Camouflaged New Building at Kirtland AFB

reply to post by A por uvas


looking at that i also think maybe its part of the star wars project but if they building weapons to shoot into space makes you ask your self what is it they are going to shoot do they know that hostiles are on their way?

Wow good thread Zorgon...starred and flagged.

Oddly, they had an hour lon show on just last night about the lazer that simulate fusion bombs, and turns them into electricity.

They said it takes them about one hour to set it up for each shot. They then went on to say that for it to be of any practical use, for powering a city or such they need be able to cut the time to a shot every minute.

So they are still a ways off.

They showed an image of what goes on inside this thing when the fusion occurs. It looked like a miniature lightning storm, was a really nice looking image.

I'm reffering to the reactor, laser emitter thing that the AP video talks about. They went inside, the same room, some of the video looks like it was right out of the show I watched last night.

Great thread S+F!

Here is a short video clip on high power energy sources:

Originally posted by zorgon


Now WHAT ON EARTH do we need all this mega fire power for?

[edit on 24-8-2009 by zorgon]

I wonder that too

If you haven't seen these here goes and I thought it best to say read between lines when watching.

www.history.com...

.

[edit on 25-8-2009 by Animal]

reply to post by zorgon

It seems to me that the Russians are saying that, unlike the US systems, Okno does not utilize lasers, and so does not have the power requirements of the US systems.

Airspace is monitored at night when objects in space reflect sunlight and the reflection provides the complex with the necessary information. Okno is fully automatic. It may operate without human supervision, keeping track of the known and newly detected objects. Since the complex operates in the passive mode, it does not use too much of electric power. (In fact, it needs as much as a house of 150 apartments uses.)

The US Department of Defense has three similar objects. They use lasers and therefore require more by way of electric power.

Thanks for the links about correcting outbound lasers. Of course it's theoretically possible that the system could work in reverse but titles of papers and abstracts don't usually tell the whole story.

Although very impressive progress has been made in overcoming the distorting effects of the atmosphere, beaming laser power to satellites with diffraction-limited divergence still requires considerable development. There are numerous engineering and procedural difficulties that must be overcome. We will attempt beaming laser energy to two orbital bodies (the moon and COMSTAR-4) to make accurate measurements of the state of the art in capability, identify the major areas of present difficulty, and explore ways of overcoming those difficulties.

www.osti.gov...

You've listed this one twice for some reason:
www.osti.gov...
These experiments involved attempting to light up satellites with ground based lasers (using the tracking methods I talked about). A ruby laser (red, very red) which produced 20 joules (less than an LED flashlight) was used. They were fairly successful, achieving illumination on 4 out of 7 attempts.




www.fas.org...

The division’s primary focus is on advanced optics for the detection and tracking of hostile targets. In support of the Air Force’s Airborne Laser program, this division is investigating how to use optics to precisely place a beam of laser light on a moving target at greater and greater ranges.

Yes, as I said, adaptive optics are used for tracking. The Airborne Laser program is part of the missile defense program, the idea being to shoot down ICBM's near their launch point (not hundreds of miles in space).

Operates autonomously, above the clouds, outside the range of threat weapons but sufficiently close to enemy territory

www.boeing.com...
But the program is in trouble:

Proposed cuts in missile-defense programs will greatly scale back Boeing's airborne-laser program; the budget maintains funding for more research but cancels a second prototype aircraft.

seattletimes.nwsource.com...




www.au.af.mil...
Yes, I mentioned the discussion about using ground based lasers to deal with orbital debris. But the research has not been encouraging.

In the 1990s, NASA and the U.S. Air Force Space Command studied a concept called Orion, sometimes called a "laser broom," designed to eliminate small debris. A ground-based laser would be aimed at each object until pressure from the beam, coupled with the reaction force from material ablating away from the target, sends it into a lower orbit.

Orion, though, "turned out to be not all that easy technically," says Johnson. And with an estimated cost of $500 million, "it was certainly not within anybody's budget." The system would have required its own tracking network, since current space surveillance cameras track objects only down to 10 centimeters. Engineers would have to work out a system that imparted enough momentum to move a chunk of debris and that would be sure to lower instead of raise its orbit. "There are lots of little gotchas in the Orion final report," Johnson says. "There's a reason why it's been sitting on the shelf for more than a decade."

www.airspacemag.com...




It's not really a secret that there is research into high energy beam technology (for a variety of purposes). But as I said, the green beams coming out of the Kirtland, and other observatories are not beaming power, nor are they "shooting" at anything. They are creating a light in the sky. Green is actually among the worst colors to use for for killing or sending power through the atmosphere.

I'm not sure if military secrecy qualifies as a conspiracy though. Shouldn't this be in some other forum?


[edit on 8/25/2009 by Phage]

reply to post by Phage



Regards from Boeing:

That is nothing..We have stuff that can blow the Moon into pieces.

Originally posted by Daisy-Lola
Is it possible that these "camouflaged tarps" are actually protecting not hiding something from the surrounding desert? Just a thought

Yup... 'eco friendly' Its all about protecting the desert turtles (that's why BLM is closing John's mine.I think he saw maybe two of them over 30 years )

Here is a compressor building at HAARP

Before...



After...



Seems a waste of money because obviously we can see it...



but still don't know what's under there... maybe that Alien spacecraft

Your car engine creates thousands of small explosions from the fuel/air mixture. There was one point where they tried creating engine fuel from gunpowder for cars, but it proved unreliable. Thinking along these lines, then the explosion could provide a short powerful burst of electrical energy

Yes true... but those explosions are mechanical... push a piston which eventually turns a shaft to turn your generator

The only explosions I know that generate electrical energy are atomic (EMP) which would certainly generated a lot of power for a short time

They do have the 'Trestle' to test EMP pulses on airplanes



Here... you can land right at 'ground zero'

+35° 1' 47.36", -106° 33' 27.53"

As for why they would develop such a weapon? I don't know if any of you remember a film called "Spies like us" (Dan Ackroyd & Chevy Chase) but the military use a weapon in the film that bounces a high energy beam off a satellite(s) to hit a designated target on the other side of the planet.

Ah you mean a mirror like this 4 meter diameter one?



Large Advanced Mirror Program (LAMP)

To demonstrate the ability to fabricate the large mirror required by an SBL, the Large Advanced Mirror Program (LAMP) built a lightweight, segmented 4 m diameter mirror on which testing was completed in 1989. Tests verified that the surface optical figure and quality desired were achieved, and that the mirror was controlled to the required tolerances by adaptive optics adjustments. This mirror consists of a 17 mm thick facesheet bonded to fine figure actuators that are mounted on a graphite epoxy supported reaction structure. To this day, this is the largest mirror completed for use in space. This LAMP segmented design is applicable to 10 m class mirrors, and the Large Optical Segment (LOS) program has since produced a mirror segment sized for an 11 m mirror. The large dimension of this LOS mirror segment approximates the diameter of the LAMP mirror

SBL=Space Based Laser

Alpha High Energy Laser (HEL) (this is one of the older ones, now obsolete ) This is the power core...

Megawatt class power levels were first achieved by the Mid-Infrared Advanced Chemical Laser (MIRACL) originally sponsored by the Navy, later by DARPA, and then by BMDO. Because the design was intended for sea level operation, the MIRACL laser does not achieve the optimum efficiency necessary for space-based operation. DARPA launched the Alpha laser program, with the goal of developing a megawatt level SBL that was scaleable to more powerful weapon levels and optimized for space operation. In this design, stacked cylindrical rings of nozzles are used for reactant mixing. The gain generation assembly achieves higher power by simply stacking more rings. In 1991, the Alpha laser demonstrated megawatt class power levels similar to MIRACL, but in a low pressure, space operation environment. Alpha demonstrates that multi-megawatt, space-compatible lasers can be built and operated.

Beam Control- Large Optics Demonstration Experiment (LODE) and ALI

The ability to control a beam was demonstrated at low power under the Large Optics Demonstration Experiment (LODE) in 1987. The current high power beam control technology is now being integrated with the Alpha laser and the LAMP mirror in a high power ground demonstration of the entire high energy laser weapon element. This is known as the Alpha-LAMP Integration (ALI) program.

Acquisition, Tracking, Pointing (ATP)

In 1985, the Talon Gold brassboard operated sub-scale versions of all the elements needed in the operational ATP system including separate pointing and tracking apertures, an illuminator, an inertial reference gyro system, fire control mode logic, sensors and trackers. Talon Gold achieved performance levels equivalent to that needed for the SBL. In 1991, the space-borne Relay Mirror Experiment (RME), relayed a low-power laser beam from a ground site to low-earth orbit and back down to a scoring target board at another location with greater pointing accuracy and beam stability than needed by SBL. The technology to point and control the large space structures of the SBL was validated in 1993 by the Rapid Retargeting and Precision Pointing (R2P2) program

Space Based Lasers

SPACE INTEGRATED CONTROLS EXPERIMENT (SPICE) PROGRAM - PDF
PL-TR-. 95-1035. SPACE INTEGRATED CONTROLS EXPERIMENT. (SPICE) PROGRAM. Dr. J. William Dettmer .... 12.4.3 Precision Pointing Experiment Controls Design 42
www.dtic.mil...

Already posted most of this in other topics so just look here for review
www.thelivingmoon.com...




Made bt TRW Automotive's 'Special' Division, which has now been sold to Northrop Grumann

As the name implies, TRW Automotive is a company focused on the automotive industry and the customers it serves. If you have an inquiry regarding any aspect of our automotive business or comments on the website, we urge you to contact us using the product inquiries or website feedback forms.

For TRW's global locations, click here.

On December 12, 2002, Northrop Grumman completed its acquisition of TRW Inc. Information about former TRW defense businesses (Space & Electronics, now Space Technology, and Systems, now Mission Systems) can be accessed from the Northrop Grumman website at www.northropgrumman.com.

Please note that the Aerospace business has been integrated into Goodrich Corp., which can be found at www.goodrich.com

Also, TRW Automotive is not in the credit reporting business. For information concerning that business or your personal credit history, contact one of the credit information management companies, such as Experian, Equifax or TransUnion.

www.trw.com...

Originally posted by Phage
It seems to me that the Russians are saying that, unlike the US systems, Okno does not utilize lasers, and so does not have the power requirements of the US systems.

Seems to me you need to look beyond 'official public replies' and see what is beneath it. If you want to believe the Russians don't have cool toys like we do that is your privilege

Of course it's theoretically possible that the system could work in reverse but titles of papers and abstracts don't usually tell the whole story.

Nothing theoretical about it at all, but I don't have the time to post ALL relevant material in a short time or in one thread... besides if I did it would over whelm everyone

Also the really good papers (if they are avalable for public viewing) require you to purchase them usually around $30-$40 a pop. I generally have good success contacting the author for a free copy but that takes time. And people here get mad at UFO researchers charging for a book

We have scads of papers that even I haven't had time to look over talking about collecting power from tethers, solar arrays etc in space and beaming the power back to Earth, to other satellites and spacecraft and for sending power to a Moon base during the night.

That is what all this is about but there is no way to put it all together in a hurry and have it make sense...

You've listed this one twice for some reason:

As I said too many hours of work... I guess that will teach me to try and answer your questions without sleep...

Why do you think that Kirtland AFB calls it the "Directed Energy Directorate"
www.de.afrl.af.mil...

Why is there a DIRECTED ENERGY PROFESSIONAL SOCIETY
www.deps.org...

Kirtland Air Force Base - Phillips Research Site

Phillips Research Site

The Phillips Research Site pages are organized to support Air Force Research Laboratory's Directed Energy (RD) and the Space Vehicles (RV) Directorates and are structured in such a manner that some site functions overarch both directorates. Those site specific support functions include Business Opportunities, Employment and the AFRL-PRS Reserves.

www.kirtland.af.mil...

Air Force Research Laboratory Directed Energy Directorate
www.militarymediainc.com...

AFRL Directed Energy Template - Powerpoint
[Intended for Government Use Only]
Directed Energy Directorate; Space Vehicles Directorate. Air Force Space Development Test Wing; Sandia National Laboratories; White Sands Missile Range ...
nmoia.org...

This is a small sample and doesn't include any of the military documents. I am still debating how much of that to post...

On the Lunar power transfer projects... I haven't even started on that and that is more in the NAVY thread department... this one is on Kirtland.. hard enough to keep track









[edit on 25-8-2009 by zorgon]

reply to post by zorgon

Who denies there is research in directed energy?

Why do you show a picture of lasers used for the creation of guide stars and imply that they are being used as weapons or energy transfer?

Why is this on the General Conspiracy board?

Originally posted by Phage
Why is this on the General Conspiracy board?

I am confident that if this was in an inappropriate section the PTB that watch from behind the curtain would have moved it. But if you wish, I can consult with you next time about thread placement ;up:

Originally posted by Phage
Why do you show a picture of lasers used for the creation of guide stars and imply that they are being used as weapons or energy transfer?

Why does the Air Force Research Laboratory Directed Energy Directorate use this photo...

on their official page on DEW weapons?

www.militarymediainc.com...

Works for them... works for me...

reply to post by zorgon



A controlled explosion could be used to spin a turbine? Maybe. Or it could be some sort of charge given off by the shock wave.

reply to post by zorgon

Oh, I don't know. Maybe because Starfire is part of the research being done there. Maybe because it's a cool picture. Maybe because it's a demonstration of producing a guide star for the adaptive optics they're talking about in the verbiage. I don't see any mention of it being a weapon or power transmittal system (unlike your claim).

As a part of the directorate, the Starfire Optical Range, a world-class optical research facility, develops optical sensing, imaging and propagation technologies to support Air Force aerospace missions. Primary experiments consist of using adaptive optics to perform real-time compensation for aberrations induced by the atmosphere. In addition, the range conducts research in space object imaging, advanced tracking, nonlinear optics and atmospheric physics.

www.militarymediainc.com...

Guessing from the color, I'd say it's a picture of the sodium system in use, rather than the green color of the lasers in the other one you showed (which would be using the Raleigh scattering method).

Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by zorgon

 

Oh, I don't know. Maybe because Starfire is part of the research being done there. Maybe because it's a cool picture. Maybe because it's a demonstration of producing a guide star for the adaptive optics they're talking about in the verbiage. ...

Indeed.

And that is a fair amount of speculation. That is alot of "Maybes" .

Besides, you don't have the clearance to be able to ascertain the true nature of the DEW research being performed in that area - You can only cite what is publicly available and that information is severely limited by the interests of National Security.

And if you did know what was going on because you did have clearance; then you'd deny it or keep mum about it.

(the penalties for the admission and confirmation of certain truths by cleared persons to non-cleared persons are quite harsh)





[edit on 26-8-2009 by Exuberant1]

Originally posted by Phage
Oh, I don't know. ...
Maybe because...
Maybe because it's a cool picture
Maybe because it's a demonstration

Whole lotta maybes there but I agree its a cool picture

Guessing from the color, I'd say it's a picture of the sodium system in use,

Well really no need to GUESS, because had you looked at my link you would have seen THIS

FASOR Sodium Laser

REALLY BIG COOL VERSION
Courtesy of Directed Energy Directorate, US Air Force

Its about the third section down on this page
Starfire Optical Range

A FASOR used at the Starfire Optical Range for LIDAR and laser guide star experiments is tuned to the sodium D2a line and used to excite sodium atoms in the upper atmosphere.

Original caption: "This sodium laser—being fired from the Starfire Optical Range on Kirtland Air Force Base, New Mexico—is used with deformable optics to help eliminate atmospheric distortions when gathering images of objects in space."

Though the caption states that this is a "sodium laser", this is actually misleading as the Starfire Optical Range LIDAR laser seen here is actually two solid state IR lasers, 1.064 and 1.319 microns, that are frequency summed in LBO within a doubly resonant cavity. The orange beam is observed due to the intense laser light scattering off particles in the air. In general, laser light travelling through a vaccum can not be seen unless aimed directly towards the observer.

So no need to guess...when the info was already posted

rather than the green color of the lasers in the other one you showed (which would be using the Raleigh scattering method).

Its also possible that the green beams are painted in



But certainly focusing on something close to Earth going by the angle

Gotta add at least a post on the Boeing ABL Airborne Laser Project just to have it all together

The Airborne Laser (ABL) will locate and track missiles in the boost phase of their flight, then accurately point and fire the high-energy laser, destroying enemy missiles near their launch areas.

Capabilities:

* Operates autonomously, above the clouds, outside the range of threat weapons but sufficiently close to enemy territory
* Engages early, destroying ballistic missiles in their boost phase of flight over launch area
* Cues and tracks targets, communicating with other joint theater assets for layered defense system

Unique Technology:

* Nose-mounted turret with 1.5m telescope that focuses beams on missile and collects return image and signals
* Beam Control System to acquire and track targets with precision accuracy

Look for further developments of the ABL as the global threat of ballistic missiles becomes ever more prevalent.

Boeing Fact Sheet (PDF)
www.boeing.com...

Missile Defense Agency Airborne Laser Fact Sheet (PDF)
www.mda.mil...

Defense Daily (PDF) Supplement on ABL
www.boeing.com...

Airborne Laser (ABL): Issues for Congress (PDF)
www.fas.org...





Credit: Boeing

Caption:
Boeing's high-tech YAL-1 Airborne Laser (ABL) weapons system consists of a high energy laser, flight turret assembly, tracker Illuminator lasers, and a beacon illuminator -- to be installed on modified 747-400Fs. Simply put, it first uses infrared sensors to detect missiles, then three low power tracking lasers calculate speed/aimport, and lastly, the main laser is fired for 3-5 seconds from a front-mounted turret.


Credit: Boeing



Credit: Boeing

AIRBORNE LASER

ABL Patch




Caption:
Lockheed Martin and Northrop Grumman Space Technologies working on a scaled laser beam control system built by Lockheed Martin Missiles & Space. It demonstrates the functional performance needed for the Air Force's Airborne Laser (ABL).

www.airforce-technology.com...

Boeing Integrated Defense Systems ABL
www.boeing.com...

Airborne Laser Resources
www.thelivingmoon.com...

Papers Full not Abstarcts in PDF
www.thelivingmoon.com...

Back to Kirtland AFB
Boeing Airborne Laser Facility, Kirtland AFB




Credit: Boeing

Airborne Laser (ABL) - News Release
The Integrated Test Force - Where It All Comes Together
Kirtland Air Force Base, New Mexico
www.boeing.com...



Caption
Researches at the Air Force Research Laboratory's Directed Energy Directorate at
Kirtland Air Force Base are exploring different materials to produce efficient lasers

Russian News Vimi.ru
www.vimi.ru...

Boeing Airborne Laser Facility
+35° 2' 22.43", -106° 34' 9.76"
www.thelivingmoon.com...

I was a member of the air force and I heard a lot of weird stories about secret bases. Mostly just rumors, being an airman you dont really get to find out the good stuff

The first question that comes to mind is why would they keep this up on google earth if they were trying to hide something? I mean didn't Cheney have his house blurred out? Surely they could do the same with this...