August 10th crop circle, the owl

Originally posted by ottozia
ALLisONE and others like you.

I must commend you in your contribution to this thread and others like it. But I have a big problem with the manner in which you present your data and explanation.

Firstly when I read through you postings, I get the uneasy feeling of someone sitting in front of their PC monitor screaming at it “You lot are efffing idiots, listen to ME ME ME”. If you are so confident in your beliefs why bother coming to this forum in the first place, what are you trying to prove.

Secondly the data you present is seemingly detailed and well prepared and often lengthily. Again why do I get the uneasy feeling that this guy is trying to overload the thread so passionately with information, dis-information, and personal opinion.

Thirdly I note your post timings
4:46
4:50
5:57
6:02
6:30
7:49
8:06
11:05
11:13
11:35
11:50
More to follow I am sure.

Either you have plenty of time on your hands and write and collate data at super quick speeds or your posting are already prepared (with slight adjustments)in an auto response to any person suggesting that this phenomena is not man-made.

I am not sure what your agenda is, but if it is to contribute to this topic so others can make an informed judgement, you are losing it slowly. I would suggest going here and read the technique of presenting ones view.

www.korncirkler.dk...

www.korncirkler.dk...

www.greatdreams.com...

So please present your data, but do not make sweeping statement that ALL crop circles ARE manmade and can be made in a timescale YOU believe is fact based upon YOUR maths and methodology of calculating a multi element linear process.

I have a hard time accepting your postings whilst they completely seem to ignore all the other scientifically proven data which has been researched by people much more knowledgeable then you or I.

Please take it easy on ALLisONE.
I'm glad you pointed out that this appears to be his Full Time job
with these crop circle posts.
I think it IS his full time job.
He is just doing his job. I think he works for either
U.S. or British Intelligence. There is another guy here DGFenir
that works at the F.B.I. Check out his location address.
935 Pennsylvania Wash, D.C. - That's the J. Edgar Hoover building.
Also known as......the F.B.I.
Just click "Ignore ALLisONE" and his posts will disappear.
I did.
It works great.

I thought this site was interresting. It helps with this debate.

www.circlemakers.org...

reply to post by pretty_vacant

Sorry to inform you that the Wabikon lake picture is a fake.

www.worth1000.com...

It was created for a contest to see who could make the best hoax picture.
Once you start posting pictures of clear fakes as evidence of alien made crop circles I'm afraid the game is up. . .

Originally posted by Graphix10
I think the problem with people making all of these intricate crop circles is this...you can't mess up!

You are completely wrong, crop circle makers mess up all the time. Actually one of the last crop circles I discussed has many flaws in it, except when they take areal shots from far away you can hardly even notice them.

In one of the video's I linked to, you can even hear professional crop circle makers say this:

Sometimes if you don't hold the rope/string tight enough, the measurement will be off. If you have a lot of measurements, the slack adds up to lots of inches and feet.

If we make a mistake, we can just change the design on the fly to incorporate the mistake, or hide it. THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF PEOPLE NOT SEEING THE DESIGN BEFORE WE MAKE IT.

Originally posted by Graphix10
If one of your guys "blows it" during the creation process, you can't fix it.

Absolutely incorrect. It's much like a tattoo artist. If they make a mistake, you can fix it by being creative adding on to the mistake. Read up on it.

Originally posted by Graphix10
The symmetry would be destroyed. This never seems to happen.

Nope if you make a mistake on one side, make it look good, and then do it to the other side to maintain symmetry. According to KNOWN crop circle makers, it happens all the time.

Originally posted by Graphix10
Generally speaking, these are mostly perfect creations...at least in the symmetrical sense.

Only to the untrained eye it is... there is flaws all over the place that always go unnoticed.

Originally posted by Graphix10
Another thing is...how do you check your work?? You would have to have someone fly over the circle (at night) to tell you how progress is going and if you've made any mistakes. That means you need a plane (& pilot), walkie-talkies, night vision equipment, etc. No. That just doesn't make sense.

Professional crop circle makers say "they usually don't know if their crop circle turned out nice until researchers take pictures of it from their aircraft". That does not include major mistakes they notice while they are making it, only mistakes that they didn't notice.

You don't need to see your work when you are doing it by numbers and a map. You can pretty much build a picture of it in your mind while doing it... and you can memorize where you are and what you are doing..

Just image, if you were stranded on a island, and you knew that aircraft will be looking for you, don't you think you could carve a huge "HELP!" sign in the sand without needing to see it from the sky?

I'm pretty sure you can. Humans posses the ability to imagine in their mind what they are drawing. You don't need to see the whole thing, you only need to see where you are, where you started, and what you are drawing.

It's pretty easy to understand actually.

Originally posted by Graphix10
And where do these people practice?? Are there fields somewhere that nobody ever flies over?

They don't need to practice on crops. Only need to practice their movements, which can be practiced anywhere.

I imagine making crop circles are much like coordinated dancing. Like a drill team. They choreograph their movements, and pre plan their steps in a hidden location. Then when they are ready, they do the dance on crops.

Actually, most of their practice is in plane sight, and every crop circle they make is practice.

They do have crop circle competitions, did you know that?

Originally posted by Graphix10
And even then, how do they check their work? No of this makes sense to me.

Like I said, professional crop circle makers have already claimed that they don't check their work, and they don't get to see the entire finished product untill someone takes an areal photo after they are done. The rest of the time they are just using their premade maps, their markings, and their minds, to make the crop circle.

They can see sections of the main parts from the ground, and that is enough for them to make the design. Plus when you have a map, and a choreographed movement, you already know where you are and what to do...

Originally posted by Graphix10
There's also been sightings associated with crop circles

Where are the videos and images? All the videos and images I have seen are held hostage, and you need to pay money to see them. I dont trust that.

The rest of the videos I have seen are blurry, and look super fake, and are not from trustworthy places.

Originally posted by Graphix10
and odd radiation readings.

The radiation readings you are talking about is when they supposedly found "radionuclide's" in the soil. Radionuclide's are found naturally in soil. When water passes through the soil, it also contaminates the water. Some farm land actually uses irrigation systems that reuse some of the water, so when they water the crops they are watering with radio active water. Also some pesticides have radionuclide's in them.. Also, a few people have LIED about their radiation readings just to make crop circles seem more authentic.

There are 100's of explanations...

Originally posted by Graphix10
There's something more going on here than just a bunch of rogue crop circle fanatics. Too many things don't add up.

Yeah there is more than rogue crop circle fanatics.... there is crop circle teams who compete, there is crop circle advertisers, there is crop circle makers who make crop circle just so they can put them in a DVD, or a yearly calendar, and or sell tickets to crop circle conferences, and even sell crop circle tour tickets, and crop circle admission, and crop circle viewing aircraft flights, and crop circle hats, and shirts, and souvenirs....

Crop circles are a million dollar industry.

It's sad that they fool so many people...

Originally posted by azure-door

HAHAHAHAHAAHAH overwhelming evidence that aliens have never visited Earth. Ok Professor of Idiotology where is the overwhelming evidence Aliens have never visited. I wait your findings with baited breath.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAH

If you knew anything about UFOlogy you would know this is the case and this is the battle that real UFOlogists are up against. There is no real evidence for aliens in the public domain. If there was then we could all just leave this forum and leave it to the rest of society to investigate further. But as it stands, the onus is on us to come up with irrefutable proof and until that happens, in the real world HAHAHAHAHAAHAH wont get you anywhere.

Obviously you haven't done any research on Erik von Daniken. He has studied countless ancient civilizations and published boooks about ancient gods actually being aliens.

reply to post by ALLis0NE


"The Discovery Channel commissioned five aeronautics and astronautics students from MIT in 2002 and asked them to create crop circles. Crop circle researcher Nancy Talbott consulted with the Discovery team and advised that there are three common identifiers that set “real” crop circles apart from man-made or faked ones.

According to Talbott, unexplained crop circles feature elongated apical plant stem nodes, expulsion cavities in the plant stems and the presence of 10–50 micrometre diameter magnetized iron spheres in the soils, distributed linearly. The team failed to create a crop circle that met these three requirements."

I realize there are hoaxers out there, and many of them are very good, but these are the things that are unexplained to me. You can't explain them and neither can any other debunker.

Originally posted by airteck

Tim is one of the farmers that are kind towards the Crop Circle Community. He will put an honesty box in the formation. Please honour this farmer by donating your spare change into the box.

Crop Circle Connector


Honestly.... I am getting sick of the phrase Crop circle; they should be called human field art. Until we get one that spans multiple fields(over a kilometer) and can be seen by satellite, I don't think it worth consideration that it's made by ALF's.

They are nice to look at though.

Amen. I have begged for evidence that even one of them isnt manmade and so far NADA. the closest someone came was to post a video of an infrared camera that picked up a ball of heat, but the ball wasn't making crop circles.

Originally posted by Graphix10
reply to post by ALLis0NE

 

"The Discovery Channel commissioned five aeronautics and astronautics students from MIT in 2002 and asked them to create crop circles. Crop circle researcher Nancy Talbott consulted with the Discovery team and advised that there are three common identifiers that set “real” crop circles apart from man-made or faked ones.

According to Talbott, unexplained crop circles feature elongated apical plant stem nodes, expulsion cavities in the plant stems and the presence of 10–50 micrometre diameter magnetized iron spheres in the soils, distributed linearly. The team failed to create a crop circle that met these three requirements."

I realize there are hoaxers out there, and many of them are very good, but these are the things that are unexplained to me. You can't explain them and neither can any other debunker.

I watched that Discovery Channel show.
The MIT students set off a bomb with just 2 minutes left in their
4 hour window.
It blew iron filings all over the place.
Very bright. Very loud. Very funny.
They blew apart the wheat with a magnetron from a microwave oven.
Nice try. The Grays do a better job.

reply to post by Armour For Victor

Since this site and group of guys have been brought up so many times now in this and all the CC threads,I have to ask,WHAT PURPOSE EXACTLY?

nice posts people,
a crop circle every day for nearly a month now :S
i wish i lived in wiltshire,
i'll be on the look out,
anyways peace.

Now there's another pair.With one that looks like its at the edge of the field.The full complement of pictures are not in yet.Perhaps a contest between two groups in the same field?"OOPS we went over again!"

Please don't bother posting cropcirclemakers site AGAIN.Please?Yes you can computo-draw them,yes you think they're a piece of cake to make.No you don't trust Linda Moulton Howe.Yes plants bend right at the nodes.Did I miss any?Oh yes,the 'honesty box' flows over with cash as the farmers are all in on it.It's all tubby Britons out on a lark after a few at the pub,making VIRTUALLY perfect mystery Signs.And correct any flaws.For a laugh or a contest or money.

Whose fields are these anyway?Gaia?GB?

Originally posted by ALLis0NE

Originally posted by whoshotJR
reply to post by ALLis0NE

 

Put your money where your mouth is and go make it on camera then.

How about I do the next best thing and prove it with math?

I said with 5 people, I could make this crop circle in 1 hour.


[edit on 12-8-2009 by ALLis0NE]

Forget the math. Get your camera and I will even give you a full day to do it on camera. Bring as many friends as you want.

If not then stop flapping your gums. It's put up or shutup time.

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
reply to post by pretty_vacant

 

Sorry to inform you that the Wabikon lake picture is a fake.

www.worth1000.com...

It was created for a contest to see who could make the best hoax picture.
Once you start posting pictures of clear fakes as evidence of alien made crop circles I'm afraid the game is up. . .

I was skeptical of the picture from the beginning but decided to include it mostly because it looked pretty amazing and also to perhaps provide a bit of perspective that would go along with what I wrote about tree circles in my previous post, considering there has been real reported cases. I didn't include it as "evidence" per se - there is not much information available on these "tree circles" over the Web. BTW, I don't remember mentioning that they were "alien made".

"The game is up"?? Well, there's an easy exist if I ever saw one.


EDIT TO ADD: I have edited the original post, mentioning that I couldn't vouch for its credibility, my apologies.

[edit on 12/8/09 by pretty_vacant]

Originally posted by pretty_vacant

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
reply to post by pretty_vacant

 

Sorry to inform you that the Wabikon lake picture is a fake.

www.worth1000.com...

It was created for a contest to see who could make the best hoax picture.
Once you start posting pictures of clear fakes as evidence of alien made crop circles I'm afraid the game is up. . .

I was skeptical of the picture from the beginning but decided to include it mostly because it looked pretty amazing and also to perhaps provide a bit of perspective that would go along with what I wrote about tree circles in my previous post, considering there has been real reported cases. I didn't include it as "evidence" per se - there is not much information available on these "tree circles" over the Web. BTW, I don't remember mentioning that they were "alien made".

"The game is up"?? Well, there's an easy exist if I ever saw one.


EDIT TO ADD: I have edited the original post, mentioning that I couldn't vouch for its credibility, my apologies.

[edit on 12/8/09 by pretty_vacant]

[edit on 12-8-2009 by Mintwithahole.]

AllInOne, you do a good job of explaining away your insulting tone that you carry in a lot of your posts. And, you are good at artfully laying down a lot of "facts," but that doesn't make your conclusion any less flawed. I'm sorry, "a number of proven man-made crop circles doesn't" = "all crop circles are man-made." I'm sorry, it just isn't logical. There are certain people who post here, who post in the same style you do. It's very degrading to the people you target. You don't seem to have any responsibility for the people you hurt with your comments, and you explain it away, like you are entitled to degrade people, or you didn't really intend to degrade someone. Right. I'm actually a bit confused as to why you guys don't get into more trouble with the mods here? You break people down and insult them, but I don't even see a slap on the wrist. Why is that? Anyway, moving on....

As has been said. It's put up or shut up time.

I want to see one of these really complex designs get done by humans in a short amount of time, with all the oddities including radioactive anomolies. And I want the designs that are layed into the bent crop. I want all the goodies man.

And I want you to do it with simple technology like ropes, and planks.

And I want it on film. Start by making one in the daytime to make it easy. And then you will need to do a night time circle.

You have 1 hour. Practice to make sure you've got your skills up to par.

The thing is, I don't doubt that humans could possibly create these anomalous crop circles, one day, with a new technology. But, I'm not so sure the we currently "do" have the technology to create some of these crop circles that have been studied. That's all. Sure, rope and plank for some of them. But apparently some of these are just not rope and plank.

Troy

Originally posted by Graphix10
reply to post by ALLis0NE

 

"The Discovery Channel commissioned five aeronautics and astronautics students from MIT in 2002 and asked them to create crop circles. Crop circle researcher Nancy Talbott consulted with the Discovery team and advised that there are three common identifiers that set “real” crop circles apart from man-made or faked ones.

According to Talbott, unexplained crop circles feature elongated apical plant stem nodes, expulsion cavities in the plant stems and the presence of 10–50 micrometre diameter magnetized iron spheres in the soils, distributed linearly. The team failed to create a crop circle that met these three requirements."

I realize there are hoaxers out there, and many of them are very good, but these are the things that are unexplained to me. You can't explain them and neither can any other debunker.

Nancy Talbott is as mad as a box of frogs, she claims that crop circles are the earth speaking to us and will lead us all to a higher conciousness. She isnt even a scientist, she is just a co-ordinator for BLT research.
Even the BLT study states that all the anomolies can be created naturally but all the blind faith believers forget to state that when posting thier only "evidence" for circles not being man made.

What NEEDS to happen, is MULTIPLE IDENTICAL crop formations to happen at the same time, in different places on this planet. The co-ordination needed to pull that off would be a huge step in quieting the debunkers. Maybe. .

Time to start channeling. . .

Oh dear! Crop circles are made by humans. If you don't believe me listen to the only guy who has ever been charged and taken to court for making a circle. He says it how it is. . .

www.youtube.com...

Those who keep trying to explain circles as being made by aliens are doing so to sell books and exploit the beliefs of the UFO believers. And as for those of you who still refuse to accept that circles ar man made why not watch Matthew Williams and his gang make this impressive circle for the News Of The World. It explain how they weave the stems and create all those fine details that the believers say distinguish the real circles from the fake ones.

www.youtube.com...

Remember, the nights in England never truly get dark during the summer months. It is quite easy to see clearly out in the fields. Also remember that circle makers have been chased from the fields by irate farmers and in some cases shot at but these instances never get reported.
Those of you who still believe that circles are made by aliens please consider this. You are having your interests and beliefs in ET exploited by some rather unscrupulous individuals who wont the alien crop circle myth to persist so that they can keep selling their books.
Crop circles are art. . . Nothing more.

That matt chap looks a right tosser,shouldnt realy say that but he comes across as a massive attention seeker with his stash of poxy youtube vids and pathetic talks to web cam.

I stumbled upon his site from another thread and bit my tounge not wanting to say anything-but cant help it! lol

Originally posted by noangels
That matt chap looks a right tosser,shouldnt realy say that but he comes across as a massive attention seeker with his stash of poxy youtube vids and pathetic talks to web cam.

I stumbled upon his site from another thread and bit my tounge not wanting to say anything-but cant help it! lol

I agree. I've met him a couple of times and he seems okay but a little off if you now what I mean. The fact is he, and groups like his, are making these circles. The myth of certain circles being "impossible to fake" is just that-a myth.