David Icke verses Jesus Christ

So if someone see's some form of evidence of their faith coming as true or working in front of them because they have choosen a certain path and it worked for them then what does that mean to other types of people who also feel out of the Matrix but use religion? What if someone reads the Bible and casts out demons with it and they saw it them selves, why choose another path? That is why Christians are seen as stubborn because of what they know spirtually and the words that support their gifts is explained as a common source. There will be false healers and teachers and Christians have been warned of this from what they read which poses questions to people like Icke and Darren Brown the psycological illusionist a like.

Nice to see a topic like this posted... we have a choice between people who can only see things through the prism of their faith and people who simply dismiss Icke as a nutter.

Here's a more recent interview in which he relates his experiences and goes through his metaphysical weltanschauung.



I too thought Icke was a nutter for some time. But as time has gone on his claims have become less and less outlandish. I'm even considering the possibility that the reptilian thing might be on some level correct.

A lot of what he says is simply the same as many of the sages from history. But I think he's spot on in trying to get beyond a lot of the mind-control and bigotry that plagues organised religions.

I've noticed that a lot of people who profess themselves to be Christians are profoundly ungenerous and mean-spirited in their words and actions: and many people who profess to be "spiritual" are well and truly up themselves so far that they've lost all chance of seeing daylight.

Icke's not nearly as bad as his detractors make him out.

[edit on 3-4-2009 by rich23]

He speaks a lot of sense but I believe there are meant to be different realms, some realms should not meant to be mixing and certain rituals may open portals whists faith rituals may open up our protection against the lower frequency forces. But he does seem to look spiritually tortured from that video but feel there are no definitive answers or focus and it kind of troubles him.

Ephesians 4
Unity in the Body of Christ

When he ascended on high,
he led captives in his train
and gave gifts to men." 9(What does "he ascended" mean except that he also descended to the lower, earthly regions[c]? 10He who descended is the very one who ascended higher than all the heavens, in order to fill the whole universe.) 11It was he who gave some to be apostles, some to be prophets, some to be evangelists, and some to be pastors and teachers, 12to prepare God's people for works of service, so that the body of Christ may be built up 13until we all reach unity in the faith and in the knowledge of the Son of God and become mature, attaining to the whole measure of the fullness of Christ.

14Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of men in their deceitful scheming. 15Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will in all things grow up into him who is the Head, that is, Christ. 16From him the whole body, joined and held together by every supporting ligament, grows and builds itself up in love, as each part does its work.
Text

Also I like to compare the opposite of Icke with Padre Pio and but do see similar torturing of his spirit.
en.wikipedia.org...

Padre Pio believed that the love of God was inseparable from suffering and that suffering all things for the sake of God was the way for the soul to reach God.[6] He felt that his soul was lost in a chaotic maze, plunged into total desolation, as if he were in the deepest pit of hell. During his period of spiritual suffering, his followers believe that Padre Pio was attacked by the Devil, both physically and spiritually.[6] His followers also believe that the devil used diabolical tricks in order to increase Padre Pio's torments. These included apparitions as an "angel of light" and the alteration or destruction of letters to and from his spiritual directors. Padre Augustine confirmed this when he said:

The Devil appeared as young girls that danced naked, as a crucifix, as a young friend of the monks, as the Spiritual Father or as the Provincial Father; as Pope Pius X, a Guardian Angel, as St. Francis and as Our Lady.[11]

Now, twenty-two days have passed, since Jesus allowed the devils to vent their anger on me. My Father, my whole body is bruised from the beatings that I have received to the present time by our enemies. Several times, they have even torn off my shirt so that they could strike my exposed flesh.[11]

Fr. Gabriele Amorth, senior exorcist of Vatican City stated in an interview that Padre Pio was able to distinguish between real apparitions of Jesus, Mary and the Saints and the illusions created by the Devil by carefully analysing the state of his mind and the feelings produced in him during the apparitions. In one of Padre Pio's Letters, he states that he remained patient in the midst of his trials because of his firm belief that Jesus, Mary, his Guardian Angel, St. Joseph and St. Francis were always with him and helped him always.[11]

Text

I experienced spontaneous Cosmic Consciousness at the age of 17...I'm 58. No, no meditation or illegal usage. My wife & I are vegetarians, two decades now. Don't drink, don't use anything, but we both meditate (very recommended to all). I am hardly a David Icke sycophant. I consider your statements as ignorance of what you are 'perceiving,' which is a view from the outside...not within.

Many concur in their understanding that the jesu mythos are slavery-indoctrination, and he is a compsited creation, as I happen to know. I would point out this source information, but it would not be understood (I have posted it on ats many times, all ignored). Heads in the sand.

You are welcome to your opinion...btw, how old are you? Sounds like you're just starting out, and have not figured much out yet

David Icke is right to denounce your blind biblical beliefs. You sound like a jesu parasite, to me. Never look in the mirror of Truth...it might bite you....and then you might learn something. Better yet, maybe a visit to sunday mass might make you feel more fortified, so you can insult others who are not blind like yourself, and spread your pathetic sycophantic jesu contagion.

The Earth & it's humanity faces these trials because of your kind of Ignorance. Perhaps you enjoy getting the 'sacrament,' and paying 10% for your 'salvation.' Beats working for it, right? Hypocrites beyond belief.

We are all Daughters-Sons of the Creator Spirit, S/He, and all will be Refolded to this condition of EverAll.

christianity began like all religions, a pagan cult, and took form as one of the four heads of the Beast, ruling Earth's peoples. You think it is steeped in ancient tradition? Yes, indeed, stolen from previous histories & cultures many times it's age. But you wouldn't know that, would you? not having studied, just kowtowing to such 'aged beliefs.' And remember, you accept that over the freedom teachings of Icke or other's of his kind. Some of us, like Kindred, are beyond all that. Dark in the cave? get a light. ROFL.

Wow someone on this thread actually did there homework well put "SS,Naga".Christians love to talk about "Revelations"(the only support the bible has, which david icke explains why)Lets ignore the rest of it.the fact that it is identical to all the gods before it horus,mithra etc.Unlike christianity which says its a sin to question it (hint,hint, something to hide maybe) david icke openly says not to believe him, find the truth for yourself.It is very appearent that most post on this thread have either read very little of him or none at all.Where david icke studys all his beliefs he also studys those he opposes.He gave up a carrer of fame to be the biggest joke in his country.Whens the last time a christian has been laughed at for believing in jesus, um never not of today anyway.But i guess this is just all the Satan coming out in me.Speaking of satan lets talk about him.Created by the all knowing god (but becuase of satans freewill god didnt know he would be evil".Then he betrays god and him and1/3 angels are cast down(but not to Hell here on earth with his "loved" ones .Where this was not his original plan, things changed now his children he loves so much has to deal with this pure evil force that can make illusions they can see with there own eyes,create a million other belief systems .make anything thats enjoyable bad,literally possess you and take your mind completely over, and so on.What power to give the highest level of evil to play with your loved ones.Then if his children he loves so much fall for any of this (another words choose the wrong path out of the 1000000000 paths avaible) ,off to eternal burning forever not 1 yr or 10yrs or100 yrs or1000000000000000000 yrs but for all eternity.Yet David Icke is the evil one becuase he speaks against your programed mind.How dare him ask you to find your own truth."CONDEMNATION WITHOUT INVESTIGATION IS THE HEIGHT OF IGNORANCE" Albert Einstein

I experienced spontaneous Cosmic Consciousness at the age of 17...I'm 58. No, no meditation or illegal usage. My wife & I are vegetarians, two decades now. Don't drink, don't use anything, but we both meditate (very recommended to all). I am hardly a David Icke sycophant. I consider your statements as ignorance of what you are 'perceiving,' which is a view from the outside...not within.

Many concur in their understanding that the jesu mythos are slavery-indoctrination, and he is a compsited creation, as I happen to know. I would point out this source information, but it would not be understood (I have posted it on ats many times, all ignored). Heads in the sand.

You are welcome to your opinion...btw, how old are you? Sounds like you're just starting out, and have not figured much out yet

David Icke is right to denounce your blind biblical beliefs. You sound like a jesu parasite, to me. Never look in the mirror of Truth...it might bite you....and then you might learn something. Better yet, maybe a visit to sunday mass might make you feel more fortified, so you can insult others who are not blind like yourself, and spread your pathetic sycophantic jesu contagion.

The Earth & it's humanity faces these trials because of your kind of Ignorance. Perhaps you enjoy getting the 'sacrament,' and paying 10% for your 'salvation.' Beats working for it, right? Hypocrites beyond belief.

We are all Daughters-Sons of the Creator Spirit, S/He, and all will be Refolded to this condition of EverAll.

christianity began like all religions, a pagan cult, and took form as one of the four heads of the Beast, ruling Earth's peoples. You think it is steeped in ancient tradition? Yes, indeed, stolen from previous histories & cultures many times it's age. But you wouldn't know that, would you? not having studied, just kowtowing to such 'aged beliefs.' And remember, you accept that over the freedom teachings of Icke or other's of his kind. Some of us, like Kindred, are beyond all that. Dark in the cave? get a light. ROFL.

Wow someone on this thread actually did there homework well put "SS,Naga".Christians love to talk about "Revelations"(the only support the bible has, which david icke explains why)Lets ignore the rest of it.the fact that it is identical to all the gods before it horus,mithra etc.Unlike christianity which says its a sin to question it (hint,hint, something to hide maybe) david icke openly says not to believe him, find the truth for yourself.It is very appearent that most post on this thread have either read very little of him or none at all.Where david icke studys all his beliefs he also studys those he opposes.He gave up a carrer of fame to be the biggest joke in his country.Whens the last time a christian has been laughed at for believing in jesus, um never not of today anyway.But i guess this is just all the Satan coming out in me.Speaking of satan lets talk about him.Created by the all knowing god (but becuase of satans freewill god didnt know he would be evil".Then he betrays god and him and1/3 angels are cast down(but not to Hell here on earth with his "loved" ones .Where this was not his original plan, things changed now his children he loves so much has to deal with this pure evil force that can make illusions they can see with there own eyes,create a million other belief systems .make anything thats enjoyable bad,literally possess you and take your mind completely over, and so on.What power to give the highest level of evil to play with your loved ones.Then if his children he loves so much fall for any of this (another words choose the wrong path out of the 1000000000 paths avaible) ,off to eternal burning forever not 1 yr or 10yrs or100 yrs or1000000000000000000 yrs but for all eternity.Yet David Icke is the evil one becuase he speaks against your programed mind.How dare him ask you to find your own truth."CONDEMNATION WITHOUT INVESTIGATION IS THE HEIGHT OF IGNORANCE" Albert Einstein

faith is faith. it doesn't have an identity or a specific religion. it's a personal STATE OF BEING. so denouncing one faith over another faith, simply because it is faith, is pointless. we all have faith of varying amounts, especially regarding personally held paradigms.

reply to post by SS,Naga


actually, i dsagree but this is probably not the right place to discuss it. i will say, however, since you took the time to type that comment, that the similarities are an indicator of something much deeper than you've been lead to believe. for example, the phrase "son of god" has referred to many because there have been many and there are many, sons of gods. this is not isolated to jewish or christian literature. it's all over the ancient world.

the stipulation in jesus' case is, he's the only BEGOTTEN son of the god of israel (as in, there are other gods but the god of israel only had one BEGOTTEN in human flesh, son). this carries threw all the ancient texts. for example:

there's a divine council in the ancient texts of egypt, sumer, akkad, phoenicia, babylon, assyria, europe, scandanavian countries, india and china (etc). this means, basically, that the biblical text is telling you that in jesus' case, the god of the council who presided over the affairs of the hebrews, only had one human flesh son born from a human woman. i think the text is pretty clear on that once you know what to look for




[edit on 8-4-2009 by undo]

Okay what about people who have a lot of faith and so much so can use it to good effect and know its real to them, but maybe not prove to everyone but is very sure even if they are bombardered by many times of athiest ideologies giving them doubt but keep growing by the test of faith when they do so. Some people know that much more and I feel even more sure than David Icke does about his view of the world, I am not threatened by his ideas there are a lot of cross references a left and right side view to everything. His reptile awareness could mean to some demonic activity or spiritual beings at work, he even says there is a connection but he puts it into his own mould of the theory of everything but never has peace with his conclutions and is very hell like for him I feel.

I have doubts all the time but I keep on my path even though its not always perfect. I had a dream about this the other day about this post like I was being kept in a room for a very long time in my life being part of a pycological experiment on and maybe it involved reptile activity or a human woman who was in disguise but I broke free and they got angry saying 'They know now' then I got angry back saying why did you lie to me all these years and escaped and got emotional and woke up. I felt like I broke out of David's Icke inner struggles and won my case or broke the curse or exorcised his demons so to say, maybe for him or my self I don't know. I think one of them in the room felt guilty and could not handle me so I ran down the streets of the night to escape fuly then woke up, it was still night time at home in the real world.


[edit on 8-4-2009 by The time lord]

reply to post by The time lord


if that was addressed to me, i wasn't addressing you with the faith comment. i know you have faith! i was addressing the way some folks like to use the word "Faith" as if it were a bad thing, when technically speaking, faith comes in all sizes and shapes. it takes faith to believe any personally held paradigm

[edit on 8-4-2009 by undo]

reply to post by undo


To be honest I missed your reply I was more concerned and in a hurry about the lengthy post above trey85, so its just coincidence or maybe more...who knows that I gave this kind of reply but really nothing towards you.

[edit on 8-4-2009 by The time lord]

There are probably lots of people through history that go through spiritual awareness. Some as the Bible describe as anti-Christs because they went away from the truth that they knew and used it against it's people. Maybe some people gain knowledge through witchcraft and Satanism but does not make them spiritually pure or special. There are bound to be good and evil forces out there and we have to understand where people like David Icke is leading all us into. The Bible is very clear about these types of people, some may gain knowledge but be lost in it, some may use it against and some may even be used without knowing it.

People who are spiritual aware tend to keep their beliefs to themselves and don't go around trying to force them onto everyone else like organised religion does.

Spiritual aware people will also tell you there is more than one truth and one path and that everyone must walk their own path and find their own truth in life. Again the complete opposite of organised religion.

I thought I would share this message from David Icke, as it truly sums up the preconceptions most of us have and shows just how brainwashed & judgmental some people truly are.

DARING TO BE



I played the clip and within a minute or so I was blubbering uncontrollably. I still can't watch it all these days later without the tears pouring down my face. I can't help it - and I don't want to help it. I find it very cathartic.

So many emotions, personal and collective, are unleashed from their years of captivity whenever I see this so-called 'ordinary woman' walk onto the stage amid the laughter, the giggles and the rolling eyes, and just give it to them ...

.... One of the other extraordinary aspects of the Susan Boyle performance was how quickly the audience changed their reaction - point of observation - when she confounded their pre-conceptions by the sheer power and beauty of her voice.

To complete the 'package' of pre-conceived ideas (programming) they all waited for her to open her mouth and for a karaoke cackle to deliver the cat's chorus. You can feel them almost wincing in anticipation at what their ears were about to endure.

Part of the initial counter-reaction was the shock at what they actually heard, but something much deeper followed and it was well expressed by Amanda Holden. It was a wake-up call. Rarely have pre-conceptions been so immediately and profoundly trounced as they were that day in Glasgow.

One clip alone of the performance on Youtube had passed 12 million hits the last time I looked and it has had a massive impact because it says something that people need to hear, and, in truth, want to hear.

It says there is no such thing as a nobody and that includes you, whoever you are. It says do not judge yourself or others by the standards and filters that you are programmed to worship by a system with a fundamental self-interest in dictating the way you see the world.




[edit on 18-4-2009 by kindred]

I have a parable which Jesus told, which kind of gives a broad message on many levels, not sure if people know it but its interesting and saw it by accident.

On another occasion, Jesus told of two sons: one did what his father wished although he said he would not, and the other said he would but did not:

He answered, 'I will not'; but later he changed his mind and went. [30] The father went to the second and said the same; and he answered, 'I go, sir'; but he did not go. [31] Which of the two did the will of his father?" They said, "The first." Jesus said to them, "Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are going into the kingdom of God ahead of you. [32] For John came to you in the way of righteousness and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes believed him; and even after you saw it, you did not change your minds and believe him. -- Matthew 21:29-32
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Those were hard words the tax collectors and the prostitutes are going into the kingdom of God ahead of you. There were many occasions when Jesus spoke in this way. So much of his good news about the kingdom of God is about including or accepting people who are regarded, even by themselves, as being unacceptable. The point of the parable of losing and finding was not so much to encourage repentance, important though that was, as to encourage acceptance of those whom God had already accepted.
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reply to post by The time lord


hey man don't worry about a thing, just stay clear of the david icke while i was tripping on acid i saw reptilles crap.

That is my whole pet peeves with these new age people, they take versus from Jesus Christ and call him the greatest teacher blah blah yet they don't follow his teachings.

They are the false prophets of the world as it was spoken about.

but i do understand where david icke is comming from i used to be in his shoes, just using bits and pieces of the bible and believing satans lies, that he tells you about god himself.

Only god himself can help David realize the truth along with all the other people.

Only god himself can help David realize the truth along with all the other people.

I very much doubt any enlightened person would waste their time with a biblical God who is both morally & ethically beneath them. I certainly wouldn't & don't. Even David Icke has more credibility. The only false prophets are those egotistical people who claim there is only one truth - Theirs!!!!!

Okay another Bible quote that might try an explain 2000 years in advance about what viewpoints man will have on the Bibleby fighting truth with truth. Here is what the Bible says or it self in all this and how if the writers ever spoke to people like David Icke would respond.

Romans1

God's Wrath Against Mankind

18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

Text

22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
Text

Again just to refrase that man exchanged the worship of reptiles be it in statue form or in spiritual form instead of accepting God as the creator.
I find it interesting that Icke promotes this reptilian theory. But lets say they are real to some point, half man half reptile it does not mean the world was created by them like some UFO fans claim we came from as some planetary experiment. But prove me wrong but just giving an angle that is not the same repetative issue on ATS.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by The time lord]

What you posted is open to interpretation, in other words it can mean anything you want it to mean. You can continue to quote the bible, but I personally don't believe the bible is the word of God, so you're wasting your time in regards to myself. There is simply no evidence to back up anything you say. You obviously believe in the bible and that's fine, but not everyone does and you can't just force your viewpoints and beliefs onto everyone else, unless you back it up with concrete, hard evidence or proof. The bible alone is not enough. People are entitled to believe whatever they like, as long as it's not harming anyone. David Icke may have gone over the top sometimes, but his message is a positive one. I don't see any hidden agendas or evil behind anything he says.

As for who our creator is, To me it's not that important. If that being is without any morals or ethics, then it won't get any recognition or servitude from me. Having an interest in Buddhism, I really don't believe in an interventionist God. The only thing that matters to me, is my own spiritual growth and my servitude to humanity and the greater good.

There's a strong possibility that Aliens have manipulated our DNA or even seeded this planet, but until there is concrete proof, it's all just speculation & conjecture. I personally look forward to the day when an intergalactic visitor lands his spaceship and meanwhile everyone's expecting something that looks like an octopus with 10 arms, but instead out walks a human who looks exactly like us. Now that would be funny. Our scientists will no doubt be very red faced.

[edit on 5-5-2009 by kindred]

I just hope that the octopus with 10 arms is not the Beast with Ten heads so to speak in prophecy. I am more sure by faith that there is so much more to this world in ways that is hard for me to explain but seems to make sense when reading the Bible. A lot of people are also in that position and I believe forces or good and bad or confused are at work.

The Bible I find has a duality in what it says and spiritually it can mould across time to mean different things because it has the fractile power of the holispirit to do so. Even if the shape was build 2000 years ago it will fit all the other circles of life and society but yet still hold its original form.

That is open to question no doubt I guess it takes more to notice it for such things to be accepted and I am not starting up a mystery course based on it either.

At the same time even David Icke can see how it fits into his own mode of thought but he is just not getting the real message or does not want to accept it. He can touch the surface I feel but he won't open the doors to that power and he creates many trap doors in his thoughts that stop him from seeing where all these mysteries come from. The Bible does speak of mysteries and secrets that God reveals to certain people.

I could also do a debate about Alex Jones verses Davide Icke, since Alex is more Christian orientated.

[edit on 6-5-2009 by The time lord]

But one thing is for sure I bet if the end time signs or something Biblical was witnessed by David Icke he will in the end believe and not only believe but like the Apostle Paul and enemy of the faith he became of the biggest belivers in history. But I say that maybe if with David if he somehow connects will ultimately make him a great believer but even I doubt God would judge him too harshly he does see the good side too in us.