Science (15 Billion years) vs Creation (6 days) maybe they are saying the same thing

Originally posted by spy66

Is it right to say that God created everything in six days!

only if you believe the impossable

When God also say that a day is like a 1000 years,and a 1000 years is like a day.
You can grow one heck of a garden in a 1000 years

that still puts you off by a factor of billions

if you compare the time scale to taking a walk your saying its reasonable to believe san franciso is only 27 yards from new york city ...... all the evidence goes agaiunst this conclusion too including 30 yard tape measures

And remember we can destroy everything on this planet in less then a day.

no we cant we can make it unlivable for us and many complex organsims but there is bacteria that can and will survive

and it wouldnt even effect the life at the bottom of the ocean around black smokers and brine pools

Then imagine the power that God has.

none unless he cares to prove it was him

other wise he has only as much power as i decide to give him and persoanlly i think an angry unicorm with a magic horn trumps a beardy old guy any day so shall we start the church of the magic unicorn and begin to pray?

false reasoning gives false answers

the power to imagine somthing doesnt make it real, and using this line of thinking to try and prove it is even more absurd

even a childs reasoning of santa has more basis of proof then this

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

Originally posted by noobfun
persoanlly i think an angry unicorm with a magic horn trumps a beardy old guy any day so shall we start the church of the magic unicorn and begin to pray?

We, as feeble humans are not allowed to pray directly to the magic unicorn... instead we must ask our priests to pray to him for us...

However, all this will someday change when Pegasus comes to earth and dies for our sins...

edit: It appears your new religion might already have a symbol


[edit on 29-11-2008 by nj2day]

Originally posted by nj2day
We, as feeble humans are not allowed to pray directly to the magic unicorn... instead we must ask our priests to pray to him for us...

However, all this will someday change when Pegasus comes to earth and dies for our sins...

and dont beleive the lies of other religeons they were set there to betray you from the one true bieng, placed there to confound and confuse your true faith by the evil one saddle of the darkness corrupter of all that is the unicorns good and holy work

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

reply to post by noobfun


The Unicorn is all powerful, capable of anything... How can people not understand this?

he devours the souls of the non-believers, leaving them to fester for eternity in his never-ending bowels...

I know this because He has said so...

What if all you nay-sayers are wrong about the Equine Almighty! at least I will be safe...

sorry... methinks we may be having too much fun with this

noob, have you seen this article?
sciencenow.sciencemag.org...

there's a thread on here somewhere about it...

we are getting close to understanding Anbiogenesis every day...

slightly off topic... but great find non-the less...

reply to post by nj2day


id say more proving the point while having fun

and they cant prove it wrong so it must be right! thats what said and if its good enough for thier religon its good enough for ours ^_^

thats awesome ive just read the first paragraph ill read the rest after this reply

we have already made most of the amino acids and one of the 4 components of dna simply by sticking what was naturally found in a jar and then doing nothing more then watching it

this coupled with the fact we can already make fully synthetic and functioning viruses

where will the god of the gaps choose as his next hiding place? i wonder if they have already tried to find a new spot for him

reply to post by noobfun


precisely! there's two different events being described in those passages. one is the original creation event. the other is the re-terraforming of the planet, which was already millions of years old.

the word for void is actually better translated from the hebrew as "chaos." the planet was not created in a chaotic state (says this elsewhere in a later book of the old testament). so what it is describing is 1) the original creation of the planet, 2) a major cataclysm that left the planet in chaos, 3) the aftermath of a cataclysm, and the re-terraforming of the planet.

the dry land was there, it was just covered in water -- the waters receeded and the dry land appeared.

the text doesn't translate well into english

[edit on 29-11-2008 by undo]

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by noobfun

 

the dry land was there, it was just covered in water

Then it wasn't... exactly... dry... was it...

sorry.... I couldn't resist... that almost made me snort coffee through my nose...






[edit on 29-11-2008 by nj2day]

reply to post by nj2day


hehe, correcto-mundo!
the waters receeded to reveal the land, which was already there

[edit on 29-11-2008 by undo]

reply to post by undo


Just so I can fully understand your stance, you're in favor of the creation, but believe the texts have been grossly mistranslated?

(addendum: this is to differentiate from the concept that it was nothing but a ball of water at that point, till the dry land was "spoken" into existence. )

reply to post by nj2day


not so much grossly mistranslated, just that english is not the optimum choice for translating the hebrew language.

reply to post by undo


ok, got it... and I would think anytime anything is translated, parts of the intent are lost...

now imagine Hebrew to Greek to Latin to English...

that doesn't bode well for keeping the text's origional meaning in tact...

what is your take on adam/eve then?

reply to post by nj2day


aye, so i have resorted to using strong's exhaustive concordance and the etymology of the ancient languages, to find the original words and their roots. that's been verrrry interesting.

Originally posted by undo


the word for void is actually better translated from the hebrew as "chaos." the planet was not created in a chaotic state (says this elsewhere in a later book of the old testament). so what it is describing is 1) the original creation of the planet, 2) a major cataclysm that left the planet in chaos, 3) the aftermath of a cataclysm, and the re-terraforming of the planet.

only nothing agrees with this no single piece of evidence

the fact the matter is here for the planet to form requires stars, through nuclear fission the force electrons and neutrons to bond creating elements(see . the periodic table)

your usual typical big yellow stars can fuse electrons to hydrogen to form any element up to iron, nd they spiut them out throughout thier lifetime and release it all at once when it goes nova and explodes

when a star becomes a red dwarf its fierce enough to fuse them from helium all the way through the rest of the table and probabily make a few we havnt found yet as well

so these elements bump into each other in space and start to bond(a totally observable natural process) to form molecules which bond again so on and so now we have large slabes of molecular chains(meteors asteroids comets floating around) they need somthing to help them get bigger, thier own gravity will do this

but with the help of a star to draw them in to a more confined space they are able to really get huge and form planets

the gravity puling them together casues massive friction the rocks begin to melt together and the heavier elements(metals) are pulled towards the center

so the further you go from the core the lighter the elements should self arrange

when we look at our planet we find exactly that the bulk of the heavier elements are found in the core and get lighter as you draw outwards

there is no first forming second forming just forming

and you need steps 4 and 6 to make step 1 and 2 work

so it is wrong

the dry land was there, it was just covered in water -- the waters receeded and the dry land appeared.

if it was covered by water it wasnt dry land then was it .....

and the rocks were still forming when it was still to hot for water molecules to be liquid

so nope, and becasue water when it returns to a liquid state all gravitate towards the lowest points the earth was probvabily never entirely covered in water there was always land

you could say the land was covered in steam but thats simply trying to make the texts fit the reality, and if an argument cant stand on its own merits its a poor one

the text doesn't translate well into english

they fare even worse when translated into science

its a list of what people saw around them and they gave an order to thier creation and a story to explain it, nothing more

its a great story dont get me wrong but it is just a story

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

reply to post by undo


what does your studies tell you about the origins of man...

from what I understand the original meaning of the word we translate as "adam" was "Little red dirt men" (note plural), and "eve" being "the mothers of all mothers"

reply to post by noobfun


well i view it much the same way as i view captain picard asking the computer to create a cup of "Tea. Earl Grey. Hot."
if science can dream it up, it will eventually learn how to approximate the same thing (i say approximate because i believe somethings are outside the realm of known or knowable physics). everything in existence is composed of matter, which can be arranged and reshaped


remember, you're talking about a "super" (as in hyper) natural being of a race known in ancient texts as the Elohiym.

reply to post by undo


o_0 ahh the joys of NOMA

well if religeon wants science to keep of its turf it better get its big muddy boots of sciences lawn

this is the simple foundation of the god of the gaps thinking

trying to explain scienctific facts by religeous means is trampling the loverly flower beds and its not really appreciated

the fact we cant disprove a supreme bieng (who just happens to be unobservable except for every bit of the bible) doesnt mean he exists anymore then the fact you cant prove he exists means he does

but we can look at the probability of it and it doesnt bode well

even if we make the wild assumption thier is a divine bieng that made it

theres an infinate number of possible biengs, the odds of picking the right one are 1:infinity

with every new understanding the odds of thier bieng a supreme ultimate bieng who made such shoddy work is already rediculously low and just keeps getting greater

youve pegged your bet on a 1:infinity coupled with a near 1:infinty

and try to say its the only truth

what you beleive it to be isnt what it is, its like beleiveing an umbrella is a mobile fold away water collection device and thats the sole reason it was made and no other possable reason can exist

as soon as someone turns it right side up and hands you a cup it makes more sense

now explain where the elohym came from with out using an infinity reduction and just saying god is the terminator of it

which still wouldnt grant him an devine powers

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]

reply to post by noobfun


i actually believe we (homo sapiens) aren't from this planet, to begin with, and there was another race here before we were brought here. but that's another topic. so yeah, i believe there's a huge gap in the opening passages of Genesis and that it was the churches that misinterpreted it, not the fault of the text itself (although the english translation is wobbly!).

Originally posted by undo
i actually believe we (homo sapiens) aren't from this planet, to begin with, and there was another race here before we were brought here. but that's another topic. so yeah, i believe there's a huge gap in the opening passages of Genesis and that it was the churches that misinterpreted it, not the fault of the text itself (although the english translation is wobbly!).

very wobbly and in the wrong order

but you still didnt expalin where the creator came from

and beleif in aliens did it is still a form of religeon, it is belief without evidence and often inspite of the evidence

[edit on 29/11/08 by noobfun]