(YYSLSC) The Yin Yang Short Love Story Contest

Originally posted by intrepid
That's NOT the case. In our communications it was made clear that we didn't want to go down this path. C'mon man.

Well, you did still threaten to ban me again, but I'll admit I deserved that for swearing at you!

The T&C is very clear on this. If you wouldn't put it on the board it doesn't belong in a story. I've seen your participation, you can do it.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Intrepid. I think that I shall try.

Originally posted by masqua
Please... let's not get personal.

Sorry. I thought you were, for a moment there. My mistake.

On the issue of interpretation of the T&C's, I suggest (again) that you take your concerns to The ATS Issues Thread where it will be seen by those who can actually make a decision.

Cheers

I thought I could ask you:

Originally posted by masqua
My personal definition is based on my understanding of the T&C's. Since I am both the originator of this contest as well as a judge, my decision to exclude a story based on my personal interpretation will be final. There is always the Complaints function if anyone disagrees. In that way it will be seen and discussed by all staff.

(?)

I see no need to complain!

Originally posted by Cadbury
I thought I could ask you:

You did and I answered that, as a moderator of the Short Stories forum, I would act on my own interpretation of the T&C's in regard to that forum. It is, you will agree, my only option since I can't 'second guess' what they may mean otherwise. All moderators can do is act according to the way they see things in any and all cases, and, when a question arises, do the same thing I'm asking you to do.

Questioning the veracity of a rule in the T&C's is best done by asking the administrators, since they, not I, have the ability to make any changes where needed.

On complaints:

If a story was rejected and the author considered it unfairly done, the best option would, of course, be a Complaint since it is then read by all staff, discussed and acted upon through concensus.

There is no baggage associated with using the complaint feature, imo.

sp edit

[edit on 18/12/08 by masqua]

Originally posted by masqua

You did and I answered that, as a moderator of the Short Stories forum, I would act on my own interpretation of the T&C's in regard to that forum.

In this particular case that's good enough for me. What are your interpretations of the T&C's in regard to this forum, then? I'll stick to them (for this contest).

It is, you will agree, my only option since I can't 'second guess' what they may mean otherwise. All moderators can do is act according to the way they see things in any and all cases, and, when a question arises, do the same thing I'm asking you to do.

Questioning the veracity of a rule in the T&C's is best done by asking the administrators, since they, not I, have the ability to make any changes where needed.

I'm not questioning any veracity in the general T&C I'm just questioning how those terms and conditions are to be applied to this contest. That's why when you said "strictly adhere," I asked (in a rather round-a-bout fashion, I admit) how strictly you meant by "strictly." There has been some leniency on occasion in the past. If there is none this time then that's fine, I won't argue. I just want things to be totally clear, that's all. I can easily see myself getting into trouble otherwise.

On complaints:

If a story was rejected and the author considered it unfairly done, the best option would, of course, be a Complaint since it is then read by all staff, discussed and acted upon through concensus.

No, I trust your judgement. I just wanted everything clear, as they haven't always been in the past (and I do not mean that as a jab at anyone).

What are your interpretations of the T&C's in regard to this forum, then? I'll stick to them (for this contest).

For this contest, they are:

1a) Offensive Content: You will not post links to images or use avatars and signatures that are offensive, abusive, distruptive and/or hateful. You will not use images, avatars or link to domains that contain gore, mutilation, pornography or illegal(2e) content. Doing so will result in removal of your post(s) and immediate termination of your account.

pornography, as I interpret it in fictional stories, is graphic or suggestive descriptions of sexual acts. To say one 'made love' is neither. To describe the act in detail is pornographic. The following rule lays it out more completely;

1b.) Profanity: You will not use profanity in our forums, and will neither post with language or content that is obscene, sexually oriented, or sexually suggestive nor link to sites that contain such content.

A contest devoted to love, as this one is, does not only mean sexual acts. Love takes many forms. The love between family members is just as valid as any other... perhaps even more so. Expressions of love can be seen in the most non-sexual ways imaginable... empathy, devotion, selflessness, care, etc.


To be even more concise on the subject, one needs to also be aware of this issue:

ABOUT ATS: Vulgarity and The Automatic ATS Censors

www.abovetopsecret.com...

There has been some leniency on occasion in the past.

That may be so, but in the case of a contest devoted to issues of loving relationships, it may be better to act in a pre-emptive manner.

To be as clear as possible, a story submitted which has within it a discourse on sexual acts and using profanity will not be acceptable in this contest.

The primary goal in this contest is to focus on the personal conflict which may arise between three main characters as a result of a decision which needs to be made.

(ie., deciding the fate of one for the benefit of the other or humanity as a whole. The question should be what you should do as opposed to what you want to do, opening up inner conflict and judgement based on your own morality. This is why I stated in the OP that happy endings are not required and Yin/Yang is central. YY is the good/evil which resides in each of us. )

I just want things to be totally clear, that's all.

Rather an impossible request, wouldn't you agree? Philosophers have been debating such logic for millenia and it is still a work in progress, isn't it? Plato, Russell, Kant (et al) would be chuckling at this, imo.

Unfortunately, I am only one of the many billions of human beings who have pondered the great moral dilemnas facing the human race. Add to that the ponderous weight of theological musings and we have a debate that could go on for centuries based only on the ATS Terms and Conditions listed above. This thread really sn't the place for it, but I AM trying.

We are all bound and limited by our own inadequate logic. There are no sureties, neither in law nor personal conscience. Our capabilty to come to a conclusion on such things only lasts until another asks the one question that destroys our determinations. Nothing carved in stone has survived intact and everything is up for contention.

'Thou shalt not kill' is interpreted according to the situation at hand, isn't it? "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" falls apart when one is suicidal or of evil bent.



As one who has spent a lifetime in making decisions regarding sensitive employee/management issues, I can vouch that every instance is different, based on the circumstances involved in the individuals involved in each case. More often than not, it means finding a middle ground. The 'middle ground of T&C's, happily, is the lot of the administrators of ATS.

There is no way to be absolute in law (T&C's) and that is why the Complaints function is so valued by both staff and membership alike.

Thank you, though, for this frank discussion.

Now, the question should be, what is your interpretation of the T&C rules as they apply in the Short Story forum and how do you think they should be applied? Ask that in the ATS Issues Thread to get to the fountain of all things (sort of) permanently completed, since one mind is inadequate where many may be more preferrable.



To all others who may have a question regarding this contest, please do ask.





[edit on 18/12/08 by masqua]

[edit on 18/12/08 by masqua]

Update... both 'member' judges have been chosen. There will be a panel of 5 altogether... 3 moderators and two members to make a split decision difficult.

Thanks to any who considered giving it a shot but were too late to jump in.

Originally posted by masqua
Stories should be no shorter than 5000 characters and no longer than 15,000 characters.

I have a story I've just written today with 11,000 characters and I tried to post it in the Short Story forum and it only accepts 10,000 characters.

What to do?

Split it into two posts, BH.

Hope you managed to save your work.

reply to post by masqua


Putting it in two posts never, ever occurred to me! I have never gone over my 10,000 word limit (believe it or not).

I feel like an idiot.

Thanks.

BH... you've never come across as idiotic.

Just human.

Originally posted by masqua

For this contest, they are:

1a) Offensive Content: You will not post links to images or use avatars and signatures that are offensive, abusive, distruptive and/or hateful. You will not use images, avatars or link to domains that contain gore, mutilation, pornography or illegal(2e) content. Doing so will result in removal of your post(s) and immediate termination of your account.

Understood and agreed to.

pornography, as I interpret it in fictional stories, is graphic or suggestive descriptions of sexual acts. To say one 'made love' is neither. To describe the act in detail is pornographic. The following rule lays it out more completely;

1b.) Profanity: You will not use profanity in our forums, and will neither post with language or content that is obscene, sexually oriented, or sexually suggestive nor link to sites that contain such content.

I see, I see. So we can reference sexual acts as long as they're not too descriptive or obscene? So I could write something like "rig," or "rigged," but I can't write something along the lines of... "He fish-hooked her in the gob with his silly banana?"

I agree to these terms (albiet reluctantly).

A contest devoted to love, as this one is, does not only mean sexual acts. Love takes many forms. The love between family members is just as valid as any other... perhaps even more so. Expressions of love can be seen in the most non-sexual ways imaginable... empathy, devotion, selflessness, care, etc.

I thought this was like a Valentine's Day type situation but with Aliens and Conspiracy Theorists? For the terrible trash I had in mind, a love of one's own family might be considered obscene in this case. I may amend my planning in light of this, but I may not.

To be even more concise on the subject, one needs to also be aware of this issue:

ABOUT ATS: Vulgarity and The Automatic ATS Censors

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Leniency if we create a .pdf to evade the Google engine? Can we swear a couple of times if we do that?

There has been some leniency on occasion in the past.

That may be so, but in the case of a contest devoted to issues of loving relationships, it may be better to act in a pre-emptive manner.

Ah, yes... But you do go on to say:

The primary goal in this contest is to focus on the personal conflict which may arise between three main characters as a result of a decision which needs to be made.

And...

(ie., deciding the fate of one for the benefit of the other or humanity as a whole. The question should be what you should do as opposed to what you want to do, opening up inner conflict and judgement based on your own morality. This is why I stated in the OP that happy endings are not required and Yin/Yang is central. YY is the good/evil which resides in each of us. )

(Emphasis added)

As I'm sure you know, lovin' relationships ain't always lovin', to completely and utterly burgle a term from somewhere obscure that I can't even begin remember right now. An "Hmmm" to pre-emption! And a Yin/yang central indeed!

Very slight leniency?

I just want things to be totally clear, that's all.

Rather an impossible request, wouldn't you agree? Philosophers have been debating such logic for millenia and it is still a work in progress, isn't it? Plato, Russell, Kant (et al) would be chuckling at this, imo.

Hah! Alright, Semanticist, you do have a point. But this point, whilst working against me, also works against Dr. Intrepid:

The T&C is very clear on this.

Hehe (sorry Intrepid).

Unfortunately, I am only one of the many billions of human beings who have pondered the great moral dilemnas facing the human race. Add to that the ponderous weight of theological musings and we have a debate that could go on for centuries based only on the ATS Terms and Conditions listed above. This thread really sn't the place for it, but I AM trying.

You are trying indeed, Sir -- and trying well. But I think I've also tried to keep it as relevant to this contest (and sometimes this forum) as possible.

We are all bound and limited by our own inadequate logic. There are no sureties, neither in law nor personal conscience. Our capabilty to come to a conclusion on such things only lasts until another asks the one question that destroys our determinations. Nothing carved in stone has survived intact and everything is up for contention.

'Thou shalt not kill' is interpreted according to the situation at hand, isn't it? "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" falls apart when one is suicidal or of evil bent.

Indeed! No argument from me there. And I hope you can see that this is why I asked for a clarification on certain matters. I wasn't trying to cause my usual mischief. Honest.

Thank you, though, for this frank discussion.

No, thank you, Sir.

Now, the question should be, what is your interpretation of the T&C rules as they apply in the Short Story forum and how do you think they should be applied? Ask that in the ATS Issues Thread to get to the fountain of all things (sort of) permanently completed, since one mind is inadequate where many may be more preferrable.

Hehe. Do you want me to ask my own interpretation of the law and then answer myself, or just ask? But if I may for one moment stop being an idiot, I'd like to say I think although one mind may be inadequate where many are preferable, you have explained well enough all on your own.

Does saying You and Your Significant Other imply the story should be first person as a rule?

[edit on 18-12-2008 by TravelerintheDark]

reply to post by TravelerintheDark


I believe it would be an easier story to create in the first person, but, you could be in the role of the alien too.

This is not a rule though. Write it any way you want as long as those three characters are involved.

reply to post by masqua


Thank you, I will have at it then

I think I'll base my story on Masqua, Intrepid, and an obstinate alien named Cadbury?

Serious dramatic potential there.

COPYRIGHT! Called it!!

reply to post by Essedarius


Does that mean Intrepid and I are to be romantically involved in your story?

OMG... I can't wait to read it when posted. Get to work, you wordsmith, you.



*looks affectionately at intrepid*

reply to post by masqua


Whoa. Break it up, break it up.

If life starts imitating art around here, we're all in big trouble.

Hi there M,

Just done mine. Can i have your oppinion on if i have kept to the rules - I'm not sure if i've strayed a little or not?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Thanks MCOG1980

[edit on 20-12-2008 by MCoG1980]

You did NOT stray from the rules. Stating the fact that you made love and thought it wonderful is certainly not pornographic and you used no language which might be called profane.

All in all, your story stuck to the guidelines proposed in the OP and it was an interesting bit of reading.

The only criticism I had with it is that you perhaps should have broken it down into more paragraphs to make it easier to read. The best way to do it is write 4 or 5 sentences in each paragraph.

This will not detract from your chances, though, because punctuation, spelling, grammar OR big paragraphs are not going to detract from the value of your submission.

Don't forget... you also may enter two stories in this contest.



Good effort!


sp edit

[edit on 20/12/08 by masqua]

reply to post by masqua


Thanks Masqua, i will bear that in mind, i did try to edit it but when i went back it didn't give me that option. Will bear that one in mind next time