Evidence in Scripture disproving god once and for all

Originally posted by Simplynoone
[[[[ Many times you will not be satisfied with the result. I don't expect you to disect something you already believe yourself to understand, but if you intend to argue against those who do understand, then maybe you'd better...]]]]

Hey Truth
Seriously though the same can be said for you and what you find to be true according to your understanding of things etc ....

lol. Nice try.
Actually I understand the Bible better than most Christians. Apparently I understand it better than you do if you can tell me that the scriptures I post are wrong and not even show how. It's the understanding that I have that led me away from Christianity.
Can you understand a contradiction? If so, I wouldn't brag about it...

reply to post by nj2day


Your comment of : "2) Since I've established taking parts of the bible figuratively unravles the entire religion itself, the bible is not the true word of god, as god is perfect."

You are stating that god wrote the bible....the bible is written by man and man alone...the only thing God set in stone was the 10 Commandments....therefore any and all translations to the bible are written by man, interpreted by man, and lost in translation over periods of time, including your interpretation. So basically your argument is null and void.

reply to post by tcbtom

So basically your argument is null and void.

Not when for the sake of argument, the assumption is made that God inspired the bible as it becomes very problematic. As a man made thing (including the Egyptian plagiarised commandments) it's so much easier to explain the problematic bits as mistakes.

[edit on 7/12/2008 by Good Wolf]

My, my, we sure have a lot of people pretending to know what God can and cannot do, what his intentions are/were in regard to man.
I can't help but wonder just what God would have to say about this.

Bible believers seem to believe that their Bible is the first ever to lay out a social code; that its God was the first to give the "law" to man. If that is the case it seems that their God is admitting that he has just come on the scene and is unfamiliar with those already existing civilization.

The Sumerian records predate the Bible. The first 5 books of The Bible are a copy of the Sumerian record.
The code of Hammurabi predates moses. It is believed that it is a reproduction of the Sumerian Law.

"[Hammurabi] was the ruler who chiefly established the greatness of Babylon, the world's first metropolis. Many relics of Hammurabi's reign ([1795-1750 BC]) have been preserved, and today we can study this remarkable King....as a wise law-giver in his celebrated code. .

[B]y far the most remarkable of the Hammurabi records is his code of laws, the earliest-known example of a ruler proclaiming publicly to his people an entire body of laws, arranged in orderly groups, so that all men might read and know what was required of them. The code was carved upon a black stone monument, eight feet high, and clearly intended to be reared in public view. This noted stone was found in the year 1901, not in Babylon, but in a city of the Persian mountains, to which some later conqueror must have carried it in triumph. It begins and ends with addresses to the gods. Even a law code was in those days regarded as a subject for prayer, though the prayers here are chiefly cursings of whoever shall neglect or destroy the law."

Hammurabi

FROM THE LINK >>

Adultery was punished with the death of both parties by drowning, but if the husband was willing to pardon his wife, the king might intervene to pardon the paramour. For incest with his own mother, both were burned to death; with a stepmother, the man was disinherited; with a daughter, the man was exiled; with a daughter-in-law, he was drowned; with a son's betrothed, he was fined. A wife who for her lover's sake procured her husband's death was gibbeted. A betrothed girl, seduced by her prospective father-in-law, took her dowry and returned to her family, and was free to marry as she chose.

In the criminal law the ruling principle was the lex talionis. Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, limb for limb was the penalty for assault upon an amelu. A sort of symbolic retaliation was the punishment of the offending member, seen in the cutting off the hand that struck a father or stole a trust; in cutting off the breast of a wet-nurse who substituted a changeling for the child entrusted to her; in the loss of the tongue that denied father or mother (in the Elamite contracts the same penalty was inflicted for perjury); in the loss of the eye that pried into forbidden secrets. The loss of the surgeon's hand that caused loss of life or limb or the brander's hand that obliterated a slave's identification mark, are very similar. The slave, who struck a freeman or denied his master, lost an ear, the organ of hearing and symbol of obedience. To bring another into danger of death by false accusation was punished by death. To cause loss of liberty or property by false witness was punished by the penalty the perjurer sought to bring upon another.

The death penalty was freely awarded for theft and other crimes regarded as coming under that head, for theft involving entrance of palace or temple treasury, for illegal purchase from minor or slave, for selling stolen goods or receiving the same, for common theft in the open (in default of multiple restoration) or receiving the same, for false claim to goods, for kidnapping, for assisting or harbouring fugitive slaves, for detaining or appropriating same, for brigandage, for fraudulent sale of drink, for disorderly conduct of tavern, for delegation of personal service, for misappropriating the levy, for oppression of feudal holders, for causing death of a householder by bad building. The manner of death is not specified in these cases. This death penalty was also fixed for such conduct as placed another in danger of death. A specified form of death penalty occurs in the following cases:-gibbeting (on the spot where crime was committed) for burglary, later also for encroaching on the king's highway, for getting a slave-brand obliterated, for procuring husband's death; burning for incest with own mother, for vestal entering or opening tavern, for theft at fire (on the spot); drowning for adultery, rape of betrothed maiden, bigamy, bad conduct as wife, seduction of daughter-in-law.
www.fordham.edu...

So ok let me get this straight ..according to some here the bible is the ONLY book with horrible laws in it eh ..

reply to post by Simplynoone

So ok let me get this straight ..according to some here the bible is the ONLY book with horrible laws in it eh ..

I don't think anyone said only, but well done conceding the point that there are horrible laws in the bible.

Wolf I will concede that I personally do not like alot of the laws of the OT ....The Ten commandments I feel are very fair though ..and if you keep them you wont be tempted to commit any of them .....Like Jesus said ..if you loved the Lord God and your neighbor ..then you sure wont want to hurt them ...steal their wife,bare false witness against them etc etc .......
I also do not like about 50 % of the laws of our own land even ..(most are unfair and they are mainly just to collect large fines and keep lawyers and judges etc in business) ..................
But I also know that laws are a must and even the strictest laws are for a reason .(more than likely as I have said before they were there to keep people in check knowing that if the consequences of their actions were severe they wont go there at all .) ..............
I will also admit that I am not God and I personally do not have to rule over millions or billions of people who are mostly not able to even control themselves even with the simple laws ..(like not stealing etc) .......

Most people even with laws and rules etc ...wont even do the one simple one ..Of The GOLDEN RULE .......so I could just see a world with no law ...
Would be the most dangerous times in history ..

So there does that make you feel any better ?



[edit on 7-12-2008 by Simplynoone]

Originally posted by Simplynoone
So ok let me get this straight ..according to some here the bible is the ONLY book with horrible laws in it eh ..

I've been over this... In a time which had such cruel laws, would not a loving God be different? That is my main point in presenting the verses - that the God of the Old Testament is polar opposite from the God of the New Testament.
Do you honestly think that just because mans laws were cruel back then that an all loving God would go along with what man thought? On the contrary, he would condemn such laws, but that's not what we see, is it?

reply to post by Simplynoone


Hehe. This is why I like you, Simply, you make it easy and fun to argue with.

The Ten commandments I feel are very fair though

You mean the ones that were lifted [plagiarised] from the Egyptian book of the dead?
Info
More Info

Most people even with laws and rules etc ...wont even do the one simple one ..Of The GOLDEN RULE .......so I could just see a world with no law ...
Would be the most dangerous times in history ..

You mean the one that logic tells us will always fail?

Shaw's comment about differing tastes suggests that if your values are not shared with others, the way you want to be treated will not be the way they want to be treated. For example, it has been said that a sadist is just a masochist who follows the golden rule. Another often used example of this inconsistency is that of the man walking into a bar looking for a fight.

Source

I'm no divine being but even I can best "The Golden Rule". How about treat others as they would like to be treated, rather that how you would like to be treated.

So there does that make you feel any better ?

Most.

[edit on 7/12/2008 by Good Wolf]

reply to post by TruthParadox


Aww, TP! I wanted to take this one. Simply is fun.

reply to post by nj2day


Problem with the original reasoning that the bible disproves God.

1. Bible proves that what it proclaims (God) is bollox.
2. The Bible is obviously bollox.
3. The Bible proves nothing.

Originally posted by tcbtom
You are stating that god wrote the bible....the bible is written by man and man alone...the only thing God set in stone was the 10 Commandments....therefore any and all translations to the bible are written by man, interpreted by man, and lost in translation over periods of time, including your interpretation. So basically your argument is null and void.

lol...
How can you be sure that the 10 commandments were directly from God then? You just said that it was written by man who is fallible...
The idea of the thread was to disprove the God of the Bible. Obviously the Bible's description of God doesn't work. Might another God exist? Perhaps one which the Bible is merely a fable of? Possibly, but that does not discount the fact that many people believe what they do because of the Bible. We have showed that their bases (the Bible) is highly flawed, thus their belief system is constructed on a flawed book.

reply to post by TruthParadox


I rather like the Ten Commandments, Moses spoke to God and they didn't even bother with witnesses. How foolish, later in time, people like you were going to come along and question the Truth. Dumb move by God, that.

Originally posted by Good Wolf
Aww, TP! I wanted to take this one. Simply is fun.

Lol no worries. There's room for both of us - this thread is like Noahs arc .

Originally posted by redled
1. Bible proves that what it proclaims (God) is bollox.

O RLY?

Originally posted by redled
2. The Bible is obviously bollox.

O RLY?

Originally posted by redled
3. The Bible proves nothing.

O RLY?


Forgive me if I'm not in shock and awe .

Originally posted by TruthParadox

Originally posted by Good Wolf
Aww, TP! I wanted to take this one. Simply is fun.

Lol no worries. There's room for both of us - this thread is like Noahs arc

.

You mean ever expanding to accommodate all the newly discovered species that we find. I think the Ark (spelt with a 'k') must be the size of a small city by now.

Originally posted by Good Wolf
You mean ever expanding to accommodate all the newly discovered species that we find.

Indeed .

Originally posted by Good Wolf
I think the Ark (spelt with a 'k') must be the size of a small city by now.

Ah. Forgive the typo. Even I make mistakes - I know, I was surprised too when I first found out.

Edit to add: I also noticed that I left out the apostrophe... How horrid .

[edit on 7-12-2008 by TruthParadox]

reply to post by TruthParadox


These days when ever I hear or read "Ark" I think 'Halo 2". What a fantastic series.

Originally posted by Good Wolf
These days when ever I hear or read "Ark" I think 'Halo 2". What a fantastic series.

Ah... more synchronicity...
I just got a working xbox cable today and was playing Halo 2 for hours . For the first time in like... 2 years.

edit to add: I just noticed that I've been doing a lot of the '...' thing lately... I think I got it from reading too many of nj2day's posts .

[edit on 7-12-2008 by TruthParadox]

reply to post by TruthParadox


ME TOO (ish - I just busted it out for fun)!!!

What a spooky coincidence.

reply to post by Good Wolf


AND we're both 19, male, hardcore disbelievers, and ATS members.
What are the odds .
I used to be impressed by crazy coincidences, but they seem to happen to me all the time lately lol. I'm starting to think it has something to do with quantum entanglement (as crazy as it sounds).