is ass backwards. What ticks me off is that people who consider themselves "conservatives" will flat out ignore this thread. I thought conservatives were about their country and protecting it's people..I guess that only applies when it COSTS TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN AN UNJUST AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL WAR IN IRAQ WHILE WHERE SOLDIERS AND INNOCENTS DIE....yet....

WE CAN"T EVEN GIVE THE PEOPLE HERE ADEQUATE HEALTH CARE!!!!!!!!!

Maybe I should have titled this thread....

Obama not an American citizen! Birth Certificiciciciate not real!

Jesus D, you sound like me, I am worried now for the human race

ROTFLMAO

NO, NO



tetracycline!!!

The funny thing is the clerks are hip to it and will give you suggestions.... ...

Like a pharmacist would



[edit on 19-9-2009 by mental modulator]

reply to post by desert

With that said, I must add that the struggle, the fight, to take back this great country from its corporate handlers, will, unfortunately, be a protracted battle. The disappointment for some is that this war will not involve weapons, or hiding out. Rather it will be one of minds and will, acting collectively, organizing for the good of the country not the corporation. We are born with the greatest weapon man has for species survival, the mind. It truly is a terrible thing to waste.

It will be a tough fight for sure....almost impossible. When the media is so easy to manipulate the thoughts and opinoins of the masses....it makes it extremely difficult. I was there once. It takes much to get beyond it. I've spent almost a year following politics. I'm far from where i first was and I understand things a bit better...but I'm also also able to see through the BS better as well....and see those who truly care and are legitimate with their feelings...and posts here on ATS. Ironically, I've learned more from those I disagree/disagreed with. Understanding why someone believes what they believes makes you question your won thinking. I think too many shut that out and just ignore it.

With the debt continuing to mount...and people continuing to struggle...eventually it won't be about the government. It will be about who has money and who doesn't...and that is why most of the focus is on the government right now. It's diversion. If Obama is who he stated he was in his campaign...he would have called out all the corporate garbage already. He hasn't.

Meanwhile...the banks and insurance companies are looting and plundering us while we are already beaten down.

Eventually things will change....if things get better though economy wise...it won't....and the cycle will continue...as people will fall back into their slumber.

We need to break the cycle and give people a fighting chance again!

reply to post by mental modulator



I found the one I used to take -

www.drsfostersmith.com...

It's good chit, but it might make your eyes a bit buggy

Erythromycin - is the other one you take for things like an infected toof, big wound, etc...

Anyways, its a good brand and I stand by it as a consumer!




[edit on 19-9-2009 by mental modulator]

Originally posted by desert

Originally posted by David9176
I made just under 30,000 last year. 1500 dollars is a lot of money for me.

The chains that keep people submissive are the ones they themselves put on.

Seriously!

This is what frustrates me to no end... This is OUR problem -

ARGH!!!

reply to post by mental modulator

Erythromycin - is the other one you take for things like an infected toof, big wound, etc... Anyways, its a good brand and I stand by it as a consumer!

I have no idea what that is! I do know that when I had that nasty ear infection....i took vicadins...they have no effect on me. My wife's grandmother has back pills called darphacets (spellled wrong)...and wow...good stuff! Took the pain away and i got some sleep after 3 days.


As you stated above..as Desert posted....we support our own demise.

One day we will get beyond it...I don't know how much suffering and pain i t will take though.

GD.....why can't people do what's best for their kids? You'd think that would make it easier....

Originally posted by David9176
reply to post by mental modulator

 

Erythromycin - is the other one you take for things like an infected toof, big wound, etc... Anyways, its a good brand and I stand by it as a consumer!

I have no idea what that is! I do know that when I had that nasty ear infection....i took vicadins...they have no effect on me. My wife's grandmother has back pills called darphacets (spellled wrong)...and wow...good stuff! Took the pain away and i got some sleep after 3 days.


As you stated above..as Desert posted....we support our own demise.

One day we will get beyond it...I don't know how much suffering and pain i t will take though.

GD.....why can't people do what's best for their kids? You'd think that would make it easier....

Well I know you don't buy into it, but I truly believe many really think that the pathway to liberty is thru self and only self.

I have been reading more founding fathers writings and they see individuality a key, but I also see that these guys really did care about community and brotherhood as well. I don't think these could have ever imagined a profit machine that is intended
to feed on peoples livelihood in this fashion, who could? Never the less I think many people chose to exclude the sentiment that we are in this together, that we look after our own and then get out of the way.

I found this in the articles of enumeration

To lay and collect taxes, duties, imposts and excises, to pay the debts and provide for the common defense and general welfare of the United States; but all duties, imposts and excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

Notice that word?

then notice the first word in the definition

health, happiness and prosperity

en.wiktionary.org...

Strange that this notion is right next to the MILITARY

the same word Welfare is what allows for all the things we all use everyday...

It is very funny that the first word in the definition is cited as UNCONSTITUTIONAL in federal domain, yet, ROADS, BRIDGES and HARBORS which are not in the definition of the word welfare are fine.

Knowledge....information... is power. The internet is the best way ever to get so much information about medicines.

Hey, everybody at ATS who is not from the US...guess what, Americans are being reduced to getting BASIC medication from fish stores and horse supply businesses. Sure, WalMart might offer cheap medicines, but it's the doctor's visit to get the cheap meds that's expensive.

Corporations cry that they want the same tax structure as European countries. Fine. Fine. Trade our tax structure AND health care system for theirs. Give us the same health and other services Europeans receive. If you corporations want to enjoy European style taxes, then we non-corporations want to enjoy what citizens enjoy in those countries of which you're so envious.

Originally posted by mental modulator


Dude it sound to me like you are defending people you don't know, I mean at the top you may be defending a couple Saudi's, a one eyed Russian and a Liberal for all you know.

HEll man I pay into the GD system, I don't go to the doctor ever, so why can't my fricking money be applied to D's wife and baby? Why do we both have to pay for the bloated pig machine, why can't we just pay for the damn COST, nothing more nothing less? We aren't talking a new car, a night on the town, cheeseburger or a trip somewhere, a bottle of water, a movie... Isn't there enough room out there to make ALLLLLL the money anyone could ever spend. There is a distinction aravoth, I don't care if the point is to adhere to objectivism, the world is an oyster, spread forth and make a Trillion dollars for all I care, but this clam is not to be shucked.

Your disagreement is ideological, but right now ideas need to take a back seat to implications. A good business man will not find a new venture to invest in, it is the nature of business, we are the people and in this one case we should come first!

And Looters??? How does D having a strong opinion, a new family and an uncertain world ahead have to do with looting? I think you are defending the looters frankly.

[edit on 19-9-2009 by mental modulator]

I know these people, I work in a major hospital. I know the work flow, I know the cost, and I know exactly how the Government subsidizes over 60% of the healthcare industry already. In fact in my hospital alone, over 70% of all cases are paid for by the Feds. By you and me. And I am not talking about snivels either. I am talking about Birth, and open heart surgery.

The title of this thread admits disdain for insurance companies and I agree with the original poster that a majority of the Insurance companies in the US are a pain in the ass. And they get that way, when the government re-imburses them. Or when the government subsidizes a majority of their cost.

The ridiculous notion about "universal" healthcare, is that Insurance companies are afraid of it. This propagandized statement is a lie, and about as divisive as a it gets. The company I work for is the largest health provider of it's kind in the United States. It also has the largest lobby among healthcare companies in the United States. Do you know what it lobbies for?

Universal Coverage for all Americans, that's what it lobbies for. In fact we routinely have government "officials" in our facilities watching how our organization works. I already know exactly what our National healthcare system will be. Because I already work in it. If you knew what I know about this company, you would not want this.

This nationalized healthcare system is not about the people VS. The Corporations. It's about Government colluding with insurance companies and private HMO's to deliver health coverage. If you think Insurance companies are raking in millions now. Wait until every single working man woman and child are forced to pay for healthcare by government mandate. These companies will do to socialized medicine exactly what they did to Medicare. They will charge the maximum amount, they will charge for procedures that do not exist, if you think fraud is bad now, wait until this thing passes.

Supporting this, is supporting corporatism. Why this is so hard for people to understand is beyond me. The healthcare lobby are the ones that created this proposed system. You really think a bunch of people in congress wrote it? They don't have the knowledge of either medicine, or of insurance to write such a bill. They have no idea what conditions are more severe than others, or how to triage. How then are they going to explain what is covered and how? They aren't. The lobbyist that paid them all off will take care of all of that for them. And the company he works for (the one I work for) is going to get unbelievably rich from it. But the catch is, patient load will increase dramatically, Doctors at my hospital all ready have a patient to MD ratio of 3,600 patients, to one doctor. And now we are going to ask them to handle a lot more than that, for a lot less money.

This will not end well.

Healthcare is not a car. You don't just park it on the side of the road and hop in whenever you need to go somewhere. Healthcare is comprised of people, not machine parts. Everyone already has a right to get healthcare, it's what bankrupts hospitals all the time. I understand David's frustration with the cost of having a child. I have two children. And the first was born by emergency c-section. I know all about the cost, believe me. But if you think that is expensive, wait until your paying for everyone else's, every single month, when corporations are forcing the government to pay more and more by increasing the costs incrementally. They've done it before, I'm sure they will do it again. Matter of fact, My company routinely charges someone with medicare coverage the maximum, while a person with private insurance gets charged much less for the same issue.

Something to think about. It isn't what it seems.

[edit on 19-9-2009 by aravoth]

reply to post by David9176

I don't want to see government take over health care...I'd like to see it non-profit and take out the middle man...THE HEALTH INSURANCE INDUSTRY....which makes nothing and does nothing for the public but MOVE NUMBERS AROUND.

It amazes me how many people have never considered that "health care reform" need not involve insurance companies or the Government.

Great thread star and flag!

BTW you are not getting all the stars and flags because you are not regurgitating the rhetoric of either side of the partisan debate.

Originally posted by aravoth
[But if you think that is expensive, wait until your paying for everyone else's,

Because goodness knows you dont that already through the current private scheme.

Just putting this here in support of the OP:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Why are Iraqis more deserving of good health than Americans?



As long as profit plays a part in health care, citizens of the wealthiest nation on Earth will only be as healthy as they can individually afford to be.

For example, Steve Jobs' transplant. He moved to Tennessee just to get it. I'm sure there were people on the waiting list in his home state and Tennessee who were ahead of him. Money talks.



[edit on 19/9/2009 by kosmicjack]

Originally posted by Southern Guardian


Because goodness knows you dont that already through the current private scheme.

OK, so I guess you are all in favor of forcing taxpayers to make the CEO of a major HMO even richer than he already is? How intellectual of you.

This is corpatist crap. There is no seperation between the US Government and Any large Corporation in this country. None, at all. Nationalized health-care is no different. That is why political parties are complete BS. Until people figure that out, this country will continue to circle the toilet bowl.

reply to post by David9176


David, I love reading many of your threads. I too do not bash the government/Obama just because that is what they are...I bash them because of a bad idea or plan.

I have talked to many adults (family, co-workers, teachers) and peers (students). A LOT of people do not like what the government is pushing through in regards to a health care reform.

But guess why? It isn't because our government is liberal. It isn't because Obama is black. It is because almost everything they ever do comes with unwanted consequences on the American people in regards to the over all economy.

When I ask them "Are you against the idea of nationalized health care, or is it something else?"

The answer I get is what I just previously said. It is to hard to believe that our government actually wants to do something good.

I have always told people that insurance companies are a JOKE. No need to further explain that.

IMO, if Obama truly wants this through, there would be a guide to dummies explaining what he truly wants, and on top of that, he would explain that guide. There is to much confusion in the air.