Paul ~ Inventing a new saviour

reply to post by Simplynoone

Originally posted by Simplynoone
Cleareyes on page 65 I gave my opinion with scriptures as to why I believe there was a sacrifice ..and why Jesus had to die (shed blood ) to accomplish what he did ..if your interested ...maybe you could add something to it to help us all understand it better ..
I believe what happened with Abraham was just a foreshadow (showing Abraham) what he was going to do with Jesus in the future (Giving his only son )

When God told Abraham to sacrifice his son, He said your only son whom you love. Abraham actually had two sons, but Isaac was the promised son. This is also the first place in the Bible where we find the word love. This story dovetails with John 3:16 very well. I also believe that Abraham believed that God would resurrect Isaac after the sacrifice and from the moment that God told him to sacrifice Isaac, Isaac was dead to Abraham. Three days later on the mount (actually Golgotha) he prepared to sacrifice his son but was stopped.

Another interesting correlation is that Isaac is not mentioned again until he meets his bride. With Abraham and Isaac, I believe we see the Father and the Son. Then Abraham sends his servant Eleazar to find a Bride for the Son. Eleazer means comforter.

Just my interpretation.

reply to post by darkelf


So then who was the Son of man? If Jesus was the Son of G.d (as in the only begotten), who was the Son of man?

Were you all even aware that the promised messiah was to be of the lineage of David and not by the mothers line, but by the line of the father?

Did you know that the only begotten Son is said to have a mother who was a Hittite and a father who was a Amorite? Did you know also that the promised messiah that is prophesied in Isaiah is said to be born of the two afore mentioned nations?

Come on! Jesus was the lie... the man was the lie. The truth is greater than you will even G.d credit for and He (G.d) does NOT break any laws!

He IS picking the snake (the deception) back up by the tail and turning it BACK into the staff (the law) to show the world that He alone is the ONLY true G.d... the G.d of Israel! Do you really want to be on the other side of that to realize the truth? It is all there written before you so that you will have no excuse to have fallen for the lie. It is the truth.


[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by darkelf


Strange.. a man is not a lamb.. actually, the strange thing is believing that a lamb does = a man.

reply to post by justamomma


Its there for you as well to read.

Mary was the wife of Joseph and the mother of Jesus Christ, who was conceived within her by the Holy Spirit when she was a virgin. She is often called the “Virgin Mary,” though never in Scripture are those two words put together as a proper name (Matt. 2:11; Matthew 1:23; Luke 1:27; Acts 1:14).

Little is known of her personal history. Her genealogy is given in Luke 3 (see below). She was of the tribe of Judah and the lineage of David (Psalm 132:11; Luke 1:32). She was connected by marriage with Elisabeth, who was of the lineage of Aaron (Luke 1:36).

Jesus was not the lie, if you deny Jesus than in essence you deny the creator.

This sounds like some kind of contradiction at first glance, but in fact there is no contradiction. An examination of Scripture reveals that the phrase "Son of Man" carries broad significance.

First of all, even if the phrase "Son of Man" is a reference to Jesus' humanity, it is not a denial of His deity. By becoming a man, Jesus did not cease being God. The incarnation of Christ did not involve the subtraction of deity, but the addition of humanity. Jesus clearly claimed to be God on many occasions (Matthew 16:16,17; John 8:58; 10:30). But in addition to being divine, He was also human (see Philippians 2:6-8). He had two natures (divine and human) conjoined in one person.

In essence Jesus was the son of man, but he was also the the Word. Jesus was born man (but was God in the flesh) and in being one with God he was the Word made flesh, the true son of God.

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by darkelf

 

So then who was the Son of man? If Jesus was the Son of G.d (as in the only begotten), who was the Son of man?

Were you all even aware that the promised messiah was to be of the lineage of David and not by the mothers line, but by the line of the father?

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

"son of man" is just a generic term like "human", or, "elf".
The son of man is a belief-machine that ultimately does not exist.
Salvation is for the Son of God, bound by belief in his belief-machines.
Half machine, half mind, the son of man is a schizophrenic phenomena.
Salvation is for separating the unreal machine from the real mind.
Jesus taught in parable and parody.
In parody, he was both the son of man and the Son of God.
He showed us how to lay down our "life" as son of man, our lie,
and take it up as the Son of God...our truth.

Christ!

reply to post by TheMythLives


Read these things yourself please before you bring them to the thread as though they were fact.

Luke 3
23And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

Not the line of Mary. It is clear.

Also I have stated over and over that the lineage in matthew is missing 4 names that are clearly noted in 2 Chronicles.

So, that is not too reliable, now is it?

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by darkelf

 

Strange.. a man is not a lamb.. actually, the strange thing is believing that a lamb does = a man.

The "son of man" [humans, elves, dark elves] is confused.
A lamb is a metaphor for the Truth.
The Truth does not attack.
The Truth does not defend itself.
The Truth was led to slaughter..."before the foundation of the world".
As the world arises to take the place of Truth, it posts a notice on the outside of a closed, darkened mind: Truth Keep Out.
So, like a lamb, the Truth stands at the door and knocks.
Truth does not break down the door.
Jesus is a metaphor for the Truth.
So,
Jesus is called, "The lamb of GoD".
This is not a sacrificial lamb.
Manhood is a sacrifice.
It is a sacrifice of the Son of God to be a "son of man".
"Son of man" is a choice.
"Son of man" is chosen by what deny's *Our Father*.
"Son of man" is defiant against his own Truth.
"Son of man" is a mask over the face of Truth.
The Truth is the Son of God
The Son of God appears when the masks are taken off.

Christ!

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by TheMythLives

 

Read these things yourself please before you bring them to the thread as though they were fact.

Luke 3
23And Jesus himself began to be about thirty years of age, being (as was supposed) the son of Joseph, which was the son of Heli,

Not the line of Mary. It is clear.

You make a good point.
Matthew was so dead set on shoehorning Jesus into Jewish mythology, he seems not to have read the part where Jesus says, "Call no man father". This is really an excellent example of how the pop gospel scribes were not free of an agenda of their own. Their agenda has been to tie Jesus up with the Tanakh, when in fact, there is really no correlation. Only to the extent that the Tanakh may point to a universal Truth does Jesus apply as a parody of that Truth. But I am not aware of any such Truth in the Tanakh. Mostly it is about regional, natialistic matters. The Messiah concept is very nationalistic and earth oriented. This does not apply to what Jesus represented. Yet, there is this agenda to force-fit his message into a narrow nationalistic wish for a fool proof defense system. Jesus did indeed teach invulnerability, but not at all in the way anyone expected or could foresee. Defenslessness as a defense? Who ever heard of that?

Christ!



[edit on 22-1-2009 by Christ!]

reply to post by TheMythLives


So, what about Ezekiel? He too was called the Son of man. Was he Jesus? Jesus was *not* the Word. The Word spoke through the prophets. Jesus was a prophet (if He even existed.. which is neither there nor here if one truly understands the Scriptures).

Originally posted by Christ!
You make a good point.
Matthew was so dead set on shoehorning Jesus into Jewish mythology, he seems not to have read the part where Jesus says, "Call no man father". This is really an excellent example of how the pop gospel scribes were not free of an agenda of their own.

*claps* exactly. The whole of the NT took the staff (the law) and turned it into a snake (deception). This was a common illusion of the magicians in the courts of Pharoah in Egypt (which is an allegorical of what most of you are buying into now.. the illusion)... hence... G.d said to Moses (allegorically), pick up the snake by the tail and what happens.. it turns back into the staff. This is happening before you and you fail to see it though it is all there in front of you all.

He is allowing it to be pointed out to you via the holes I am pointing out and all the laws that were broken in their version.. and yet you all continue to say "G.d breaks Laws."



[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

Originally posted by justamomma
reply to post by TheMythLives

 

So, what about Ezekiel? He too was called the Son of man. Was he Jesus? Jesus was *not* the Word. The Word spoke through the prophets. Jesus was a prophet (if He even existed.. which is neither there nor here if one truly understands the Scriptures).

The term son of man is generic. It can apply to anyone who is experiencing the experience of personhood. It is the experience of what is not true. A prophet is merely one who speaks the truth. Truth is available to any who would open the door of a closed mind and desire to be liberated by what is true. Unfortunately, the son of man attempts to liberate himself by molesting the truth, and forcing it to fit his expectations of how things ought to be. The truth cannot be used for fantasy fulfillment. So, the Jewish Messiah concept can never be anything other than a fantasy. As an extention of the Jewish Messiah concept, the world of Christianity is also fantasizing about a fantastic world that fits their own wishes and expectations.

Christ!

reply to post by Christ!



Believe what you want.. and I say to others. Believe what you want. I know the truth and I know because I asked; I questioned; I did not settle; I searched and I searched and I searched; I did not buy into the illusion because it did not feel right; I cried and I searched some more. I was laughed at, scolded, rebuked, rejected, and called a sinner... and yet I could not stop until I knew.

there was not a magic sinners prayers.. and there was not a man standing with his hand held out to me.... There was... the Truth. Right there.. all along, in front of me.. undeniably there.

Originally posted by justamomma

Originally posted by Christ!
You make a good point.
Matthew was so dead set on shoehorning Jesus into Jewish mythology, he seems not to have read the part where Jesus says, "Call no man father". This is really an excellent example of how the pop gospel scribes were not free of an agenda of their own.

*claps* exactly. The whole of the NT took the staff (the law) and turned it into a snake (deception). This was a common illusion of the magicians in the courts of Pharoah in Egypt (which is an allegory of what most of you are buying into now.. the illusion)... hence... G.d said to Moses (allegory), pick up the snake by the tail and what happens.. it turns back into the staff. This is happening before you and you fail to see it though it is all there in front of you all.

He is allowing it to be pointed out to you the holes and all the laws that were broken in their version.. and yet you all continue to say "G.d breaks Laws."

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

If you were willing to understand the "Law" to be the Law of One, you may actually be onto something. However, it must first be understood that there is another "law" which parades as the truth. And that is the "law of separation". The whole world is built on this "law". So, the whole world is not true. Merely look around and see. Everything is separated from everything else. Everything is different from everything else. This is the "law" of the world. This is the great deception. The "Law of One" supercedes this so-called "law".

Which law are you talking about?
Which do you believe in?
Which law do you say is "the truth"?

Christ!



[edit on 22-1-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by justamomma
There was... the Truth. Right there.. all along, in front of me.. undeniably there.

In your own words, describe the Truth.

Christ!

Originally posted by justamomma
He is allowing it to be pointed out to you the holes and all the laws that were broken in their version.. and yet you all continue to say "G.d breaks Laws."

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

I've never said GoD breaks laws.
I've never said anyone has broken a law.
I'm saying that the world is the concept that the Law of One can be broken and replaced with the law of separation.
The law of separation is the law of the "Old Testament", properly understood.
The Law of One is the law of the New Testament, properly understood.

Christianity, as it parades as the 'new', is actually still under the 'old' law of separation...believing in it more than the Law of One.

Christ!

[edit on 22-1-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by justamomma
He is allowing it to be pointed out to you the holes and all the laws that were broken in their version.. and yet you all continue to say "G.d breaks Laws."

[edit on 22-1-2009 by justamomma]

You continue to say that man breaks laws.
This is not true either.
Whether its the Law of One or the law of separation, none have ever broken the law.
What can be broken was a set-up...something intended to frame the "lawbreaker" as guilty.
The law of separation intends to do just this.
And yet, the law of seperation has never broken the Law of One.
Think of the law of separation as a subset, or, twisted form of the Law of One.
It's possible to fulfill the law of separation and the Law of One.
Everyone has.
So, Christ has.
The Law of One states that one must be given as asked.
The law of separation is also an agreement to give as asked.
What is asked for under the law of separation is the experience of what is untrue.
The law of separation is called "liFe", lies for feelings.
The law of separation is a covert agreement between all parties to tell lies for feelings.
Feelings that are not felt under the Law of One are felt under the law of separation.
Feelings of sadness, pain, suffering, rejection, guilt, separation, betrayal.
All these feelings are by agreement.
They can only be felt as the agreement is kept secret...hidden.
They are asked for and given as asked.
The agreement is deeply hidden in the collective unconscious.
The agreement fulfills the Law of One by giving only as each has asked.
In this way, each recieves as asked, and experiences what is not true.
When secrets are not longer cherished, when the experiences have made them "weary", it is time to return to the Law of One only.
The Law of One is overt agreement to give as asked.
The Law of One agrees to give and ask only for what is the Truth.
In this way, the Truth is the only experience that is desired.
In this way, the New Testament supercedes the Old and replaces it with the Truth.

The Old Testament is the idea that the Law can be broken.
Many laws are made that everyone may break at least one law.
But a law that can be broken is not a law, it is a set-up to justify the feelings of guilt.
To insist that man breaks laws is to insist that the Old Testament is the Truth.
It's not.
You can break the spell of secret convenants any time.
There is no obligation to hold anyone guilty of anything.
You do not have to 'give' this way.

Christ!

[edit on 22-1-2009 by Christ!]

Originally posted by TheMythLives
Mislead Sheep? I personally doubt that she is mislead. Look at what she has provided excellent examples and the TRUTH of the word and the Truth by God. The true word of God was written by the OT, but his son, Jesus, brought the word of truth. Jesus spoke the word of his father,in essence he was the word made flesh.

Such is to say 1+1=2. While this is technically true, this is still to be deceived. Even the Pharisees could repeat 1+1=2(You tell it so well Jesus would say). But those with true understanding do not see it as simply 1+1=2. Instead, it is seen as A+B=C, and 1+1=2 is just a single expression of the truth.

Any fool can repeat 1+1=2. Anyone can memorize it. But to see A+B=C is to understand how to add. She may see 1+1=2, but she doesn't understand how to add. And what Jesus and the holy spirit will do is teach you how to add.

To see Jesus is truth is easy to memorize. Jesus is an expression of the truth. But if you are locked into the single expression, then you are decieved. This is the same thing as creating an idol.

You know where god says not to make idols after his likeness? At first it sounds like people are to be kept ignorant. Not the case. It's because if you create an idol in his likeness, then you are only looking at 1+1=2, and not the entirety of god, which is A+B=C.

1+1=2 is true(Jesus), but the father is much greater than that(A+B=C). See what I am getting at? I recognize Jesus because I can see he is a true expression of the father, 1+1=2 is a true expression of A+B=C. By keeping someone locked on 1+1=2 only, they are kept ignorant to the truth of A+B=C. And they fail to see the father which is in them, because they are kept to a single expression, of which they are not.

When you follow the path of Jesus, and when the father is expressed through you, then you will do what Jesus does. You are not physically Jesus, you don't turn water into wine and such. You are not 1+1=2. But you are maybe a 2, and you are maybe living in a 1. And by following Jesus, you can also be an expression of the father, you may express and show it as 1+2=3, but you are still a true expression of A+B=C.

To believe and follow for the works sake alone, is still to make a truthful expression, and the rest will come on it's own.


[edit on 22-1-2009 by badmedia]

Originally posted by justamomma
Also I have stated over and over that the lineage in matthew is missing 4 names that are clearly noted in 2 Chronicles.

So, that is not too reliable, now is it?

One pop gospel lists the apostles differently from another.
But hey! Who's counting.
The apostles symbolize everyone.
Everyone is not in perfect agreement as we shift from the Old Testament agreement to the New Testament agreement.
The Old Testament agreement thrives in a culture of ignorance.
In fact,
The world is an experience that only ignorance could possibly invoke.
As such,
Ignorance is intentional and must be established somehow, before there can be a "world".
Ignorance is the denial of total knowledge.
Total knowledge is Christ, so, the world begins with the denial of Christ.
Christ is Self, so the experience of what is not true begins with the denial of what is true.

Christ!

reply to post by Christ!


I do agree that what you say in general is true. But I think we disagree on the reasons and purpose behind it.

There is a reason we purposely take on limited knowledge.