The great flood.

Originally posted by Sparky63
It may seem too simplistic for some, especially those that deny the existance of God, but the Bible clearly states that Faith is not a possession of all men.

but all the bible proves is what the bible says in it,

not that it really is the whole truth nothing but the truth, or even a tiny bit of truth

Modern science does not know how the ancients constructed many of the massive structures that exist or existed,

examples?

so until the Ark is found

cant find what likley never existed

and scientists have the opportunity to examine it constructon, people should not dogmatically conclude that it would not be sea worthy.

its not the construction method its the fact its so large and made of wood which kinda sucks for making large ships from

the design isnt the problem its the materials at hand that are

IF God could cause this catastrophe, He could sure ensure the safety of the passengers, human & non human, on the ark.

but can you prove he could?

sorry the entire posts pure speculation with a bible quote thrown in for good measure

This does a pretty good job of dealing with the various logical fallacies with the Biblical Account and why the origin of the story dealing with a local shepard is the most likely.

It makes no sense not because of the story, but because of the interpretation of it.

You assume the Ark was one, but God spoke to Noah and his son's.

You are mislead to believe "The Ark" is a boat, but it is not.

In short, the translators of the bible made an assumption and bad translation of an undetermined word rendered Kfa. Please view this sitting from wikipedia on the handling the most important piece of evidence in finding the Ark

[color=#993300]Gopher wood From Wikipedia
A painting of Noah's Ark, said to be constructed from gopher wood. Gopher wood or gopherwood is a term used once in the Bible, for the substance whose identity is unknown from which Noah's ark was built. Contents [hide] * 1 Question over identity * 2 Fictional references * 3 External links * 4 References [edit] Question over identity Gen 6:14 states that Noah built the Ark of גפר (gofer, more commonly gopher) wood, a word not otherwise known in the Bible or in Hebrew. The Jewish Encyclopedia believes it was most likely a translation of the Babylonian "gushure i÷ erini" (cedar-beams), or the Assyrian "giparu" (reed).[1] The Greek Septuagint (3rd–1st centuries BC) translated it as xylon tetragonon, "squared timber".[2] Similarly, the Latin Vulgate (5th century AD) rendered it as lignis levigatis, "smoothed (possibly planed) wood". Older English translations, including the King James Version (17th century), simply leave it untranslated. Many modern translations tend to favour cypress (although the word for "cypress" in Biblical Hebrew is brosh), following Adam Clarke, a Methodist theologian famous for his commentary on the Bible: Clarke cited the resemblance between Greek word for cypress, kuparisson and the Hebrew word gophar, although Greek and Hebrew are not related languages and the linguistic resemblance is superficial. Other suggestions include pine, cedar, fir, ebony, wicker, juniper, acacia, boxwood, slimed bulrushes and resinous wood, and even American trees such as Cladrastis kentuckea, or American yellowwood, although this type of gopherwood has no known relation to the material of Noah's Ark. Others, noting the physical similarity between the Hebrew letters g and k, suggest that the word may actually be kopher, the Hebrew word meaning "pitch"; thus kopher wood would be pitched wood. Recent suggestions have included a lamination process (to strengthen the Ark), or a now-lost type of tree, but there is no consensus.[3]

[color=#336666]
The word in question is Kefa. Kph..Kopher which means stone in Stone in hebrew and is where we derive Coffin.

[color=#333333]
Here are the instructions with *stone replacing wood:

Gen 6:14 `Make for thyself an ark of *stone; rooms dost thou make with the ark, and thou hast covered it within and without with *stone;
Gen 6:15 and this is that which thou dost with it: three hundred cubits is the length of the ark, fifty cubits its breadth, and thirty cubits its height;
Gen 6:16 a window dost thou make for the ark, and unto a cubit thou dost restrain it from above; and the opening of the ark thou dost put in its side, --lower, second, and third stories dost thou make it.

A cubit is a volume, not a distance. Also, the numbers can be used in ratio 300/50/30/1 noting the odd similarity gone unnoticed for thousands of years of "restrain it to a cubit (that being one) above"...

Here is a layout of the "The Great Pyramid". The Arc


Bow:
It is Orions Bow that is set in the heavens, not the rainbow as the reminder from God. " I set my bow in the heavens..."

Names:
Names are important to consider. English readers are not getting a direct translation of the words integral to understanding the truth.

Noach is how Noah is spelled. This name means rest. Insert "Rest" into the scripture where you see noahs name appear and re-read. Also consider when seeing it properly, it now no longer is resourcing an individual, but an action. "But rest found grace in the eyes of the Lord".

Design:
What would be the best design to withstand water pressure?

Locations:
All over the world, with Noah's sons...Sirian Zigurauts, Egyptian pyramids, Mayan Temples, stone with ornate design.

Numbers:
7 clean pair, 2 unclean pair

Animal determined from: "To be Mute"

7 Warm Land masses 2 Frozen poles

Mountains:
Ararat Erets...Earth

Ark:
Tay-baw in hebrew, based from Egyptian again meaning coffin.

We Rest in Coffins...Noah's Ark.

"Nothing is hidden, since the beginning of the world..."

Peace



[edit on 19-11-2008 by letthereaderunderstand]

How did they get koalas in the ark/arc and how did they get them back to Australia afterwards?

Originally posted by Velvet Death
Or fleas, ticks, flies, mosquitos, viruses, rats, mice, a whole lot of bad bugs and worms, snakes, parasites, harmful bacteria. Noah had a chance to leave all these pests behind so we can blame him for all these things. That is if it were real and not a fairy tale.

how deadfully irresponsible of Noah

come to think - was God being an absolute prankster when he created those things?

er -substitute the word prankster with any word of your own choosing please

reply to post by Essan


No one lived...The ark is for rememberence. A coffen and headstone.

No flesh survived. Life is new, in very short times it re-flours into full grown sentient. Dead species re appear. It was a seed vault if you will.

Peace

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand

maybe its just me reading it wrong

but your saying noahs ark isnt the story of a man in a boat full of animals

but a metaphore for continental drift?


*if i am totally reading this wrong im sorry ive just replied to a post on evolution and its so large its gone 2 posts long so my heads all fuzzy*

[edit on 19/11/08 by noobfun]

I'm even more confused. - So the Ark was a stone temple that contained dna/seeds?

Anyway, I was actually given the wholesome treat of talking to a (christian) creationist today. So, in my giddilly delighted euphoria, I asked her what she thought of the story of Noah's ark. She said "what do you mean?" "Well, do you think it's true?" I asked. "Of course!" She said, like I was stupid. "What people don't understand is that there is no mention of time. It was probably a process that occured over a long time. And they don't mention the size of the boat". OK, but what about the marsupials in Australia?" I quizzed. "What do you mean?; she eyed me suspiciously. "I mean, they're native to that continent. They don't exist anywhere else. If the story of Noah is true, then he sailed to Australia and picked up 2 of each, right? They survived the flood, right, so he either went there and picked them up, or there is something wrong with the story of Noah, right?" She replied "I don't know. I believe in the bible. I have someone at our church who knows the answer to such things".
"But what do you think. Does it sound pheasible Noah could have sailed to Australia within 40 days and picked up the marsupials. Also picked up a bunch of creatures from Africa, the Arctic and Antarctic? What about bacteria and algae and fauna and insects? Do you really think that's really possible?" "I don't know." she said again. "I'll have to ask at the church". was her final comment.
So there you have it, a creationist who would rather follow whatever she's told rather than face the obvious flaws of the good books logic. Indeed, rather than have to think for herself, she will take and regurgitate whatever is given to her, no matter how stupid or implausible, illogical or reality-defying it sounds.
It really cemented my opinion creationists are muppets.

reply to post by noobfun


Exactly....but then again the story of animals on a boat was never what the story was about...

We add all the glitz in our desire to be told, not learn. "Give someone an inch, they will take a mile"

Peace

reply to post by letthereaderunderstand


So you don't think then that the tale is a plagerisation of the epic of Gilgamesh?

reply to post by cruzion


I am lost as to why people brush right over the importance of knowing what the translations actually said. If you look at the description of what "Rest"(noah) is to build, it is the pyramid...not a boat. Study the words, and you will see the boat you are looking for is a deception.

You are all gods, but their are others, no better then any of you, getting the better of you right now. Simple deceptions, done right in front of you blind you to seeing the power you possess, it is natural...all of us are blind only some have massed and recall. They do everything to make sure you don't remember who you are...you do everything to make sure you don't remember who you are...They and You are the same.

People are brainwashed into believing that the bible is infallible and that scribes who Jesus himself warned people of would not "alter" things. People are fallible, and God being true and able the reflection of each of us has no master, yet you're own and my own drink up over you, drain you drop for drop in every aspect, even in the hidden ways. Anything written on paper, is a doctrine of man. Spirit is spirit. When it says God's words are spirit...they are spoken and completed Cause Full fill. Drop by drop.

If, as the wikipedia article on Gopher Wood is correct which I sited, translators have been using a false description of what the ark is constructed of since it went into print, the bible, meaning everyone is looking for a boat, but it is not a boat, so the questions of animals and dinosaurs and australia will never receive a proper answer.

I believe the building material being in question is very valid to understanding an important mystery in our past and also the functions these ARCs actually played...instead of thinking they harness magic and stuff, why not look at reality?

Peace

Originally posted by noobfun
just for the record an Ark is also a cube or rectangle,
and its not the most sea worthy, its the largest ever built and that includes steel and iron built ships
a ship of those dimensions made from wood would leak like a sieve

You are absolutely incorrect in every aspect.
The ratio of dimensions of the ark are still used today in building large, stable, vessels such as aircraft carriers:

Its length to width ratio of six to one provided excellent stability on the high seas. In fact, modern shipbuilders say it would have been almost impossible to turn over.

I have seen your posts before, and you seem to be on quite the agenda to dispute anything you consider to be Christian, I have to wonder why you find Christianity to be such a threat.

Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by letthereaderunderstand

 

So you don't think then that the tale is a plagerisation of the epic of Gilgamesh?

I haven't studied the Akkadian language. I couldn't say for sure, but when similar stories arrive from all over the world regardless of the oldest recorded tradition of it I am able to determine from the meanings of the names incorporated into the various regions stories, not the names themselves, but the actual meanings to determine if simularity exists
across cultural bounds. ex. Rock is Rock no matter what phonetic sound is employed, so to do the names work. Yisrael means "he will rule as God"...why do we say Yisrael? It should be, when called "He will rule as God", and not Hey Yisrael. Yisrael could be a nick name, but without the meaning of the nick you are lost. Make any sense?

I think they are all the same story Good Wolf. If you look at the bible...all the books...It is all the same story...different variations of names...same struggle.

This is where the Mayan help us. You know how the Mayan calander is as a condenseing of the same space and exponential as the time shortens it also quickens at the same rate of the previous cycle only in scaled space.

The bible stories read like this. Imagine the bible is a 3d cube where you are reading the entire thing at once. The shifts are variables, but the pivots remain solid. This is the bible.

They are wheel with in wheel.

Peace

Originally posted by noobfun

so until the Ark is found

cant find what likley never existed

many believe that it has already been found:
This is Noah’s Ark
As a matter of fact, the Bible is not the latest record of the existence of the Ark, it is mentioned by Flavius Josephus in his writings The Antiquities of the Jews

6. Now all the writers of barbarian histories make mention of this flood, and of this ark; among whom is Berosus the Chaldean. For when he is describing the circumstances of the flood, he goes on thus: "It is said there is still some part of this ship in Armenia, at the mountain of the Cordyaeans; and that some people carry off pieces of the bitumen, which they take away, and use chiefly as amulets for the averting of mischiefs." Hieronymus the Egyptian also, who wrote the Phoenician Antiquities, and Mnaseas, and a great many more, make mention of the same. Nay, Nicolaus of Damascus, in his ninety-sixth book, hath a particular relation about them; where he speaks thus: "There is a great mountain in Armenia, over Minyas, called Baris, upon which it is reported that many who fled at the time of the Deluge were saved; and that one who was carried in an ark came on shore upon the top of it; and that the remains of the timber were a great while preserved. This might be the man about whom Moses the legislator of the Jews wrote."

Originally posted by noobfun

IF God could cause this catastrophe, He could sure ensure the safety of the passengers, human & non human, on the ark.

but can you prove he could?

Which, that there was a flood, or that there was an ark?

[edit on 11/20/2008 by defcon5]

How long ago was this flood? Must have been a long time back since presumably any creosote bushes alive at the time would have died under all that water? And we know some of them are about 12,000 years old .....

Why don't you just read the bible?

Originally posted by masterweb
Why don't you just read the bible?

Is there mention in the bible when this deluge happened?
As far as I'm aware, there isn't any mention of time-frames.
I'd gladly stand corrected if you know otherwise.

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


There are more than 270 flood traditions/stories in the world today and all include 8 souls and animals on a boat...

I wonder why the whole of the world, from Africa to Central America to Hawaii all have the same flood story and all about the same date...

Here's an interesting overview of multiple angles and facets of the Noah flood story, if anyone is interested.

www.skepdic.com...

I'll just add that this is a sceptical overview.

[edit on 20-11-2008 by cruzion]

reply to post by theindependentjournal


May I please something to validate that besides some creationist spin doctors? Each culture has some kind of flood story, but the details are all way out of line.