Big Fat Lie: Overeating is a symptom, not the cause, of Obesity!

Originally posted by DevolutionEvolvd
reply to post by PrisonerOfSociety

 

No, you get an award for being completely unoriginal and for realizing that your "hypothesis" hasn't worked for the past 50 years. It doesn't fit. Energy balance hypotheses are headed out the door.

-Dev

Cool, any award is a reward

*snip*



Mod Edit: snipped offensive and explicit content

[edit on 6/25/2009 by JacKatMtn]

reply to post by PrisonerOfSociety


reply to post by PrisonerOfSociety


That's funny. I would be careful posting videos like that though. Just a little advice since you're new and all. I liked it, but it's not exactly within T&C.

Saying people get fat because they eat too much is like saying Yao Ming grew so tall because he ate too much.

Aushwitz? Really? Have you any idea what Catabolism is?

The prisoners were confined to the rail cars, often for days or weeks, without food or water.

en.wikipedia.org...

Once again, overeating is a symptom of obesity. Overeating is also the result of consuming carbohydrates which cause cravings and ultimately causes one to eat more. And that "more" is usually carbohydrates.

-Dev

I've always heard that some forms of obesity are caused by chemical imbalances in the brain. When you eat, chemicals signal your brain to let you know that you're full and should stop eating. Some people don't receive these signals properly and eat past the point that they are full without feeling discomfort. And therefore become obese.

I've seen it happen, I don't understand how some people can eat plates and plates of food without feeling full or even ill. I can't eat past when I'm full, it's physically impossible for me.

reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd


Someone posted a video of a woman dying in Iran and dolphins been hacked to death, so i doubt they will mod my posted vid; if they do then it is a sad state of affairs 4 ATS and they are pandering to the wrong audience by continually censoring the slightest subjective infraction. Oops, i used the number 4 instead of 'for', does that mean this post will get deleted

Regarding your obesity = overeating statement, i'm confused. If you're fat, stop shovelling food in your mouth...it's not rocket science

Edit: typo

[edit on 24-6-2009 by PrisonerOfSociety]

It would explain to a degree why some people can eat an entire buffet for breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and not gain any weight and have a six pack. If people can eat everything, and not gain weight, the idea that someone could eat little and gain weight isn't farfetched. And I don't think saying "high metabolism" is the right answer. There is an extent to which you can burn calories sitting on your butt, if you're eating like 3-4k calories a day or something I don't see how that could all be burned off.

Hormones do control hunger and metabolism, so I don't think the idea is that outlandish.

I did read recently that the body might become "blind" to how much fat is being stored, which I think is pretty fascinating. Even if you're not obese, perhaps our bodies can be a bit unaware of the fat stores.

[edit on 24-6-2009 by ghaleon12]

Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
reply to post by DevolutionEvolvd

 

Someone posted a video of a woman dying in Iran and dolphins been hacked to death, so i doubt they will mod my posted vid; if they do then it is a sad state of affairs 4 ATS and they are pandering to the wrong audience by continually censoring the slightest subjective infraction. Oops, i used the number 4 instead of 'for', does that mean this post will get deleted

Reminder : ATS Is A Family Friendly Site

That's the only reason I brought it up. Content on the site as of late has been a little of the non family friendly nature. I like the video you posted but others might not think it's family friendly, is all. I love me some comedy. But remember, comedy doesn't equal reality.

Regarding your obesity = overeating statement, i'm confused. If you're fat, stop shovelling food in your mouth...it's not rocket science

Please review the material and/or watch the video to understand what I'm speaking of. It's not rocket science, as you've so bluntly stated, so think about it.

For the 3rd time, fat accumulation is not caused by overeating. The fatter you get the more you eat, not the other way around.

I appreciate your comments on the subject thus far; however, if you're going to argue/debate this with me, you should understand basic biochemistry, or at least read the material that is given in the OP, before trying to defend a baseless argument.

I respect your opinion, if you've even given one yet, but we are here to deny ignorance and your mockery of the subject is evidence that you are clueless as to the physiological effects that nutrients have on the body and it's basic functions to survive.

Reading the material before posting a rebuttal is crucial, otherwise, this discussion will go nowhere.

-Dev



[edit on 25-6-2009 by DevolutionEvolvd]

Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Eat food + no exercise = you get fat

Go on diet + exercise = burn calories

Do i get a doctorate for those formulas?

Only if you can include the formula for :

Skinny female + lots of fatty fast foods + lots of alcohol + no exercise + smoker = skinny person who never gets fat or puts on weight & looks almost anorexic.

If you can work that out, in conjunction with your previous evaluation, then we can agree.

Till then, hrmm... something don't add up...


(btw, thats not me, but a friend of mine, just thought I'd mention that, as Im a fat bearded bugger who eats bugger all crap, and does more exercise than anyone I know... but I don't claim I should be thin!)


[edit on 25/6/2009 by badw0lf]

Originally posted by Mintwithahole.
Unfortunately, most of that food is fried or full of saturated fat.

Thats the problem, it's those 'feel good' instant gratification foods that more or less addict some people.

You can take that greasy KFC away from them and give them a salad, and it won't be touched. Simply because, it's not the food their body is craving, but the decadent slosh of fat that sedates them and creates the lethargy they associate with the feeling satiated.

That's probly why where I live, in one block alone, there is 3 bottle shops (1 pub, two liquor lands), a KFC, a SUBWAY, a McDonalds, a Charcoal Chicken, a Pretzal store (I mean, those ones that are more like a corissant covered in garlic sauce, parmesian, etc..), a Chicken Treat, a Nandos chicken, a Dominos pizza...

Thats just the fast food outlets that I can remember off hand.

They know that the combination of booze and grease is an easy money market. But for people who already have a problem in every day life, the attraction must be obscene.

At least the asian grocers sell cheap decent veggies, so I try to spend more time perusing their stores for chillies and things I can make into a tastey HOT next-day-regret salad..

Originally posted by DevolutionEvolvd
reply to post by PrisonerOfSociety

 

No, you get an award for being completely unoriginal and for realizing that your "hypothesis" hasn't worked for the past 50 years. It doesn't fit. Energy balance hypotheses are headed out the door.

-Dev

I say b*llocks to that. I believe it is that simple.

Every time I've been overweight in my life it's because I was lazy and not exercising and eating too much - I was consuming too many calories and my body didn't need the energy, so my metabolism slowed and I packed on the weight. And granted some foods provide more colories than others, but even healthy food will still pack on weight if you aren't burning energy.

As soon as I got into a proper fitness regime (running, swimming, weight training) and lowered my colorie intake and then matched the calories to the energy i was spending, my weight dropped off and I was/am slim and trim.

I admit that everyone's bodytype and genetics are different and some people are more prone to weight gaining due to their body storing more energy than others, slower & faster metabolisms, etc.

But I think it really is that simple and it's worked for me; when I was overweight, when I was body building, when I was just staying trim.

For those 30 stone fatties that are bed ridden and moaning about being fat - you know the ones; they sit there eating 30 strips of bacon for breakies and whinge about being fat. Stop the massive calorie intake and get some basic exercise. The question is not whether it will work or not - it will. It's whether people *want* to do what is needed to lose the weight. Which usually means drastic changes to diet and lifestyle.

And in a society of plenty, few want to go without.

I must respectfully disagree with Taube. I know that overreating is a direct cause of my weight gain. I ALSO had a hormonal imbalance caused by the weight gain. Once I started eating less, moving more... the weight came off, and the hormonal issue corrected itself.

low carb has always been the best approach for me, as soon as i start eating too much carby crap i feel like crap and even tho im not eating much more i get bloated and start gaining weight. Its esp hard cause its so much easier to just grab some food and go, so sometimes during the week all im eating is pre-packaged garbage. im trying to balance out now with low carb and organic snacks and its working good. im not fat but always had to battle my whole life to keep my figure, im on a diet 24-7.

it's a screaming shock how many people are coming onto the thread to say "don't be stupid, of course it's over eating" when they clearly haven't taken a blind bit of notice of the video in the OP. watch the first ten minutes of the video at least, ffs. otherwise, don't bother posting. it makes you look like a jerk.

sorry, on topic, it's an interesting standpoint, i hadn't heard the low carb option's reasoning before but he lays out the case very well. decreasing the ability of the body to store fat through reducing carb intake seems like a plan although i have a reservation i was disappointed he didn't address.

the damage to the circulatory system is allegedly caused by fat in the blood stream, it seems to me that, if anything, this lowcarb option will increase the level of fat in the blood stream by not allowing it to be stored in the body. this seems dangerous.

there's an article in the OP support material that kind of skirts the issue but i fear it's misleading.

reply to post by king9072


i can only offer my own ` case studdy ` as a rebuttal - but i regularly consume huge ` sugar spikes ` - typically 3 to 4 mars mars or a large block of kendal mint cake - far in excess of 50 gms sugars in one go - oh and topped off with fats and protiens too - typically a couple of peices of polish kabanos

and i have never had any weight gain ` issues `[ 5 foot 11 , , 68 kg , waiste 30" ]

maybee its because i wolf all that down while cold , wet and exhausted as a ` pick me up ` - while engaged in a full days caving , climbing or kyaking outing

its the idiots who waddle from thier hous to the car [ on the drive ] to mcdonals [ drive through ] and eat all that shiite before driving back home to the saftey of thier sofa who are having problems

i have also managed to LOOSE weight - while on a 6000 cal [ yup 6 thousand ] / day ` expedition diet ` - again never properly dry , warm or rested for 10 to 20 days

maybee i am ` spacial ` - but hey - why are all the freinds and associates who do the same sports as i ` special ` too ?

Great, another excuse for people to say they cannot lose weight! To me this is going along the lines of saying an alcohalic has a disease, instead of an addiction. Sorry, but I know a lot of people who have used a simple time proven advice on how to lose weight successfully, all this is just another excuse for people to contintue to drink two cases of coke today and all the take out and junk food they can get their fat little hands on.

Originally posted by king9072
I don't want to get too far into this cause I seriously do not want to look up the sources, but I know they exist and the facts have been around for a decade now.


When we are on low card, low fat diets, after a short period we certain chemical our body produces starts to get the impression that we are going through starvation. Reducing the amount of calories that are burned and feverishly attempts to store as much fat from what it intakes.

On these diets, this chemical dries up as we enter our "starvation" and the body quits shedding fat. But, the kicker is, is that you can restart the chemical by having a day of complex carb gorging. In fact, studies showed that people who stayed near starvation for several days, then had one day of complex carb gorging, maintained levels of this chemical similar to someone who was eating all the time everyday.

But noone should consider any form of 1 sided diet, if you truly want to lose weight and get healthy, it requires a multi-pronged attack of proper, balanced eating, as well as exercise. Anything that promises fast fat lose is either garbage, or dangerous to your long term health. It's also worth noting that most of these crash diets, that even on the small percentage that they work for, those people gain weight back rapidly as they return to prior habits.

Back in the '70's there was this thing called "controlled cheating" to do just that with the bio-chemical starvation imbalance created by 100% low carb>

Originally posted by Darth Lumina
all this is just another excuse for people to contintue to drink two cases of coke today and all the take out and junk food they can get their fat little hands on.

strangely enough, given the fact that the problem with soda is carbs and the bulk of the issue with junk food is, again, carbs, i'm going to say that you wanted to take the opportunity to say "fat little hands" in a disparaging way rather than actually contribute to the discussion.

why is that? does it make you feel better about yourself to put someone else down? do you feel all glowy and righteous now? well done, good for you. hope your day is better for having done it.

reply to post by pieman


Sorry, I just don't have any pity for people who are the size of Gilbert Grapes mom, I really don't care if it hurts their feelings they need a reality check. A few extra pounds, fine whatever, but at least they can still get around. But those people who get that big, typically collect disability and welfare only to supplement their excessive eating habits and not have to work. There are some that have thyroid problems, fluid build up, yes there are medical reason for someone to get big, but not typically in the 400 and up range. You can blame anything you want, but none of those excuses fly by me.

reply to post by Darth Lumina

the discussion isn't about weather or not you like fat people, frankly, no-one cares, that's why no one started a thread called "does darth lumina like fat people", the thread is about obesity and how the actual cause seems to have been misrepresented by the medical profession as overeating in general despite the bulk of evidence to suggest it is actually to do with the types of food eaten.

if the type of one size fits all medical advice given at the moment is actually wrong, utterly wrong, as shown by numerous instances outlined in the first ten minutes of the video, why is that such an issue for you?

Originally posted by PrisonerOfSociety
Eat food + no exercise = you get fat

Go on diet + exercise = burn calories

Do i get a doctorate for those formulas?

I'm afraid not since there's no money to be made in stating the bleedin obvious. Now if you asked for money to research the bleedin obvious first then there's stacks of money. I would like to modify your equation slightly:

Weight Gain = Calories Eaten - (Food type Overhead + Exercise Burn) * Metabolism

where:
Food Type Overhead is a numb er that various by food type.
Metabolism is a number that decreases the less you eat (ironically!!) and the less you exercise.

That metabolism number is a killer. The less you eat the lower it becomes so the more weight you gain per calorie!! Hence why low calorie diets ON THEIR OWN don't work. You MUST exercise and that is why lazy overweight people seek alternate reasons for their weight.

Please note medical conditions merely alter "Food Type Overhead and Metabolism" with the Exercise parameter still present. You just plain can't get away from "Exercise" and a balanced diet

It is IMPOSSIBLE to put on weight without eating. As Scottie from Star Trek would say : You cannae break the laws of physics captain.

In answer to some posters, i did read the OP but i didn't watch the video; i feel i don't need to because it's pretty lame to make up medical fallacies to justify fatness.

I speak from experience because my weight has fluctuated quite a lot and it's happening again now as i spend way too much time on my PC (and ATS) and have noticed my belly getting bigger!

If you're fat and you really want to loose weight, just stop shovelling crap into your mouth and burn off calories with exercise.

However, i do understand that people have different metabolisms and so the thin girl analogy by a poster is correct, but anyone can get fat with food and anyone can get thin without it. It's just a case of how much to the extreme do you need to go to push your bodies internal switch to change the way it burns or consumes calories.

And yes, people who become 30 stones of waddling fat is disgusting. That's not a physical issue, but mental.

Flame away