August 10th crop circle, the owl

reply to post by ALLis0NE


There is no way you could make this -Owl-
in 4 hours from midnight to 4 AM.
With your stupid rope tricks, you would be stomping around all
over the place and making a mess.
It would probably take you 4 weeks to make a copy AND it
would look ugly from all the stomped on wheat.
I think you know in the back of your mind that you
are not going to convince anyone that all crop circles are man made.
Pick up your marbles and go play somewhere else.
We know who you are and what you're up to.
Go find yourself a cute little unicorn somewhere.


[edit on 11-8-2009 by Eurisko2012]

Originally posted by Total Package
38 and investigating for 22 years. How old are you?

So, investigating 22 years and you STILL haven't realised these are man-made?

That proves that the human brain diminishes with old age.

Originally posted by Total Package
Yeah yeah seen that video 100 times before. It's 1 crop circle of.... wow lots of CIRCLES. Gee they must all be fake huh.... because all crop circles are such simple patterns

The ignorance from you is outrageous... What you are asking is for EVERY crop circle to have a video with it... and any crop circle without a video is suspect of being made by "aliens" or "advanced technology"... That's idiotic.

That's like saying "If you don't film a house or building built by humans, it could possibly be made by aliens"...

Oh my, I have never seen a video of my cell phone being created, so there for, I have no proof it wasn't made by aliens. LOL...

You must have completely lost the "logic" portion of your brain.

If a crop circle is so simple that it can be designed with a simple piece of rope, logic points to it being made with known crop circle making techniques (human).

Originally posted by Total Package
Now I said it again. Go out there and get video evidence that most crop circles out there are man made and catch them doing it. 1 video of a group who admit they do it.... making a basic crop circle formation proves nothing.

Pure ignorance...... I can show you 100's of video's of men making crop circles... I can show you 100's of examples of people admitting they make crop circles....

What YOU are asking for, is evidence for ALL crop circles.... Ok sure, let me follow every single crop circle making group with cameras, every single night, every single time, just so your logic-less brain could see they are man-made. No thanks...

Basic crop circle??? ALL CROP CIRCLES ARE BASIC!!!

Originally posted by Total Package
Show me the weaved patterns in that video above.

Do you realize to make a weave all they have to do is bend the crops in different directions? Any moron can do that... it's so simple, people don't even need to make a video of it, you should be smart enough to figure it out on your own...

Originally posted by Total Package
Show me that it contains higher levels of radiation...

I can play your ignorance game too....

Show ME that crop circles have higher levels or radiation! Show me REALLY PHYSICAL PROOF. Don't show me a website, don't show me data from faulty measuring devices. Show me something that YOU personally found, and not someone else...

Even then, YOU STOPPED INVESTIGATING. There are MANY different causes for radiation. The radiation they found was "radionuclide's" in the soil. Did you know that soil has NATURAL radionuclide's in them?? Did you realize that water can absorb these radionuclide's? And the irrigation systems at farms reuse the water, and spray their crops with it? Did you know radionuclide's are found in pesticides? The radiation they found is also common in water systems that use underground water streams for a source.

But you didn't do any research at all, nor did you do any logical thinking for yourself. Everything you know is rehashed lies from websites.

Everything you know about "radiation in crops" can be easily explained away, and has nothing to do with aliens. The only radiation they found was from radionuclides.

Originally posted by Total Package
show me the way the crops were bent in that circle above..

The straw man tactics again...

No... you show ME the way the crops were bent in that circle above.

Do you seriously think it is hard to bend crops?? Do you not posses the ability to understand how to bend a crop??

Originally posted by Total Package
Where is the evidence that the faked circle in that video is identical to all of the other circles found in the way it was formed.

Well for one, there is evidence that the circles are created by several rotations around a pivot point, and each rotation lays down another row of crops.

In almost EVERY crop circle, there is evidence that the circles are created in the same exact fashion. Row by row, rotation around a pivot. You can even see the lines created with each rotation. I even drew lines showing the lines in my first post on this topic.

Actually there is a LOT of evidence right in front of your face, but you ignore it... that's called ignorance. I don't even want to reply any further to you because its obvious you didn't do any research, and all you are going to do is keep bringing back points that have already been debunked.


-Radiation = can be caused by pesticides, contaminated water, and radionuclide's are already found in soil, also could be a complete lie fabricated by fake researchers.

-Iron fillings/magnetic spheres = can be caused by tractor soil tilling equipment, and be already found naturally in soil, could also be a complete lie created by fake researchers.

- Lengthened crop nodes = can naturally happen after being damaged, and dried by the Sun. Just because some fake researcher found that when you put a crop in a microwave is lengthens the nodes, doesn't mean it was caused by microwaves. It could happen in Sunlight, and DOES happen after the crops are damaged in the moist night, and then dried in the day.

Everything related to crop circles has already been debunked... there is absolutely no reason to think they are, or ever were, created by "aliens" or "advanced technology".... the only LAST reason to believe they are... is simple because we didn't film the creation of them.... which is DUMB.

[edit on 12-8-2009 by ALLis0NE]

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
Alright for the the naysayers who say they know that they are man made, allow me to direct you to this thread.

For those who say that they know it's from ET's, go to the same place.

Back to topic, these crop circles are popping up each day now and by the looks of it getting more intricate. Notice the weaving we've seen in the past few weeks with some of them.

Regardless of whether it's made made or not, these are truly wonderful images we are being presented with.

Which begs the question, why? Why would man or ET make these for our eyes to see?

~Keeper

Thank you for your words of wisdom. Lets get back to the crop circle
- Owl-
The Grays are making these crop circles for one reason.
The message is......"we are here" "you are not alone"
They are beautiful. I hope they make them everyday.
I like the one that represents Pi made last year.
It took an American from North Carolina Mike Reed to figure
that one out. 3.14159.....June 2008 i think.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
reply to post by ALLis0NE

 

There is no way you could make this -Owl-
in 4 hours from midnight to 4 AM.

You are full of yourself. This crop circle can be made in 1 hour. All you have to do is bend crops....

Tell me, can you not bend crops? Is that something impossible for you? Are you in a wheelchair?

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
With your stupid rope tricks, you would be stomping around all
over the place and making a mess.

Stupid rope tricks?

I am a professional drafter. The tricks learned in drafting have been discovered 1000's of years ago.

Using a rope to make a circle has been known for CENTURIES! Using a rope to measure distances has also been known... If you don't know how to create a drawing or image using a rope, I think your IQ is below 15, and that is classified as an idiot.

This is what you sound like:

"I BET YOU CAN'T DRAW A CIRCLE USING A ROPE!"

I can't even put words to how dumb that sounds to me... that is beyond dumb...

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
It would probably take you 4 weeks to make a copy AND it
would look ugly from all the stomped on wheat.

Every time you talk, you prove you know NOTHING about man-made crop circles.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
I think you know in the back of your mind that you
are not going to convince anyone that all crop circles are man made.

I was here to express my opinion about THIS 8/10 crop circle being man-made... Not all crop circles..

I would have to be really stupid to think I could convince any brainwashed people anyway.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
Pick up your marbles and go play somewhere else.

Um, at least I didn't loose my marbles. YOU have lost your marbles (mentally challenged).

Originally posted by Eurisko2012
We know who you are and what you're up to.
Go find yourself a cute little unicorn somewhere.

You know who and am, and what I'm up too??

You have lost your mind, literally. You just proved that I was correct, you ARE mentally challenged. It's ok, there are mental hospitals for you...

[edit on 12-8-2009 by ALLis0NE]

So with the squabbling aside, it could mean to watch the sun closely don't you think?

reply to post by wize1one


If you think the crop circle means anything, then that means you should watch your sanity a lot closer.

Imagine for one second that you didn't know why or what the American flag represents. Now imagine you had to figure it out...

50, 5-pointed stars, and 13 stripes.... It could mean literally 1 million different things...

This is because the American flag is a symbol. All the knowledge of it's meaning is NOT included in the symbol. It says nothing about 50 states, or 13 original colonies, nor does it say anything about red, white, and blue..... It's just a symbol representing that knowledge, and the knowledge is NOT included in the symbol.

Do you understand what that means?

Even if these crop circles were not man-made, the only message you will get from them is whatever message you created with your own mind, and your own knowledge. Not knowledge from "aliens".

ALLis0NE,

Ok, so you bundle every crop circle up and stamp it with "man-made." How sane is that? You certainly like to throw that word, insane, around to the folks here on the forum. It's people like you who stomp people down, who don't seem to belong on ATS. You join an "alternative" type forum, and yet all you seem to do is squash, squash, squash every theory that doesn't fit inside of a narrow box.

Yeah, maybe some of us do believe that something else is out there. And that there is something more to be found as regards life. Some of us are dreamers, that's true.

We know that some crop circles are man-made, we know that. But it's not very sane, my friend, to lable every single one as man-made, without proof of such a big statement.

Since you "know" that "all" crop circles are hoaxes, then prove it. Since you are obviously of superior intelligence, then that shouldn't be too hard for you.

Troy

Originally posted by cybertroy
ALLis0NE,

Ok, so you bundle every crop circle up and stamp it with "man-made." How sane is that?

It's pretty sane considering that there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that shows "aliens" have never even visited this Earth, let alone tried to communicate with humans. If they wanted to communicate with humans, there is much easier more intelligent ways.

There is overwhelming evidence that the majority of crop circles ARE man-made, but you people ALWAYS ignore the evidence.

Crop circles were first invented by MAN. The first crop circle was made by MAN. The whole concept of crop circles was created by MAN....

There have been 1000+ man-made crop circles created...

There is ZERO evidence that even 1 crop circle was made by aliens, yet 100+ pieces of PROOF that crop circles have been made by man.

What is not sane, is to not be able to put the logic together and see that people are creating crop circles.

So lets see....

100+ proven man-made crop circles.

vs

0 proven alien made crop circles.

I'm going with the man-made explaination untill someone proves at least 1 crop circle has ever been made by aliens...

Pretty sane reasoning to me.... There is absoutly no reason to think aliens made crop circles.... that is insane.

Originally posted by cybertroy
You certainly like to throw that word, insane, around to the folks here on the forum. It's people like you who stomp people down, who don't seem to belong on ATS.

Insane is the most proper word to describe people that are "not of sound judgement"...

To think crop circles are alien made, even when there has NEVER been ANY proof... that is considered "not of sound judgement" a.k.a. INSANE.

You know who doesn't belong on ATS? People who are not willing to look at the evidence or concider the evidence.

I have already considered the idea of aliens and advanced technology creating crop circles.... but I have such an open mind, that I see far beyond that... I see a much more complicated answer. That, humans are making these, and are fooling people into thinking aliens are... Thats much more out of the box that you think it is...

Originally posted by cybertroy
You join an "alternative" type forum, and yet all you seem to do is squash, squash, squash every theory that doesn't fit inside of a narrow box.

What a joke. You obviously don't know the motto of this "alternative" type forum... its called DENY IGNORANCE.

I have done exactly that, I have studied crop circles so much that I am VERY informed about them. I know every single reason why someone thinks they are "alien". I know every single so called "anomoly" that has brainwashed people to think they are "alien". I have seen every single complex crop circle that tricked people into thinking only "aliens" can make them..... I KNOW everything you will ever tell me about crop circles...

I denied ignorance so well, that every single reason someone thinks they are alien, I have researched and found an explaination showing why they are NOT alien.

I am so open minded, that anyone who doesn't think crop circles are man-made, to me, looks close minded.. They have already closed their mind, and came to a conclusion that "aliens" are making them..... that is close minded to me...

Originally posted by cybertroy
Yeah, maybe some of us do believe that something else is out there. And that there is something more to be found as regards life. Some of us are dreamers, that's true.

I'm exactly the same as you...

I believe there is something else out there. I am also a dreamer, but a SANE one (sound judgement).

Originally posted by cybertroy
We know that some crop circles are man-made, we know that.

Some? Try THE MAJORITY OF THEM ALL. The only ones that people think have been made by aliens are the ones that nobody saw being created, or have some not so common properties to them that tricks people into thinking it.

Originally posted by cybertroy
But it's not very sane, my friend, to lable every single one as man-made, without proof of such a big statement.

I have proof that ZERO crop circles have ever been proven to be made by "aliens".

That is proof enough for me, and is very sane.

Originally posted by cybertroy
Since you "know" that "all" crop circles are hoaxes, then prove it. Since you are obviously of superior intelligence, then that shouldn't be too hard for you.

What a joke, even if I did prove it, your idea of "proof" is more strict because you are brainwashed by your over active imagination, and you will create an excuse to dismiss that proof.

So let me ask you, how would you expect me to prove it?
Do you expect me to travel back in time and catch every single one on video???? Get a clue. You are purpously asking me to do something that is impossible, just so you could support ANY small idea that "aliens" could have created them...

It's a straw man argument of the worst case.

Try using logic and deductive reasoning... Start by knowing that ZERO crop circles have ever been proven to be made by aliens... thats a good start.

Almost ALL crop circles have these lines in them:

These lines are found in KNOWN man-made crop circles, and are created by the devices that were used to bend the crops (rollers, planks, other devices that could be used).

Any crops with these lines in them, can be considered MAN-MADE. The majority of ALL crop circles has these lines.

Good day.

It look's very nice. These aliens are very good artists.

reply to post by ALLis0NE


Put your money where your mouth is and go make it on camera then.

If you can do it like you say you could in an hour then I will star and flag anything you put up that I see for as long as I'm on this site.

I will even let you do it during the day rather then in the dark.

Originally posted by mrFantastic4567

Originally posted by oldgoat
Do you have proof they are human made? I'm getting sick of people getting sick of them being called paranormal

Do you have any proof aliens have even visited earth, let alone drive around creating art in fields. I am getting sick of people getting sick of people getting sick of them being called man-made. WHICH THEY ARE!

Surely the sheer size, frequency, intricacy, ingenuity and apparent symbolic mystery of this artwork would indicate that this is not simply and purely a "human-made" phenomena.
Maybe when crop circles first became wide-spread and were a "new" freakish occurrence to the world, the "humans made them" excuse would have cut it. I would understand if these occurrences were central to one particular area of the world and were not spanned across Europe, America, Asia, Africa, Australia, New Zealand etc etc, if some of them hadn't taken 45 minutes to create in broad daylight, if there wasn't unusual related phenomena surrounding these events, then maybe humans were at least in some part involved in the actual creation of this "crop-art".

However, as it stands, this is far from the case and I wonder how can one immediately veto some form of "non-human" participation, when that same person doesn't know the first thing about their/ its reason for being here?? I mean, why the eff couldn't it be the result of something other than humans? Are we all so determined that we're the end all, be all of existence?

You know, I can take a bit of skepticism and I can understand some people's incessant need to rationalise everything in their own way, but when these rationalisations conflict with occurrences that are undoubtedly beyond the capabilities of human beings at present, all I see is ignorance, really. You see what you want to see, accept what you want to accept.
It's all well and good to question, but to blindly claim outright that such a phenomenon could not be the work of anything but humans, and vice versa might I add, is just foolish.



BUT GETTING BACK TO THE PICTURE:
It kind of resembles an owl's head inside a Sun, inside a circle from my perspective.
Owl = wisdom?
Sun = centrality, the Sun?
Circle = eternity, infinity?

Maybe??

[edit on 12/8/09 by pretty_vacant]

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.

Originally posted by Eurisko2012

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
Oh for gods sake, I 've visited Avebury several times and the crop circle makers make no secret of the fact that they are creating these circles. I even watched one loon trying to convince a watching audience that the circles were alien in origin even when stomper boards were leaning against the wall behind him.
Crop circles are art. Their makers would be chuffed to bits to hear you lot describing them as mysterious or paranormal because thats what art is all about. Its about causing contreversy and making people think. Its about stirring emotions in those who study it. . .

You shouldn't use God when trying to deceive.
The truth is that some crop circles are man made and some are clearly not.
Nice try though.
I like your style.
I think God has already forgiven you.

I'm not trying to deceive anyone! However, I honestly do believe that those who think crop circles are alien in origin are letting their hearts, their beliefs, rule their head, common sense.
I mean, why would aliens choose to contact the human race by creating easily replicable circles in crops? It just doesn't make any sense. . .

What makes you think they are making these circles to contact us?They might be for their own use,whatever that may be

But your right a majority of these are man made,but not all of them!the hard part now is finding out who did what!The best way to debunk crop circles is to have a group of people make some,that way all can now be called man made

Debunkers:We get it already.You think:All CC's are man made.We get it.They are made up of circles and you can draw those on computer so making them is easy.OK?We get it.You think this and repeat it.Going in circles about going in circles.WE GET IT!!!Plants bend AT the nodes,you say,Yes we understand that,disagree,but get it,OK?Lines along the path of infill circularity,again,WE GET IT.Your work is clearly (Over)done here,why say more?Really!Your several points have been made and repeated and beaten like a dead horse.Doug and dave,yes we've seen their claims ditto with that rude boy sole arestee,we've missed nothing by way of claims.They're EZ we're fools for thinking otherwise and the circle jerks are having a big laugh at us,WE GET IT.Nuff said.Since you've said your points and this topic is about the owl in the field,why not let those of us with something else to add to the discussion do so without what is now mere repititious naysayage.At this point,even if you were correct,you are muddying the waters of constructive dialogue about the thing.Really,we get it.

Originally posted by ALLis0NE

Originally posted by cybertroy
ALLis0NE,

Ok, so you bundle every crop circle up and stamp it with "man-made." How sane is that?

It's pretty sane considering that there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that shows "aliens" have never even visited this Earth, let alone tried to communicate with humans. If they wanted to communicate with humans, there is much easier more intelligent ways.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAH overwhelming evidence that aliens have never visited Earth. Ok Professor of Idiotology where is the overwhelming evidence Aliens have never visited. I wait your findings with baited breath.

Originally posted by ALLis0NE
There is overwhelming evidence that the majority of crop circles ARE man-made, but you people ALWAYS ignore the evidence.

So now it's "majority" of crop circles are man made is it. Do you want to back peddle any quicker? How hilarious is it that you think people all over the world are making crop circles and somehow keeping it a secret.

You are truly an idiot.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAH overwhelming evidence that aliens have never visited Earth. Ok Professor of Idiotology where is the overwhelming evidence Aliens have never visited. I wait your findings with baited breath.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAH

If you knew anything about UFOlogy you would know this is the case and this is the battle that real UFOlogists are up against. There is no real evidence for aliens in the public domain. If there was then we could all just leave this forum and leave it to the rest of society to investigate further. But as it stands, the onus is on us to come up with irrefutable proof and until that happens, in the real world HAHAHAHAHAAHAH wont get you anywhere.

Originally posted by whoshotJR
reply to post by ALLis0NE

 

Put your money where your mouth is and go make it on camera then.

How about I do the next best thing and prove it with math?

I said with 5 people, I could make this crop circle in 1 hour.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

In this video ( www.youtube.com... ) from 3:25 to 3:53 a guy made 18 steps which were 4 feet long using a 4 foot long plank of wood to bend crops.

4ft. long by 4ft. wide = 16 sq. ft. x 18 steps = 288 sq. ft. of crops bent in 28 seconds.

ONE guy bent 10.285 sq. ft. of crops per second.

Now, let's measure the square footage of the crop circle. According to this website tramlines are usually 30cm thick (tire tracks), 2 meters apart.

(2 meters) + (30cm + 30cm) = 2.6 meters = 8.5 feet wide tramlines.

The outer circle of the crop circle is about 39 tramlines in diameter.

39 x 8.5ft. = 331.5 feet in diameter divided in half is 165.75 radius. To find the area of a circle you use the formula ( PI x R²).

3.14 x 165.75² = 86309.17 sq. ft. of crops inside of that crop circle.

86309.17 sq. ft. divided by 10.285 sq. ft. a second = 8391.75 seconds.

That means if I wanted to bend all of the crops inside of the circle to make one giant solid circle, it would take 8391.75 seconds.

8391.75 sec. / 60 = 140 minutes, which is 2.33 hours.

That means ONE person can bend 86,309 square feet of crops in 2.33 hours.

...and I said I could do it with 5 people.

10.285 sq. ft. a second x 5 people = 51.425 sq. ft. a second.

86309.17 sq. ft. divided by 51.425 sq. f.t a second = 1678.35 seconds.

1678.35 sec. / 60 = 28 minutes for 5 guys to make a solid circle in the crops that is 331.5 in diameter..

But the calculation is if you wanted to make one solid circle the same size as the crop circle in the original post. The crop circle in the post is NOT solid, so that means there is LESS square feet of crops to bend. That means it would take LESS time than I calculated.

5 people could bend the crops of this crop circle in 28 minutes!!

Now, put your money where YOUR mouth is, and prove to me you CANT make this crop circle in 1 hour.

You can't because it IS possible to make it in 1 hour.


[edit on 12-8-2009 by ALLis0NE]

reply to post by trueforger


Obviously, you don't get it...

I am here to debunk THIS crop circle. YOU CROPPIES are the ones that always turn it into a debate about ALL crop circles...

THIS crop circle is MAN-MADE, and the PROOF is hidden in the way it was designed, and the way it was made.

It is designed with circles and lines AND NOTHING MORE (very simple for man).

There is lines and sloppy mistakes in the "infill" which is also PROOF that it was made the traditional man-made technique.

There is also holes in perfect positions for pivot points.

The crop circle in the original post is man-made.

NEXT!

Originally posted by pretty_vacant
Surely the sheer size, frequency, intricacy, ingenuity and apparent symbolic mystery of this artwork would indicate that this is not simply and purely a "human-made" phenomena.

So if a bunch of humans met your requirements; size, frequency, intricacy, ingenuity, and symbolism, you would think the humans are alien?

Originally posted by pretty_vacant
I mean, why the eff couldn't it be the result of something other than humans? Are we all so determined that we're the end all, be all of existence?

Yes sure it could. But even after circles have appeared in the same area, people still don't have ANY proof that it is anything but humans making them.

One of the newest crop circles was made over a period of 9 days in 3 phases. That means whatever made the crop circle CAME BACK to the SAME SPOT, MULTIPLE TIMES, and people STILL don't have proof it was not man-made.

Please tell me, Why is there no proof that anything non-human made these?

Why is there a TON of proof that humans make crop circles, but ZERO proof that anything else does?

Originally posted by pretty_vacant
It's all well and good to question, but to blindly claim outright that such a phenomenon could not be the work of anything but humans, and vice versa might I add, is just foolish.

What is foolish, is to ignore the importance of the question I asked...

Why is there no proof that anything non-human made these?

You would think, after all these years, after all these crop circles, someone would have PROOF that they are made by non-humans. But there is ZERO proof.

That is a very important fact.

Originally posted by pretty_vacant
BUT GETTING BACK TO THE PICTURE:
It kind of resembles an owl's head inside a Sun, inside a circle from my perspective.
Owl = wisdom?
Sun = centrality, the Sun?
Circle = eternity, infinity?

Maybe??

It is foolish to think Owl = wisdom to an alien, or Sun = centrality to an alien that is from another star system, or circle = infinity to an alien instead of representing a 3D sphere in 2D.

ALL of your guesses are USELESS, and POINTLESS, because the only answers humans will ever get from crop circles are MAN-MADE ANSWERS.

Guess all you want, but you are just wasting your time.

Originally posted by Total Package
HAHAHAHAHAAHAH overwhelming evidence that aliens have never visited Earth. Ok Professor of Idiotology where is the overwhelming evidence Aliens have never visited. I wait your findings with baited breath.

You are old and clueless... I am saddened to know the world if full of people like yourself.

There is ZERO evidence that aliens have ever visited Earth.

So.... that alone is overwhelming evidence. Duh

No matter how many so called "UFO" videos you show me, you still haven't proven that they are controlled by aliens.

Originally posted by Total Package

Originally posted by ALLis0NE
There is overwhelming evidence that the majority of crop circles ARE man-made, but you people ALWAYS ignore the evidence.

So now it's "majority" of crop circles are man made is it.

Holy crap you are useless.

What I said means only the majority of the crop circles have evidence of being man-made, the rest just don't have evidence either way....

You are twisting my words around to make me look like "back peddling" when in fact, I am just telling you that the majority of crop circles have evidence, and the rest just don't.

I believe ALL crop circles are MAN-MADE. But only the majority have evidence of it... I'm sure they ALL have evidence in some way, but I don't have it, neither do you...

Originally posted by Total Package
Do you want to back peddle any quicker? How hilarious is it that you think people all over the world are making crop circles and somehow keeping it a secret.

You are truly an idiot.

Keeping it a secret????????

There have been MANY groups that have come forward and proved they make crop circles...

Heck this is from Wiki:
en.wikipedia.org...

Many circles are known to be man-made,[6][7][8] such as those created by Doug Bower, Dave Chorley, and John Lundberg. [6][9] Bower and Chorley were awarded an Ig Nobel Prize in 1992 for their crop circle hoaxing.

KEEPING IT A SECRET?!!

You are truly useless. You should take back your insult of calling me an idiot before I prove that YOU are the true one AGAIN.