Forced birth control? I say YES!

reply to post by Gorman91


Genetic Elitism -- otherwise known as racism (right?)

I agree with you, there's no reason to let Darwinism take over at this point. We are in control of our own genetics, and therefore we are in the drivers seat of evolution.

It's an intellectual step backwards to just let nature run the show.

Originally posted by Donkey_Dean

Without the aid we would have shanty towns (Shack towns) in this country, and would not be the nation we are today. It would be a mix of third world existence vs. the mainstream American dream so to speak. You can’t breed out this type of thing. Just as you cannot bread in narcissism.




[edit on 14-5-2009 by Donkey_Dean]

There is towns like these all over the US and you know the worst part? they're all what would be considered working class people and they're all white. Do you know why? cause the government won't help them out!

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by ldyserenity

 

That's really not right. Weak according to nature is not weak according to man. I have asthma, so should I die because my lungs are weak? 1000 years ago I would die. Now I am on meds when I need them, but remain a fully functioning member of society.

No, it won't be the downfall of society, it will be its rise. For only the species which commits itself to self preservation in such a way so as to make the weakest into equals is the best survival.

to hell with genetic elitism.

No, I'm not talking Physical weaknesses like that...I'm talking about weak willed, lazy, drug/alcohol addicted, People who don't ever do one day's worth of hard labor and this includes the very rich who sit on their A** because they are just doing paperwork basically. The US was built on the laborers the working class, not someone who can't even stand for 30 minutes at a time!

[edit on 18-6-2009 by ldyserenity]

However, as one post had pointed out mother nature knows what she's doing, I don't think there will ever be a need to do the forced BC thing, As I feel in a few very short years, Mother nature is going to exact a solution, and those who can't cut it without the monetary system "Crutch" this world depends on, will simply be weeded out. Nature takes care of business in that way. One way6 or another it'll catch up to us...I'm ready! Too bad those of you will cry out for the people who are less desirable, I won't be joining your pity party.

[edit on 18-6-2009 by ldyserenity]

reply to post by ldyserenity


But that is their choice, and it's not even related to genetics or viability.

it is not your right, nor the government's right, to force any kind of ethical, cultural, life style, etc upon the individual. This is an absolute truth. You dissatisfaction with other's life styles is not justification to alter it. Why can't a pastor force a homosexual to be strait? Because it is not his right. You are in that pastors position. You are entitled to your opinion, but you have no right to force your beliefs of what a human should be or do onto others under any circumstances unless they are a criminal in need of being readjusted so they don't murder/rape/pillage/etc.

End of story.

Also, as to your edit, wouldn't these people be in the position to survive? After all, the rich conservatives would buy people to save them, the rich liberals would buy government to save them. Either way you look at it, you are wrong. They will not die.

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

The very idea of this is frightening.

Really?

And after you have done away with the constitution's right to the pursuit of happiness, what shall you set your teeth on next?

I'm curious about the narcissitic and superior attitudes that some feel themselves so outstanding they are able to make these type personal decisions for others.

As far as teens....do you think the teen, her parents, and her physician are the people best suited to make such a decision.....

or do you really think it should be you?

reply to post by ldyserenity


That's just it, you touched on a great point! Natural Selection will indeed come into play once again because of the abuse of the people on this earth! When will humanity start to realize that the poor, irresponsible behavior is only tolerated by the universe for so long? Sadly, it doesn't matter for the rest of us because people that try to do the right thing don't really ever get any benefit.

I used to be alot more sympathetic in general. Now I reserve my pity for people that were genuinely dealt a bad hand in life, not those just acting out of ignorance and complacency. Sure we have the right to do whatever we want, the freedom to make terrible decisions.....and a pathetic society that supports and even enables it! So is that a good reason to keep it going? I don't think so but the bleeding hearts will never get it anyway. I may as well stop looking at this thread already.

I think when one of these poor excuses for manhood has fathered a welfare child he should be forcibly sterilized. Why should hard working men and women pay for these low life men in training to have non-stop sex?

Billions of welfare dollars would be saved.

I am also in favor of incarcerating those who father welfare babies should sterilizing them be found too "severe". Something has to be done though. We cannot let this breeding continue unabated. We cannot afford it as a society.

Humans today are selfish, greedy, fear mongering control freaks. Women are being told mixed messages. And forced sometimes into lifestyles they cannot control. Either through addiction or male dominances. This behavior is due solely to money. Money is a drug. Money is a tool of control. Where there is none. I say we lose money, all allow ourselves a place in this world working together, farming, gathering, storing and provisioning. "what about the mining and production no one will work those for free."?

Robots..? we already have them for vehicle production. That way we humans can relax and farm and spend time with family. That is after all an originating intent. Living naked in the garden, unashamed or scared. Provided for by paradise, all it takes to achieve paradise is overcoming losers who want to use money to corrupt your minds and hearts with violence, usury for pleasure and confusion. In this world. Nothing is wrong. Whats wrong are the way people treat each other in doing so. Im not saying killing is right, or stealing or any type of harrassment. But normal human things. Expirementations. We all are prone to this. Why deny it in fear of a group of inexperienced know it alls who use unjust force justified by moneys grip. Money whether you want to admit it or not will be the worlds downfall. Let go now of microchips and money and live not socialisticly, but practicly. If i have a government, i will call it

Practocracy.

reply to post by groingrinder


HaHa! See?! And people give me all kinds of attitude for suggesting forced birth control. I thought I was being pretty soft. Alot of people I have this discussion with say, "just sterilize them". I knew I was being lenient!

In all seriousness, I do think the whole sterilization thing is a little harsh (but only) because a persons situation could change. Sterilization lasts a lifetime and doesn't take into consideration that at some point in time, an individual may be suitable to have children. I proposed that while people are unfit (those individuals who DO NOT contribute to society, cannot support themselves, require tax payer assistance, etc.), they be required to practice birth control. At such time they do become contributing members of society, then they may proceed as they wish, bearing as many children as they can (and wish) to care for.

I really wish people would stop defending this practice of having babies erroneously! It's not okay to bring people into the world that you cannot be responsible for! Sadly, the masses (and the gov't) think it's okay for this to happen. Keep enabling and creating more burdens for an already debilitated society. I do not know one single working class person that feels like supporting one of these families. We cannot afford it ourselves, why should we be forced to pay for something we do not condone????? ugh!!!!

Also, really, how hard is it to swallow a simple pill? Or wear a diaphram, cervical cap.....or the unthinkable......condom! Ideally, these things would be provided, free of charge. So individuals would have an option as to what type of birth control was best for them, etc, etc. I'm not heartless.

reply to post by jackieps1975


Once again I must ask how natural selection will come about if the left wants government to save them and the right wants companies to save them? The right wants you to have kiddies and self support them, and the left wants you to have kiddies and the government support them. Don't matter who's in power, once a certain sea saw changes, the other gets elected.

When exactly is natural selection going to come into affect if every single person in power basically does stuff to save them for the vote?

Weather you like the fact or not, humanity's population will only grow larger and larger. Before you die you will see 10 billion on Earth. I wouldn't be surprised if a government starts producing people during a prolonged war if their reproduction rate is low or in the negative. If a very long war like Iraq happened at a larger scale, the government would have no problem in building large people factories to replace those in war and hope some will also go to war from those people. 10,000 die in 10 years? 100,000 thousand are produced to replace them and take jobs.

And why do you think natural selection WOULD come into affect at all? Are you an idiot? In 10,000 years of human history and civilization, no people killed off once they got to the top. Nations rose and fell, but the people were always there. Some were slaughtered by war, but most still live in those places.

You are simply wrong and the more you speak the dumber and more far from reality to you look like you are. Within a decade we are expected to have weather control, massive vertical farming, and a half way decent alternative power supply. Within 20 years we will have helium nuclear power being beamed down and giganourmous solar panels near the sun beaming electricity to us.

When in this time is a catastrophe suppose to happen? Germs don't take more than a year to cure, food shortages are a myth, water shortages are laughable when we know how to clean water from the sea, climate change is a joke when New York hasn't had a day over 80 this year, except maybe 1 or 2 other days. War is folly as machine and diplomacy make them futile annoyances. overpopulation is also a joke with so much space above and bellow to expand into, and economic collapses will happen, and all it will do will make other nations rise and other nations be replaces.

Nothing is going to happen for your little dream of blood to come true.



[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

Originally posted by mastermind77
Humans today are selfish, greedy, fear mongering control freaks. Women are being told mixed messages. And forced sometimes into lifestyles they cannot control. Either through addiction or male dominances. This behavior is due solely to money. Money is a drug. Money is a tool of control. Where there is none. I say we lose money, all allow ourselves a place in this world working together, farming, gathering, storing and provisioning. "what about the mining and production no one will work those for free."?

Robots..? we already have them for vehicle production. That way we humans can relax and farm and spend time with family. That is after all an originating intent. Living naked in the garden, unashamed or scared. Provided for by paradise, all it takes to achieve paradise is overcoming losers who want to use money to corrupt your minds and hearts with violence, usury for pleasure and confusion. In this world. Nothing is wrong. Whats wrong are the way people treat each other in doing so. Im not saying killing is right, or stealing or any type of harrassment. But normal human things. Expirementations. We all are prone to this. Why deny it in fear of a group of inexperienced know it alls who use unjust force justified by moneys grip. Money whether you want to admit it or not will be the worlds downfall. Let go now of microchips and money and live not socialisticly, but practicly. If i have a government, i will call it

Practocracy.

so true!!!!!!!!!!!!Star for YOU!

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by ldyserenity

 

But that is their choice, and it's not even related to genetics or viability.

it is not your right, nor the government's right, to force any kind of ethical, cultural, life style, etc upon the individual. This is an absolute truth. You dissatisfaction with other's life styles is not justification to alter it. Why can't a pastor force a homosexual to be strait? Because it is not his right. You are in that pastors position. You are entitled to your opinion, but you have no right to force your beliefs of what a human should be or do onto others under any circumstances unless they are a criminal in need of being readjusted so they don't murder/rape/pillage/etc.

End of story.

Also, as to your edit, wouldn't these people be in the position to survive? After all, the rich conservatives would buy people to save them, the rich liberals would buy government to save them. Either way you look at it, you are wrong. They will not die.

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

Money will have no value, so why would anybody take it from these worthless slugs?When this happens, nobody will have any use for money and I will personally be at the US Mint burning all that worthless paper to keep my toucus warm...and I will take all the metal coins and melt it down to make hunting tools and maybe even some pretty jewellery for myself, which will be worth alot more in the post apocolyptic world!

reply to post by ldyserenity


Because money will have value. it will just be something else. Maybe Euros, maybe personal jewelry. Does it matter?

Any sensible government knows that wealth means nothing in disaster. That's why the US always gets so much debt whenever we have a bad thing happen. Bush was the only one who put money first, but his kind are a dieing breed.

The military would follow orders without pay if they loved a general enough. All it would take is an inspiration speech. This happened with Washington, some other guys in the war with Mexico, it happened somewhat with the south after the occupation post bellum, it happened with Teddy's troops, it happened in WW1 with General black jack Pershing, it happened with Patton and MacArthur, and it still happens till this day. When soldiers love their leaders, money, the end of the world, etc, doesn't matter. Because the soldiers know they are either dead or free. And in such a case, money is not on the mind. Freedom is. They know that freedom will create wealth after a few years. Even the first revolts after the revolutionary war were sometimes silenced just by leaders saying "hold on".

Some politicians joining this general would make a moneyless force. Money means nothing in disaster.

And once again, how are these disasters suppose to happen?

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

[edit on 18-6-2009 by Gorman91]

This is starting to give me the creeps. But before I go, think about this.

Suppose there is a majority of people who think like me. That what you are proposing here is not only unconstitutional, but ethically and morally wrong.

Suppose we decide that people who lack compassion for other human beings, should not be able to propagate, out of fear that they will pass those traits, which we consider undesirable, on to future generations?

Supposed it was adjudged that you were included in this group, and we consequently put chemicals in your water to sterilize you, even if only temporarily.

But you know. That's not your point is it? Your point is money, isn't it?
Well now, you can just sit back with your smug sense of superiority, and give yourself a good pat on the back. You do that. But while you are doing this, at least consider respecting our constitution. If you start breaking that down.....who knows. You could be the next victim of someone else's bigotry and disdain.

The country shouldn't force birth control. However, if we offered free long-term control (implants & such) until the age of 21, we probably would save money in the long haul. However, then sexually transmitted diseases would skyrocket, so... Interesting concept, though.

reply to post by ladyinwaiting


It's not a lack of compassion, quite the contrary! Think of all the innocent lives that would be saved! If you missed my post (in this thread) on unfit mothers murdering their children, perhaps you should take a moment to google it. This is the epitome of compassion in that it would cut out a chunk of child abuse, death and needless poverty.

Of course no one wants the will of others imposed upon them! This is just a concept...and a very good one IMO (obviously). Sometimes we all need to look at the flipside of an argument. I haven't suggested we sew anyone up or sterilize. I'm just saying when innocents are at stake due to someone's irresponsibility, there are reasonable things that can be done to prevent it. We already have plenty of needless laws that no one likes. What harm would this do? Use birth control. It would be beneficial to all parties involved in the long run.

With all of these fatherless children, you would think there is a good chance when these children grow up they could be dating , having sex, or marrying their biological siblings.

I know , it's a strange thought but it came to mind reading these posts and watching Maury.

reply to post by jackieps1975


That's such a stupid claim. It's barely a large number of people who kill their kids.

Using a minority to justify subjugating the majority is disgusting and I would proudly fight in a military to enforce the end of the existence of people like you.

The more you talk the more it makes me hope this happens just to give justification for bringing down the government that does it.

[edit on 19-6-2009 by Gorman91]

[edit on 19-6-2009 by Gorman91]

Well, sorry-didn't have time to read all 8 pages of this thread, but I have a few things to say.

I think rather than trying to force people to use birth control, or sterilize them, would be to stop the social programs that enable young women and girls to engage in behavior that causes unwanted pregnancies. The government would save a lot of money that way, and it would discourage girls from getting pregnant without considering what it would be like to have a kid, or two, or three, or four, etc.-without MONEY $$ to support it/them!

The system is being abused! I've seen people at the food bank that have cell phones, good clothes, etc. that have money and don't really need assistance. Other times, I've volunteered at a place that hands out meals to the "needy" who drove nicer cars than the volunteers!

Another example....the beggar on the corner at WalMart, who sits there all day with a sign, saying "homeless vet, need food, need work, etc." as an example, then they get handouts from people all day and booze and smoke with the money. It's a job for them, a business, you might say. Stop giving them money, too. They should work for a living like other people.

Also, as far as birth control is concerned, if it was forced, how would you enforce it anyway? I don't think Americans would stand for it, unless they were punished in some way for not cooperating with it. You'd have to fine them or throw them in jail or something when they have a kid.

Birth control methods all have side effects, and some women would object to taking them, including me. I wouldn't want to take Depo-Provera, called "the shot", because I knew someone who took that, and it made her hair thin and fall out. And they aren't 100% effective either.

Sterilization would be too extreme. I doubt you'd get away with doing that to people, anyway. The way you'd have to do that would be to call women in somewhere, like a hospital, and either take out their uteruses (hysterectomy), or do tubal ligations. And that would mean doing a lot of surgeries.

I think the greater problem is the lack of morals, or moral decline in America, if you will. People don't believe in waiting until marriage anymore to have sex. Hardly anybody does. The age people start sexual activity keeps getting younger and younger.

I wonder if anybody in the US government reads any of this stuff. Maybe they'll get some good ideas.

[edit on 30-6-2009 by muffingirl]

[edit on 30-6-2009 by muffingirl]