The Three Clinchers for Proof of Alien Life

Originally posted by nablator
Mike, you need to read your own link. If you believe the picture you posted is a cave painting thousand of years old, you are blind, and can't read.

Start here:
"It seems that there are really prehistoric caves there, showing these "ancient astronauts" paintings which inspired the Sputnik Magazine article and illustration:"

NOT the same painting, OK? How many times was it pointed out already in this thread? Are you so desperate to believe anything that you're unable to read?

Nablator, either you can't comprehend what's been written or your plain dumb!

I will do you a favour by reproducing what I wrote in my previous post, which you don't seem to have read thereby shooting from the hip which is getting tiring.

Here is the original painting....

ROCK ENGRAVINGS OF FERGANA

Next to the town of Fergana, near the Alai mountains, in Uzbekistan, there exists this cave painting 2 meters in height and ten thousand years in antiquity.

The Academy of Sciences in Moscow has exhibited a copy of this image.

The painting has been reproduced and exhibited in the Academy of Sciences in Moscow. They obviously can't get the entire cave into the museum, can they? So the natural thing to do is to photograph the painting/reproduce it for exhibition. I thought you knew this procedure for displaying such paintings in museums round the world?

Do you get it?

Now stop clutching at straws and calling people blind. Before doing that I suggest you visit the Academy of Sciences in Moscow and see it for yourself before making unsavory remarks. Probably the next thing you'll say is that the Academy of sciences in Moscow is rubbish and has been known to exhibit trash from articles such as the one in the Sputnik magazine.

Cheers!

[edit on 6-4-2009 by mikesingh]

reply to post by mikesingh


Greeting Mike!

Here is a zoom-in of the same rock art that singles out a being that has bee interpreted to be alien.

(clearly my earlier assessment was flawed, as I had described this as a separate image. Narf!)
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f990c6af2d77.jpg[/atsimg]
files.abovetopsecret.com...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e2d34b5769c8.jpg[/atsimg]
files.abovetopsecret.com...



[edit on 6-4-2009 by Exuberant1]

reply to post by Exuberant1


Hell's bells!! Now that's intriguing! The figures resemble the ones in the Fergana cave painting I posted above!

Can you provide the details of these paintings? Are they from ATS archives?

Cheers! Good find!

reply to post by mikesingh


Not from ATS.

I found it on the IrishUfology.net Forum:
www.irishufology.net...

I had seen it before years ago (in a book of all places) and was trying to find a version of the image online - that forum is the only place I could find it... for now.

[edit on 6-4-2009 by Exuberant1]

Originally posted by mikesingh

Hell's bells!! Now that's intriguing! The figures resemble the ones in the Fergana cave painting I posted above!

No wonder they look very much alike... The figure is from the excact same cave painting!

reply to post by sebarud


LOL

You are right.

I am a senior citizen - what is your excuse mike?

*I guess we both got distracted by the propensity of psychedelic imagery in this piece.

[edit on 6-4-2009 by Exuberant1]

Originally posted by Exuberant1
reply to post by sebarud

 

LOL
You are right.
I am a senior citizen - what is your excuse mike?

Ditto! But what hit me initially was that you mentioned these pics were found in Pakistan! That site seems to have got it wrong! It's not from Pakistan but Uzbekistan! They got the 'stan' part right but messed up on the 'Paki' and 'Uzbeki' part! Jeeez!

Cheers!



[edit on 6-4-2009 by mikesingh]

Originally posted by jkrog08
I am talking about ancient civilizations that were as advanced or more advanced than us now.Societies that existed thousands,if not millions of years ago that were responsible for the Atlantis and Lumeria stories.If you do believe in them don't you think they might had come from elsewhere or had help?

OK, thanks.

To answer your question, no, I do not believe there was such an ancient civilisation, and I don't think Atlantis and Lemuria (not Lumeria) ever existed, at least as they are represented in the most descriptions.

I think that an ancient, advanced civilisation should have left at least some clues of its existence (like garbage, for example, the more advanced we are the more garbage we produce because we use more resources), and I have never seen anything that could interpreted as such.

Originally posted by mikesingh
Nablator, either you can't comprehend what's been written or your plain dumb!

Thanks for pointing out how dumb I am, I appreciate it. The painting that you keep posting is a modern painting by a Russian artist. The misunderstanding originates from a simple mistake in a French magazine, that described a real cave painting, ON A DIFFERENT PAGE. The painting has NOTHING to do with the cave. An erratum was posted in the next issue. READ the bibliotecapleiades page slowly, and the explanations posted earlier in this thread if you're still unconvinced.

Originally posted by Indigo_Child
To the person who posted the demo of the star map. I'm sorry I couldn't understand your demo. I asked that random dots and points be drawn and then we see if we can find a match. In the betty diagram they are a lot of exaxt matches. So I am looking for a demo which can replicate every or most features of the map, but be random.

It was a way of showing that a seemingly random number of dots could represent the same stars seen from outer space.

The meaning behind it was that if you try to paint the stars shown in the video on different sheets of paper a few seconds of film time apart it would be the same stars but looking very different. EVEN if Sol was the center all the time.

I choose to show only the stars within about 200 light years. I could have expanded that number and seen a lot more stars making it even easier to match a given set of dots.

Point of this exercise is to show that with a certain number of dots it probably won't be too difficult to make a match.

Don't know how I can explain it any better than that.

Originally posted by mikesingh

Originally posted by HolgerTheDane

Originally posted by mikesingh
Here’s something that’ll set the debunkers thinking. This looks like ancient astronauts and a UFO in this Fergana cave painting, Uzbekistan.

Courtesy: K Pax. Dan Mirahorian

But some will contend that it's just a rock painting by a moron under the influence of pot!

Oh yeah!

Cheers!

No - but some would check further...

"French researcher Didier Leroux revealed in Lumières dans la Nuit (n. 335, Feb 2000) that it’s not a 12,000 years old rock art, but rather a 1967 soviet magazine illustration.

The first issue of Russian magazine Spoutnik, also published in other languagues, including French, featured the article “The Visitors from Cosmos”, authored by Viatcheslaw Zaitsev. Right at the start of the article you can find the familiar illustration."

Clearly a case of "Believing is seeing"

Have you even bothered to research this or just copied what that web site says?

You mean like bothering to actually find the magazine or just to be content that others have found it, translated it, scanned it and bothered to post in on the internet?

Here is the original painting....

ROCK ENGRAVINGS OF FERGANA

Next of the town of Fergana, near the Alai mountains, in
Uzbekistan, there exists this cave painting 2 meters in height
and ten thousand years in antiquity. The Academy of Sciences
of Moscow has exhibited a copy of this image.
Courtesy: bibliotecapleyades.

You want to believe and ignore facts presented by others.

I do not believe this and ignore the "facts" you present taken out of context. You don't even bother to read what else is written on the webpage you link to.

I rest my case.

[edit on 6.4.2009 by HolgerTheDane]

Just Read through entire thread (extra large coffee)

S F

I never tire of good threads like this, Good points both sides

I believe in ufo's myself

some things I saw here reaffirmed my belief

Link

My question is, why are all these well known people lying like this ??

Originally posted by jkrog08
I just made a thread with very strong events that are the hardest to disprove,

disprove what?

that there are cave paintings?

figures on the ground in south america?

plainly those things cant be disproved they are there

your ideas about them cant be disproved

just as your ideas cant be proved

if the base for your conclusion is 'just because' it can be disproved with 'just because its not'

the star map......

how is the scale of the original hill star map known?

try experiment, get eight people to put one each a random dot on a white piece of paper.

scan and post

we can check the odds of matching them kind of close to what exists

i feel confident it can be done

Originally posted by CuriosityStrikes
The star map is certainly very interesting, it had me pretty convinced until I read another member's posts, with the seemingly boundless expanse that is space having the ability to match up a seemingly random array of dots with existing star systems really could be coincidence, has anyone tried doing it with a randomly generated set of stars?

darn

i didnt read far enough

thats a very good idea btw

reply to post by jkrog08



Re the Nazca Lines.
Guess what the drawings could have been to impress their god's and what would the most likely place that they thought their gods lived?

I will let you answer that!

reply to post by mikesingh


Seen more clearly, the little "alien grey" takes on quite a different perspective. The figure looked much more alien-like in the fuzzy picture, but here it looks rather like something else altogether. But what is it?


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5cd39e895ff3.gif[/atsimg]

What before looked like a mouth now looks like the neck of a bottle, perhaps, and the head doesn't look like a head at all, but more like a flower or some plant-like thing, sprouting spiny projections. The "eyes" here no longer resemble eyes. What is this thing? Recall that the context in which this relief is found is that of an offering scene. Might this be an offering of some plant, perhaps a flower? Consulting a general reference on ancient Egyptian culture, and looking specifically for flowers, it could be found that the lotus represents Upper Egypt and also is symbolic of rebirth. This seems a reasonable image to be found in a tomb. Further, a casual library researcher would discover that there are two types of lotus, one with "pointed buds and petals." This seems to better describe the mysterious figure than its being in the likeness of an alien from some other planet.

It seems much more logical to suppose that the peculiar figure pictured is the image of a lotus blossom, with a bud on each side of it, placed in a vase or jar as an offering. Is it possible to confirm this alternate theory? Another relief in the same tomb depicts a man gathering lotus blossoms as he places them in a basket:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/8907593132cd.gif[/atsimg]

Clearly, we may now say that what looked like eyes were in reality flower buds, and what in a very poor photograph looked something like an "alien grey" looks exactly like that which it was meant to represent: An offering of a lotus blossom.

Problem with cave paintings wall murals etc is that we try to interpret them with our beliefs and current knowledge.

Ps The aztec relief not alien spaceship dont want to fight that fight right now will get back to it.

Originally posted by platosallegory
Good info.

The problem you will have with the debunkers is that they don't use reason when looking at these things.

They will ask for absolute proof or extraordinary evidence. I think when you weigh the evidence within reason it points to extraterrestrial or extradimensional life.

You presented some strong evidence.

The problem with gullible people is they don't ask for enough evidence. "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" points out that the whackier the claim, the greater the demand for good evidence. Whether it's dead men climbing out of their tombs or little space friends needing "runways" for ships that can traverse the stars, you should provide some proof over and above "well, I like it, so it must be true."

Sorry about that.

reply to post by dragonridr

The shuttle communicates via 2 systems neither of these two would be picked up by short wave radio like this person claims. Short wave radio would just bounce off the atmosphere and go into space. Same reason why you can talk with people in china on short wave it bounces off the atmosphere and sent back down to earth doesnt make it into space. So the obvious conclusion is this person is lying.
see below:

Quite obvious uh?

Briefly I recorded some of
the radio broadcast via my audio scanner from the space shuttle
Discovery through WA3NAN, the club station of the Goddard Amateur Radio
Club at Greenbelt, Md, transmitting on 147.450 MHZ. It is a
retransmission from the NASA Select original.

ufoseek.org

reply to post by dragonridr

Tsk tsk tsk. You're not playing this game properly. You're supposed to congratulate Mike for posting misleading cropped low resolution pictures. This thread is not about science, it's about entertainment; how to entertain delusional ideas about aliens while ignoring facts. Yes, it can be done! You can become a believer in the ancient extraterrestrial theory, maybe even without the help of a frontal lobotomy.

Thank you all for the fantastic material, I learned a lot from this thread. The cave painting is extra cool, I'm going to look for more info about this cave. Special thanks to Exuberant1 for the fantastic Japanese sandalwood boat err... UFO, that was awesome. That almost made me a believer.