NY cartoon appears to link Obama to dead chimp

reply to post by ScRuFFy63



While you may be correct that we all feel racism, It all stems from slavery. Yeah it may sound like crap, that was a long time ago but its the truth. Look at the conditions the majority of black people live in. I'm sorry for what happened to on the train but the mentality of black people has been screwed up for a very long time. White culture and black culture did not "evolve" the same and thats just the way it is.

It is a very recent thing that our culture is being motivated like the white culture has been for a very long time. I've spoken with the whitest of white people and the blackest of black people and there is no way you can blame a whole culture for being ignorant.


Maybe its not really a black white thing but more of a poverty thing. It just so happens that blacks set up the value system for poverty.

Originally posted by ScRuFFy63
Well I'm not actually upset. How would you even know if I was upset.

I wouldn't. I didn't say you specifically, but your posts are coming across as being a little upset, if I'm wrong forgive me. It's just crazy, because you may be upset over something that to me CLEARLY wasn't meant the way you see it.

Now all of a sudden I want racism to continue. So you're saying that whether it is or isn't racism, my calling it racism is continuing racism.

Well yeah. It automatically puts us whites on the defensive, and only continues to highlight our MINOR difference, skin color, when it is not needed. I am VERY confident saying I'm not a racist in that I don't think my race is better than anybody, and we are all humans. I do acknowledge skin color exists, and as humans, we ALL pick out differences when we're angry at each other, and that just perpetuates this particular problem because it's making it us vs. them.

So lets play devils advocate for a sec. Say it's a fact that the toon is racist. Should I say anything about it then?

If it is BLATANTLY and OBVIOUSLY racist, then yes. You have the right to speak your mind and I would be right behind you speaking mine as well. Any business that would publish something blatantly racist would deserve the financial and public relations backlash that would follow. But you should be DAMNED sure it's actually racist before you make that call, or else this is what you get. More division and anger.

Now you're saying some "people" have lost their grounds to complain so they cling to whats left of racism. Are you getting all of this based on my posts. You would be highly ignorant if that was so. Honestly poverty is one thing but when people look down on you before they know you based on your skin color it's arguably the worst feeling in the world.

Why did you quote "people" like that? Holy crap, are you perceiving racism again where it is not, and trying to point it out cleverly? I sure hope not. And just for YOUR info, poverty is NOT a "black thing". I grew up fairly poor myself, and still live paycheck to paycheck. I'm quite sure you have been given FAR more opportunity than I have in this country.

Originally posted by americandingbat
Take a deep breath, it'll be okay.

Are you a regular New York Post reader?

Nope, I've actually never read it.

Second line.

reply to post by ScRuFFy63


like blacks were the only people ever enslaved? like there aren't different forms of oppression, imprisonment, and slavery with similar if not worse aftereffects that people were able to overcome in one generation, never mind the 10+ it's been in the U.S.?

reply to post by 27jd


I don't see how my posts came across as being upset but thats fine. You say i'm highlighting the difference, is that not the topic of the thread? Maybe if there wasn't any blatant or undercover racism we'd all be better off.I put people in quotations b/c you did not say who you were talking about but it was obvious. So I say "people" with sarcasm not racism. But now do you see it's how you say things that matters.

And again I say how are you so sure about me. Both of my parents are from Jamaica meaning they came here with nothing. We had money issues and cultural clashing issues. But this isn't me vs. you. And while I may look black I'm actually only half black. Supposedly the other half is syrian, irish and other unknowns.

Lucidity I seriously doubt any culture has been though what blacks have been through. this would be because america is one of a kind.

Now in my own opinion America is full of man made stuff. this might be the conspiracy side of me talking, but it seems to me that while most other countries have had their cultures develop naturally The good ol USA seems to manufacture/manipulate everything including culture.

[edit on 19-2-2009 by ScRuFFy63]

Originally posted by ScRuFFy63
Now in my own opinion America is full of man made stuff. this might be the conspiracy side of me talking, but it seems to me that while most other countries have had their cultures develop naturally The good ol USA seems to manufacture/manipulate everything including culture.

There's something we can agree on. They WANT us to be divided, and if you really feel that way, than think about it a little deeper and see that if you get upset over their manufactured crap and get us all worked up emotionally and at each others throats, then we are playing right into the hands of those who are keeping us ALL down and stealing OUR money. We're ALL "people".

Originally posted by skeptic1
reply to post by vor78

 

Oh, the other side started it so this is ok? Real mature way to look at things. Kind of reminds me of "Nanny-nanny-boo-boo".....

I don't like Obama and I certainly don't like Congress, but this cartoon is uncalled for and unnecessary.

Your correct naturally. I suppose we are going to have to let the hard core warriors of this type of characterizations have their war.

It is rather clear that some calling for outrage are simply hypocrites. What a bad word but true. Bush got just flat out lambasted with all manner of madness. Absolutely nothing was sacred to those that FILLED the net with just about ever characterization of Bush one could fathom.

Originally posted by 27jd

Originally posted by americandingbat
Take a deep breath, it'll be okay.

Are you a regular New York Post reader?

Nope, I've actually never read it.

Second line.

Then you're not the target audience for the cartoon and what you first thought of isn't all that relevant. If you ever do read it, you may find that it's not exactly geared toward a sophisticated or politically astute readership.

It's geared toward people who read "Obama's Stimulus Plan Passed Senate" and assume that means that Obama wrote a Stimulus Plan that was Passed by the Senate.

My only dog on this thread is trying to point out that context matters in trying to figure out what the cartoonist thought his audience would assume. To guess that the Post readership would associate the dead chimp with the one name they have been given to associate with the stimulus package is not unreasonable – it's logical.

edit: changed "gorilla" to "chimp"

[edit on 2/19/09 by americandingbat]

Originally posted by americandingbat
My only dog on this thread is trying to point out that context matters in trying to figure out what the cartoonist thought his audience would assume.

I understand that the cartoonist came out and said it was not his intention to link the ape to Obama, can we not just take him at his word and move on? If the cartoonist is lying about what his intent was, he is a plain coward. Either way, we're arguing over what we see in a cloud, and there's no way to prove anything one way or the other, so we can go round and round. I don't see the racism, that's all I can say for sure and I'm just speaking for myself.

I am going to be honest and say that I have not read this entire thread.

In my opinion I believe that this leaves a lot to interpretation.

Think of it as an art-form and imagine its a big red spot. Some people see a red dot, others see a white background and others see a ball bouncing etc etc.

Whether this artist intended to represent racism in any shape or form was his right ( not agreeing with his thoughts if so ). How we interpret it based on what we see is ours.

I do not personally feel it was offensive and I supported Obama as our president during the election cycle, but it did make me think about how others may see it.

To those who find it offensive, good for you and I hope your voice is heard in your outrage. In the end we can all just agree to see it how we see it.

This cartoon seems out of line to me. Personally I like President Obama. I don't know if he can really help the country very much, though.

Being a politician nowadays seems to be more difficult.

Bush was openly criticised for some of his personal behavior. Kennedy was called "red jack", some felt that Lincoln was a tyrant.

Originally posted by vor78
They called Bush a chimp, a monkey and an ape for eight years. There were plenty of cartoons depicting him as such, too.

Normally, I'd consider it to be offensive, but in this particular case, I'd say that turnabout is fair play. The other side started this. Don't whine and cry when it gets thrown back at you.

Did any of those Bush cartoons show him with 2 gunshot holes in his chest? I'm really asking, because, I've yet to see one. Lest we forget, this isn't barack obama, night mgr at walmart. He's the President Of The United States. Methinks there's a cartoonist out there who needs to have a sit-down with the secret service. These guys used the chimp story as cover to get their little racist dig in, that's all..and it is dangerous, because americans are(rightfully) very angry at government right now. Hell, on top of the stimulus screwing, we in CA just got a major tax increase..people are spitting mad, and just today we got pics of octomom looking at some mansion in whittier...it's a powder keg in america at the moment. This was racist, but more than that, it was also foolish and stupid given the attitude of the country right now. Someone just might try it..there are those evil enough to at least give it some thought. why fan the flames?

reply to post by Djarums


The cartoon has nothing to do with Obama, you guys are reading way to much into it, its basically comparing the stimulis package that Pelosi and Reed drew up with one that a monkey could write. I think its halarious but sad in a way because the stimulis plan that is suppose to help this country is going to sink this country...

Help me? I dont see how this cartoon even refers to Obama. Its the racists mind that links monkeys and blacks when there is no link in a sane persons world

[edit on 19-2-2009 by alienj]

reply to post by Djarums


I would have to worry about someone's racial ethics if they read more than that into it, as Sharpton and Jackson are in the business of racism, so lately for them anyway business is dying so they have to inject their racism anywhere they can.

[edit on 19-2-2009 by alienj]

reply to post by dragonseeker


Soooo, lemme get this straight. On the one hand you're saying that we're rightfully angry at our corrupt government and the mess they've created while stealing our tax money and giving it to their friends. On the other hand, you're rooting for the same corrupt government to start detaining citizens for creating cartoons that may be in bad taste, but not directly linked to the president enough in ANY way to charge him with trying to incite an assasination. Wow, okay.

This post is much to do over nothing, there are so many more pressing matters then for us to sit and listen to racists injecting their thoughts onto a cartoon. A cartoon that has nothing to do with Obama. Maybe the church of Obama wants to stiffel anything that they think insinuates negatively on their "Lord and Saviour"

Originally posted by 27jd
reply to post by dragonseeker

 

Soooo, lemme get this straight. On the one hand you're saying that we're rightfully angry at our corrupt government and the mess they've created while stealing our tax money and giving it to their friends. On the other hand, you're rooting for the same corrupt government to start detaining citizens for creating cartoons that may be in bad taste, but not directly linked to the president enough in ANY way to charge him with trying to incite an assasination. Wow, okay.

Last time I checked, "talk to" was not the same as "detain". SS talks to people all the time without actually placing them in custody..this guy would be worth a conversation.

So, if you say negative things about President Obama, you are automatically labeled a racist....Hmmmm, interesting. That's one way to keep a candidate from being blasted by the MSM!

Every president, throughout history, has been criticized by the media and the public in one form or another. Very few, if any, defended President Bush, Clinton, Bush, Reagan, Carter, Ford, etc. But wait, they were all white guys so that's okay.

Ridiculous! If that cartoon was sketched in 2007, would anyone care?

Originally posted by nyk537
A good point Irish M1ck, a good point.

Although I think most people would assume that it is Obama.

What are you people talking about.

Only someone dumber than a chimp would think Obama wrote this 1000+ page bill himself. What? Did he do nothing for the last several weeks but sit at his keyboard and pound this thing out?

I read several articles about how Sharpton and the NAACP are freaking out but I couldn't understand why. Because the people who wrote this bill ARE dumber than chimps; in my mind anyway. So I guess the fools protesting this cartoon think Obama wrote the bill?

That last sentence felt funny to type.

In my opinion only fools protest cartoons. Regardless of the content.

Vas

reply to post by Feltrick


No I am not saying that, its your racists mind(not so much yours but people who posted this thread) that link a monkey to Obama thru a cartoon that is exploiting the stupidity of the stimulus bill. The bill looks like it was written by a monkey, thats the whole cartoon but racist individuals want to project thier minds connection of monkeys and blacks onto this cartoon. Presidents Democratic and Republican alike are fair game for constructive riducule all day long. I have noticed that if the Obama crew thinks they have been dissed in anyway(crew meaning the "church of Obama") They will then label you RACIST.. just like thier doing with this cartoon, hey its an easy dishonest way to hit back and takes no intellectual thinking on their part...