Dark forces at work in the Crypto world: The "Lost Evidence".

reply to post by Gemwolf


This is what the second crypto thread in three months to make the top three?? Raven had the other one. GREAT thread my friend.

This one really has lit a spark in crypto again for me personally, I hope it does for others as well. I have nothing other to add, just a bump and a "good job".

[edit on 8/5/2009 by jkrog08]

reply to post by ravenshadow13


I actually just emailed Mr. Shuker asking him if he could provide me with links or excerpts from the articles that are used as sources for the Encyclopedia article in which he names these two other mystery sources. Not sure if that email address is active, if he checks it often, or if he'll find my request a bit presumptuous and not respond, but hell, figured it was worth a shot. I'll see what happens.

The email:
Hello Mr. Shuker. Before I start I would just like to say I have a huge amount of respect for you and your research. I've read some of your work and always have been quite impressed with your level-headed-ness and your ability to not jump to conclusions, a trait which many Fortean researches, I find, lack. But enough brown-nosing. On to my question.

In the entry on De Loys's Ape in the "Encyclopedia of Cryptozoology: A Global Guide" compiled by Michael Newton, it mentions that in the 1990's you were researching the stories circulating about a second photo of De Loy's Ape that appeared in an unnamed book. A excerpt from one of your articles in which you discuses this second photo with Susan Ford, Professor of Anthropology, Southern Illinois University is provided. It also mentions that you had two other sources who claimed to remember seeing this photo. I was wondering if it were possible for you to link me to the articles were these sources were named, as I have been unable to find the articles that are mentioned as sources for the encyclopedia entry. They are: "Alien Zoo" Fortean Times 134( June 2000), "Monkeying Around With Memories" Strange Magazine No. 20(December 1998) and "Another Missing Photo?"(Source not given except your name). If links to the actual articles are not possible, excerpts from said articles where these sources are mentioned would also be helpful. Thank you in advance.



[edit on 5-8-2009 by RoboKy]

Originally posted by Darthorious
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

I have to agree there was a photo on the net back in the wee early days of the net and I do recall seeing it. But back then you could also download the entire set of schematics to build a nuclear bomb, shelter and how to enrich the plutonium for the bomb with a big warning of "Don't do this at home you'll die for sure". Obviously a lot has changed sense govt.'s started playing on the net.

I remember those days, and I spent them looking for that Mokele-Mbembe video! The fact that it didn't turn up even then -- or since then -- is a major reason that I'm so doubtful that it even existed (as I mentioned in another thread).

As longtime fan of saurapod dinosaurs, the story has always been appealing. If a large dinosaur were going to survive (in a relatively familiar form, and not by evolving into something unrecognizable as a dinosaur) then Mokele-Mbembe seems to meet the basic requirements of being in a very secluded location, and of shedding considerable body mass. It's also easy to see how convergent evolution could yield something very similar (but yet, unrelated) to these saurapods.

But like I said, I'm not an optimist. Hope you guys have better luck than I do.

reply to post by RoboKy


AWESOME job. That is dedication, motivation, I'm so excited!

Please let us know if/what he emails you back! Good luck!

Thank you thank you thank you.

I think that when you're dealing with "Lost Evidence" you also have to keep the paranoia factor in mind (and this goes for all alternative subjects, not just Cryptozoology).

Nikola Tesla's "Death Ray" proposal is a prime example. By all indications, it's still Classified, but it leaked out circa 1984 and was published following one of the Tesla Symposium's that used to take place. Every major Tesla researcher has a copy of it, and you can find a couple of the diagrams on the web, but you can't find the entire proposal posted anywhere. This one famous document, that everybody and there mother seems to have a copy of, hasn't made it onto the web. Because people are too paranoid to post it.

Eventually it can become a feedback loop of sorts, where people who have the evidence see that it's NOT on the web, and think "hell, everything is on the web, so if this isn't then there must be a reason...if I post this then my happy butt will land in Gitmo!!!"

So I guess when this happens, the key is to be persistent and build relationships with the small group of people who have (or claim to have) the evidence.


[edit on 6-8-2009 by theWCH]

Great thread star for you.
Second line ; This is what i like about ATS.

I don't post much here, but occasionally a thread catches my eye.

Couple of interesting topics here.

I have an alternative theory (well more of an idea) about some of these crypto memories/stories.

I have been studying up a lot lately on ATS and other sources about parallel universes and the like. I think it's very possible that life takes many branches and a lot of them are simple two-way (1s and 0s, left turn/right turn, clockwise/counter-clockwise etc). Heck even at the atomic level this could apply. We make a yes/no decision and lead life down a different path.

I also think that it's possible - through our travels in the murk that is time - to mix a bit of one universe with another. What if in universe A a thunderbird is a common predator but in universe B a bacteria was introduced via, say, man that targets only the thunderbird and makes it extinct.

If the universes are some how linked it's possible we might have vague "memories" of such a creature. This theory also helps explain deja vu and a host of other similar phenomena. One of these days I'll compile all my research into a thread. Thanks Gem for posting some thought-provoking ideas here.

I'd like to give Fooffstarr a plug for the effort he put in to this thread.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Yowies of Australia are a very intresting subject as is Bunyips.

also this website should be of intrest to some of you.

www.yowiehunters.com...

Originally posted by [davinci]
I think that many maybe close to the truth about why these images have disappeared. I don't believe that it is a conspiracy to hide the evidence of a particular story, I would say that it is more a general desire to hide anything that raises questions outside of the norm. I have always been fascinated by these standouts and have been following the alternative history advocates for years. The one thing that always stands out is coverups.

The most recent is the staggeringly ancient forest in Austrailia. Several years ago a hiker discovered in the remote outback that there was a Jurassic "forest" still happily growing in near total isolation.

findarticles.com...

They just transplanted one of those trees into Stanley Partk in Vancouver Canada!

vancouverisawesome.com...

P.S. I love the word Pterodactyl - too bad they're not still around.

Can you just imagine the exo-biology on other planets..! If we've got elephants and giraffs, what might they have..? Oh to be God and see it ALL!

[edit on 6-8-2009 by OmegaPoint]

With the amount of permafrost melting and all those microbes, bacteria and god only knows what else bubbling up to the surface. For the first time in millions of years would it be of any wonder that we are amazed to see thing from the past?

Dinosaurs a plenty and those were rather recent on the time line what lies beneath the ice is only to be guessed at.

I am sure we shall see in years to come amany historial mysteries and extinct species resurfacing into the light of the modern day.

I feel the problem with such an event will be our own undoing, can we deal with the germs and diseases that effected the species of the past?

So yes we can sit in wonder at the amazing variety of life long lost and ponder our own existance in this world, however is the past able to live along side us here in the present day?

Aww I dunno about all that, but I do know that the Thylacine is one of the worst tragedies our land ever lost - such a fascinating creature.

And yes, I have also heard of tales of them still existing in small pockets in the wild.

Humans are so crap at times; hunting and killing these things for nothing more than to ease fears...

If you've ever seen footage of them, they are truly amazing to consider... not a dog, not a cat, all marsupial... yet, evolutionarily magnificent.

Hunted to extinction on the mainland before the first fleet, then hunted to extinction elsewhere - possibly - at the hands of the settlers...

Anyway, good thread!!



[edit on 6/8/2009 by Ha`la`tha]

Anyone feel up to looking through all the issues of Fate magazine? That's where I suspect I saw when I was a teenager that photo of the Thunderbird nailed to a barn door.

Start here:
www.fatemag.com...

Good news and bad news...

I came across an article about the photo in Strange Magazine #21:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/ac3b3dfa987f.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/caeca6d58735.jpg[/atsimg]

The Author - Mark Chorvinsky - did some amazing research to find the legendary "Thunderbird" picture...

And he came out empty.

The Full Article - Strange Magazine #21

I'm running out for a while. I'll try to summarize the article on my return. (Unless someone else volunteers... )

reply to post by Gemwolf


Really cool post! S&F

I have a lady friend who says she was picked up by one of these Thunderbirds when she was a little girl. Her sister ran and grabbed her as the bird was flying off and fortunately for her the bird only got her hair and as it was still going up with the weight of both girls her hair pulled out and they fell..

Farmers gathered to hunt it down and found its nest in, "several" trees at the top of a hill and shot it. The then took the bird to Wilmington college in Ohio.

The bird ended up, "disappearing" from the college and she told me the FBI came and told them that the incident never occurred and not to talk about it or they would come and take them somewhere.

The college administrator had long passed but I knew the son of the college administrator at the time of the incident.. Interested in her story, I went to his house and talked with the son and his mother about the bird and they lit up about the subject and told me that the event did in fact occur..

I too have seen one of these birds from a great distance. I was riding around on a bicycle and I saw what I thought to be a huge kite flying from a schoolyard about a mile away. Then It flapped its wings and I knew it was not a kite!

I then thought it was an optical illusion because it appeared to be at the height of one small cloud in the sky. but then it flew right back into the little cloud and though I followed the cloud the bird never came back out of it.

The clouds were allmost non-existent; just 2 or three small clouds that were very high that day.

What really strikes me is the intelligence of the creature understanding to use the clouds as a cloak! The cloud was very small; about 5 football fields square like. It was really using it to conceal itself from the evil human race!

That makes me believe there is a lot more of them doing the same. It looked like this one was hoping to find another bigger cloud but there were none so it went back into the small one it came out of. The cloud was not much bigger than the bird as in 20 of them might be able to stay in it.

In description it was not a vulture or a pterodactyl. It was more of what appeared to be in color of a dove or some hawks and it was majestic to say the least. I believe it was the size of a cessna or better..

Edit to add: About the most a bird can pick up and fly with is about 1/10th to 1/8th of its weight; so that would mean that the bird had to weigh at least 640 pounds to pick up two 40 pound girls!!

Thank you.

Noconsequence.





[edit on 6-8-2009 by noconsequence]

reply to post by ravenshadow13


No I have no idea what the issue number was.
My brother had a HUGE stack of Argosy issues that my uncle had given him. This was about the mid to late sixties I think.
Whats weird is I remember the Thunderbird pic and another issue with Bigfoot.
The Bigfoot one I have been able to find.
But not the Thunderbird.

reply to post by anonamousantichrist


The problem of photoshopping and digital manipulation is quite a large one. It provides an easy way to debunk something that is in fact real. It also provides an easy way to fake something that is not real. It offers confusion. There is a silver lining, as I see it; It acts as a stimulus to get individuals to search within, and they can then realize the artificial elements within that they thought were "real."

I'd never heard of this illusive photo before this thread.

So i think we can can say ufo's are not Alien in origin but ourselves from the future visiting the past,only someone deliberately or accidentally brought with them one of these extinct birds into the 19th century were it escaped as was shot by some cowboys.The photo has since disappeared as those who knew about this photo knew they had to get rid of the evidence that this bird ever existed so we wouldn't be able to discover the bird actually did exist and after figuring out it is not from our time realize it must have come through a time portal. This could alter the entire future,not good

Well not good for them!

reply to post by muzzleflash

So really that 2nd photo listed the link you gave, or the top photo on slayers post, still seems totally genuine to me. I just cannot find anything wrong with it.

I'm not sure about the television promo, but there is something about that photo that is just not right.

It has to do with the guy in front with his foot on the "monster's" head. His hat is just not right. During that time period, any soldier wearing a full brim hat would have one side folded up against the crown. That way when he was marching, he could rest his rifle on his shoulder and not knock his hat off with the rifle.

To me it looks like it was faked by someone without enough knowledge to get it right.

I'm making a separate thread for the Missing Thunderbird Picture, specifically.

ATS Hunts For The Missing Thunderbird Picture

Please continue commentary about the Thunderbird Picture there. Please continue any commentary about other "Lost Evidence" such as the ape picture and anything else here.

[edit on 8/6/2009 by ravenshadow13]