I Think the Rapture has happened

reply to post by Kratos1220


This is my point, also only sinners will be left bickering amongst themselves unaware of the start of the doom, by the end of the tribulation all we be clear but it takes seven years for the veil to fall, i'm saying we're in the middle of those seven years.

Though we may be sure that this "change" of the last living members of the body of Christ will not take place until the work committed to them in the flesh is accomplished, we are told that before long our work will be cut short-graduallly at first, and then completely and finally when "the night cometh when no man can work."

How long the Lord may be pleased to let his saints stand in idleness, we do not know, but probably only long enough to let faith and patience have their perfect work. This test of patience will be the final trial of the Church.

Then "God will help her, at the dawning of [her] morning" (Ps. 46:5, Lesser's translation). The dawning of her morning in which she is to be changed to the nature and likeness of her Lord. HER morning is to precede the Millenial morning.

The lives of Elijah and John the Baptist-the beheading of the one, and the whirlwind and fiery chariot that bore away the other-probably indicate violence to the last members of the body of Christ.

The church's consecration is unto death and her privilege is to prove her faithfulness. "The disciple is not above his master, not the servant above his lord. It is enough for the disciple that he be AS his master, and the servant AS his lord."

It will probably be in an effort at self-preservation on the part of "Great Babylon," "Christendom," when she sees her power in politics, priestcraft and superstition waning, that the work of truth-spreading will be stopped as detrimental to her system. And probably at this juncture the Elijah class, persisting in declaring the truth to the last, will suffer violence, pass into glory and escape from the severest features of the great time of trouble coming.

Although the exact time of the deliveranace or "change" of the last members of the body of Christ is not stated, the approximate time is clearly manifest, as 'shortly after the door is shut'; after the truth, which Babylon now begins to regard as her enemy shall have become more generally known and widely circulated.

Paul declares, "We must all be changed (the living no less than the dead saints); this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality; for FLESH AND BLOOD cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, neither does corruption inherit incorruption."

And this "change" from mortality to immortality will not be accomplished by gradual development, but it will be instantaneous, "in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye," under the sounding of the "last trump."

The living who are left over to the presence of the Lord, will by no means precede those who fell asleep (died). Those who sleep in Christ are not required to wait in sleep for the living members to finish their course, but are resurrected at once, as one of the first acts of the Lord when he takes his great power.

To be among those who remain is no dishonor. To be the very last one of those to be 'changed' will be no discredit. Several scriptures show that there is a special work for the last members of the body to do from this side of the veil, as important and as fully a part of Kingdom work as that of the glorified members on the other side the veil.

These with their message are clearly pointed out by the prophet Isaiah (52:7) as the "feet" or last members of the body of Christ in the flesh, when he says: "How beautiful upon the mountains [kingdoms] are the feet of him that brings good tidings of good, that publishes salvation; that says unto Zion, 'Thy God REIGNS'" . (current tense)

One by one the "feet" class will pass from the present condition, in which, though often weary and wounded, they are always rejoicing, to the other side of the veil;-changed in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye.

Those who will be "caught away" from earthly conditions to be united "together with the Lord in the air"-in the spiritual rulership of the world. The "air" here mentioned pictures spiritual rule or power. Satan has long occupied the position of prince of the power of the air (Eph 2:2).

In due time the present prince of the air shall be bound, and shall deceive no more; and the present heavens, the great Antichrist SYSTEM, will "pass away with a great noise," while the new prince of the air, the true spiritual ruler, Christ, will take the dominion and establish the "new heavens," uniting with himself in this power or "air" his bride, the "overcomers" of the Gospel age.

Must all die? Yes; they all consecrated themselves "even unto death". Ps. 82:6 says, "I have said, Ye are gods [might ones]! All of you SONS OF THE HIGHEST [YHWH]! Yet ye shall ALL DIE LIKE MEN [literally: a man], and fall like one of the princes."

All the bride of Christ, justified by faith are reckoned as free from the sins of Adam and also from the death penalty attached to that sin, in order that they may share with Christ as co-sacrificers. It is as such co-sacrificers with Christ that the death of the saints is esteemed by God.

"Behold I show you a mystery: "we shall not all sleep." To die is one thing, to "sleep", remain unconscious, dead, is quite another. Our Lord died and then slept until the third day when the Father raised him up. Paul and the other apostles died and thus "fell asleep," to rest from labor and weariness, to "sleep in Yeshua" and to wait for the promised resurrection and a share in the Kingdom at the Lord's second advent. "The dead in Christ shall rise first".

Since the time that Christ has taken his great power and began to exercise his authority, none of his members need to sleep. So, with all of the "feet" who die since that date, the moment of death is the moment of change. They die as men and like men, but in the same instant they are made like their Lord, glorious spirit beings. They are caught away from earthly conditions to be forever with the Lord, "in the air," in Kingdom power and glory.

Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord FROM HENCEFORTH; yea, saith the spirit, that they may rest from their labors, but their works follow with them. (Rev. 14:13) "The dead who die" is not a mistaken expression. They are reckoned of God as being alread dead, and they are exhorted so also to reckon themselves.

Each member of the body of Christ must finish his sacrifice in actual death.

Ibid 230-241

The prize of our high calling is not to get out of jail free or be whisked away to the throne of the Almighty but to be obedient "unto death" that we may be glorified as our Lord was glorified. Christ was given a crown and a throne (rulership), and eternal life (which before only the Father possessed). Prize indeed!

Christianity's poor version of reward with streets of gold, free bubble-up and rainbow stew is just ridiculous and, frankly, insulting to the Almighty.
The Father knows how to give good gifts to His sons. We need to be worthy to be called sons and not just servants. Servants are rewarded too (if faithful, chastised if not).

So, like Paul, let us press on to the prize of the high calling.

reply to post by pureevil81

hell I dont even agree with what I thought last year.

A sure sign that one is growing spiritually if our ideas change and grow from year to year. We don't want to be stagnant!

reply to post by justamomma

I know w/out a doubt we are looking at the numbers given by Daniel wrong... I just can't see how. Maybe He will show one of you.

I assume you are talking about the 70 weeks of years prophesy?

Christians have their take on it just as my former religion did. That time frame did culminate in Jesus, but to what significance, is the question.

Perhaps our adjustment needs to alter regarding Jesus? How about this:

Jesus fulfilled many points. One HUGE one would be this; his name would be used to define, and name a religious community, for about 2000 years. So his presence would take on a very calculated, yet mysterious meaning.

Remember the Mystery Novel - the Bible? How would this time line pointing to Jesus, be an important one? Perhaps not the Messiah that Christianity taught, but one that would be used to separate the masses, and create tremendous upheaval? So would not his predestined existence be an important one? Could he, being born, and dying, fit a pivotal role in a calculated Game?

I know that you have a difficult time accepting Jesus as a Messiah. Well, this could be accurate! BUT...he did serve a very important role, regardless. Just not one promulgated by Christianity.

reply to post by evilod

Exactly. And I don't mean this to be offensive, but I've always felt like the strict church-going, interpret-as-your-told folks seem to be looking one way, while not seeing what's going on behind them (in regards to looking for a concrete event or such to fulfill scripture).

Yes, and I believe that this was part of the plan. It would take real foresight to "see" and express things that no one else sees. It really means going against the tide. This is what makes the Bible so cunningly written, IMO! Just like a mystery novel.

reply to post by amatrine

The bible also states that in the end time, it would be hard to find even one who follows his ways to the end . I can not remember which book.

"Go in through the narrow gate; because broad and spacious is the road leading off into destruction, and many are the ones going in through it; whereas narrow is the gate and cramped the road leading off into life, and few are the ones finding it." Matt. 7

This scripture always perplexed me, as religion, including my former one, was filled with walkers!! No few pedestrians there!

reply to post by justamomma

Where is the 144 thousand talked about.. is that a NT thing?

Revelation 14


reply to post by badmedia

Christians actively working to bring about the anti-Christ. Is that yet another sign that Christianity is the anti-Christ religion?

Good point, a self fulfilled prophesy?

Originally posted by gotrox
But, for the true believer, "no may know the hour, and all should be prepared constantly" as some of the more mellow proponents argue, and any who attempt to put a date on the second coming are false prophets.

Funny thing about this though. Many people just blatantly dismiss anyone because of this. Of course, not all will be false prophets, and the ones who aren't false will be dismissed in this line of thinking and rejected as false prophets, when of course these won't be false because they will actually be right.

It is easy to miss the forest for the trees if one is not awake! It is a good excuse to wear blinders! Whose to say whether God uses individuals today or not? Why on earth would he stop?

I tell my friends I'm not a christian, I actually follow Jesus.

You and me both!

reply to post by NatureBoy

This is my point, also only sinners will be left bickering amongst themselves unaware of the start of the doom, by the end of the tribulation all we be clear but it takes seven years for the veil to fall, i'm saying we're in the middle of those seven years.

No, this is all man's invention. The Great Tribulation has been going on for more than 1.5 centuries! You will see that I am right. Open your eyes and you will see that it has been here all along and that the thief came and went while you were asleep.

More and more points to this being the tribulation,

check this thread out,

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Birds sining all night, i'm sure i remember something like that happening at the end times, the world goes crazy and the natural order is turned on its head, birds sing at night and dogs playing poker or something.

reply to post by MatrixProphet


Yeah but the bible also says the world will be full of false prophets and lieing churches and things, you sir, no insult meant, sound like the exact biblical definition of a false prophet and i fear you have been lead astray by whoever leads people astray in the end times, one of Satans minions no doubt.

The bible warns against this sort of thing,

Deuteronomy 29:19
'If anyone should think to himself, "I will do well enough if I follow the dictates of my heart, Yahweh will not pardon him. His wrath shall burn against him.'

Bible in Lego

Here's a link to this bible verse told in lego.

Deuteronomy 13:1
'If a prophet arises among you offering some sign or wonder and if he then tells you to follow other gods and worship them Do not listen to that prophet's words. Yahweh your God is testing you to find out if you love him with all your heart and soul.'

www.thebricktestament.com...
We were never supposed to understand,

This from Mark and Luke,
When he was alone, those around him and the Twelve asked him about the parables. He said, 'The secret of the kingdom of God is granted to you But to those on the outside, everything comes in parables so that they may look and look but never perceive, listen and listen but never understand. Otherwise they might change their ways and be forgiven.

We were never supposed to understand what was going on, we're just disposable sinners and out use by data has run out. -the tribulation is upon us, all good men allready gone. Enjoy what sin you can before that eternal sleep we've always been destined for arrives.

[edit on 28-1-2009 by NatureBoy]

Such a dangerous topic. All the prophecy Ive been exposed to(biblical and not) has no real concept of time. Just as a higher power has no concept of time. All of the prohecies can be fufilled at the time of thier inception as well as at any given point in the future. Its like a sport. It has rules. Penalties for breaking the rules and rewards for following them, and all sorts of contingencies along the way. No matter when the game is played, there is a winner and a loser and gameplay throughout. The rules make it to where the players cant really go outside the box. They can excel within the parameters of the game, but the game itself can not be dissolved as long as the players are willing participants. I dont like sports for this reason...If I use my mind and bring a ball bat onto the basketball court I cant play anymore...and will probably be locked away for the attempt. Thats what I feel ALL of the interpretations and man made doctrine are designed to do...take away my spiritual ball bat. The truth is written on all of our hearts at birth...and all the analyzation and scriptural debate does is give people justification to bend th rules to suit thier needs. All dilusions that keep us preoccupied with everything but acknowledging the simple truth that we all posess. Bottom line. Mankind will do, say, create, divert, lie and just plain live any way but the right one because we are selfish, corrupt, undisciplinned children.

So lets just assume there is not going to be a rapture ..
If that is so ...then why are new age masters etc preparing to give an explanation for what has happened to christians ?Even the Illumminati are prepping for a plan to explain why some have disappeared .
(Project Bluebeam comes to mind along with the article below)
www.bibliotecapleyades.net...


This is just a snip from an article about the GAME that came out in 1995 called Illuminati (way before 911 and the pentagon attacks and the anthrax attacks and the London bombings etc ..It is all there in the cards way before it happened ...I would just like to know WHY if there is not going to be a rapture why then would the Illumanti and new age channelors be prepping for an explanation for it >?)

Rapture" -- Even though I was surprised at the detail of the other cards, the inclusion of this Rapture card shocked me greatly. The Rapture is something the Born Again Christians are aching for, not the Illuminati; but, then, I remembered an article I posted nearly five years ago, entitled, "The Rapture of the Church May Be Close, and Both Sides Are Waiting For It". In this article, I made the following very pertinent points:

+ Christians are mightily looking forward to the Rapture, based upon Revelation 3:10; I Thessalonians 4:13-5:4; I Corinthians 15:13-58; and others

* Occultists are also looking forward to the Rapture, having been alerted by their Guiding Spirits that such an event would occur! Beginning in 1987, 'Guiding Spirits' of key New World Order leaders began to inform these human leaders to start preparing their adherents for a spectacular global event, that would occur just after The New Age Christ [Antichrist] will make his appearance. What was this spectacular event to be? As these 'Guiding Spirits' explained, when The Christ appears, there will be many people throughout the world that could never accept his views or his teachings. These people would prove to be a great obstacle in the way the New Age Christ wanted to move the peoples of the world.

Therefore, the 'Masters of the Logos' had decided, these 'Guiding Spirits' said, to suddenly snap these people into another dimension, soon after The Christ arose. These recalcitrant people would be retrained in spirit, so that, when they reenter the 'Reincarnation Cycle', they will be fully persuaded as to the merits of the New World Order. Of course, when these people get back to earth in reincarnated bodies, the New World Order will have been in full swing for several hundred years, and everyone will know then how wonderful the system of The Christ is!

On August 18, 1991, I was sneaked into a major seminar of the Boston House of Theosophy and heard with my own ears a very logical explanation as to why so many people were going to be suddenly snatched out of this dimension [Read NEWS1052].

The fact that the Rapture card is depicted in this deck of playing cards for this game, and arranged last in order by White Magic practitioner, David Icke, speaks volumes about the fact that, in 1995, Steve Jackson knew the entire plan of the Illuminati. They know that, after Antichrist arises, tens of millions of people worldwide are going to be taken in the Rapture; the Illuminati has already spun the lie that will explain this event to their followers.

www.cephas-library.com...

[edit on 28-1-2009 by Simplynoone]

reply to post by NatureBoy

Yeah but the bible also says the world will be full of false prophets and lieing churches and things, you sir, no insult meant, sound like the exact biblical definition of a false prophet and i fear you have been lead astray by whoever leads people astray in the end times, one of Satans minions no doubt.

Or...I could be right! You are assuming a lot with God. This is, and has been, the end of times for a very long time. History is my witness. You must understand the thief in the night. If you all are correct, then the prophesy of the thief is wrong, and Jesus did not speak those words!!

But hey, take what you want and leave the rest!

The Bible does speak of tribulation, but I'm not sure what the deal is with the rapture. That idea wasn't around until 100 years or so ago.

If the rapture has taken place I know of several people that should be gone, but they are still here.

If there is going to be a rapture I would love to be taken out before things got bad (or worse and worse and worse).

If there is going to be a rapture I don't think it will happen to either the middle of the 7 years or until the end of that time.

If the tribulation has started now then halfway through will be in 2012 and then that could be the rapture.

Originally posted by NatureBoy

The bible warns against this sort of thing,

Deuteronomy 29:19
'If anyone should think to himself, "I will do well enough if I follow the dictates of my heart, Yahweh will not pardon him. His wrath shall burn against him.'

This is an excellent verse. I often use a similar one: "Every man is right in his own eyes."

This from Mark and Luke,
When he was alone, those around him and the Twelve asked him about the parables. He said, 'The secret of the kingdom of God is granted to you But to those on the outside, everything comes in parables so that they may look and look but never perceive, listen and listen but never understand. Otherwise they might change their ways and be forgiven.

We were never supposed to understand what was going on, we're just disposable sinners and out use by data has run out. -the tribulation is upon us, all good men already gone. Enjoy what sin you can before that eternal sleep we've always been destined for arrives.

Just as adults will sometimes spell out words in conversations around children that may be heavy for their young ears, Christ often spoke in parables in the crowds.

And then, as now, the written word doesn't always reflect the same meaning as it would if you heard the same conversation spoken. To the above Mark/Luke verse, imagine the last line with the word, "Duh!" at the end and a rolly eye emoticon. You would understand it to be sarcasm that might translate something like, "I'm giving you guys the scoop because those dolts won't pull their head out and act right."

It doesn't mean that the average Joe wasn't meant to understand or that he has been rejected of God so he might as well keep on sinning since there's no hope of redemption. The door is still open for salvation.

Make no mistake-EVERY knee WILL bow and EVERY tongue WILL confess that Yeshua the Annointed is our Mighty One. Would you rather do it as a servant or a son?

Originally posted by Simplynoone
So lets just assume there is not going to be a rapture ..
If that is so ...then why are new age masters etc preparing to give an explanation for what has happened to christians ?Even the Illumminati are prepping for a plan to explain why some have disappeared .

So what? Those people believe that there is a rapture. Belief in the rapture cult - invented in the mid 1800s by failed Anglican Priest Nelson Darby - does not mean that it will happen.

IT IS NOT SCRIPTURAL.

It's a shame that so many people spend their time obsessed over archaic supperstitons, drug induced hallucinations and stories not meant to be taken literally.

The universe is much more amazing then what we can understand. Much more then the simplistic view of a god.

If you need to believe in it to have a reason to be a good person, other then just being a good person then fine. But don't think christianity is any more valid then any other belief or that its writings will come true while other religions won't.

reply to post by drock905


Actually, I find the story of revelations to be one of great wisdom. It is the story which tells how control and power grows, and say that a day will come when this method of control reaches the entire world. You can see many of the same principles applied on the smaller scale, Hitler for example, the roman catholic church is another and now the US is seemingly lead the way these days.

There is really only 1 way such a world government could come about, and revelations pretty much lays the methods down.

Revelation was written by the students of a very old man who lived in very stressful conditions and who was a religious zealot. It's most likely that he was having a dementia driven hallucination and naturally, due to his religious ferver, the hallucination took on religious tones.

reply to post by MatrixProphet


Fine words spoken by you, alas as i say in my post -the bible warns against people like you, people who think they can find special meanings and clever answers hidden in the text when only Gods word is law, why should i follow your false prophecy when the literal truth of the matter is right their in black and white?

reply to post by FlyersFan


No these people do not believe in a rapture ..The Illuminati do not believe in it ..Steve Jackson (who made those cards ) do not believe in it ....
And
New Agers say christians are going to be whisked away by the ascended masters to be reprogrammed ..
So why do they have a plan like this to explain what happened to Christians ?

Originally posted by NatureBoy

Fine words spoken by you, alas as i say in my post -the bible warns against people like you, people who think they can find special meanings and clever answers hidden in the text when only Gods word is law, why should i follow your false prophecy when the literal truth of the matter is right their in black and white?

Nothing is in black and white, are you would be foolish to say so. People who see in black and white are hypocrites. They see themselves as white, and anything against that as black. They have no real understanding of anything, and are merely a bunch of blind repeaters. Anyone can repeat 1+1=2, but the man with wisdom understands how to add.

Even from your own example we can see the hypocrisy. Are you not filling the role of what a prophet would do by saying the Rapture has happened? Of course, you will not see it this way.

Given that anyone who posts their opinion can be accused of being a false prophet, then how about we stop calling people false prophets as a means to ignore what they said, and actually address any points that are made. Are they a false prophet? I dunno, but I know the only way to tell is by looking at what they say, not just blindly dismissing anyone with an opinion that isn't in agreement with yours as such.

Personally, I'm not foolish enough to take any man for their words alone. I look for understanding on if I agree with someone or not.

Sorry, but I don't stand for such low levels of thinking.

Originally posted by Simplynoone
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

No these people do not believe in a rapture ..The Illuminati do not believe in it ..Steve Jackson (who made those cards ) do not believe in it ....
And
New Agers say christians are going to be whisked away by the ascended masters to be reprogrammed ..
So why do they have a plan like this to explain what happened to Christians ?

Perhaps the entire thing is just a show to keep Christians looking outward? I keep hearing all these anti-Christ posts and such, and I'm pretty sure it's all nothing more than a distraction. A distraction that keeps you look externally, rather than internally. A way of getting people to think they are right? I always hear of these things, but do we ever actually see any of them really go anywhere? They always end up being some minor cult that goes nowhere, but boy they will sure gain alot of spotlight as "being the anti-christ".

All the while it is the systems used to give such things power in the first place that people should be worried about.

Well Badmedia you can keep looking in at yourself all you want to .... .....if that is where your heart is (on yourself) then you just keep on looking in .......that does not mean we are all that self absorbed .

When the bible said to watch ..I dont believe it meant to watch in the mirror ..

[edit on 29-1-2009 by Simplynoone]