Those who are Awake have no obligations to those who are asleep.

reply to post by Wertdagf


It would be better to be prepared...

BTW, I'd like to shed some more light to the OP and his little trick.
Interesting enough, the OP is about something else. Yet, as it turned out, the posters picked out something that kinda slipped away from the opening statement.

This thread is not really about the "elite" of the society and its relation to the oppressed ones, as it was apparently meant, it turned out that it's about the "spiritual" elite and its obligation to the sleeping ones.

This caused a little confusion, and I believe it should be properly clarified.

The ruling elite in society got its power exactly from those who are oppressed. And they got it exactly because of the fear of death. So those who don't feel that death is an option, are very likely to become oppressed and that's about it. The elite can boast and imagine that they are "better" and that all they got is in the contract signed by the slaves. And, it is true.

But this is a very limited vision. And the awakened ones clearly see what it is about.

Now, if those slaves wanted to tear the contract, the awakened ones will be awaiting to help, and the "social elite" will be the ones with guns pointed at them.

I hope this is now set as it should be.

While I cannot say that I completly disagree, I have to say that I disagree in principle. So, let's all look out for "No.1," right. You are the epitome of the "me generation." If I am incorrect, then show me where I am wrong.

reply to post by DangerDeath


Jeah, you're right, I didn't read the OP very well, shame on me, and after reading it back I realised that it didn't have the same meaning as I originally thought and what I've been saying in this thread is from another perspective.

reply to post by DangerDeath


There are situations and experiances you can manufacture to make people think about these concepts. It really wouldnt be that hard on an individual basis. You must first THINK about it.... not sit in a tower assuming it impossible.

reply to post by Wertdagf


So how many people have you awakened or guided on their spiritual journey?

[edit on 28/2/09 by enigmania]

reply to post by PriamsPride


To be awake one must have at some point been asleep.Correct? With this in mind, i'm sure there was some point in which our brave OP was stuck in the poop and noise of his own little nest of ignorance.Then came the time which some hero,either a loved parent or friend maybe a coach or teacher decided to take an interest in our sticky little friend,he or she showed him how to fly on his own,how to get away from the rest of us.Woke him to the beauty and wealth,dangers and evil all around him.I must ask OP,why do you think this world is more yours than mine.We all should have,must have,the opportunity to receive knowledge.You recommend the knowledge not be given,the cattle aren't intelligent enough to receive it.I recommend the "cattle" receive the knowledge,only then can they be intelligent enough to awaken others.Your society stunts itself.You spend too much time sliding down the surface of things.

reply to post by enigmania


Judge for yourself. Maybe what i have said previously will help you. Just do some research into my past posts.

The title of the thread is misleading relative to the OP.

I believe I have learned from people more that they've learned from me. But, I've learned from dead people, from their work, a lot.

I have discovered things for myself, and then realized others have discovered that long time ago. Yet, it is only known to the few, and what is important, I couldn't recognize their discoveries until I had my own experience to match theirs.

This is why I believe that everybody has to make his own personal effort in order to advance in knowledge. All knowledge has already been published many times and in many places. But it cannot be imposed on those who don't have enough capacity to accept it.

And the only way to increase the capacity is to be hungry for knowledge and never stop to rest.

Personally, I can't blame anyone for being wiser than me, because I know it is all up to me to find the way to improve myself. And I expect the same from others. Only then is possible to share the experience and to help each other.

Sharing experience is not same as exchanging it, because the principle of exchange means you lose what you give. Because of this it is insane to accuse those who are "awake" that they are keeping something just for themselves, It just doesn't work that way. It cannot be.

If you where truly awake you would see you are well within the grand illusion of self, and not at all any more awake than those you would ignore.

You are actually asleep.

If you where truly awake you would actually see that you "are" in fact everyone else you fancy yourself separate from.

You are not separate in any way. Your responsibility, spiritually, intellectually, financially is to everyone. Responsibility does not end at your skin.

With your logic, those with more money than you, and who have the right to make policy that create systems that take more money from you, and can take things from you unfairly because you are asleep to your legal and human rights, are deserving of everything you have?

This is just a fearful fancy you have. Such attitudes will keep you from advancing real understanding. Please contemplate this subject with a wider mind, an attached heart and a keener wit. We all need your help so we can help in understanding and knowledge so we can all help you too.

All we have is bootstraps here. Join the great pull out of ignorance. Don't fool yourself. You are there with the rest of us.

ZG

reply to post by Wertdagf


I've already seen your MO.

You enter discussion with hollow statements, never answer questions, and you keep changing the subject.

reply to post by manganesejolt


I HAVE been trying for 25 years and have been so visible people the other side of the world know who I am sometimes when I ring to over there
I have been screwed by so many people who pretended to be my friends you would NOT believe it and have been invited on American talk shows - radio- and was told it is best I don’t
don’t believe me doesn’t matter ITS FACT
after all this I am poor hurt causes I was linked to by people who said they wanted to help and didn’t
sick if trying I have done all can running to stay still and still going backwards trying my best for the cause
and they screwed my rating here you wouldn’t believe that here either
so no I don’t care anymore except for

Maya00a said:

There are many people who aren't interested in being awake or knowing the truth - whatever awake and truth actually means. The majority of people moan and complain a lot but they don't actually do anything to change their situation. Most will say they can't do whatever and that it's someone else's fault. Bottom line - people don't want to take responsibility for their own lives. Maybe they do want to but they don't know how and really can't be bothered to learn.

autowrench: So very true, Myah00a, many people just aren't interested in learning anything new, and I have to blame this on religion and public education. The choice, though, in an individual thing, to be decided by the person. I have had people say to me, "I learned everything I need to know in school/church/parents." When I was a boy, there were no PCs, pocket, or otherwise, no cable television, Blackberry, cell phone, video game. We read books, lot of book in my own case, but some in the 1960s read themselves into law school, or medical school. I learned to be an automobile mechanic by reading Popular Mechanics, (a good mag back then) and Hot Rod mag, and Street Rodder. These were my information sources, far and above what a Chilton's Manual would be. I still read a lot, maybe two books a week. I have met people who have never read a book at all. This is sad.

They really don't know how to function away from their usual routine which has been ingrained into them - school, job, career, finance, mortgage, rinse and repeat. At least they try and at least they want to break free but they really don't know how.

aw: They really don't, do they? I was like that once, my life wrapped up in job and family, and car and electronic toys, my life was TIME, and time alone. When later I drove a semi for a living, time became even more important. Now that I have stepped away from the grind, to rat race of humanity, my life is slower and better, and I have more time to think, research, and read. And meditate, which I think is essential to human development and evolution. The time is near, and all need to prepare for it, in their own way. No one can take another along, this is not possible. No ET being will take your hand, for they would then be responsible for you. Take personal responsibility into yourself, and life it each day.

I don't believe I'm 'awake' I just believe in take responsibility for my own life. Doesn't mean I know it all either but I'm always prepared to ask questions and hear the answers. Doesn't mean I'll act on the answer but I'll consider the opinion. Ultimately it's up to me. If I'm not doing what makes me happy how can I be any good for my children? If I'm not doing what makes me happy how can I be any good around anyone?

aw: Me either, just aware. None of us will be fully awake until such a time arrives for it to happen. I do take responsibility, not only for myself, but for my wife and three sons. And you are right, you cannot be good to anyone if you are filled with fear. You can become fearless with a little practice in developing one's inner power base.

We will soon come to a time when all will know, there will be no more secrets. All will have it, but how many will use it, or even know how to use it?

DangerDeath said:

I you are using analytical mind, you are "awake".
If you are simply following (given) protocols, you are not "awake".
It's as simple as that.

Intelligence is creativeness.

aw: I agree with the second statement, but not the first....it is the reverse, i think; One has an Analytical type of thinking, while another has a Multi-Dimensional type. do you see the difference?

Maya00a said:

I suppose 'awake' people are happy to know that they'll never actually be totally happy!

There's always more to see, more to do, more to learn, more to experience. I love learning but I don't necessarily want all the answers. I appreciate the fact that I'm alive and have so much to explore in life. Life isn't always easy - that would be so boring. However, I always remain grateful that I'm even here.

aw: I certainly hope there is more to learn! You are right, of course, for to know everything, you would then be God/Goddess wouldn't you now? I don't really think it's about knowing more, but rather being in contact with the Collective Mind that is all of us.

Maya00a said:

"Golden Rule" - Do unto others. I always live my life by that rule to the best of my ability.

aw: Me too. this is the best rule of all, isn't it?

I think its a bit patronising of someone to assume that their way is the right way and they must wake everyone else up and tell them how they should be living.

aw: There is no "right way," or "wrong way," because all is relative to existence. All paths lead to the One Creator. And no religion has it right, but only partly right, IMHO.

reply to post by enigmania


Can you give me an example. Id like to awnser any questions i missed.

aw: I agree with the second statement, but not the first....it is the reverse, i think; One has an Analytical type of thinking, while another has a Multi-Dimensional type. do you see the difference?

Analytical thinking is needed to understand and deconstruct projections, delusions, ideas, emotions, call them as you wish.

Without analytical thinking you cannot arrive at Multi-Dimensional thinking, because MT is CREATIVE thinking. Creative thinking creates new logic and new perception every moment (new dimensions). And following protocols, any given logic, is not creative thinking (acting, actually).

So I believe I was correct. Analytical thinking should not be confused with linear, statistical, computing, calculating... thinking.

Analytical thinking enables you to understand "the order and connection of things". When this happens, you are free to open doors to dimensions which go beyond the present human condition - into the infinite realms of spirit and infinite knowledge of all sentient beings in the Universe.

The mind is a terrible liar and will rationalize anything for the false self. The Supreme Being is all merciful and entirely in charge. It is unnecessary to worry about the welfare of others. But is is a natural act of compassion and responsibility to try and dispel darkness with truth and light.

When the spirit descends in matter it is endowed with characteristics for it's existence and survival. These are substitutes for what it has temporarily left behind. First it is given ego and mind, latter in descent to a form on this plane it is endowed with instinct suitable to that form. These instincts are inclined towards the individuals survival and inclined towards it's self / selfish / self centric existence here.

The rational of "Awake" or of the NWO always being around is just a means of self deception. The angle is Superiority, normalcy and entitlement to the "awake" and "entitled". The world is dark and filthy and forever a place for the expression of imperfection. The first duty is to the welfare of our own souls and making appropriate efforts for our own genuine salvation. Sharing light and truth with others is not a primary duty but a secondary one. Rationalizing "my" entitlement and "their" bad luck is a sure sight that suffering is to follow for you. It is ego and delusion and not truly awake at all. We should be compassionate for all life and try to make every ones stay here as reasonably peaceful as we can.

Originally posted by enigmania
reply to post by FritosBBQTwist

 

The only reason you are awake is because the lessons you have learned from others, whether directly or indirectly. You should be thanking them for your awakening, not yourself. They have lighted the fuse to help trigger such self enlightenment.

Please speak for yourself, I'm glad for you that you had a lot of support for your enlightenment, but when I speak for myself, I have to say that I went through some troubled, lonely years to get to the point where I can feel at peace with my world views.

And I sure didn't get any help from the people around me.

"Whether directly or indirectly"

Would you still be enlightened if you had everything handed to you?

Just to let you all know...

My definition of enlightened = Knowing whats actual happening in the world in a realistic manner...

The point I was trying to make is that there is a lessoned learned through everything. Those so called lonely years you had - must have had been a product of something, just as the thing before was a product of something else. Or, easily called, the chain of life.

I am not here to say be nice to everybody - all I am saying is that do your thing in life, but not to intentionally prevent another person from waking up, when all you sometimes have to do is say a single word.

When something bad happens, I tend to look at the brighter side and the moral of it all. Seems to me that you do the same, and with that said, was affected by other people indirectly.

The way I look at the OP is like this.

If someone could see life in a much better perspective from you saying two words to him/her - why not? Even if those words are harsh and cruel - but realistic?

reply to post by manganesejolt


So the decrepit academic mentality you picked up at Yale is finally starting to cause delusions... You people are no worse than the Sophists of Ancient Greece. You're despicable. That you revere the arete, that you believe your life is merely a highway for pure conditioning is a sad thing indeed.

You can live in your marble halls and read books and attempt to shuffle the world's resources, but before such a dream becomes reality I will make you tremble, weep and lash before my feet, and you will be driven into cowardice and irreparable discomfiture for the rest of your life. Whoever picks up the cause where you have failed will meet the same fate. This world is for the meek, the poor and the disadvantaged. You are only a guest... be nice.

[edit on 28-2-2009 by cognoscente]

I think the bigger question of this thread is if you believe people can truly change, which is the same as saying if someone else wants to be woken up or not, and whether or not if they can help it.

Everyone will have their roots. Their gets and go's, their down and out's.

But some of you seem two sided in the fact that you were not enlightened upon birth yet make claims that whatever event throughout your life has changed your perception.

Some people have not hit that spark which changes their view on life. I am safe to assume many of us here have...but before that happened, you were not always like you were now. Ignorance is bliss, and some are born into a world of pure ignorance, while others are born with hard core reality.

Why am I wrong to want to wake someone up if the opportunity presents itself, whether I know it or not?

I hope I am not sounding like a cultist or something, because many of my words are reference to others

That is one of the most ego based speeches I have heard in a long time.

Let's see. Children are unaware let them rot, with your logic.

Compassion has a lot to do with it, those that have it help others that are in need or can't seem to do for themselves.

And your right many people are a sleep, but do you treat them like cattle, walk over them, look down on them?

Let's see a house is on fire, people are sleeping......hmmmmm I'll just walk out without trying to wake them up.





reply to post by manganesejolt

selfishness abounds in this place and at all walks of life.

people that are awake are the ones that are blessed to lead the ones that are asleep!

this is the reason why there are leaders and there are followers.