Did North Korea just test a Nuke? YES they did!

I feel so sorry for the Koreans, they are in this state due to no fault of their own. They've been invaded and occupied hundreds of times over the last 2000 years by various Chinese clans, Mongols and Japs. Then had to suffer abuse and humiliation by the Japanese Imperial occupation 1910 - 1945, only to have what should have been their long awaited freedom destroyed by being caught up in the power struggles between the USSR, China and the USA. In short outsiders have brought nothing but misery to Korea, who themselves have done nothing to warrant it. It is this deep suspicion of foreign powers which is behind the mentality of the DPRK, as well as of the state ideology, "Juche", or self reliance - the concept that you can only rely on or trust your own.

China is the only slight exception to this mind set, not only for propping up the regime and siding with the Great Leader in the Korean War, but because in between invasions and occupations in the past, despite turning old Korea into a vassal state, friendly cultural and economic exchanges were the norm - Buddhism, Confucianism, and script (which the DPRK has banned by the way for being Imperialistic! - too hard for the common person to learn). There has never been such an exchange with Japan, only hostility and occupation, and current attitudes reflect this history.

Harder to understand is the attitude towards former WW2 allies America. Shortly after the WW2 and the Chinese Civil War, the official Communist line was warm towards America who were seen as liberators and friends. There was an abrupt change in policy well before the Korean War, however, where pro American references and pro Western thinkers were purged and a propaganda campaign was launched to portray the USA specifically as the evil empire. The DPRK would have inherited this stance off their Chinese and Soviet benefactors in the early days of the North/South divide.

The attitude towards their brothers in the South has always been one of sympathy on the basis that they are occupied and downtrodden by the Imperialist and Capitalists. The policy seems to be to liberate their less fortunate siblings and to reunite the family, and for this reason I think it unlikely that nuclear weapons will be used in the South. More likely they will be used to threaten Japanese and American soil.

The current Chinese policy is possibly the most important and yet hardest to fathom aspect of the crisis. A South Korean national I met recently explained it to me in terms of history - The old Korean Empire, Goguryeo c.37 bc to 668 ce, extended into Han Chinese Liaodong province in the North, but not to the Southern portion of the Peninsula which was occupied by 3 independant states - more or less what South Korea is now. This empire was eventually defeated by an alliance of one of these southern states and the Chinese Tang dynasty. Because China conquered this land, and because it was theirs originally anyway under the Han, the current Chinese mindset is that the North is "their" territory in much the way they claim Tibet and Inner Mongolia is theirs. This is why, so my Korean friend believed, they intervened in the korean war and why they will never allow Korea to be united - it is their land, they own it. Why they allow it to continue as a vaasal state now or in the past isn't clear to me. There are 56 ethnic groups in China today, one more shouldn't make much difference.

Somehow, though, despite all the odds, the Koreans have survived as a unique nation. I fear for their future, but they've been through much worse. Don't underestimate their ability to come through against the odds.

Sorry for the ramble, I've become quite passionate about the country from watching all their TV Dramas online. The historical ones are the best - when President Roh met Kim in 2007 he presented him with a box set of my favourite Dae Jang Geum. No idea what he made of it, I understand the Dear leader prefers to watch Disney cartoons all day.

really good post ^^

So what is the general consensus?

Will this fizzle out

or

Is this eventually going to lead to a conflict or war?

It looks like that with North Korea saying that If SK agreed to join the US initiative in searching naval vessels in waters around NK for weapons and nuclear materials smuggling, they would declare war. South Korea have agreed.


[edit on 26-5-2009 by jonny2410]

Hot of the press - North Korea has launched a third missile - they are determined, i will give them that.

Edit - South Korean news agency - North Korea has launched a third missile

[edit on 26-5-2009 by jonny2410]

reply to post by jonny2410




Its insane isnt it... I really do wonder WTF is going on.

I filed another post in the last 10 mins about it but didnt make the breaking call LOL..

Still..

Lets watch and see... I noticed there was a Magnitude 4.9 in Taiwan minutes after... made me wonder..

Probably coincidence.

Originally posted by komp_uk
reply to post by jonny2410

 

Its insane isnt it... I really do wonder WTF is going on.

I filed another post in the last 10 mins about it but didnt make the breaking call LOL..

Still..

Lets watch and see... I noticed there was a Magnitude 4.9 in Taiwan minutes after... made me wonder..

Probably coincidence.

its like they really have lost is this time, i mean in 3 days they have threatened to declare war, tested a nuke and fired 5 missiles.

To answer a question from a previous poster, I think this will go for a bit.

"IMO" nuclear is that invisible line that when you cross, nice is out the window and not nice is put into play.

Even China and Russia who live to mess with the West are not happy about this.

As funny as it may sound, their is a very deep line between saying you have nukes and exploding one.

Funny thing is this will make N.K. "LESS SECURE" from attack.

A psycho leader is one thing, a psycho leader with nuclear bombs is a very different animal.

A big mouth temper tantrum childlike leader is easy to ignore, same leader with nuclear weapons needs to be removed or have his toys removed/destroyed.

I don't think the west can afford to let it fissile out and if the west lost interest then Japan would act unilaterally. So would Isreal against NK's partner Iran.

The West has to get involved to try and stop it spiralling out of control.

Any armed confrontation by Japan, NK or SK will result in China's intervention. There will be a great deal of high level contact between Washington and Beijing at the moment to get a united approach. That is the only hope for avoiding a wider regional conflict.

Article on sky news website about the 5th missile fired.
It says breaking news but I see its been mentioned here.

5 th Missile fired

nuclear weapons dont frighten me.
they are an empty threat.

why kill your enemy when it will result in killing yourself?

to me, a smaller nation going nuclear just means the bullies on the block cant # with them anymore.

reply to post by epitaph.one

to me, a smaller nation going nuclear just means the bullies on the block cant # with them anymore.

It's more sinister than that when they are also developing the Taepo-dong 2 ICBM and are busy proliferating weapons and delivery systems to countries itching to start WW3.

I think your above assessment is quite shallow

Breaking news.North Korea has launched its 6th missile now.

Missile Number 6.

It occurs to me that....

Little Kimmy is throwing a temper tantrum that no one is paying attention to him.

What we all might consider is blockade the sea and air of anything coming in or out.

That way he can be ignored and told he is being ignored like a child throwing a temper tantrum.

When he wants to play nice, he can come out from his "time-out".

Me and my Grandpa were talking about North Korea this morning... the only person who can stand up to them with military force right now is China. We're too tied up in other affairs right now and definitely can't take them on. C'mon China... show us you can be our friends...

I am not worried about North Korea. As many have said/infered already, if they were to actually attack a major nation, they would be blown to smithereens.

Please give Kim Jong SOME respect; as insane as some may believe him to be, he isn't totally stupid; lauching a missile into another nation would be suicide, and he knows this.

This is a deterrent. Iraq "may" have had WMD's. They were invaded, occupied and brutalized. Iran "may" have nukes, and is well on the same path as Iraq was just before the war.

Neither of them had nukes. Neither of them have nukes. And that is why Iraq was invaded, and why Iran will be. They are enough to look like big bad enemies, but in reality, are small enough not to take a full force american assault. Keep the war going for some good moneymaking time, yes. But actually fend off, no.

North Korea is simply showing that it IS a force to be reckoned with. Watch america ignore North Korea as far as actual military action, as it can defend itself.

Did NK just announce ANOTHER nuke test????

read 5:52

Source

And this just in.....NK massing troops in readiness excercise...

Source

[edit on 26-5-2009 by RolandBrichter]

reply to post by RolandBrichter


Indeed. Got to it before me, Roland!

On we go.

North Korea: nerves fray in South Korea's border village - 8 hours ago

Four M109 Howitzers, loaded on the backs of military transporters, trundled slowly down the Freedom motorway towards Seoul on Tuesday, as South Korea nervously began to reinforce its capital.


(South Korea begins to reinforce its capital - Photo: Malcolm Moore)

"I have been watching army trucks moving up and down the motorway since yesterday," said 73-year-old Shim Hee-Soon from her vantage point in Imjingak, a village of 600 people which sits on the edge of the Demilitarised Zone (DMZ), the most-heavily armed border in the world.

Almost two million soldiers face each other across the zone, a 2.5-mile buffer at the 38th parallel between North and South Korea which is still littered with landmines from the Korean war. As the US soldiers stationed here joke: "There's no D in the DMZ".

Mrs Shim revealed that North Korea's nuclear test had triggered a panicky series of drills around the village. "There were lots of heavily armed soldiers moving through," she said.

....and now this????? WTF???

Source

(URGENT) North Korea says it will respond militarily to South Korea's joining in U.S.-led PSI

reply to post by komp_uk


Finally the world is becoming balanced in power and America is scared. Good on you, all the rogue wars you have implemented across the world which has caused major devastation for your own so called 'interests'. More powers mean more divisions which in result means less resources and tactical advantages for the already existing greedy war mongering powers.

I hate them all. The new player at least deserves a 'welcome', don't you think? Just wait for couple of more players then the world war will erupt because they are all greedy, they are like thief, at they end they will all kill each other for more profit hence WWI & WWII.

Yeah just caught of yahoo this particular statement from the DPRK

The statement, carried by the North's Korean Central News Agency, said North Korea no longer considers itself bound by the armistice that ended the Korean War, as a protest over the South's participation.

from AP via Yahoo

Is the DPRK just testing the Obamassiah or are they really as rabidly bonkers as they appear?