The Christians hating gays contradiction, page 10

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:16 PM

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Originally posted by MAINTAL
"he without sin, cast the first stone"

Coming from the guy who said that he wasn't coming to change Gods law, hence the old testament.

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:18 PM

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The new testament is not plan B
It is part of the continued plan from the beginning.
It reveals itself in inexplicable ways, the scripture is more than just words.
There is MORE, but it is hidden and must be hunted like a treasure.
Scripture is only the map. It is the things that are hidden that have real value.

"We speak about the mystery of God's wisdom. It is a wisdom that has been hidden, which God had planned for our glory before the world began." 1 Corinthians 2:7

Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy
reply to post by Deaf Alien

One would surmise as much since they say Every Word is the infallible Word of God.

However, as I pointed out, they have a Plan B when they get cornered about obvious neglect of God's Word:

New Covenant

When it supports their argument EVERY WORD is to be followed to the T. When it doesn't support their argument, the New Covenant logic overrides the OT Law. It's ridiculous.

Deaf Alien

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:20 PM

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reply to post by MAINTAL

Tell that to Jesus when he suggested to those who were about to stone the harlot saying: "he without sin, cast the first stone" Guess that kinda screws up your whole argument eh

Nope, it doesn't. Christians use that verse in the old testament against homosexuality. My point was why don't they also pick the ones that commands to stone people to death and that says that slavery is okay?
Pick one, pick all. Or don't pick at all.

Clearskies

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:20 PM

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reply to post by Good Wolf

Jesus FULFILLED the Old Testament.
He didn't stone women or gays. He didn't start a war, because God had FULFILLED His promise to the jews and was opening a gate to ALL, Jew, gentile, men, women.
Jerusalem was no longer under the covenant of rituals and sacrifice.
The old passed away and all became new.
Jesus said "My Kingdom is not of this world".

Good Wolf

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:23 PM

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reply to post by Clearskies

So why then do christians call gays sinners if the old testament is fulfilled?
As alien says; pick one, pick all or don't pick at all.

jakyll

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:23 PM

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reply to post by MAINTAL

His design for Marriage was between a man and a woman That when he spoke sex sin such as adultery and fornication sex before marriage THAT DUH YEAH,, THAT MEANS SEX ANY SEX AND ALL SEX BEFORE MARRIAGE FALLS UNDER SEX SIN.

I guess that means gay married cpl's who have sex or not sinners then.

And those Christians who spew out hatred to gay people are actually harming themselves more than a homosexual is harming themselves or anyone else.As the bible teaches,if you can not forgive another then God will not forgive you.

Good Wolf

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:32 PM

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reply to post by Clearskies

Look here's the thing. God made the universe, God made nature. The study of nature (God's creation) is science. When we look at science we see that homosexuality is natural and even functional as a population control[all the latest studies are saying].

This being the case then God made gays, gay and he made then for a purpose (which is why they are gay in the first place).

When we study the bible it says that homosexuality is wrong, but then jesus made that part of the bible null when "He fulfilled the old testament"

That seems fairly logical to me.

[edit on 11/14/2008 by Good Wolf]

MAINTAL

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:35 PM

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Originally posted by Good Wolf

Coming from the guy who said that he wasn't coming to change Gods law, hence the old testament.

Knock it off good wolf,, Jesus didn't come to change the law he came to fulfill it. Jeez I may as well put you on ignore now. I can see you're a lot of exercise and it's all minutia especially when it wouldn't make a damn difference to you what I said. You aren't about explaining why a contradictions in the Bible are incorrect, that with more education and less angst aggression toward the Bible you see that simply isn't true.

I don't spend my days googling for searches like you do for example: Dirt on the Bible" or Contradictions of the Bible, etc"

You are about promoting them as such and that, you spend more time involved in than most Christians I know, do just reading the Bible.

Have a nice life wolf

Iggy time

Wordshavepower

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:37 PM

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Read Jude
comes right before Revelations
There IS more to come

Originally posted by Good Wolf
reply to post by Clearskies

Look here's the thing. God made the universe, God made nature. The study of nature (God's creation) is science. When we look at science we see that homosexuality is natural and even functional as a population control[all the latest studies are saying].

This being the case then God made gays, gay and he made then for a purpose (which is why they are gay in the first place).

When we study the bible it says that homosexuality is wrong, but then jesus made that part of the bible null when "He fulfilled the old testament"

That seems fairly logical to me.

[edit on 11/14/2008 by Good Wolf]

whoswatchinwho

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:37 PM

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If god were real why would he make things so difficult for people to believe in him,

why are the scriptures like a treasure hunt?

If he has everything planned out isn't the whole arguement academic, theres no point in debateing if nothings going to change.

Jesus himself may have been gay, why does he keep refering to John as "the disciple he loved" why does he single him out? surely he loved them all the same. or does this refer to a hidden love.

"in Matthew 8:5-13: and Luke 7:2: "One day a Roman Centurion asked him to heal his dying servant. Scholars of both Scripture and Ancient History tell us that Roman Centurions, who were not permitted to marry while in service, regularly chose a favorite male slave to be their personal assistant and sexual servant. Such liaisons were common in the Greco-Roman world and it was not unusual for them to deepen into loving partnerships....Jesus offered to go to the servant, but the centurion asked him simply to speak a word of healing, since he was not worthy to welcome this itinerant Jewish teacher under his roof. Jesus responded by healing the servant and proclaiming that even in Israel he had never found faith like this! So, in the one Gospel story where Jesus encountered people sharing what we would call a 'gay relationship,' we see him simply concerned about — and deeply moved by — their faith and love." Kelly implies that Jesus' sensitivity towards the gay couple might have arisen from his own bisexual or homosexual orientation. "

I'm not saying he was gay, I am saying the scripture can be read in many different ways.

Lucid Lunacy

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:38 PM

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Originally posted by MAINTAL
Jeez I may as well put you on ignore now

Ignoring members is so prevalent from the Christian fundies on ATS. I think it's because they are so prone to covering their eyes to begin with.

[edit on 14-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

Anonymous ATS

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:39 PM

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reply to post by ghaleon12

WEll if you think that people don't talk out against that , then you're wrong.Peopke talk out against it all the time. but people aren't going around and saying you all have to accept that men do their wives in the butt and teach our kids about it in school...

jakyll

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:39 PM

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reply to post by Clearskies

The old passed away and all became new.

Really?

Matthew 5:17-18

17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Here Jesus berates the Pharisees for not upholding the death penalty for those who do not honor their parents.

Matthew 15:3-6

3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Good Wolf

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:43 PM
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Originally posted by whoswatchinwho
Jesus himself may have been gay, why does he keep refering to John as "the disciple he loved" why does he single him out? surely he loved them all the same. or does this refer to a hidden love.

Lol. That'd be a laugh!

I'm not saying he was gay, I am saying the scripture can be read in many different ways.

You make a good point, that's why I say investing your mind into the bible is un-intellectual and just generally unwise.

Lucid Lunacy

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:44 PM
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Originally posted by MAINTAL
Yeah Jesus wasn't one to insult other peoples intelligence so much that we would have to actually wonder whether he was against a man sleeping with another man.

Or women sleeping with women.

They hyperfocus from the male Christian fundies on male gay sex is indicative of something else entirely

So let me translate your rebuttal to my point:

No Jesus said nothing anti-homosexual.

You can rationalize ALL DAY LONG on Jesus's behalf about "common sense" this "common sense that" but it does not change the absolute fact that the Bible contains zero anti-homosexual words from Jesus.

[edit on 14-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

MAINTAL

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:47 PM
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Originally posted by jakyll
reply to post by MAINTAL

His design for Marriage was between a man and a woman That when he spoke sex sin such as adultery and fornication sex before marriage THAT DUH YEAH,, THAT MEANS SEX ANY SEX AND ALL SEX BEFORE MARRIAGE FALLS UNDER SEX SIN.

I guess that means gay married cpl's who have sex or not sinners then.

Jeez you guys reach for anything, you know I was going to change that but I assumed that when I mentioned the design of marriage between a man and woman, I assumed people would have the common sense to know again.

And those Christians who spew out hatred to gay people are actually harming themselves more than a homosexual is harming themselves or anyone else.As the bible teaches,if you can not forgive another then God will not forgive you.

First of all, I have no idea who is gay and who is not. Invariably, I find out when gay people feel it is their civil duty to always have to "share" that information with me. I never ask and it is none of my business.

As for the rest of that, and my feelings about those who are gay,, by the grace of god there go I. I don't have any reason to be unforgiving but I have every reason to state as factually to them as they can state the thorns in my flesh as factually to me. I don't really care what gays do and if they ever get prop 8 there way, more power to them. I can't agree when they try to convolute the Bible to this extent that it's just Ok!

It isn't and neither are my own battles with the flesh

Good Wolf

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:52 PM
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Originally posted by MAINTAL
As for the rest of that, and my feelings about those who are gay,, by the grace of god there go I. I don't have any reason to be unforgiving but I have every reason to state as factually to them as they can state the thorns in my flesh as factually to me.

Lucky you, strait christian MAINTAL, you can do something about you thorns. Spare a though the gays who's 'thorns' can't be removed.

MAINTAL

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 08:56 PM
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Originally posted by Lucid Lunacy

So let me translate your rebuttal to my point:

No Jesus said nothing anti-homosexual.

You can rationalize ALL DAY LONG on Jesus's behalf about "common sense" this "common sense that" but it does not change the absolute fact that the Bible contains zero anti-homosexual words from Jesus.

[edit on 14-11-2008 by Lucid Lunacy]

Yeah and Jesus doesn't say anything about anti animal sex, sex with children, sex with goats for the same reason!

He expects you to have the common sense to know that since he ONLY talks about sex with a man and woman he never felt he had to explain
"Oh and by the way all you who may be thinking about things other than the man and woman concept I spoke of,, doesn't mean that those other things are OK too".

Jeez get REAL Lucid

[edit on 14-11-2008 by MAINTAL]

catinthebox

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 09:01 PM
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reply to post by crmanager

First women weren't considered equals
Then blacks were born black, captured, and enslaved because they were less than humans (Is a dark skin pigment also a disease like being a homosexual? Should they be working on a cure? If you owned a slave back then, you'd think so)
And now gays, come on, this is ridiculous.

Some people embrace ignorance, the problem is, that's not the motto.

Deaf Alien

posted on Nov, 14 2008 @ 09:03 PM
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reply to post by MAINTAL

He expects you to have the common sense to know that since he ONLY talks about sex with a man and woman he never felt he had to explain

Jesus had an opportunity to mention homosexuality when he mentioned Sodom. He never did.

Why the omission? Common sense? Bah! He mentioned OTHER sins, not homosexuality.