Tesla: The Forgotten Mysteries II [The UFO Connection]

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


About time someone brought that up. I've actually spent more time reading and researching the whole 'Ancient Astronauts' phenomena, especially in regards to ancient sightings. I know about the Vimana's and other Hindu texts which describe the building of such craft.

I really have no explanation for some of those sightings, my best bet would be to state that they weren't actually drawing UFO's but something else, but then i would be going against what i really believe as i know all ancient cave drawings are in some way or another inspired by what has been seen first hand.

Interesting, we probably wont ever find out the truth, but i stand by my belief that at least 90% of all modern UFO sightings are of man made craft and that the government does have the possession of this technology and has had for some time.

reply to post by serbsta



There is no denying as to what the ancient accounts tell us. You can't dismiss all of the paintings, and much less the writtings which describe these flying machines, and the fact that it is even explained in the ancient writtings such as the Vedas, that the gods gave these aircraft, and the knowledge of how to fly them to ancient men to fight against other men who served other gods/godesses.

It is more probable that 80%-90% of the sightings are actually flying aircraft which some ancient humans were given by these gods/goddesses, and that at least some of these people kept this technology and are still using them.

But then again, why would a government sanctioned project of UFOs be at times just hovering in the sky, barely been seen unless you use binoculars, and how is it possible that there are videos of aircraft from which too many smaller aircraft come out of.

Way too many which have more mass than the main aircraft.

www.youtube.com...

Aircraft such as those in the video above are seen very frequently in places like Mexico.

IMO there is no way that 90% of the sightings are "government aircraft".

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Its ignorant to state that there 'is no way' that 90% can be govt. aircraft. I dont want any confusion, what i meant to state is that 90% can be explained more reasonably as being govt. aircraft that extraterrestrial aircraft.

Back again, there 'is a way' that most of them can be govt. aircraft because it is a lot more plausible than aliens taking all the trouble to come here yet they fail to make their presence known worldwide.

reply to post by serbsta


It is ignorance to state that 90% of such aircraft are government sanctioned, more so since much of what you gave was pointed out as being hoaxes, such as the German UFOs in some of those pictures you gave.

You can't say 90% of the aircraft "are government sanctioned" since there have been sightings of such aircraft for millenium.

As for the reason why they haven't made themselves more public? They have done so for millenia, they, whoever they are, are just not interested at least for now to show themselves every time someone wants them to.

Not to mention that they can have their own reasons for doing this.



[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Also something worth to note is the fact that the government has been denying the existance of such alien aircraft, and even in the miltiary this is a no-no discussion.

I should know it since in the first meeting i had in my S-3 Viking squadron the first thing that came out of the skipper's mouth was to claim that alien aircraft don't exist. Then again, this is done because they know we would see such aircraft.

After all the decades of denying the existence of these aircraft I wouldn't put it past them to claim that "most or all of such aircraft are government sanctioned".

Oh, and btw I am not implying that you are a governemnt agent, unless you want to tell us this yourself.

[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Read my last post more carefully, as i didn't mean to state that. Otherwise i would have been ignorant.

And no, i am not a government agent.

reply to post by serbsta


First of all, obviously you can't take a bit of humor for what it is.

Second of all, you did claim that it is ignorant to claim that 90% of such aircraft can't be government sanctioned, yet i can say, and did say the same about you more so since there is more evidence which shows most such aircraft are not made by the government.

Third of all, such aircraft are seen all over the globe, as to the reason why they don't come to your house to tell you why they are here, that is their own choice, and they could have many reasons for not doing this, among them could very well be who are you for them to have to tell you what, and why they do what they do.

Fourth of all, since they have been seen for millenium it should be known by now that either there are at least colonies closer to Earth, or and it could also be true that at least some of them live on Earth, and some are interdimensional beings.

As far as we know it is not possible for an aircraft of limited size to produce several aircraft which mass put together is bigger than the original/mothership, yet we even have videos of this happening, which should show at least some of these aircraft can bend, or break rules that our own science tells us can't be broken.

There are also ancient accounts in which the pilots of these aircraft have been killed by ancient men because of their religious beliefs.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


I took the humour, i just thought the rolly eyed emoticon suited the response better. Nothing personal taken.

And as i stated:

I dont want any confusion, what i meant to state is that 90% can be explained more reasonably as being govt. aircraft that extraterrestrial aircraft.

But again, one mans dust particle is another mans spacecraft.

reply to post by serbsta



And tell us why is it that 90% have to be "government made"?...

There have been as many sightings throughout the history of mankind as there are today, but then again an alien aircraft is to another man such as yourself a dust particle no-matter what the evidence says.

[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Originally posted by serbsta
reply to post by VitriolAndAngst

 

Thanks for the very interesting post, you seem to be very knowledgable in the field. I would love to hear about some of your ideas, in a theoretical application ofcourse.

So scientifcally, propulsion would not be possible via an electromagnetic field unless theres a plasma? Im no science buff, so i would honestly love to hear more about this in regards to what Tesla had planned.

Cheers.

I'm not an expert in Electronics. Some college courses in Physics, reading Feinman and Einstein and a few quantum physics books.

The "plasma" I'm referring to is what is created with a LOT of electricity under high voltage with rapid "flow." I forget the article, but a garage inventor was using electricity to levitate a small weight. It took a LOT of current, and a plasma was created as the voltage moved across the metallic surface. The LIFT was merely a byproduct of the current flow creating a plasma, and the motion of the plasma down the surface. So, about the most expensive fan one could conceive of.

I'd read some Popular Mechanics articles about the possibility of a charged skin on aircraft helping to reduce drag. The air particles are accelerated on the surface of the plane, and this reduces the vortices that are created behind an object moving at high speed. That's about the extent of "electricity's" usefulness as propulsion.

Well, then there are ion and plasma drives that can be used in outer space -- but not in the air.

The flying saucer most often depicted of the United States efforts, has a turbo fan in the middle. It's an unstable and expensive toy. I can't verify those German photos -- but those obviously aren't using turbo fans.

If anyone has built these saucers, then magnetism would be very useful as the OPPOSING FORCE-- magnetism DOES NOT, provide the motive force. The past year, I've figured there are better ways -- so it only stands to reason that aliens, would be on to bigger and better things. The saucer shape might be convenient -- but we aren't going to see them traveling. Just look at the advances made in invisibility cloaks -- sure it's at level of very tiny objects. The nano-wire / nano-hole breakthrough is the most promising -- I think when they really understand how that works, they'll realize that they are creating vibrations that are half-plank lengths and this effects the transmission of gravity. It doesn't effect weight directly, but all things that have weight emit "space-time" and that creates gravity. You can tune gravity to have light move through an object undisturbed (since its the PATTERN of an atom, that makes it opaque in the first place -- remember, we are Phantoms) . Matter can be made transparent to other matter as well and slide right through (needs a carrier wave and it's easier if the other matter is a pure substance -- crystals the easiest) Position can be "retuned" in higher dimensions. When you are traveling in the vacuum of space, how do the particles you are made of, distinguish that point in space from any other?

To explain the phantom comment; When you think about how "empty" matter is -- you realize that we are phantoms. The distance between an electron and it's nucleus is like the distance between Jupiter and the Sun. Why then, does one object not fall right through another? The distortions in space/time (the aether) that the electron's and protons create when they are in phase. Solid matter is created by a linking of charges of atoms that allows them to be stable with less energy. It was only about a month ago, that I finally figured out why electrons pair up. I'd always thought of particles as sort of little vortex's, that have a north and south pole -- part of them is pushing OUT space/time, and the other end is pulling it in (more goes OUT). Alignment of LOCAL gravity flow creates magnetism. However, I now realize that the vortex is in two 4 dimensional branes, and its fluctuating back and forth. The electron's are the energetic half and slightly further in the "future" have a negative charge -- that's why they seem to be moving so rapidly and we get "uncertainty." But pairing allows for equal and opposite "brane" fluctuation to balance forces.

When reading some Quantum String theory, I realized it's the same thing as much of what I've been thinking up on my own -- except for some very, very key principles. THE physicists seem to have a love for lot's of forces and particles -- anything that doesn't fit the math results in a new particle. The "particle" is discovered, because something LIKE a particle, will resolve any energy state. I now see that the three "branes" that vibrate in classical string theory are the three "layers" of our Universe. Except I call the lower 4 dimensions what we think of as reality, the top 4 dimensions as "space-time" that flow into this one as gravity, and the middle "unseen" dimension as "the aether." That's just an easier model to visualize what is going on. Actual reality, is a confluence of all three.

What I SEE sounds like gobbledy-gook, because so much is vocabulary. Few people understand quantum physics and I think they make it a lot more complicated than it needs to be. The math is amazing and works. But I think the "quantum phenomenon" is merely that everything is waves with "holes in space" (that makes something a particle), and the waves only exchange energy on their "peaks." So the discrete ON or OFF packets of energy that Quantum physics describes is like if you looked at two oceans -- one almost reflected above the other and only a foot distant. When there is a wave on the bottom ocean, and a wave on the top ocean -- that intersection of the "peaks" is creating a packet exchange of energy. In REALITY; what we know of as matter may be only structure in a more energetic vacuum -- hard to say.


Five blind men examining the same elephant will give you five different descriptions -- they may be still true to the elephant from their perspectives. Since we all see the "color" blue -- we all know what me mean. But how do you describe blue, other than to say BLUE or point to something that is blue? A blind man can be told that the sky is blue. If everyone does that consistently for the same references -- then it might make sense. But no human sees the underlying structure of the Universe except in their mind's eye

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


Im not sure if you're getting confused with what im saying. I said that 90% of sightings can be more reasonably explained as government aircraft rather than extra-terrestrial aircraft. Simply because we've yet to see proof of the latter.



[edit on 12/7/2009 by serbsta]

reply to post by serbsta


lol and yet again you claim there is no proof despite the fact that every culture on Earth has writtings about these aircraft, and even though we even have ancient paintings that depict many different aircraft, and "there is no proof"?...

You are trying too hard to dismiss facts, and sorry to say just because the government might have done some research, and some obscure writtings which were supposedly confiscated after Tesla's death doesn't prove 90% of these aircraft "can be explained as being government aircraft"...

[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


This still isn't proof although it is very... 'enticing'. How could you know what the ancients were drawing, do you know for certain that they weren't just telling stories? Im not saying its not possible, to the contrary, i just think its more plausible (now) that they are not alien spacecraft.

reply to post by serbsta


None of what you presented is proof of your claims, more so since first of all, Tesla's writtings were confiscated, and I wonder why there have been some supposed "leaks' of some of his writtings lately.

Second of all, the ancient writtings, such as the Vedas not only describe these aircraft, but there are text about physics, as well as astronomical knowledge which according to the Vedas were given to mankind by gods/godesses.

Part of the Vedas talk about things such as the atom, they also talk about ancient wars in which weapons which would shine like the Sun and make enemies run into the water trying to relieve the pain from radiation, would get even worse injuries.

These were not "made up stories". We also have 13th-17th century paintings which show similar aircraft in the skies and can't be mistaken by anything else than what they are.

There "might be some" of such aircraft having been back engineered by the government, but it doesn't make most sightings "government aircraft" even though the government would love to now claim this after decades of denying the existance of these aircraft.

I am not even the first former military man to talk about these things, and there have been military personnel and officers who have talked about this for decades, such as Jesse Marcel, and these people ahve seen a lot more than I ever did...


[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Of course, that's also without mentioning the fact that even astronauts have talked about seen such aircraft as they went to the Moon. But I guess those were also "government aircraft" even though astronauts were briefed not to mention them, and to just dismiss them.

Originally posted by MattMulder

excellent topic, serbsta. Really.
Those UFOs we see out there definitely are human-made, why would they crash then ?
An alien civilization capable of crossing the universe and check us out definitely has the know-how to prevent crashes, don't you think ?

the real case, now, would be to study the research on invisibility, which is possible ( i remember having read a topic about a team of "something university" putting together means of making a "stealth coat" ... )

Maybe the UFOs we captuire on pics/video are failing UFOs, which "stealth" function has been disabled due to some technical problem?
I've got some serious thinking ahead.
Thanks again Serbsta !

>> Without committing to SAYING there are flying saucers or not (my dad said he saw one flying for the Navy -- but it could have been swamp gas above his air craft carrier with a metallic glint on it). I have to agree with your assessment.

LOGIC, would tell you, that an alien race that crossed that galaxy would have BETTER understanding of materials science and physics than we do at any given time. Hence, when we see those old "metal bucket" flying saucers -- if they weren't fakes, they don't look as advanced in materials science as the seamless sports cars of today.

And to shoot one down?

We can imagine some force used to propel them. It's the next phase in our own discoveries. We have a few inklings of many new technologies. So if you fast-forward a thousand years with just human science -- well, these UFO's don't look so dang advanced. Likely they wouldn't be glowing anymore if they could move through matter, or "re-tune themselves to another point in space." Likely, in a million years we won't be using vehicles to cross the stars. And with this infinite Universe -- how many civilizations have a million years head start? For all intents and purposes, they would be like God to us. I don't think technology stands still.

I predict our current research into invisibility WILL lead to some understanding of gravity. I predicted they would find that light could influence gravity -- I think a University at Virginia conducted some experiments -- it's too late in the night for me to hunt it down. Anyway,.. light can "push" gravity as gravity can push on light. You can bounce light "for free" between mirrors, so it's possible to make an area more dense in Photons than in matter.

The invisibility cloaks that use Nano-holes and threads are the key here; LINK. I totally missed that until the discovery was announced about a month ago -- I'm ashamed I didn't figure it out before. It works -- but not for the reasons they are describing yet. It get's right down to why I think that Quantum physics is off track in that it's about resonant "octaves" in space/time that forces energy to be released in packets. If a wave does not interact with another wave at a peak threshold, no energy is exchanged -- BUT, space can be influenced. So if you can get resonances and distances BELOW quantum thresholds (Plank length), well then, you can start creating materials that give you free energy and force.

Half-plank lengths between structures NOT fused into the same molecular structure is the key. And there are other possibilities between two vacuum plates with nano-holes and wires. If you could create a large area of non-associated matter that was closer between the two plates, than the molecules were in the plates themselves -- well, that might be the secret to vacuum energy.

And invisibility is the secret to one of the five Faster than Light techniques I've been thinking of. Of course, WHY that is so, is another matter entirely. And YES, the Warp Drive concept should work, but it's the more difficult one, since you've got some neutron star material, being "shut off" from the Universe and back on -- and you probably would have to orbit the stuff at the same time (making a curve shorter than a straight line). Damn messy and you'd have to rid yourself of inertia -- which means you've already mastered the important physics that would allow you to bypass the bending of space with a gravity well in the first place.

With Anti-Matter, and an understanding of gravity, you should be able to control inertia. With an understanding of invisibility -- you can control gravity as well. With an understanding of plank-length structures to master invisibility, you understand vacuum energy. Of course, the last two would really help to produce anti-matter in the first place. It's only less tricky than the warp drive.

If you can figure out how to create plank-length vacuum plates (I had an inkling a month ago and forgot it just as quickly) and anti-matter, then it's handy to really understand how to make coherent matter and,... I forget the term, it's what they are calling matter that is quantumly "in sync" -- anyway, you do that with the anti-matter and you can create a gate that can trick the higher dimensional states of matter to move to another gate. This is NOT like a worm-hole at all.

A few years ago, I was thinking about absolute vacuums, that you could travel behind, and "warp' through space, bypassing the light-speed constraint. But a "worm hole" -- well, that's only a way to travel if you want something recycled.

And if you don't understand invisibility -- everything I said makes no sense at all.

>> And I predict that anti-matter will produce negative gravity (not anti-gravity, but it will push matter AWAY and more so in stronger gravity fields). I could be wrong, however, it has happened before.


>> But I have to get back to the real world. Hard to mix the pursuits where my mind takes over and the day-to-day. I have to get this lady's web site built tonight and go to work tomorrow. And of course, take care of the kids.

Still wish I could have pursued invention as a career. I've had so many very BASIC ideas come out. When my parents built an underground house, I really got into all sorts of ideas for insulation, and home construction. The "light pipe" used to pump light for free from the sun into the house -- that's something I designed when I was ten. It's an invention that GE and a few other companies make money on today. I could have gotten the patent for that -- but I'm sure there are a thousand other people who had the same idea.

Meh; The spoils go to the Lawyers, no matter who spends the sweat equity to actually implement an idea.

Tesla built some many things even on a toilet for a life time could learn and read all the diarrea he did. Tesla most likly did invent a ufo and within the past day now believe ufos are man made but i think its backengeered so there are still some ufos in the sky probably in space though.

reply to post by ElectricUniverse


The fact that they don't mention them supports my argument not yours. Wouldn't that be the smart thing to do if those we're their craft?

Im not disagreeing with you mate, you could be right. But personally, with what i currently know and have seen i believe that these aren't alien in origin. Maybe if I witness and experience as much as you have in my lifetime i might have a different perception.

Thanks for the conversation.

Originally posted by serbsta

The fact that they don't mention them supports my argument not yours. Wouldn't that be the smart thing to do if those we're their craft?

I have no idea what you just said in there. Did you mean to say "if those were their craft"?... And who is not mentioning what exactly?

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
reply to post by serbsta

 

lol and yet again you claim there is no proof despite the fact that every culture on Earth has writtings about these aircraft, and even though we even have ancient paintings that depict many different aircraft, and "there is no proof"?...

You are trying too hard to dismiss facts, and sorry to say just because the government might have done some research, and some obscure writtings which were supposedly confiscated after Tesla's death doesn't prove 90% of these aircraft "can be explained as being government aircraft"...

[edit on 12-7-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

>> Look, if smart people can't agree about what happened to JFK and 9/11 -- then how can SMART PEOPLE get all riled up about what ancient folks scratched on a wall?

These are REALLY BAD pieces of art for accuracy. Sure they might be inspirational and good design -- but you have to rely on language for what was INTENDED by the pictures.

So, bad art, stuck in the ground for a thousand years. On top of that -- we've got Greeks describing Athena in the sky flying a chariot as they go into battle with the Trojans. So, these people are not great witnesses you'd like to take into a court room. And humans really suck at remembering details during a surprise event -- just check out how often witnesses misremember things in court. We fix facts on shocking events to what we EXPECT to see. Once we have familiarity with an event -- we see it better.

If Moses went to the burning bush maybe ten times, I'd give it some credibility. We have one witness, to some event out of the ordinary, and then the Catholic Church gets a few billion bucks a year. So hey, somehow people put more weight behind things without support, and then don't question things that should be questioned. Half our country doesn't believe in evolution.

Humans and history are unreliable at best -- no point in getting bent out of shape over it.

So, add a few thousand years, and imagine what could be discerned of 9/11 or the JFK assassination, add into the mix, that people who commit crimes don't want to get caught -- and the BEST people at crime, end up running things. So are the SKY chariots some craft, some drug hallucination, or the result of creative propaganda?

>> I'm absolutely certain of ONE THING. That our government would be telling us exactly what we are hearing now, with or without their knowledge of UFOs. IN fact, if they had no real experience with aliens, they'd probably be a lot more curious of people claiming to have seen them.

Only if you are guilty, to you pretend not to notice the scene of the crime. Am I right?