Tyrants who love "conspiracy theories"

reply to post by HunkaHunka

Except that in this case, it's self evident.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

[edit on 10-9-2009 by OmegaPoint]

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by LordCarpainter
And both Hitler/Stalin were financed by Wall Street. They also both had strong connections to the Vatican.

I see these huge leaps in speculation all over the place. And they eventually turn into "reversal of truth" mentioned in the OP. This one goes something like this:

1. Hitler had money in banks in New York becomes

2. Hitler was financed by Wall Street becomes

3. Hitler was financed by Jews/Americans becomes

4. Jews/Americans are responsible for WWII

No, Hitler was financed by George W. Bush's grandfather and his cronies, and that is where the Bush crime family really got it's start, I should say the Busche crime family. Nazis. And the past administration looked a LOT like the resurrection of the ghost of Hitler, combined with the crusades of the Knights Templar of old..

[edit on 10-9-2009 by OmegaPoint]

reply to post by Skyfloating


Nice try Skyfloating The battle for critical thinking is a thankless job. Great post.

Tyrants and evils? If this is the foundation of your perspectives, your thinking processes are no more sophisticated than those of George Bush.

reply to post by Blaine91555


Except critical thinking does not begin with a presumption or a conclusion biased by any sort of emotional attachment or inclination, and requires, by neccessity, an open mind that is free of any sort of contempt, prior to investigation. That's critical thinking. You cannot assume.

The argument of "our government would never do such a thing, or allow it to happen, or cover it up" is not an argument based on critical thinking.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by OmegaPoint]

I enjoy coming here and exchanging ideas. But almost any perspective that isn't sanctioned by our corporate-government media is considered a conspiracy theory. I don't think that bothers me enough to try to shout-down people that buy the official MSM version of events.

Most people here seem to be concerned with discovering the truth about various topics. Yes there is some intentional subterfuge at times, and I've also encountered some great pieces that I would guess are just fiction. But what I like is the ability to be exposed to facts, which have been hidden from us for whatever reasons.

Questioning things and using critical thinking: this is paramount to our survival.
Only in an Orwellian dystopia would some one seriously call independent thinkers en masse a bunch of tyrants.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
And anyone who dares to expose the misinformation is automatically "in on it", "part of the conspiracy" or as you say "Cointelpro" or "classic debunker

I think the problem is that you're arguing like a conspiracy theorist against other conspiracy theorists. You make the claim that certain others are Tyrants and use 'truth-reversal' to their advantage, but fact of the matter is, they're not reversing The Truth, they're just reversing whatever is Your Truth.

While I don't deny that some of the things you've spelled out in your OP may be more factual than not, I still think you've made your position quite clear and have your own biases to work out first.

In many if not most areas of the world; the mere premise of defending Freemasonry whilst condemning and labeling many prominent world leaders as Tyrants is absolutely absurd. I hope you understand that I have nothing against Masons myself, just a bit of constructive criticism from the real world of non-conspiracy-theorists and regular people who probably harbor this opinion.

The main thing I disagree with is your usage of the word Tyrant. It's quite a powerful term. Just as powerful as the guys on the other side who think westerners and those of other religions are Disbelievers/Transgressors/Infidels. The wording is different but its the exact same sentiment.

Best regards,

reply to post by harpsounds


Laughing about your post, as Chomsky is one who seems to never have met a conspiracy theory he didn't like; yet on the Kennedy assassination and 9/11 he takes the orthodox leftist mainstream gatekeeper positions which completely absolve the Zionists from being the perpetrators of these crimes, IOW no surprise there. Pat Buchanan plays the same sort of role from the right. It's funny how the only far out reactionaries earning paychecks from TPTB are those who always stop just short of blaming the Zionists for much of anything. Michael Savage claims to be the only anti-NWO guy out there on talk radio and yet he is the most rabid Zionist there is; surely the most glaring contradiction and elephant in any room! While Alex Jones and World Net preach the end of the world thanks to the NWO; their Zionist advertisers will gladly buy your gold for pennies on the dollar and sell it to you at a ransom; while other Semitic advertisers will sell you a years supply of meals ready to eat to save you from the engineered economic calamities being caused by Boesky, Levine, Milken, Stanford (nee Stein), Greenberg, Madoff, Bernanke, Friedman, et. al.

"Its in the eye of the beholder"

"Its only your truth"

"Its a matter of perspective"

"These are not necessarily bad"

"One mans terrorist is another mans freedom fighter"

"The U.S./Jews created WWII"

"The U.S./Jews created 9/11"


Before one can reverse facts one has to relativize facts.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by Frith
Firstly your post didn't prove that any conspiracy theories promoted by foreign leaders are actually propaganda used to shape public opinion and keep them in power. You're speculating (essentially creating a conspiracy theory) on the machinations of foreign powers without showing direct cause and effect.

So it must be a coincidence that Histories greatest mass-murderers essentially all believed in or promoted similar conspiracy-theories.

You also failed to mention nations like the USA and its allies that used conspiracy theories like the proven nonexistent WMDs allegation against Iraq that resulted in the deaths and maimings of untold thousands (millions?) over what we know now to be completely based in criminal fantasy.

The wrongdoings of the U.S. are evident. But tyrants love to exaggerate and overblow them as a means of deflection from their own wrongdoings.

I don't know what you're trying to pull here, but it isn't going to work on me.

For sure Im trying to pull a disinformation operation as some have already implied.

Originally posted by Dean Goldberry
Does anyone believe Hugo Chavez and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had anything to do with the CREATION of the criticism of the official 9/11 line of BS? If so, that's the wackiest conspiracy theory I ever heard... Even those who are rotten to the core (or close enough) aren't going to be 100% wrong about EVERYTHING.

The whole point is that credence is given to people like that while the leaders of relatively free countries are regarded with great suspicion.

Originally posted by LordCarpainter
Catholics have dominated the US Congress for decades.

People here have "proven" that Catholics run it all, that Jews run it all, that Americans run it all, that Bankers run it all, Reptilians run it all, Secret Socities run it all...and then, when they notice how contradictory it all is, they put them all into one pot and say "The Illuminati, which consists of top ranking Catholics, Freemasons, Jesuits, Intelligence Agencies, Bankers and Reptilians run it all".

Fact of the matter is that many groups are striving for power in fierce

Competition

of each other. And in order to make the competing group/movement look bad, conspiracy-theories about them are published.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by Skyfloating]

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
No, Hitler was financed by George W. Bush's grandfather and his cronies, and that is where the Bush crime family really got it's start, I should say the Busche crime family.

Another variation of "The U.S. is responsible for WWII, not the Nazis".

Another 360-degrees reversal of historically proven and documented events with no other intent than to demonize the U.S.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by Skyfloating]

Hugo Chavez is not a tyrant !

He was elected, repeatedly, and nobody not even the US media said or invented or found anything suspicious in the elections.

Do you know that their voting machines also produce a paper receipt of the vote ? Something you can get at any store in the world. I heard US voting machines give no receipt, so there is no paper trail, nothing to recount. Recount what ? Numbers in a computer ?

Also see this :
THE REVOLUTION WILL NOT BE TELEVISED

Google Video Link

www.oldamericancentury.org...
www.indybay.org...

As for electronic voting, Gould said he preferred Venezuela's system over the calculator-sized touchpads in Miami. "Each electronic vote in Venezuela also produces a ticket that voters then drop into a ballot box," Gould said. "Unlike fully electronic systems, this gives a backup that can be used to counter claims of massive fraud.

[edit on 11-9-2009 by pai mei]

Originally posted by Majorion
I think the problem is that you're arguing like a conspiracy theorist against other conspiracy theorists. You make the claim that certain others are Tyrants and use 'truth-reversal' to their advantage, but fact of the matter is, they're not reversing The Truth, they're just reversing whatever is Your Truth.

At the end of the day, behind all this weird form of relativism used, there are the fruits and end-results of certain movements. If truth has been lost, facts have been lost, there is only one way to discern whats true: By their fruits. Im looking at the fruits of certain mindsets, nothing more.

While I don't deny that some of the things you've spelled out in your OP may be more factual than not, I still think you've made your position quite clear and have your own biases to work out first.

If I were biased I would not be reading this website and would have not read at least 50 conspiracy books, including Jim Marrs, David Icke, etc.

In many if not most areas of the world; the mere premise of defending Freemasonry whilst condemning and labeling many prominent world leaders as Tyrants is absolutely absurd.

You have the "evil" Freemasons to thank for the U.S. Constitution, which is one of the most reasonable and peaceful documents out there. You have tyrants to thank for persecuting and killing Freemasons.

The fact that so many around here actively hate this decent group of people says everything about the mindset of some CTs.

The main thing I disagree with is your usage of the word Tyrant. It's quite a powerful term. Just as powerful as the guys on the other side who think westerners and those of other religions are Disbelievers/Transgressors/Infidels. The wording is different but its the exact same sentiment.

Go live in NKorea/Venezuela/Zimbabwe/Iran for a few months and you`ll better understand the other side of the argument.

Originally posted by pai mei
Hugo Chavez is not a tyrant !

He was elected, repeatedly, and nobody not even the US media said or invented or found anything suspicious in the elections.

Do you know that their voting machines also produce a paper receipt of the vote ? Something you can get at any store in the world. I heard US voting machines give no receipt, so there is no paper trail, nothing to recount. Recount what ? Numbers in a computer ?

Chavez moving to silence media crticis

Chavez jails 59 of the opposition

And thats just the beginning. Its how all madmen begin.

If 75% of the CTs were real, it would be dangerous posting them. Its funny how many post "really secret, really dangerous stuff" and then live to see the next day and post more "really secret, really dangerous stuff".

reply to post by Skyfloating

Watch that movie from my post The Revolution Will Not Be Televised- shows the US coup against Chavez, filmed from inside. See how the US media says "everything is under control in Venezuela , the new president has been named, all OK."

Why do you think the movie has that name ? Because : all the TV stations owned by the 20% rich white people of Venezuela, lied and did not show what was going on.
Millions of people surrounding the presidential palace, demanding Chavez to be released - they did not show that. They showed the new "president" chatting happily with the organizers of the coup. Corruption and exploitation of natural resources - that is what the US wants for Venezuela and all third world countries.

So what if he jailed 59 after 1 corrupt escaped from prison ? Is normal - jail the ones who helped him.

Did you know that after the coup in 2000, after he escaped alive - he killed nobody ? Some even remain free - not even in jail to continue lying using their TV stations.





[edit on 11-9-2009 by pai mei]

reply to post by pai mei


Other socialist governments also began as benign movements. Even the closing down of critical media and radio and the jailing of oppositional politicians was first seen as benign and for the good of the people.
The first step, before that, is that the ruler says he can stay in office indefinetely and that attempts not to stay in office forever are conspiracies of other countries (in this case U.S. Intelligence).

Thats how the trouble begins, although at this stage you are still seeing it as benign.

Some of the people jailed were not actually of the opposition but people who took part in the Revolution at Chavez side.

Wait and see what transpires in the next years...

reply to post by Skyfloating


The internet in Venezuela is free. Unlike some other places. I agree NK is a dictatorship, am not sure about Iran. Did not research. But Iran also has internet censorship.
Problem: 80% of Venezuela is too poor ro make themselves heard - trough the internet or media.
As long as people keep electing him - and nobody yells "fraud", not even his enemies, he is no tyrant. He is wanted there.

I lived under socialism in Romania. Is better than this s..t capitalism. Everybody pretended to work, lots of free time, vacations, no stress - everybody was hired by law. Yes we had fewer consumer items and almost no TV programs. So what. We filled our time with reading , playing outside. Sports. Now we fight like slaves among us - to serve.

Beginning of communism - the poor workers of 1900 did not want to create dictatorships when they revolted.

Do you think USA is a democracy ? Yes sure. The real tyrants are the ones behind your president. Who is just a front man. You get to "vote". Nothing has changed since Obama became president, and nothing will. Their agenda will go forward.

I am not "communist" or "capitalist". Nothing that is imposed can last. It must develop by itself - I am more of a tribalist. Something like socialism but with as little work as possible, no "jobs", no "money" and maintain the knowledge we have, tribalism does not mean going back to the woods.
Capitalism is not imposed ? It is. It's imposed on the poor. The rich feel quite free. Also it starts in school , brainwashing is required to maintain it, see John Taylor Gatto.

Nvm. I could go on and be off topic. I want to say that Chavez is not a dictator.


[edit on 11-9-2009 by pai mei]