Help me out about Creation.....

Many say without doubt that God is Love, he is only made of Love....now from what I can see ..a product reflects the ingredients and after watching several documentaries which shows God's product in motion unfortunately I can see very little of his Main Ingredient...Love..

Whilst watching all the creation in the wildlife eating each other and just cant stop thinking if this was really an act of Love...I mean if we beleive that there is a God full of Love who created everything couldn't he just created a little bit less violent?..he can do everything why not giving other alternatives to survival.

I love to watch the World in motion where human civilizations are still out of bound like Africa, Antarctica and beleive me...all the animals start from early morning with only one task..what am i gonna to kill to eat.

So is our creator not only love but love survival and competitions?..so is he not alone?


Now this thread covers 2 topics...because adding up with the survival issue I cant still figure out yet how can an animal decide what to be...we had many land animals which evolved in sea..others which developed their weaponry on demand...how can all this be done?..can the mind alter the DNA?..can we as humans decide what to have in the future? are we doing this already without knowing?

www.youtube.com...


... but he loves u!

reply to post by Ayrton


nic vid 10ks

I'm not sure about the whole god side of things but this is the kind of thing that makes me be the atheist i am. If God loves us all so much why is there so much pain and hurt? However I'm not here to debate about whether there is a god or not, i just found your point about evolution interesting.

I do think after years the certain species does evolve into something that can survive its surroundings better. Such as a polar bear, not a great deal different from a normal bear except its white like its surroundings and its has alot more hair to keep it warm, is this so it survive better? Did these things become because of its surroundings? I for one certainly think they did, i believe the change is so slight you don't see it coming but it certainly does.

[edit on 17-8-2009 by Somebodyelse7]

reply to post by heineken


A god of love?
“You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God, punishing the chilren for the father's sins, to the third and fourth generations of those who hate me, but showing faithfull love to a thousand generations who love Me and keep my commands.” (Exodus 20:4-5).

"When you buy a hebrew slave, he is to serve you for 6 years, then in the seventh he is to leave as a free man without paying anything.If he arrives alone he is to leave alone;If he arrives with a wife, his wife is to leave with him. If his master gives him a wife and she bears him sons or daughters, the wife and the children belong to the master, and the man must leave alone." Exodus 21:2-4

"Whoever strikes a person so that he dies must be put to death" Ex 21:12
BUT
"When a man strikes a male or female slave,and the slave dies under abuse,the owner must be punished. However,if the slave can stand up after a day or two,the owner should not be punished for he is his owners property" Ex 21:20

Quite contradictory and unfair for a Loving God. The list goes on and on but I think I might take up too much space on the thread.

GOD = LOVE
EVIL = THE ABSENCE OF LOVE

So how can God be everywhere?

Because it is not real hehehehehehe....

All life on this planet evolved to survive and propagate their species. If God had any part of this, then he is really very incompetent. Think about it.

Just accept that you as a human are a very special creature in the animal world with the ability to protect all of the animals in the world. No other animal can do this.

[edit on 17-8-2009 by WorldObserver]

reply to post by WorldObserver


very nice post...i like mostly this part..

Just accept that you as a human are a very special creature in the animal world with the ability to protect all of the animals in the world. No other animal can do this.



Then I think..so if we take out some animals from the Food Chain they claim unbalanced disasters occur...exmaple if we take out the white shark from the seas there shall be more seals and Tunas which eat more fish etc etc......now that we literally removed the Humans from the animal food chain...what was the outcome?..because we are part of the food chain and many dont realize that..we have our computers, mobiles, girlfriend / boyfriend, fav music, fav art, beloved football team etc etc but still we are all walking meals lol

reply to post by heineken


If we remove humans from the planet many people think that the earth would not suffer. In fact, they believe that the earth and nature would benefit.

But a recent theory (“hyperdisease”) may force these people to think again.

If humans are gone, then domesticated animals like dogs will once again be susceptible to, and carry diseases like rabies, distemper and Canine parvovirus.

Without human intervention to vaccinate dogs, these diseases would eventually run rampant and most probably infect other species.

So with humans gone, I believe many species would die out. Thus, humans may be out of the immediate food chain, but we still play a very important part in maintaining balance.

reply to post by WorldObserver


I agree with you in part, although we do play a role in vacsinating our dogs, cats and other pets,and keeping them pest free...If our actions as a species where weighed, I would bet we cause more harm and imbalance than good to mother nature. After all, we where the ones to domesticate these animals in the first place, of course they would now be dependant on us.

to start off God made evreything perfect and in the beginning human were vegetarian and everything coexisted peacefully. but when satan caused sin to come into the world then everything changed and things became imperfect and do not reflect love anymore. but isnt it love anyway. God is providing animals with what they need to survive and animals have to be built the way they are because if they werent then we'd die from starvation and we have our bodies because they are perfect. on the topic of evolution things do not evolve as such, only adapt into what they nedd and this happens over generations, the dna only changes slightly, this in part is done by natural selection and breeding. i do not think the mind controls the cell structure

reply to post by thedevineone


sorry but i think that DNA in involved much more than you pointed out ...i mean look at the changes...birds a coming from walking dinos...there are animals which never had wings and developed them...there are animal that instead of feet now have fins...everything is wrtitten in the DNA so i cant see how this can remain the same..so..which is the mechanism that can read and write the DNA?

reply to post by WorldObserver


very interesting point my friend...didnt realize at first that infact we may be considered Nature's vet..which is cool XD

Reply to post by heineken

The 'mechanism' in which you ask of is called 'circumstance'.


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reply to post by heineken


God isn't 'made of love', he's made of atoms like anyone else, he has a spirit and a physical body, that's the perfect state anyway, that's what Jesus had after the resurrection a perfected physical body and a perfected spiritual body in one, immortal, the resurrected perfected immortal body doesn't need what the mortal body needs, it can literally walk on the sun if it wants and would feel no pain, so when people talk about hell, it's mental, it's not physical, anyway God is love, because he has the most perfect love possible, he literally isn't made out of love, that's taking the
verse a little too literally, but one would say the same thing about the resurrection, I guess when it gets down to it, there are those that know the Bible's true meaning and those that don't no matter how much they study it, it all comes down to the Spirit, if you don't have this Spirit you literally will not be able to understand the key points of the bible and will wander aimlessly reading wondering what is literal and what is symbolic, what was made by man what was inspired by God, when you have the Spirit in you at the time that you read you can know what a verse actually means not by some ancient translation but the true spiritual meaning, many claim to have this but I would say few actually have it, resulting in the countless mis-interpretations of the bible. Where is God, it doesn't matter, he can be anywhere he wants, but he is physical, the reason he can be everywhere is because part of his team the Spirit, the Holy Spirit can be everywhere at once because time has literally zero meaning for him, so he can be at every point in the unverse at every timeframe because he is out of time, like him he knows all and relates the info to God the Father. There's God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Ghost, don't let the word ghost throw you, it's no different than spirit, anyway, they need to be 3 to be an all knowing all powerful, all loving God, without one of them they cannot be this.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by Razimus]

Hi

God is not made of atoms, atoms are made from him.
Or he is made from God, and God from him, including all


Anyway, why is God so cruel ?

Because you see god as far away,
you have to understand the logic behind god,
its not a difficult logic,
but you can't recognise it as long you do not need it,
people who caary cross need more and more
explination to forgive god, themselves, the world,
because he is one (leviticus, isaiah, gospels, quran, logic )

You see god as hurting us
but try to understand
it is god hurting god
himself
he only does this for a reason
every pain, everything is functional,
it's your job to grow understanding
and forgive yourself, god.
= real love is understanding and accepting it to be good,
as needed for good, as free to be there, it is not romantic,
it is acceptance by understanding.

because there is only god, carry his cross of care and honesty,
because it allows truth to be truth without needing truth
this reality is building the paradox of logic,
and logic is truth, and truth is god.
it allows god to be logically free, and still be logic.
in god logic follows freedom, in this world everything follows logic
but they are not seperated, they mix up as both true in god
when logic thinks god needs him, then you have lucifer thinking god
is chained into him, logic as obliged prisoner is not god, logic as choice is

anyway, it looks like russian i guess
pain will make you in need of forgiving god
that will grow your understanding
and your love for all.

truth is so simple, that it is not about going to higher ground
a mountain is part fo the earth, and some climb the highest
mountaintops to find and obtain the whole earth, but
what is closest to the whole are those low hills that were
erased and grew old, they are almost one with the earth,
even when nobody sees them.

God is very easily ignored, because there is no honor where
everything becomes equal, except the honor of being everything.


the question you as believer have to start asking,
(not have to, thats your choide)
is why do i need that pain ?
what does it do with me ?
why do i need peace ? and is peace
(not) obtained by ignorance ?
why is peace not obtained by taking away ?
pain is here to make you grow into one,
God is one, that is your scripture,
so try to understand your scriptures
or your logic or your heart
because they all say the same thing,
they say we are one,
i suffer because of myself, and myself
is part of god.

Time is not a difficult concept,
when you take your cross of care
one day you will be one with god
and outside this time
you will know
you always allowed yourself
to feel that pain
that's why honesty makes cowards into heroes
because they do not have another choice
then their own choice, which is from all as one.



jonathan.





[edit on 18-8-2009 by pasttheclouds]

Originally posted by Razimus
reply to post by heineken

 

God isn't 'made of love', he's made of atoms like anyone else, he has a spirit and a physical body, that's the perfect state anyway, that's what Jesus had after the resurrection a perfected physical body and a perfected spiritual body in one, immortal, the resurrected perfected immortal body doesn't need what the mortal body needs, it can literally walk on the sun if it wants and would feel no pain, so when people talk about hell, it's mental, it's not physical, anyway God is love, because he has the most perfect love possible, he literally isn't made out of love, that's taking the
verse a little too literally, but one would say the same thing about the resurrection, I guess when it gets down to it, there are those that know the Bible's true meaning and those that don't no matter how much they study it, it all comes down to the Spirit, if you don't have this Spirit you literally will not be able to understand the key points of the bible and will wander aimlessly reading wondering what is literal and what is symbolic, what was made by man what was inspired by God, when you have the Spirit in you at the time that you read you can know what a verse actually means not by some ancient translation but the true spiritual meaning, many claim to have this but I would say few actually have it, resulting in the countless mis-interpretations of the bible. Where is God, it doesn't matter, he can be anywhere he wants, but he is physical, the reason he can be everywhere is because part of his team the Spirit, the Holy Spirit can be everywhere at once because time has literally zero meaning for him, so he can be at every point in the unverse at every timeframe because he is out of time, like him he knows all and relates the info to God the Father. There's God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Ghost, don't let the word ghost throw you, it's no different than spirit, anyway, they need to be 3 to be an all knowing all powerful, all loving God, without one of them they cannot be this.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by Razimus]

I really don't know what part of the brain your missing and it seems the answer is all of it the more I read your post. Even if God existed, you wouldn't be able to say things so specific as to what "he" is. I am assuming your being serious but the amount of stupidity in your statement makes me think you could be really go at telling jokes. I don't know where to start.

First, where are any scientific facts about god? I can answer that one for you, there arn't. Your taking an extra step and making up scientific fact about something not only not real but something that you would not understand if he was real. I guess I should just go down the list. Your saying your god is made of atoms and also have a physical and spiritual body. Thats a person. You saying those few words are saying you think god is a person. If the perfect state has atoms and a physical/spiritual body then I guess humans are perfect. Then you retract that and say Jesus had a perfected perfect body. You say the "perfected resurrected body doesn't need anything" so what about the atoms you say he is made of? If he has a physical body with atoms then the sun would defiantly affect him. The spirit is physical and goes to hell, which you say is only mental? Then you say that you need to have a specific "spirit" to understand what symbolism is? That is ridiculous. I can tell your egotistical because you think your one of the only people who know the "true meaning" of the Bible, which is terrible. For #s sake do you not see the many contradictions in your explanation? Why does god need to be three different entities if he is already an omnipotent being? If god is such an all powerful thing that why the hell can't he be perfect without being three things as you say. Simply hilarious.

reply to post by heineken


Well good question. That is how he initially created it. Remember the tree of good and evil? He told us not to eat of it, but we did. It that statement it tells me that mankind is to be held responsible for all the bad that has come about.

reply to post by heineken


violence is harsh, eh?
lol.
I think that people are putting themselves in other "being's" shoes. However, I think that people are afraid of dying so much, and afraid of being hurt in any way whatsoever so much, that it draws them into the line of thinking that there is gain to be had without sacrifice.

Sacrifice for the good of the whole, that is, the system that sustains life, is important.

Op you claim to love, then right after claim the very system that keeps the only known life in the universe continuous to be that of hatred or of evil or something negative like that?
How can we possibly think we know a fraction of the things in our universe that are required to make even an educated guess at the mind of the creator?
It's so...presumptuous.

well if God created us so that we had no other choice but to love Him then what joy would that bring? a computer programmer can create a program that says "i love you" a million times but is it really that great? if the computer programmer instead created a program that is able to have emotions, imagination, intelligence etc.. and then that program said "i love you" to the programmer wouldnt that more likely bring joy to the programmer?

God created people with the ability to choose Him or not, rather than being robots that have no decisions at all.

people say "Well He should prove Himself" but i believe He already has. its up to us to prove ourselves. thats where faith comes in. He came to the physical world in the form of man and His name was Jesus. if you truly seek Him, the creator of all, then you will truly find Him.

John 3:16 (New International Version)

"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son," (Jesus) "that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life."

his one and only son you say:

is that text right translated ?

and second

his one and only son was ONE with the father
it means when someone is glorified he becomes
the only son god has, and that is the FATHER HIMSELF

sounds wrong ?
ofcourse it does, because history made you not see the connection
between ONE and ONE;

thats why the quran states god does not beget sons,
and stillt he quran agrees with the gospels,
and commands the torah law as the direction,
the gospels as the truth.

the son of ONE father is ONE father.

the moment someone choose fully, and did his cross,
gets glorified, he comes to us not in a human name,
but in a oneness name of the father,
jesus was like that, and if someone else comes back in
that same name, people will not recognise him as one
with jesus. Do religion think One god forgot his capacity
to shine in all forms ? Why were there two spies to come back
from the promised land to bring the rest, the promised land is
oneness as begotten son that is father.
What does Jacobs stone mean ? did you learn about that ?

it means everybody will one day join in,
when you choose care above ignorance.

We are ONE, and oneness is the LAW
and it is logic, and truth is absolute and one.
beliefs are part of truth, and truth makes them be together as one.




[edit on 1-9-2009 by pasttheclouds]

[edit on 1-9-2009 by pasttheclouds]