Kennedy bill would make employers provide care

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife

They just need to let us keep more of our money and level the playing field as you said. Simple solutions just profit killers for business and gov. So it is completely off the table.

And what people have yet to realize is that both parties are bought and paid for by the health care companies...the Republicans are worse...but both are bought regardless.

Single payer healthcare isn't even on the table...it won't even be discussed..nothing will be discussed that will cut into the profits of the huge corporations.

Really both sides of the argument really have more in common than they think....many just don't realize that both of them (government and the health care business) are working against them.

I know that people say Obama has brought Fascism...and he has...but it was already here.

Big business and government are working hand in hand...and the corporate owned media plays their tune.

The people need to be heard..but as always...no matter what the issue is...we are almost completely silenced.

reply to post by Chakotay


You might want to read my sig once again.

You expect the business to provide everything for you, you fall under the category of a taker not a doer. A doer comes up with his own solutions to his problems. You want the government to step in and take from the business so you can live better.

And this admin is the perfect example of the last phrase in my sig, even though ya'll won the election ya'll still lost. You just haven't realized yet.

Yep the economy has been destroyed by greed, and the people that helped destroy it are in office right now, the other people that helped destroy it got voted out. The other people that helped destroy it are people like you that want the government to solve all their problems.

You have no idea what will happen if something along these lines passes. The reason why is because you think governments solve problems. Well they are about to make all of our lives a living hell, and you are cheering them on.

This is just a bad piece of legislation. You won't realize though until its too late.

reply to post by David9176


Oh yea, they go to their expensive restaurants in the backrooms out of sight of everybody and laugh and tell jokes. When they are on camera they are just posturing and putting on a show.

They are all about to find out if this crap bill passes. Then we will have to listen to how it sucks and it isn't what they thought it was going to be and everything else.

Oh well such is life. Those who don't understand history are doomed to repeat it. The question is how do we make sure future generations after we live through this hard time don't repeat it. What kind of plan can we write for our children to pass on?

edit - grammar

[edit on 6-6-2009 by Hastobemoretolife]

100% unconstitutional crap.

If this piece of garbage passes, get ready for prices to skyrocket

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife


The funny thing about this is that many on the left don't like this either. I know that people see Universal health care and think yippie!

This won't fix the problem..only make it worse.

Costs need to be cut...by both the government and health care in general.

Bah...the government and it's will to submit to big business/lobbyist and ignoring the American citizen is what the problem is.

The more I learn...the more disgusted I am.

Horrible policies have sucked the wealth of this country dry...and is leaving us all poor with health care we can't afford and jobs that don't pay enough...if we can even find one!

Not to mention...we still have nafta...still have no border protection..still have wars going on.

They have done nothing to protect american workers. NOTHING.

Instead they devalue our money with debt that we cannot possibly repay.

People should be marching in the streets...maybe one day they will.

Originally posted by David9176
While I do agree that companies shouldn't be forced to pay health care....I think we all agree that something has to be changed.

I do too!

How about a cap on how much you can sue a doctor who just might have made a mistake?

Yes, the person who gets hurt gets "what they deserve", but usually the lawyers get almost half of that !

I'm not saying that the person the doctor might have harmed shouldn't be compensated, but these lawsuits are what's bringing the cost of health care thru the roof!

A doctor has to pay astronomical malpractice insurance premiums just to be able to practice his profession nowadays.

And two people profit from this!

The insurance companies and lawyers!

The number one priority of a business is to make a profit....and that is what is happening...at the cost of lives.

My family has owned a small business for over 30 years, and we could NEVER afford health insurance even for our selves!

Yes, our companies main goal was to make a profit, but was NEVER enough to pay for health insurance for me or our employee's.

[edit on 6/6/2009 by Keyhole]

reply to post by David9176


Yep, its a horrible situation. Nobody wants to do for themselves.

My health care reform would be:
1) Insurance companies turn into not for profit.
2) They are not allowed to turn down procedures.
3) Reform of Tort Law for Malpractice suits.
4) Get rid of the income tax and go to a national sales tax.
5) Phase out medicare and medicaid.
6) Phase out social security.
7) Hospitals have to offer payment plans that are affordable and they must tell the patient up front.
8) Get rid of fiat currency
9) Some other things too

That is the problem people are missing is that people don't realize that there are tons of other factors that cause Health Care to be so expensive. Well there is a hell storm fast approaching this country, the people that are happy with Obama just don't realize it.

The people that want Government run Health Care or Insurance are actually a small minority and not only that but it is also as somebody mentioned earlier unconstitutional as all heck.

reply to post by Keyhole

Yes, our companies main goal was to make a profit, but was NEVER enough to pay for health insurance for me or our employee's!

I understand...and what I was referring to was the insurance companies and the large health care corporations....those are the ones who are profiting from all of this...believe me I'm for small business as well! My place of employment is a small business..and luckily they do have health insurance...although it's not that good! I also have no dental...which quite honestly should be pooled together with health insurance...why is it separate? Dental costs are expensive as well when you don't have coverage.

The Obama team sure is on a roll arent they. Oh and by team I mean the whole democratic party. This issue should be and my guess will be stopped at the front door. They cant do this, it will kill small buisness as we know it. Maybe thats what they want?

reply to post by Common Good


What they are doing is exactly what Chavez is doing in Venezuela and Fidel did to Cuba. They want complete control of our lives. What they don't know though is that it isn't going to be that easy.

I hope it is stopped. Hopefully they will start the infighting like the Dem's always do. We will see though.

I'm still wondering if this will get challenged in court.

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife


I agree with most of that list. The only thing that I would change is that there needs to be some form of coverage for the disabled who can no longer work...but that is the only way the government should be involved in health care....other than to prosecute fraud.

My father cannot work due to an auto accident not caused by him and has been unable to work for years. He is on both medicare and SS...and just recently was diagnosed with prostate cancer.

We can't leave people hanging in this situation.

And you are right...things are going to get NASTY! Beyond nasty. They've kept things afloat for awhile..but it won't last forever.

They cannot stop it...but they can make the fall worse...and they are certainly doing a good job of that!

reply to post by David9176


I understand, what I would do is expand disability pay so the disabled could find and pay for their own insurance. What would happen is a few specialty insurance companies would pop up to provide for them.

Disability is the only form of welfare I agree with.

Ohhh it sounds soooo good that we'll all be gauranteed healthcare just like auto insurance is such a great idea. I don't care if your democrat or republican our government sucks! I hope someone blows up Washington so we can start over.

I don't know what your government is up to regarding this health care stuff, whatever it is I just don't think the US economy can survive this at all, I can only wait and see.

I was told once that reinhardt said something about medicare/health care fraud. Boy, these elites must hate you a lot to do this kind of thing to you.

This news is more important than it seems, it has huge implication down the road if the bill is passed, so star and flag for the thread.

reply to post by wantsome

I hope someone blows up Washington so we can start over.

I don't think that will be needed! They are doing a wonderful job blowing themselves up!

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife


The sad thing about this conversation is...why isn't our government and politicians making talking about this? They don't function on rationality anymore....it's all about their pockets.

I only feel that there are a few good ones on both sides. Bernie Sanders, the only self declared "socialist" in the democrat party to my knowledge, is probably one of the most honest and admits to widespread corruption in the Senate. He also has an "audit the fed" bill. Although I don't agree with many of the things he believes in...he seems to be honest and I can respect that...and I do like that he is for term limits and campaign finance reform...2 things I think are definitely needed.

Both sides..R's and D's, need to find the few in Congress who actually stand for the small guy. 95 percent seem to be bought...very few actually defend the people anymore.

Many do not realize that most Democrats are just as big on Big Business as Republicans are....and so many democrats are bought by the health industry...that's why nothing good ever gets done.

I hope voters make some changes soon. I'd love to see other parties get a chance as well.

Originally posted by Keyhole
This is just going to KILL small businesses if this actually does end up being the "law"!

Universal healthcare doesn't sound so stupid now.. does it?

Its one thing when everyone must pay for themselves but if it is forced on the employer, its is completely wrong. Small business's are the backbone of any economy.. adding pressure on small business owners is a stupid idea.

reply to post by David9176


Yea Bernie Sanders I don't agree with him on a lot of things, but at least he is honest and there is some common ground there, not a lot, but he would def. be a vote for the main things that need to be changed.

It's just crazy stuff, people are so brain dead. They just see what they want and fail to critically think about anything.

People just need to break out of the whole parties paradigm. That is the main problem. If we could get past that we could actually get somewhere.

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife

People just need to break out of the whole parties paradigm. That is the main problem. If we could get past that we could actually get somewhere.

Couldn't agree more on that. We need to stop screwing ourselves over! That's all we are doing by continuing to argue among each other.

Some have let go of it as many are becoming quite angry..but many are still holding on.

You can definitely see it here on ATS..on both sides.

This bill should not pass, but not because employers should not be providing health care to their employees. Actually they should be, but health care is far too expensive right now for reasons I won't get into.

However, it is the company's job to provide for the employees. That is after all why they're working for you. It's not out of the kindness of their hearts

Health care, no way. Far too expensive and I'm sure most bosses would love to provide health care to their employees and a good employee probably understands that you would like to, but that you simply can't. Well I have insurance, but if my company couldn't provide it I would understand why.

However, one thing that ticks me off is there are a few bosses, not most of them, but a few bosses that have this attitude.

That my life isn't their problem at ALL. They shouldn't have to pay for your clothes, rent, food, car, car insurance, health care, and things like that. However, that doesn't make any sense. If you're not paying me enough to afford those things, why in heck would I work for you?

I get most of my money from my boss. If he isn't going to pay me enough to buy those things then I have to find someone that will or I'll friggin starve to death. I'm not gonna get much work done like that. Yes, it is your job to pay your employees bills. That's why they're working for you in the first place. To get the bills paid. Duh!

So, health care is one of those things the company should be paying the employee enough to afford. After all, dead employees don't clock a lot of hours.

But the health care is so expensive, even if it's the right thing to do, it's just simply not possible right now. If it were companies in the free market would already be offering it to woo the better employees to their company.

However, the bill does have the right idea. If I'm working then it should be my boss's responsiblity to pay the bills. Not the American tax payers. I'm working for you all week long to get money from you so I can pay my own bills. I don't want nationalized programs where I take money from the tax payers to pay for my health care and other bills. It definitely is not the tax payers reponsibility. The responsibly is mine and I will expect my boss to pay me enough to have health care or I will simply walk to another company. It's just that simple.

[edit on 6-6-2009 by tinfoilman]

They're going in the wrong direction!!

WE CAN'T AFFORD THE HEALTHCARE!!

we, the people can't...
we the businesses can't....
we, the taxpayers can't....
and, WE THE GOVERNMENT, can't!!!

so, instead of doing something with the healthcare to try to get the cost down.....
they force the people to buy into the insurance they can't afford...
they force the businesses to provide it to their employees, which they can't afford....
they force the taxpayers to pay more for it...which they can't afford....
and they spend more on it...WHICH THEY CAN'T AFFORD!!!

BIG CORP wins again, the rest of us lose...

a big part of the problem with the healthcare system is that it is so heavily based on employer provided plans.....which leaves those without employers kind of out in the cold...
ya know, like the owners of those small businesses...
stay at home moms, which many tend to have the opinion that hey, they should be at home, but in reality, if they want the healthcare, well, they just might find themselves having to work just for the healthcare!!
and well, sick people, who are sick enough not to be able to work!! ya know, the ones that actually need the healthcare!!!