Students to be taught there isn't a God

reply to post by tezzajw


I don't think he meant it should be taught in the sense you are thinking...

I think he meant more of a study in different dogmas, highlighting the points of contention between each group... etc.. much like a sociology class...

He is right... If we chose to ignore religion, and the next generation is completely ignorant to whats out there, how can we ever hope to understand the international community...

Would you offer a jewish guy, or a muslim a strip of bacon? Of course not... But this is because you have been taught one of the dogmatic principals of their religions...

He's not talking pulpits... he's talking textbooks...

Much like my point that you can never understand the renessance, crusades, middle ages, etc without properly understanding the religious motiviations involved... (sorry for taking it back to history... but thats my major )

The only fair approach, is to teach both sides of the argument, even though only 1 is right.

This would allow for youths to make their own decisions. Nothing should be forced on them.

One of my most interesting courses in college was World Religions. It outlined the teachings of many major denominations (not all--there are too many to teach them all) and gave us some perspective on how these religions have influenced culture and history.

I was an agnostic then and have my doubts now, so it didn't influence me in any particular religious direction. It just gave me an appreciation of other ways of thinking and behaving.

In my elementary school we were taught neither creationism nor atheism (I believe I didn't learn about Darwin until I was a little older)--it left religion to be taught at home. There were students of many different nationalities and denominations in my school and this worked well for us.

Originally posted by nj2day
I think he meant more of a study in different dogmas, highlighting the points of contention between each group... etc.. much like a sociology class...

I know what the article implies. Teaching religion in the context of ethics, values and society.

He is right... If we chose to ignore religion, and the next generation is completely ignorant to whats out there, how can we ever hope to understand the international community...

Hey, I hope EVERYONE chooses to ignore religion! Imagine how much of a better place the world will be in twenty years time if a whole generation of children ignored religion!

Would you offer a jewish guy, or a muslim a strip of bacon? Of course not... But this is because you have been taught one of the dogmatic principals of their religions...

I don't care what they believe. If I offer them bacon and they don't want it, then that's their problem NOT mine. I'm not bending over to please them and I don't expect my non-religious children to do the same either.

If they want to adhere to their dogmatic rituals, then they can grow a thick skin for when people who don't give a flying firetruck about their religion happens to do something that 'offends' them.

reply to post by tezzajw


hehe while I agree with your premise completely... You can understand how the nation's future leaders would have problems with other nations if they don't understand their beliefs...

Honestly... a student who's informed about ALL religions, is probably better off when he meets a religious bigot... he'll know exactly what kind of BS is going to get spewed in his direction lol

Originally posted by nj2day
hehe while I agree with your premise completely... You can understand how the nation's future leaders would have problems with other nations if they don't understand their beliefs...

But isn't that the problem with today's world?

Why can't a nation's leaders worry about its OWN nation, instead of worrying about other nations?

I live in Victoria, where this will affect the schools near me. It's a disgrace.

I can't understand why in this day and age people need to push their religious crutch onto others??? It's useless!

reply to post by tezzajw


I can't think of an overly successful isolationist country at the moment...

like it or not... we're all on the same planet together...

Let me point out, this is primary school we're talking about here. 6 - 12 year olds. About 5 - 10 years ago I went to Primary school in Victoria. About once a week we had a 'Religious Education' lesson for about an hour. It was pretty cool, we just read some parts of the New Testament, and also the basics about God.

Of course, we wern't forced to believe anything, there was no 'arguement', just learning about it. Of course, we did lots of science too. Which is honestly how it should be. School is for education not indoctrination; students should learn parts of everything relevant. Teaching them god is not real is going to cause major problems when they're older.

[edit on 14/12/2008 by C0bzz]

Originally posted by C0bzz
Let me point out, this is primary school people. 6 - 12 year olds.

About 5 - 10 years ago I went to Primary school in Victoria. About once a week we had a 'Religious Education' lesson for about an hour. It was pretty cool, we just read about the bible and some of the lessons.

Of course, we wern't forced to believe anything, and we did some science too. Which is honestly how it should be. School is for education not indoctrination; students should learn about everything then base there conclusions of it.

[edit on 14/12/2008 by C0bzz]

In this instance... I would immediately yank my child out of that school... and file a lawsuit...

Religious education should NOT be taught to kids that young... who are impressionable, and more than willing to take a teacher's words as law.

If the class was about all religions, and what each one believes... and the history of discord between given sects... I am ok with that

No child should ever be required to read about the bible exclusively in class...

mixing religion and science? Sounds like a brainwashing I.D. class to me...




[edit on 14-12-2008 by nj2day]

Originally posted by C0bzz
Let me point out, this is primary school we're talking about here. 6 - 12 year olds.

What type of Primary School? It couldn't have been government if it taught religion. It must have been Catholic or Independent, where they can indoctrinate as much as they wish.

Superintendent Chalmers said it best on The Simpsons, when referring to religion in government schools: "God has no place within these walls!"

reply to post by WatchNLearn


I have proof of creation and that it exists.



Someone named God I do not know. Anyone's guess.

reply to post by nj2day


Maybe I wasn't clear enough. Science and religion were not mixed. We learn't the two in seperate classes, they were not integrated with eachother. Let me make it clear; there was no brainwashing, there was no indoctination - it was all about learning. 11 - 12 year olds are no where near as impressionable as you may think; I am still in touch with most people from back then and they're all athiests. Before the classes started notices were sent home; if you tried to file a lawsuit, you would not get one inch, and to be honest, I'd be on the side of the school.

I honestly think Religion should be taught more thoroughly; more than once a week. I have noticed younger people around here, who are almost always Athiests, are being disrespectful to religious people and religion. Even ridcule. Now some minority humanist group wants to teach that god isn't real? I can see a hell of a lot more disrespect and even segregation coming - you just watch.

That being said, science classes should NOT touch on religion, and vice versa. No arguements in schools about which is right. It should all be about learning with the students deciding what they think. Thankfully, that's the way it was with me - I don't know about this new ciruculum.

By the way, in the original article.

As with lessons delivered by faith groups, parents will be able to request that their children do not participate.

reply to post by tezzajw


Yes it was a government school. It was all about learning not indoctrination - read my original post.

[edit on 14/12/2008 by C0bzz]

I don't think it's a good idea. Religion should be kept out of the classroom. That includes arguments for ("intelligent" design) and arguments against. Kids need to make up their own minds.

Originally posted by Jazzyguy

Originally posted by zroth
I find it interesting that people who do not believe in GOD want everyone to feel the same way. It is almost just like...religion.

Atheism is actually a belief in god of the ego-self. It takes a while before people figure it out.

Yep, I find it hilarious how many Atheists deny the existence of God, yet are convinced of the existence of self.

Personally I feel study should be encouraged. Hermetic, Vedic, etc; There are too many similarities to ignore the fact that there is more to the universe than our little rock.

True but the best way to do it is yet to be discovered.

Wow.... how wonderfully put.

reply to post by pluckynoonez



Plucky! Cymatics is great isn't it!


You know you can buy this kit from PASCO. PASCO has a LOT of cool stuff like this.

Originally posted by nj2day


In this instance... I would immediately yank my child out of that school... and file a lawsuit...

Ok... I can understand your need to remove your children from the educational influences which you are offended by, but a lawsuit? Really? This is optional. Not Mandatory.

Religious education should NOT be taught to kids that young... who are impressionable, and more than willing to take a teacher's words as law.

Why not? Kids, as you say are very impressionable. This is the exact age to teach them values. If these are your values, then your children will be in a school like this, if they are not, then you will not put them in a school like that... it's the beauty of Freedom

Greatest thing I've heard all week. Cheers!

To be honest, I don't find a problem with Believing in God.


What I find a problem with, is humans thinking they have a clue what the will of a potential supreme being might be. Or better yet, the people who assume that God is a personal entity in an objective way.

The whole mystery of God is that, if there is such a form, we have no idea what God would be, or what the Will of such an entity would be.

Originally posted by HunkaHunka
Ok... I can understand your need to remove your children from the educational influences which you are offended by, but a lawsuit? Really? This is optional. Not Mandatory.

Here, the U.S. Supreme court has determined that the only appropriate time for religion to enter the school in that manner is after school hours are over... teaching the christian religion exclusively, like was mentioned earlier, is against the U.S. Constitution...

My tax dollars WILL NOT be spent like that without me at least putting up a fight.

Why not? Kids, as you say are very impressionable. This is the exact age to teach them values. If these are your values, then your children will be in a school like this, if they are not, then you will not put them in a school like that... it's the beauty of Freedom

Values are the responsibility of the parents... NOT THE SCHOOLS...

If this is taught in public schools, this is unacceptable... If people want to pay good money to have their children taught rubbish... than more power to them... although I consider forcing a religion on a child before they have the cognative capacity to choose responsibly is a form of child abuse.

Here, the U.S. Supreme court has determined that the only appropriate time for religion to enter the school in that manner is after school hours are over... teaching the christian religion exclusively, like was mentioned earlier, is against the U.S. Constitution...

Thankfully, Australia is not the United States.

My tax dollars WILL NOT be spent like that without me at least putting up a fight.

K.

In my experience the teachers for RE are volunteers. You don't pay them a cent.

Values are the responsibility of the parents... NOT THE SCHOOLS...

Well that's the way it should be. But I'm afraid that's not how the world works.

[edit on 14/12/2008 by C0bzz]