U.S. vs. China

initially no

in the long run yes... it's the basics of economics.

Europe had better make policy changes if they want to improve those nations living standars.

like they did with ireland and portugal who in the space of 20 years went from poor countries to some of the richest in the world

Ireland and Portugal did it through capitalism. They both kept low taxes, and took a more hand's off approach to the economy.

and large development grants as well...

not forgetting the EU required ireland and portgal to reform their systems before joining... hence the reason for their growth

The minute a missile is detected then they can shut off the radar.

The once again we have a problem... No active SAM radar = no SAM intercepting Attacker...

So americas possible 300 stealth planes will clear the way in one night?

It's allot easier for a battle tested military to totaly outs another airforce rather then the other airforce sending its whole fleet to hundreds of spots around the globe (even with an intact command structure) especcialy with little to no command chain left...

How could the F/A22's be effective? There is only one squadron of them.
Also do you know how long it takes to cross the pacific?

There is/will be allot more then 1 squadren of them... If needbe they can have wing mounted tanks and supercruise to Hawaii where a tanker in the air will meet them or they can quickly refuel on the ground, take a piss and e on their way to Japan...

Too many bases for one group to hit....believe me i have checked.

Not really... Send in 10 B-2s with a few concrete busters and they will make the round to most, if not all bases with impunity...

I dont think the latest russian SAM is going to be called dinky, its better than the patriot.
Well the patriot isnt hard to beat, you only need something that doesnt shoot down friendly jets.

The S-400 is only slightly above the PAC-3 (with the newest motors installed)
And the fact that a PAC-3 can shoot down a Hornet with heavy ECM capabilities says something about it...

You will still need tanks, unless of course you think a war can be won just in the air?

Tanks are a luxury. We don�t need them but after the first few days when all of the enemy tanks are token out by Vipers and Super Bugs our tanks will have a field day.

Yeah thats the point , and your not takeing into account camoflauge, angle, cloud cover, terrain.etc.

Camouflage what? Angel? Who needs an angle when you can photograph the whole land mass?

The same can be said about the USAF and USN.

? Yeah, so the airforces with the advantage cant take out an immobile SAM site with harms? give it a break!

Yet again another arogant statement, B2's can be tracked and shot down.

Guess we should stop developing stealth aircraft, huh? Anyhow, I'd hate to see you Europeans get into any modern conflict as seeing that an almost fully stealth aircraft can get shot down, no?

All in all, I smell jealousy of America�s almost unstoppable military... It's okay! You can come and move here...

I don't think grants from the EU are the reason. Portugal has raised taxes, and seen awful growth in recent years. Ireland has kept low taxes, and continued to grow at a rapid pace.

Not even the top EU countries can compare economically to individual American states in GDP per capita.

Originally posted by ChrisRT
The once again we have a problem... No active SAM radar = no SAM intercepting Attacker...

Missle detected , radar off=missle crashes= radar on , plane goes bye bye

It's allot easier for a battle tested military to totaly outs another airforce rather then the other airforce sending its whole fleet to hundreds of spots around the globe (even with an intact command structure) especcialy with little to no command chain left...

......okey care to exsplain this random comment?

There is/will be allot more then 1 squadren of them... If needbe they can have wing mounted tanks and supercruise to Hawaii where a tanker in the air will meet them or they can quickly refuel on the ground, take a piss and e on their way to Japan...

Yeah one squadron wont win the war, a lot more is 300 planes.

Not really... Send in 10 B-2s with a few concrete busters and they will make the round to most, if not all bases with impunity...

too many bases even for 10 bombers.
Believe me , i've checked and the south coastal area along has an insane number...hang on i posted the number of major bases in another thread a while ago.

The S-400 is only slightly above the PAC-3 (with the newest motors installed)
And the fact that a PAC-3 can shoot down a Hornet with heavy ECM capabilities says something about it...

The fact it shot down a tornado with IFF on and ECM is something....

Tanks are a luxury. We don�t need them but after the first few days when all of the enemy tanks are token out by Vipers and Super Bugs our tanks will have a field day.

Yeah a field day in thier urban areas?
OR on the beaches?
No it will be a fire fight the entire way.

Camouflage what? Angel? Who needs an angle when you can photograph the whole land mass?

You cant photograpgh through trees, you cant photograph through clouds.
Also at the angle the satalite is at i dont think it will be able to get all of china.
You cant just redirect every satalite in US control to geosync over china.

? Yeah, so the airforces with the advantage cant take out an immobile SAM site with harms? give it a break!

I was saying that some americans think the USAF and USN are unstopppable.
Also why do you think SAM sites are totally immobile??

Guess we should stop developing stealth aircraft, huh?

Anyhow, I'd hate to see you Europeans get into any modern conflict as seeing that an almost fully stealth aircraft can get shot down, no?

No they add an advantage but they are like anyother plane, vunerable.
Care to explain that comment?

All in all, I smell jealousy of America�s almost unstoppable military... It's okay! You can come and move here...

Yeah unstoppable military lol.
I'm sure your proud of the US military and its FF reacord.
I'm also sure your proud of the US military's great training and fitness standards , which i can proudly say i passed the USMC fitness test when i was 14.....yeah im really jelous of one of the most least trained country's in the world!



[edit on 2-1-2005 by devilwasp]

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
Europe had better make policy changes if they want to improve those nations living standars.

Umm our liveing standards are fine, only in the cities do i ever see anything really bad and thats the odd couple of cases. Nothing like the american city cases.

Umm our liveing standards are fine, only in the cities do i ever see anything really bad and thats the odd couple of cases. Nothing like the american city cases.

America is the richest country on the planet. We have the highest GDP per capita.

I wasn't talking about all of Europe, anyway, I was talking about the Eastern European countries that have been joining.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
America is the richest country on the planet. We have the highest GDP per capita.

Yeah but your liveing standards as a whole suck.

I wasn't talking about all of Europe, anyway, I was talking about the Eastern European countries that have been joining.

Eastern european countries are like russia suffering from an economic colapse.

Yeah but your liveing standards as a whole suck.

No, they do not. Even our poor don't have it so bad.

Pretty much every state has a higher GDP then Germany, the most powerful economy in Europe.

Eastern european countries are like russia suffering from an economic colapse.

They weren't doing so good with communism, or before it.

Aahh but you fail to understand that except for the Kurds the socail state Iraq was in before US niterference was very good. It was the only secular nation in the Middle East. The Standard of living was quite high. The thirty years of oppression was for those who opposed the rule of Saddam. Those who didn't complain were not bothered by him(except for the kurds). In a dictatorship thats understandable. And the Us support for dictatorships is world reknowned as shown by our good friend micheal moore in "Bowling for Columbine"

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer
No, they do not. Even our poor don't have it so bad.

Dude you guys have to pay for health care!

Pretty much every state has a higher GDP then Germany, the most powerful economy in Europe.

Yeah and how many industries are in america?
Hundereds, the reason britain stopped being the "workhouse of the world" as it was called was because america had such large reasources.
It was simply cheaper and easier.

They weren't doing so good with communism, or before it.

Is that what is being discussed?
NO what is being disscussed is the current state of affairs if you want to disscuss this then create one in BTS.

Originally posted by Disturbed Deliverer

Umm our liveing standards are fine, only in the cities do i ever see anything really bad and thats the odd couple of cases. Nothing like the american city cases.

America is the richest country on the planet. We have the highest GDP per capita.

I wasn't talking about all of Europe, anyway, I was talking about the Eastern European countries that have been joining.

Switzerland $43,479.93
Japan $42,736.09
Denmark $36,656.21
Norway $36,206.64
Singapore $31,600.89
Germany $30,493.78
Austria $29,485.56
United States $29,142.63
Belgium $28,002.34
France $27,228.94
Netherlands $27,179.38
Sweden $26,941.52
Finland $26,894.44
Hong Kong $23,955.67
Australia $20,380.37
Ireland $20,304.91
Canada $20,121.92
United Kingdom $19,893.68
Italy $19,378.54
Israel $16,754.10

Lucretius, I'm not sure where you got that list, but its off:

America - $37,800 - www.cia.gov...
Germany - $27,600 - www.cia.gov...
Japan - $28,200 - www.cia.gov...
Switzerland - $32,700 - www.cia.gov...

You know, I don't think I have to look up the rest.

Dude you guys have to pay for health care!

You have far higher taxes.

This is capitalism, and it works. Europeans need to learn that, or the EU will never pass America.

Yeah and how many industries are in america?
Hundereds, the reason britain stopped being the "workhouse of the world" as it was called was because america had such large reasources.
It was simply cheaper and easier.

America keeps growing while companies move out of America.

Is that what is being discussed?
NO what is being disscussed is the current state of affairs if you want to disscuss this then create one in BTS.

The current state isn't much worse then the state before hand. To say that they're economic problems are just that they're making a switch would be false.

depends who's figures you believe.

I posted real GDP... which is a closer reflection on actual per head production as opposed to corporate.

You must have your head screwed on wrong if you think the EU is a socialist nanny state.

war between vietnam and China
please check where is Hanoi.
www.onwar.com...

The Japanese never had any intention of attacking the Soviets, and they made that perfectly clear. They had no reason to, unlike attacking America. They didn't even want to actual fight America.
And I never asked what role China played in WW2, so you had no questions to answer.

Did you realize the whole board start joking about you when you pretend to know anything about WWII? The more you say, the more we know how much IQ you really have. And you claim youself live in New York? Hey, anybody here live in New York? This guy is not only brain washed, but also start doing funny bully talk about himself.

They, like Russia, have always relied on overwhelming numbers and geography to keep them safe.

nobody in this board think so, poor boy. you really need to see a doctor.

I'm from New York, and I get most of my news from the BBC.

please, donot tarnish the name of New York and BBC. Our new yorker and European friends in this website will feel humiliated when you claim so.

Proteinx why do you take so much to personalising your retorts...

disproving the stuff you disagree with would suffice..really im sure you could do that... You need to channel all that uncontrolled anger!!..relax..

Originally posted by Daedalus3
Proteinx why do you take so much to personalising your retorts...

disproving the stuff you disagree with would suffice..really im sure you could do that... You need to channel all that uncontrolled anger!!..relax..

No, making "disturbed" disturbed is better.

The real views will be demonstrated when people get "anger"