Life is just like a MMORPG.

You are all thinking on very physical terms.

Reality, what you experience is JUST data going into your consciouness. "Out there" is just a mental construct. Imagine you're in a holodeck. You arent really moving, it's just how your consciousness interprits the data. Any "multi-verse", is just another frame of reference. You switch your focus, and you go OOBE, or you're in a medatative state.

MBT forums

Tom Campbell posts on the discussion forums and will be happy to answer questions. I would reccomen reading through the topics first to get an idea of his TOE and Virtual Realities.





[edit on 4-5-2009 by tobiascore]

reply to post by tobiascore


Thanks for the link Tobiascore.

I think we are thinking more in metaphors to communicate ideas about reality in a way that is not entirely physical, rather metaphysical in that it is very much a generated experience.

Using a game metaphor presents a perspective about reality that describes it as a computerized software program of which we are playing inside the software architecture, bound by the rules of the game.

It is one such metaphor by which I like to look at reality as game play seems to be a very ongoing theme in all the realities I have observed.

Thomas Campbell goes as far as describing reality like the World of Warcraft where what is rendered for us, happens only when our focus is there looking at it.

My other metaphor to look at reality comes from a non-physical perspective, that reality itself is nothing more then language and thought, and we are simply engaged in a non-verbal language which unfolds to describe what we experience as reality.

The true reality is one of pure mind, pure consciousness and pure self, and it resides in no-time, no-space and projects its awareness into the focal points of which we ultimately become.

At any rate, I should check out the forum as I can imagine there are some very interesting things being discussed.

The objective reality however is real, and though interpreted through the five senses, it's not generated by them nor by observation, I can't buy that, but I can accapt that reality is a consciously generated by-design matrix, a manifestation of a light-based implicate order and that we are in it, as if our reality, is God's dream.
But the thing itself out there, is there, and there are trees and mountains, the moon, etc. and those things are real, but the whole thing is more dreamlike than we previously assumed. It's just too narcissistic and solipsistic to suggest that we are generating the actual objective world around us via subjective experience, that's absurd and unacceptible, utter nonsense. The subjective experience is dependant upon the objective reality, not the other way around.
However, that said, if mind is really holographic, and if the universe is non-local and holographic, which are proven true, and if the former is something that has emerged from the latter, and is inextricably interwoven with it, then the implications of that are no less astonishing, and no less gamelike or dreamlike.

As a player, I am a part of, where the whole is greater than the sum of all the parts, and in this way, my "I am" of being is subject to and dependant upon the "Great I am" of God as higher power, or a power and a being and intelligence greater than my self, even though my self is an inextricable part of the whole. It's a wonderful paradox that I can live with, but I have no interest in being God, and neither would that be appropriate. Personally I think that the Christian frame of reference is superior to the Buddhist, and incorporates it within itself within the frameowork of an authentic I-thou relationship, with the game designer and chief architect of the game who loves the players and is worthy of their love in kind, since it is by love and for the cause of love, that the game was created in the first place.

Question: If the architect of the game created the human being by design, to contain the full representation of the whole, in potential, and if the architect then entered that framework, would not the 'reality' be then subject to his will and re-creation, making things that appear to the other players as 'miracles', possible? When I dream, I can perform miracles which the other players in my dreamscape cannot do, and are amazed by..

Could it be, putting aside any bias or prejudice against religion, that the game of man on earth was made, by design, to include a salvation "from above" or from the highest game player, so as to preclude individual players from being left "orphaned" or imprisoned in their own subjective prison cell, in isolation from the game maker, and so as to ensure the right relationship between game players and the game maker, so that they may be joined together as one, without either one replacing the other or unfairly excluding the other..?

I see it as an issue of appropriate appreciation for inclusion in the game, and a preventive measure to uphold the rules of the game and ensure that no one player within it, can operate as a source of corruption, or hijack the game for his own selfish ends or usurp the game maker by removing him from the equation. This allows maximal flexibility and participation and inclusion, without removing the game architect from the game itself, which would be unjust and unfair, since everyone deserves to play, even and perhaps even especially, the game maker himself.


[edit on 4-5-2009 by OmegaPoint]

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
The objective reality however is real, and though interpreted through the five senses, it's not generated by them nor by observation, I can't buy that, but I can accapt that reality is a consciously generated by-design matrix, a manifestation of a light-based implicate order and that we are in it, as if our reality, is God's dream.

I can certainly relate to that. This whole dream within a dream within a dream matrix that I am having certainly bears weight to that realization.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
But the thing itself out there, is there, and there are trees and mountains, the moon, etc. and those things are real, but the whole thing is more dreamlike than we previously assumed. It's just too narcissistic and solipsistic to suggest that we are generating the actual objective world around us via subjective experience, that's absurd and unacceptible, utter nonsense. The subjective experience is dependant upon the objective reality, not the other way around.

This is a very interesting part of the experience. Right now, in our human perspective it seems impossible that our subjective self is dependent on the objective reality. That it is the objective reality that created the subjective self, and not the other way around.

What is interesting in this, is the two fold state of our true self. The human part, which is us right now as we contemplate the relationship with God, the Universe and everything. However, we forget about the second part of ourselves which oversees the smaller part. This other part is where we become part of the summation of all things, where the whole emerges.

That is the grand architect, the creator, the spark of thought which created the Universe. We are expanding and collapsing in and out of the whole, expressing our dreams along with it, and in this unified field, within the rule set of this game, we see the objective emerge as something we think is separate from us, outside of us... because what we see is just the raw physical human system.

Step outside that system and we witness creation as it unfolds in our dreams, where the subjective is creating the objective. I have seen it, experienced it and know that it is an amazing process by which reality is created by us, and not reality creating us.

A real flip of what we think it truly is. Creation is masked in illusion of physicality but the reality is much larger, much grander then we could have ever imagined.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
However, that said, if mind is really holographic, and if the universe is non-local and holographic, which are proven true, and if the former is something that has emerged from the latter, and is inextricably interwoven with it, then the implications of that are no less astonishing, and no less gamelike or dreamlike.

It starts to unravel our physical belief system and allows us to start to emerge within a much more metaphysical belief system where we start to really see this creative dynamic of which we are all a part of.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
As a player, I am a part of, where the whole is greater than the sum of all the parts, and in this way, my "I am" of being is subject to and dependant upon the "Great I am" of God as higher power, or a power and a being and intelligence greater than my self, even though my self is an inextricable part of the whole. It's a wonderful paradox that I can live with, but I have no interest in being God, and neither would that be appropriate. Personally I think that the Christian frame of reference is superior to the Buddhist, and incorporates it within itself within the frameowork of an authentic I-thou relationship, with the game designer and chief architect of the game who loves the players and is worthy of their love in kind, since it is by love and for the cause of love, that the game was created in the first place.

Well, what is interesting in your observation here is you are not interested in being God, but God is very interested in being you. That paradox is what we will all struggle with, ultimately when the illusion fades and we see the truth, the true reality of which we are, where and will always be.

All the what am I, who am I, why do I exist kind of introspection starts to collapse as the realizations of the whole start to settle in.

The relationship between us and God is a remarkable one, hard to imagine because it is wrapped in the paradox of a whole, experiencing itself as one of it's parts.

Which is precisely what is happening right now. The whole divided up into units of self-realized parts of itself, completely cast into an illusion of separation, however separation is impossible as ultimately in every quantum fractal fragment, each node is still part of the fabric, there is no separation. Just an belief that there is.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
Question: If the architect of the game created the human being by design, to contain the full representation of the whole, in potential, and if the architect then entered that framework, would not the 'reality' be then subject to his will and re-creation, making things that appear to the other players as 'miracles', possible? When I dream, I can perform miracles which the other players in my dreamscape cannot do, and are amazed by..

Personally, based on dream theory and precognitive dream research, there is certainly a very real possibility of that, if the Game Designer so chooses to start to change the rules. I personally think the Game Designer knows this, and chooses to let the game play out based on the rules to see where and how everything ends in the end game.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
Could it be, putting aside any bias or prejudice against religion, that the game of man on earth was made, by design, to include a salvation "from above" or from the highest game player, so as to preclude individual players from being left "orphaned" or imprisoned in their own subjective prison cell, in isolation from the game maker, and so as to ensure the right relationship between game players and the game maker, so that they may be joined together as one, without either one replacing the other or unfairly excluding the other..?

That is a good question, certainly there has to be this intervention, and from
what I have read in the works of Robert A. Monroe, there is this outreach program that is going on between the highest levels helping and assisting the lower levels. I am not totally observed of this, but it does ring with some truth. I have had expeirences that certainly say this is the case. Something higher assisting something lower into a higher realization.

Originally posted by OmegaPoint
I see it as an issue of appropriate appreciation for inclusion in the game, and a preventive measure to uphold the rules of the game and ensure that no one player within it, can operate as a source of corruption, or hijack the game for his own selfish ends or usurp the game maker by removing him from the equation. This allows maximal flexibility and participation and inclusion, without removing the game architect from the game itself, which would be unjust and unfair, since everyone deserves to play, even and perhaps even especially, the game maker himself.

I think the game maker is very wrapped up in the games the maker chooses to make. That much is for certain. We wouldn't be wrapped up in this game if that were not the case.

Some very good ideas to think about.

I am borrowing this quote from Thomas Campbell's website where he just recently posted on an mmorpg analogy.

www.my-big-toe.com...

Let me try to develop a more accurate, less limited perspective with some computer game metaphors. Like any metaphor, the fit is never perfect but I think it might lead you to a more useful perspective. Hopefully it will not scare you or depress you. If it does it will be because of a small PMR perspective becoming inadvertently twisted around self focused ego.

You, the Josh-guy you identify with as being you, is not an independent being. Josh-guy is just a character in a virtual reality simulator game that is animated by your consciousness. Very much like the lizard-man or wizard or barbarian you make up in World of Warcraft. Except in the PMR game you don't roll dice or pick from a list to determine a character's characteristics which define the abilities and limitations (decision space) with which you must work as your free will makes the choices that determine what that character does within the game. Instead you "birth" a character and let it develop and interact while you, as before, are at the helm making choices and generating intent for your character. So, your individuated unit of consciousness (IUOC) is playing in the PMR virtual reality trainer and he picks a situation (perhaps as part of a plan with some friends who are also playing the game) and births a potential character onto the playing field (Virtual Earth) to suit whatever strategy he has in mind to raise his characters "level" as quickly as possible. He may or may not get exactly what he wants in a character because the birth algorithms within the games rule-set contain a lot of uncertainty which keeps the game more interesting and challenging since it inhibits players from stacking the deck in their favor by always dealing themselves pat hands.

The Josh-guy character birthed in the VR (generated by the PMR rule-set) is really just a set of data and rules that must remain consistent with the causality defined by the PMR rule-set (i.e., the Josh-guy is a computer model -- a probability and statistics model -- just like lizard-man). It is the players consciousness (the IUOC player provides the free will and intent) that animates the Josh-guy character with motivation/intent and makes the choices available to the characters decision space (just like you do with lizard-man). As the IUOC player makes choices in the present moment of game play from the array of future possibilities, he “collapses the probability wave function” to a specific result that becomes part of the historic database of the virtual PMR game. (See how the process fractal pattern repeats at each level?) The player has to “level up” his character through his characters experience so he can evolve that character to a larger decision space which gives the IUOC more choices and possibilities to work with. The virtual Josh-guy character, generated by the computer in the mind of the IUOC, is limited to the virtual PMR game play viewpoint in which he was birthed and in which he experiences (just like lizard-man). He calls his IUOC his soul or higher self because he thinks of himself as a real, independent being within PMR making decisions with his own personal consciousness that belongs just to him. Thus his higher self must be a “different” being (because everything that is not him must be different and independent from him from the PMR viewpoint). Josh-guy believes that his independent consciousness will one day merge with the quite different (bigger, better) IUOCs consciousness because he cannot fathom that his consciousness is nothing other than the IUOCs playing a PMR experience game in a virtual reality trainer.

When you play your Lizard–man in World of Warcraft (WOW), can you not parallel process and eat some Pizza and talk to your friends who are also playing WOW with you at the same time? If you are young enough, you can probably handle all that while pretending to do your homework. Because you are doing these other things (and lizard man only gets some fraction of your attention) does that mean that the intents and choices you make when you are playing your lizard man character are somehow no longer precisely representative of you? Does it make sense that you are actually a whole lot wiser and more evolved and better at playing the PMR game than the way you play your lizard man? No. You always play lizard man pretty much to the best of your ability – his consciousness is, in fact, your consciousness. There are not two separate consciousnesses here (yours and a higher self) – just one consciousness trying to evolve its quality by playing a multiplayer virtual reality game as best he can and doing a little parallel processing on the side to meet the larger demands of existence (like eating pizza).

Could you have two computers going and be playing two characters at the same time? What if a friend came over who was really good at getting through a particular situation; would you get help? When your character slept, would you use your “dream spell” or OOBE spell to try to give him or her some insight or special experience that would help them level up sooner? Would you test him or her below the intellectual level to find out what is really under the hood (and to avoid the useless PMR ego based jibber jabber you would otherwise get) to determine what the best learning strategies might be? Well, you might if your own success depended on how much your character leveled up – i.e., if what you learned in the game leveled you up as well. After all that is what VR trainers are for.

Do you see that your questions don’t make sense? A character like Josh-guy is an imagined virtual being, a character in a chapter of a book generated by a rule-set that may or may not pop up again in subsequent chapters depending how useful he is to the story. In the real world there is only consciousness. The little man behind the curtain running the Josh-Guy character (providing the Josh-guy’s character with consciousness and free will, is the real Josh – the character/personality (the suave debonair, cool guy) you are today in this particular chapter (experience packet) is just a creation of the VR trainer – a virtual wrapper for the IUOC to use in the trainer so that the IUOC can evolve more efficiently through the interactive experience of PMR. The only thing real and fundamental about Josh is Josh’s consciousness and that is effectively immortal. Josh, the personality, is a virtual being in an experience packet story that, if it happens to be productive, will be used over and over – a favorite persona. However other personas (male and female, grumpy and happy, bright and dull) are required at times to produce a more rounded experience base. Obsessing over the immortality of some largely random, virtual persona-wrapper generated by the trainer’s rule-set for the consciousness to wear in one or more of ten thousand experience packets makes no sense. Do you obsess over the value of the wrappers your candy bars come in – do you save them all?

You need to identify with your consciousness, not your body, personality, sex, IQ, cool index, or quirky habits. Next time you birth a wrapper in which to learn, all that stuff will very likely be different – only the consciousness will be the same. The personality is not integral to the consciousness – it is in large part a function of your body – driven by your biochemistry and genetics. The more you grow, the more your consciousness and personality become intertwined.

Tom C

Good thread. I started one with a similar idea a couple of years ago but someone moved it to BTS television category. I used the Red Dwarf episode with the total immersion video game as my example. That was before I knew what a MMORPG was, lol.
Dunno why it was moved, I didn't want to discuss TV, it was about reality and how it might work too.


Title was - Of all the space bars in all the worlds you had to re-materialise in mine.

The question was - Some of the common questions on the ATS web-site (reading between the lines) are - How does reality work? Who or what am I? and, Do we/can we control our reality?

Not sure how to do a direct link, sorry. If you're interested you can find Red Dwarf Better Than Life episode on youtube. It's split into three parts. It's a laugh too and worth a watch whether you're interested in the question - is there's a life behind this one or not?

Trying to make a link, the "game" starts around at 6 minutes.





[edit on 5-5-2009 by wigit]

Part 3

reply to post by wigit


I remember watching that eons ago... Red Dwarf is a great series.

Very funny bit to watch... another funny bit is when they wake up as different, less likable characters from some space squid episode...

looking it up...









Now mods, this is in topic, not some red dwarf fandom spin.. lol... these guys where very multidimensionally brilliant in their writings. It doesn't get more on topic then this

Okay, Who is gonna hit the reset button, PLEASE. No seriously this life was wasted on the accumulation of love and that gets you no skill points and every time you level up something comes along and drags you down again. Also I'd like another character preferably male, Females don't get the same respect. So when will I be able to reroll my character?

You are simply speaking about the success matrix.

In life, usually when you strive for your goals and complete them, you will feel a sense of euphoria. It's the success matrix, everybody does it, and everybody respects it. That's the reason it gives you that euphoria.

Not everybody does it at all times though. Some people drop completley out of it, and seek other ways to attain happiness.

[edit on 7-5-2009 by CrygSol]

[edit on 7-5-2009 by CrygSol]

[edit on 7-5-2009 by CrygSol]