Whats going on at yellowstone?

reply to post by PuterMan

If you want an easier way to get out the data (you or anyone else here), The Yellowstoner exports any set of quakes you want as CSV. Select by date range and/or a minimum magnitude, get the report, then click the link above the form saying "CSV/Excel". Here's a CSV export for the swarm so far... and it's good until the end of the month, too, so you can keep using that same link and getting the full set every time. A bit easier than trying to read various data formats, eh? Enjoy... (Oops; I see I'm using degrees-west, non-negative, in my database. Just... fill the cell G2 with "=0-C2", then cut'n'paste all the way down column G, and use that one instead of Longitude...

PS: shame on you for blogging during the State Of The Union speech!! Snicker.

[edit on 1/28/2010 by Thought Provoker]

As I woke up and was about to check the seismograms, a largish earthquake occurred!
I think it's M3.3-M3.4, quickly followed by a M2.5-2.6,

[edit on 2010-1-28 by Shirakawa]

Probably the second one wasn't that large, but I got the first correctly
By the way, PB.B207.EHZ appears to be dead.

[edit on 2010-1-28 by Shirakawa]

Magnitude 3.2 - YELLOWSTONE NATIONAL PARK, WYOMING
2010 January 28 08:46:15 UTC

FULL MOON ON SUNDAY

www.apfn.org...

well this is very interesting ! about the UN controlling or owning (debate here) our parks among other stuff how true ! im not positive what is
also (rumor) i heard that UN is using our National parks grounds for (FEMA camps ) (Alien underground Housing) ? Underground quake > detonation (making room ) i just need to do some research to see what i can come up with

Study the research of our parks !

it like some of the ports on the west coast is owned by china as Alex Jones had Interview the Manager of one of these ports

our land is being taken by Foreigners little by little ! I Say Miss Liberty Should her book for now! for a while !

where I Live ! a Electric Company Called (National Grid) is owned by a British Company !

en.wikipedia.org...
it has bought out Niagara Mohawk and our Natural Gas is Really (produced) owned by Canada (Commonwealth) Were living in a funny World !

reply to post by berkeleygal


A 3.2 that 's a bit worrisome. Wouldn't you say so Puter? That looks to be a nice cluster ____ right there inside the caldera eh?

[edit on 28-1-2010 by randyvs]

Originally posted by randyvs
A 3.2 that 's a bit worrisome. Wouldn't you say so Puter? That looks to be a nice cluster ____ right there inside the caldera eh?

Just for the record, a M3.7 immediately followed by a M3.8 have already occurred in past days.
If a M3.2 is a bit worrisome, what about them?

reply to post by Shirakawa


I assume this swarm is now on a par with last years - energy-wise?

reply to post by MoorfNZ


It still has not reached the total energy of the 2008/2009 swarm.
To confirm this I'm waiting for the final data. Even a 0.1 difference of magnitude for earthquakes of around M3.0 makes a noticeable difference.

How much does the moon’s gravitational pull affect earthquakes?

Seismologists have investigated the effect of the moon’s gravity for many years. The short answer is that while the moon does deform the earth slightly in a 12-hour cycle called the solid earth tides, it doesn’t seem to have an effect on the time an occurrence of big earthquakes. There are difficulties in understanding the effects of tidal forces because they are relatively small. However, if a fault or region is ready to rupture, it wouldn’t take much to tip the local stress field to the point of rupture. It’s worth noting that there is a much better correlation between the earth’s gravitational pull on the moon and moonquakes. Yes, seismographs have been taken to the moon and have recorded between 300 and 600 ‘moonquakes’ per year.

Source: www.gns.cri.nz...

Wondered if any of you guys watched these guys on YouTube?

They seem to get interviews with Utah scientists...

www.youtube.com...

I find the pattern noted below to be somewhat disturbing given that just when this swarm should be ending we will be approaching or at full moon.

Shirakawa, what do you make of it? IF the pattern continues, then even if this swarm "ends" we would see another start in less than 1 month. It would appear that some sort of "event" would have to take place to relieve the stress. Maybe not a wholesale eruption but an event large enough to release the pressure to end the pattern. Could we be looking at a large "event" with the coming of this full moon or the next ?


reply to post by pantangele Peter, Per my earlier suggestion, here is an example of the kind of post (from another forum) that I think is worthy of address by an expert... THE POST: QUIET... Sure for now, but another poster on another thread pointed out very well how quickly the swarms have gotten closer together (more frequent) since 1985. Specifically: Here are the notable swarms since 1985:
Nov. 85
Jul. 95
Apr. 04
Dec. 08
Jan. 10
They are getting closer each time:
116 month wait for next
then 105 month wait
then 56 month wait
then 13 month wait....
The next wait calculates to less than 0 months if you chart this. So clearly pressure is building and reaching the point where it will blow soon. END POST IMO, this is someone drawing sweeping conclusions based on a small sample, but the STORY they build is compelling, and as a result this kind of post will sway novices to believe that Yellowstone is like a mother about to give birth... It would be nice if an expert could calmly and rationally address this, perhaps by giving a brief overview of the cause of the individual swarms and providing a different perspective than the one offered.

[edit on 28-1-2010 by AwakeAndAware]

[edit on 28-1-2010 by AwakeAndAware]

Originally posted by MoorfNZ
Wondered if any of you guys watched these guys on YouTube?

They seem to get interviews with Utah scientists...

www.youtube.com...

good video, i was also lookin on the video info off to the side on youtube, and is there actually a gag order on yellowstone? Say if it was defin gonna blow its top? Seen it said it goes all the way to the bush admin in 2000?

reply to post by Shirakawa

Just for the record, a M3.7 immediately followed by a M3.8 have already occurred in past days.

Holy! you kiddin me?
Something is going on these days. A few years back you hardly ever seen quakes around our nations mid section. Now we see them as a common occurance.

reply to post by AwakeAndAware

I don't think there's a pattern there, even the original poster agreed the same and said that many people in other forums are taking that for truth because it fuels their imagination and sounds pseudoscientifically good.

reply to post by randyvs

Just go in this page from Yellowstone Volcano Observatory and you will learn that earthquake swarms with multiple >M3.0 earthquakes like the current one are relatively normal:

volcanoes.usgs.gov...

* * *

For everybody else: YVO has updated their January 2010 EQ swarm page with a RSAM plot of the current activity:

volcanoes.usgs.gov...

What's a RSAM plot? click here for info from the Alaska Volcano Observatory website.

[edit on 2010-1-28 by Shirakawa]

reply to post by Shirakawa


Just for accuracy, I did not originally write that post, I merely copy and pasted it here from another forum, using it as an example to the YVO of the kind of question that if left unchallenged can be taken as truth when I am quite sure simple examination of the facts would reveal no such pattern can be rationally assumed.

reply to post by MoorfNZ


I've have developed many wild ideas, but they are all based on scientific research. I only take the principle to the extreme.

Does the moon cause earthquakes?

There are at least two studies that have found evidence to support this. But it's not the moon alone. As I've stated, it's when the moon is at apogee and perigee. The Lake swarm and this current swarm started with a new moon at apogee. The sun is also a factor because in early January, the earth is closest to the sun at it's perihelion.

One of the studies that looked at the moon used statistics. They studied data back to 1973 and found a correlation with cycle of the moon.

news.discovery.com...

Well that's just one study and the moon only causes a fraction of the eathquakes in the world.

The second important study was from data on the San Andreas fault. This is important because the project was started in hopes that they geologists would learn enough to develope a way to predict earthquakes. The San Andreas is the most extensivley studied fault in the world. They found that the moon was responsible for small quakes. The moon does not cause events like Haiti or Mega Thrusts like the Indonesian quake. The moon sets of little quakes which add up over time to add to the stress of the larger fault. The moon has been shown to contribute to the process of tetonic movement, not cause it.

www.cbc.ca...

So at least two studies show data supporting the moon and sun are causing small tremblers.

How does the moon cause these small earthquakes?

Most probably it's the groundwater. Lubricant for faults. The movement of the ground water can the faults to slip. That's the most likely answer.

But I think there's more than just the lubrication of faults. I also believe there must be pressure with the movement of groundwater which also destabilzes the faults. I don't think the process that we're seeing here at Yellowstone is simply one dimensional. I mean, I don't think that it's just the water being moved throughout the crust and loosening faults. There is a cycle. In the case at Yellowstone, it starts with a full moon at perigee. But wait, in both cases, the swarms did not start on the full moon. ??? That's the first step. Then the tidal influence pauses until the new moon. Still no quakes. ??? It's not until the new moon, at apogee, along with the sun at perhilion, that the show begins. Frankly, I'm not going to pretend I know what's happening during the entire cycle. But I know there is some dynamic that is present. It's a complex dynamic, so several things are happening in a progressive chain reaction. ???

The best illlustration of this principle may be an desiel engine. The first stoke of the piston, the full moon does not start the engine. It produces the heat and compression for the second stroke to ignite. So the full moon forces movement of groundwater, then the system returns to a relatively normal state in the time between tides, (maybe still slightly pressurized) and then on the return stoke, the chain reaction begins.

What's happening in the aquifer during this process?

Maybe pockets of water are trapped? The pulsing of the flow moves sediments and material which clog pasageways. This may produce high pressure jets which blasts through narrow gaps. Maybe the moon also affects the lake.This may allow crust above the chamber to flex as the weight above it is reduced. However slightly. Hey'm not sure. But I know that there is no coincidence that both of these swarms happen under similar lunar cycles.

I've even been pondering whether or not the magma chamber itself is affected. I know it's not exactly a liquid and it's not splashing around as we spin around the sun. But the chamber is not a single density. Does the tidal influnece move different density zones around in the chamber? Are the gases within the magma stable during this process?

The question is not whether or not the moon's marginal gravitional pull does or doesn't cause quakes. The question should be, what affect does the alignment of the sun, earth and moon have on earthquakes, ground water, and volcanoes?

The moon on Saturday will be at it's closest to earth for the year. So make sure you get outside and appreciate it.

PS. Swarms of 1500+ quakes in a matter of weeks are not common. On record, there's only been one other. 1985. Swarms of varying size in the Yellowstone region are "relatively" common. Swarms within the caldera are less common. This swarm needs to be put in the proper context to understand it's relevance. However, I agree that you can't only notable swarms and try to determine an interval. But I will say that having back to back major swarms is very curious and definately not common. This swarm is not exactly normal, it's historically significant. Presuming this thread reaches a thousands of pages and we're here studying Yellowstone a decade from now, we will look back and remember this time as truly memorable.

[edit on 28-1-2010 by Robin Marks]

reply to post by Thought Provoker


Not that I have a problem with the ANNS method of collection, but thanks, and it does not graph it for me which is why I use my QuakeData program.

I have just uploaded the latest version to my website - click the link in my signature to go to the QuakeData page. The latest data in SQL Compact format database is also available updated to 14:00 UTC today so if you are new to QuakeData this is worth downloading.

Currently only the cumulative graph is available, and only using ANSS data, and there is a minor problem with the axis ticks, but it works and I will sort these out. I will also create an upload for Thought Provoker's CSV and add that to the next version so it can plot those for you as well (Unless you don't wish me to do that TP?).

Also in the next version you will be able to graph straight from the automatically collected data, but bear in mind that this is only 1.0+

reply to post by Shirakawa


Agreed Shirakawa. Let's worry about the 8.0 if it happens!!!

I guess this might just be it's final little fling before it all simmers down again.

reply to post by PuterMan


Give me 2 4.0+ and then 2 5.0+ and I will be worried.

until then its just part of the intro.

New press release from YVO:
volcanoes.usgs.gov...

The earthquake swarm on the northwest edge of Yellowstone Caldera that began on January 17, 2010 continues. There is still no indication of premonitory volcanic or hydrothermal activity. For more information about the swarm, see volcano.wr.usgs.gov...

PRESS RELEASE FROM YVO PARTNER UNIVERSITY OF UTAH SEISMOGRAPH STATIONS

Released: January 28, 2010 9:00AM MST

This release is a continuation of information updates building upon our four previous press releases on the ongoing earthquake swarm on the west side of Yellowstone National Park.

The University of Utah Seismograph Stations reports that a pair of earthquakes of magnitude 3.1 and 3.2 occurred in Yellowstone National Park. The magnitude 3.1 event occurred at 12:52 PM on January 27, 2010. The magnitude 3.2 occurred on the morning of January 28, 2010 at 1:46 AM. Both shocks were located around 9 miles to the southeast of West Yellowstone, MT and about 10 miles to the northwest of Old Faithful, WY. Both earthquakes were reported felt in Yellowstone National Park.

These earthquakes are part of an ongoing swarm in Yellowstone National Park that began January 17, 2010 (1:00 PM MST). The largest earthquake in the swarm as of 9 AM MST, January 28, 2010, has been a magnitude 3.8. There have been 1,497 located earthquakes in the swarm of magnitude 0.4 to 3.8 up to 9AM January 28, 2010. This includes 12 events of magnitude larger than 3, with 111 events of magnitude 2 to 3, and 1,374 events of magnitude less than 2. There have been multiple personal reports of ground shaking from observers inside the Park and in surrounding areas for some of the larger events (for felt reports, please visit earthquake.usgs.gov...). Earthquake swarms are relatively common in Yellowstone.

Yellowstone Volcano Observatory scientists still consider that the swarm events are likely the result of slip on pre-existing faults and are not thought to be caused by underground movement of magma. Currently there is no indication of premonitory volcanic or hydrothermal activity, but ongoing observations and analyses will continue to evaluate these different sources.

Seismic information on the earthquake can be viewed at the University of Utah Seismograph Stations: www.seis.utah.edu...

Seismograph recordings from stations of the Yellowstone seismograph network can be viewed online at: quake.utah.edu...

Anyone who has felt earthquakes in the swarm are encouraged to fill out a form on the USGS Community Felt reports web site: earthquake.usgs.gov...

This press release was prepared by the Yellowstone Volcano Observatory partners of the U.S. Geol. Survey, the University of Utah, and the National Park Service: volcanoes.usgs.gov...

Update in Common Alerting Protocol (CAP) format

[edit on 2010-1-28 by Shirakawa]