New video of all three towers

reply to post by benoni


No, they dont show a massive explosion of any sort. They show a building collapsing due to strike damage and fire.

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by LucidDreamer85

 

No. The designers ASSUMED that they had built the towers to withstand a low-speed collision with an airplane, just as it was assumed that the Titanic was designed to be unsinkable. Human arrogance rears its ugly head once again.

reply to your post on page 2

well.. this i wrong. Titanic sank because the bolts used were some cheap ones instead of the ones meant to be used. i saw this i a documentary years ago.
besides, i've never heard that the towers were built to withstand a "low speed" collision? correct me if i'm wrong though, doubt it, as it would be strange if there is anything i don't know about this subject, really


something happened that day, we don't know for sure what, but one thing I'M sure of is, that it doesn't follow the official story 100 %. to quote heath ledger in TDK:

"not. one. bit".

even if it was controlled demo...

why does it have to be the govt or some secret agency that planted the explosives.....why can't it be the terrorist?.....

reply to post by makkerskilap


Does not change the fact that at the time the Titanic was considered as unsinkable by many and her designers had thought that the watertight bulkheads would ensure that the ship would stay afloat under all by the most drastic circumstances. And they were wrong.

Originally posted by yellowcard
How does it not make sense? The entire world hates us now, we went from a budget surplus to a 1 Trillion dollar deficit, our hands are tied in doing further military action, Israel has become more vulnerable as a result, and have faced a potential great depression 2.0...yes, Osama's plan made no sense at all

My respect for bin Laden has suddenly gone way up. He has to be the greatest military genius of all time. This is like clearing the table in billiards with one shot. Ordinary mortals regard that as impossible. What a guy! No wonder America is working so hard to catch him.



[edit on 2-1-2009 by ipsedixit]

Thanks for the post --more evidence that the Towers were brought down by a controlled demolition. Interesting video link on demolitions
www.youtube.com...

Wow, more proof that the government is way in over their heads.

Someone throw that guy a bone, he was DEFINITELY at the right spot at the right time. I don't think I've seen anything that clearly yet, and if that doesn't prove that it was an inside job, then I don't know what would,

And you do know that if had gotten out and was proven that it was controlled demolition, that they would had stilled pointed fingers at the terrorists?

I can hear it now, "They had one side man to accomplish the job on ground while the other two attacks were in the air, it was a very well plotted scheme that could had taken ages did they not have the man power. It is an extreme need to get to the money source of these terrorists..." Blah blah blah, but there is no way, that if the backers behind this inside job thought they'd get blamed, that they wouldn't frame the other terrorists in some way or come out and claim it was their controlled demolition.

Hell! I don't know what to believe anymore, about anything that has ever happened in this country.

Happy New Years!
*Keep Fighting
Cm

Originally posted by ipsedixit
reply to post by wylekat

 

I think you make a very good point.

Many people observing the scene in the US, expecially over the last eight years (the Bush administration's time in office) are very disturbed by what has been going on, both overseas and within the US itself. Numerous books and movies both on and off the internet have explored these concerns.

If the concerns are valid, concerns of the sort expressed in Jim Marrs's book The Rise of the Fourth Reich, i.e., concerns about the infestation and proliferation of fascist ideas and methods in America, then one day it will be too late to make it right.

The kinds of changes creeping up on America are too pervasive to ignore. People will no longer be able to say, "Well, I'm not political. I don't have to bother with this stuff."

The lesson of history is that you always have to bother with this stuff. The only choice you have is to deal with it when it is a relatively small problem, or to deal with it when it is a monumental problem that is costing millions of people their lives and getting your butt drafted into the army.

So right. Nip it in the bud. A stitch in time saves nine. Problem is people are selfish and indifferent. The establishment of a fascist regime can be achieved little by little over generations. I do not arrogate to myself knowledge of exactly how it will be done, but I have seen evidence that we might just be headed in that direction in this country. Once they obtain to the power over you and your rights they want, they will not willingly give it up. History shows us power is overreaching, and always searching for new avenues where it can extend itself, often under the guise of some pretext or another, for example, solving some problem in society. The fact that problems sometimes get worse after power has had its way for some reason seems to be lost on some folks. There are books on the subject. Political and other powers are dangers. Their management has been a central problem of civilization for as long as we know.

[edit on 3-1-2009 by Jailhouserock]

Originally posted by RFBurns
Thats high quality? I beg to differ. And why does the video, just before the south tower begins to collapse, edit from a zoom in looking at a puff of smoke comming out of the side of the south tower, and then suddenly we see debris already falling almost half way down, then the camera zooms out?

The north tower part, extremely pixilated and doesnt even show the begining of the collapse.

The footage I got on the day all this happend, raw footage I should also add, recorded on a DVD from the ABC live news feed right off the network affiliate sattelite, is FAR better than this stuff.


Cheers!!!!

No doubt. I was cracking up reading some of these posts after I watched the video. Each transition at point of explosion is so choppy and non-linear feeling. The effects you mentioned were also pretty blatantly obvious as well.

reply to post by HunkaHunka


I hear you out. But just want to add that even though they arent shot in the best way possible they nonetheless are new videos... right? If they are not then yeah my post was pointless maybe useless, but I would like to think its not and that I added something to the discussion. I am not taking your post defensively just kinda want to reiterate that my main goal here is to facilitate discussion with new found evidence.

Happy new year brother.

Do not underestimate the resources, and the time the and $$$ the US government has to plan things such as 9/11.

Months Swampfoxx says Months. You do underestimate what the U.S shadow gov, can rig up in a few months.I know you of all people didn't believe that but threw it out there hoping some people would say yea, he's right how could a few demo guys, with butt cracks shown and hard hats do this in a month. Well they did, our Shadow Government with weapons and tech that would make your head spin did.

I' mean They've been planning this since their failed false flag on the towers in the early 90's. Well maybe that was a true terrorist attack, but when they saw the public outcry for Middle Eastern, Terrorist blood, they knew they had something there,

Also we are not talking about convention stuff, i.e. thermite/cutter charges ect, were talking about stuff so far advance it would make your headspin, like a stealth bomber in the 60's.

But you know ALL about that Swampfoxx, *wink*.

Pretext for War.

Save billions of dollars of clearing the asbestos from 1 and 2, and turn that into a muli- million dollar profit, pretty good.

Get all the U.S. Citizens, well mostof them anyways to back a war.

Partriot act, takeing away many of our constitutional freedoms.

Now on the verge of a new Potus, GW , scrambles to pass a bil that he can not be charged for war crimes, foreign or Domestic.

I mean c'mon.

You'd have to be rediculously blinded by fear, or money to believe the 9/11 commission report, which makes no mention of of WTC, because, they cannot refute that one, we'll leave it out, sound familiar.

AND, I say AND this isn't even where the shadiest of stuff took place.

Have a look at Thepilots for truth, and Citizens investigation team, and you'll see, the Pentagon, AND shanksville (what's that missile you say took down 93 Rumsfeild, ok thanks, that clears that up).

I mean serioursly,they have been planning these wargames, and planes crashing, or makeing it "look" like planes have crashed into buildings for over a decade.

7/7 England, it just so happened they were planning a wargame in the exact RR / subway station the bombings took place.

Inside knowlegde anyone.

Ok for the un initiated I'd go Lihop (the US knw, these planes were off course and did nothing to stop them, hmm lefts flow out into the atlantic), The pentagon, no missile battariesin the US's most defendeble bunker (that the public know of.) Maybe they were testing outthier new blast shield windows that just were nearly finished on the 11th, "the cfatchers mitt", and thank Hanjour with his terrible, will never be able to fly a cessana , pulling a 320 degree bank to hit the catchers mitt, man this guy must (well the standin) or the guy at the remote. Must have had "top gun skills.

But I'll go with Mihop. and say we MADE it happen like Operations Northwoords, and the one JFK said no to!, what was that gulf of Tomkin? I could be way off, but they wanted JFK to sign a FF op, where American ships with american navy men would be detoyed outside Cuba in Neutral Waters, By American subs orwhat have you. JFK said hell no or whatver any person with morals (cough* unlike bush*) would say. A short whie later JFK was assassinated, coincidence, hah.

Bottom line it come down to money. oil=money, insurance scams=money, ect ecct, and who's money is this? You guessed it.... Yours. The hard working taxpayer, who are even defending this slime. Unless of course you are part of it, not saying anyone is, but I wouldn't be suprised if there's disinfo guys heres in droves. Or guys who push holograms and other silly things to make the "thuth " movement look dumb. But thats the was this goes.

Anyhow star and Falg OP!

Never stop searching for the truth!

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by makkerskilap

 

Does not change the fact that at the time the Titanic was considered as unsinkable by many and her designers had thought that the watertight bulkheads would ensure that the ship would stay afloat under all by the most drastic circumstances. And they were wrong.

I read it. It's not really necessary to say it does not change the fact, except it is understandable that nobody wants their statements denounced with statements irrelevant to the fact.

The titanic was unsinkable. The WTC was able to withstand impacts by aircraft. It never rains on holidays. If one can believe these things, one can believe anything.

There are three unquestionable facts of which millons of people are well aware. The unsinkable Titanic sank. The airplane proof WTC came down in a heap. It definitely does rain on holidays.

All the comic book CTs to the contrary have not proven anything otherwise except that there are people who will exploit any issue for whatever purpose or agenda they might have.

Originally posted by Swampfox46_1999
reply to post by benoni

 

No, they dont show a massive explosion of any sort. They show a building collapsing due to strike damage and fire.

Explosiveness does not necessarily have to come from a bomb. To explode is to explode. When a balloon pops it explodes because the force of the air is pushed outwards from the rubber sphere holding it in. The explosive forces in the collapse of the WTC came from millions of pounds of matter being pulled down by gravity, and forcing other matter in all directions in an explosive manner, but not by bombs.

Nobody has ever provided any material evidence of residues that are very well known to emit from ordnances, and adhere to surrounding materials.
Part of the problem is semantic in that too many people have limited personal definitions of what it means to explode by restricting the meaning of the word to only that which can be caused by a bomb. It is not so.

There were explosions, but not bombs causing them

[edit on 3-1-2009 by Jailhouserock]

Someone earlier was sceptical about nuts and bolt failing in perfect sequence. In fact when a structure made of steel and bolts does fail that is exactly how they fail. Each individual fastener failure puts extra stress on the next one, that fails and a greater proportion of the stress from the first two is put on the next one and the balance of the whole structure. So if the first one failed it is highly likely the rest will fail, in sequence.

Seriously though any conspiracy believers out there have obviously never worked in a organisation of more than two people. They would then realise it is practically impossible to keep a secret in a group of five people let alone a multi faceted conspiracy within vast network of government, military and business involving thousands of people. That is the universal failing of all conspiracy theories. And whenever it has been tried it fails, miserably.

Most governments can't even run a Motor Vehicle Registration department properly.

Incidentally I did not think there was any secret about WT7. The fire department was working to save it when the Owner of the building asked them to pull back and let it burn and fall. He said that with the loss of life that day he did not want anybody else (fire department) to put themselves at risk trying to save mere concrete and steel.

Originally posted by 911fnord
basically its as simple as this... I have studied almost every possible explanation of 9/11 and not one has answered the question of why wtc7 fell. Im not on vendetta here but I do want to say to all the 9/11 debunker types, LOOK AGAIN! and when one of you can honestly explain how a fully intact building collapses on itself I still will not respond cause it freaking hopeless...after a couple years it has been made very clear to me...ppl dont come here to discuss this topic they just come here to spout their various fear.
FNORD.

[edit on 1-1-2009 by 911fnord]

Indeed. I also don't like to be TOLD what to think re this. But this does make one think.

One concept is unspeakable. the other implausible. But.. well, who knows.

Good video.

Originally posted by Nola213
Do not underestimate the resources, and the time the and $$$ the US government has to plan things such as 9/11.


I' mean They've been planning this since their failed false flag on the towers in the early 90's. Well maybe that was a true terrorist attack, but when they saw the public outcry for Middle Eastern, Terrorist blood, they knew they had something there,

Also we are not talking about convention stuff, i.e. thermite/cutter charges ect, were talking about stuff so far advance it would make your headspin, like a stealth bomber in the 60's.

But you know ALL about that Swampfoxx, *wink*.

Pretext for War.

Save billions of dollars of clearing the asbestos from 1 and 2, and turn that into a muli- million dollar profit, pretty good. ....



Let's start out on how good controlled demolition experts are on getting even the simplest facts right.

Asbestos only up to 38 floors on one tower, half of it had been taken care of. It just needs to be sprayed to prevent flaking, not removed. The rest was inspected and to be remove voluntary. Costs thousands not billions.

This stuff just gets loopier to the point that you can just make up anything and conspiracist will buy into it.

If there is a mysterious shadow govt their best friends are the armchair quartebacks trying to find out about it. The whole movement discredits itself from the starting gate.


Mike F

reply to post by Swampfox46_1999


This video shows the lean of WTC7 towards the south quite pronouncedly towards the end. Its almost totally tilting over by the time it goes behind the other building in the foreground.

posted by Nola213
Do not underestimate the resources, and the time the and $$$ the US government has to plan things such as 9/11.

I' mean They've been planning this since their failed false flag on the towers in the early 90's. Well maybe that was a true terrorist attack, but when they saw the public outcry for Middle Eastern, Terrorist blood, they knew they had something there,

posted by mmiichael
If there is a mysterious shadow govt their best friends are the armchair quartebacks trying to find out about it. The whole movement discredits itself from the starting gate.

How come you only picked out one sentence in Nola213's lengthy post to debunk? Was the remainder too difficult? Too close to the truth? You are aware that the US has a long history of false flag attacks? You are aware that the FBI was heavily involved in the preparations and planning of WTC 93? You are aware of the deliberate murders of American citizens and children at Waco by the US Military and FBI?

You do not think the US Government and/or the Israeli government is capable of planning and carrying out 9-11? You do understand they have an abundance of cash stolen from the American taxpayers to carry out anything they please? You do understand that the CIA is primarily a drug running/supplying and money laundering cash cow? Thank you former CIA Director and major Drug Lord George HW Bush. Remember the drug runner and Iran/Contra professional liar Colonel Olliver North?

Those Towers were deliberately destroyed from the top-down by whatever 'explosives' their trillions in stolen loot needed to succeed. Cost and manpower would not be an issue. There are plenty of highly trained people who will say 'Yes sir; how high should we jump?', and not feel one second of remorse over the innocent lives wasted under orders.




[edit on 1/3/09 by SPreston]

www.youtube.com...

Looks like a real plane hit them towers to me. The way the wing crumples a little as the fuselage begins its impact with the building. And that explosion looks like it could have been started because of that airplane's fuel capacity to go cross-country.