if i witness an alien or ufo.. this is the LAST PLACE ill present the evidence

Hi there, this thread is not meant to be a `lets bash each other thread` its a statement that if i have a ufo or et encounter this is the LAST PLACE ill provide my pics or videos. why? ill tell you why.. i can have a clear as day pic of an alien or ufo right above me and guess what? youll get the people who wouldnt believe anything even if it was staring them in their face, who`ll go `hoax`! ive seen evidence on here better than anything else yet they still scream `hoax`!

There is more evidence that there is an e.t phenomena than that jesus EVER EXISTED..... yet you get the ANNOYING SKEPTICS WHO have nothing better to do than either create hoax material to ridicule the believers or will scream `thats too blurry must be hoax` or `thats too clear its too good to be true that must be a hoax`

At the end of the day life isnt about impressing other people or proving things to other people... you know your own truth and i know in my heart of heart that there are other races who visit us, some friendly, some with an interest in us, possibly because we originated from the same place as them, and that we are evolving and will one day become like them.

With regards to the skeptics ill say this..... for you to believe that we are the ONLY species with any sort of intelligence is damn right ignorance!

And yes i know ill get the usual people with nothing better to do than attack the `o p` attack my writing, quote my phrases and try and twist them or winge and cry about how we`ve had this thread `so many times close it now` etc etc etc

ANSWER THIS................................ PROOVE TO ME THAT JESUS WHOM BILLIONS UPON BILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE WORSHIPED FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS EXIST...... NO DONT CHANGE THE SUBJECT... ANSWER THAT AND THEN GIVE ME YOUR RUBBISH ABOUT `WE HAVE NO EVIDENCE OF ETS EXISTING`

Some people make me sick, i dont care what a bored skeptic on the ats thinks of me... i know my truth and so do hundreds of thousands of other people and at the end of the day thats ALL THAT MATTERS,

from a very fed up and frustrated member who joined ats because he thought it was welcoming and open minded of alternative subjects... clearly i was wrong

[edit on 29-10-2008 by weneedtoknow]

well - in my short time here i've identified a few regular posters who seem to see ufos around every corner and under every bush. they tend to rabbit on about every minuscule bird, star and dot in the sky and claim it's absolute "proof!" pfff

quite frankly i'm sick of those types and if they give up posting it'll be a bloody relief!

first of all you are acting just like the people who you are dissing. How can you expect everyone in a PUBLIC forum to think the same way as you?

That being said, as you mature, you will come to see that everyone in this world is different and unique. But let me post what I posted in answer to the I want to discuss disinfo agents thread. It will help to understand why some act the way they do.

Now the skeptics can be seperated into several categories:

1. Those who deny even when faced with irrefutable proof because that belief would mean admitting to something that goes against what they want to believe.

2. Those who deny because they have never had an "in your face" belief changing experience.

3. Those who deny because it is more "mainstream" and are trying to hang with the "in" crowd.

4. Those who deny due to a mental safety response that would keep them insulated from stressful possible truth.

5. Those who enjoy taking the opposite side.

6. Those who are turned on or excited by calling others beliefs crazy.

7. Those who find that having nothing to prove is a much easier position to take than proving something.

Did I miss any?

Originally posted by weneedtoknow

ANSWER THIS................................ PROOVE TO ME THAT JESUS WHOM BILLIONS UPON BILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE WORSHIPED FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS EXIST

I can't prove it but others might be able to. I haven't studied the evidence. Just because people believe it does not make it true, especially when you're talking about religion. Faith is not proof and faith does not require proof.

from a very fed up and frustrated member who joined ats because he thought it was welcoming and open minded of alternative subjects... clearly i was wrong

You mean no one agrees with you? No one at all? Or is it just that not everyone agrees with you? Maybe you can find someplace where they do, but I doubt it. But then, I doubt a lot of things. I am a sceptic after all.

Yes, the FAKERS created the SKEPTICS, so it is the FAKERS who are the bottom line of the problem.

Intelligent yet open minded skeptics can be good to root out the fakers.....BUT......

Flamer skeptics who jut rip everything appart for no reason with no research behind it just look like immature idiots in my opinion....I just skip my eyes right past them or put them on block and it makes for a much more pleasant experience.

As for Jesus.....the verdict is still out there for me on that one.

I definatly believe in a creator or creative intelligent force in the universe, and like the principles in the bible, yet religon has given me too bad a taste in my mouth, and I just think a true creator would be MUCH higher, smarter, and just plain BETTER than the image they made out to be in religion.

I also think there really is no way to prove or disprove it without a real un-edited, un tampered with bible.....even THEN...is it just the men's INTERPRETATION of things or the way things really went down?

Blah blah blah, I'm talking to much now, lol...sorry.

I get the feeling you never actually read anything the "skeptics" say. First off, I don't think any of them have denied the existence of aliens, there's just no hard evidence to unequivocally say that they exist. Secondly, most of the "evidence" presented on this site is complete rubbish. A light in the night sky isn't evidence of any kind, it is so ambiguous that it could be pretty much anything. Even the Turkey footage is not going to change the minds of all the common people out there. The goal of the "skeptic" is to get hard physical evidence to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt to everyone that all of this is going on.

The way I see it, you think of ufology as more of a religion whereas the skeptics think of it as more of a science. You can believe whatever you want, but if you start going around claiming something as fact then you're going to get jumped on by those who want proof. I'm fairly certain most "skeptics" will agree that UFOs exist, however they will go on to say that that's all you can say. There is no evidence after that to make any kind of objective observation. So, you can hate on "skeptics" all you want because they don't conform to your world view, but they are an essential part to ufology. As I've mentioned before J. Allen Hynek would fall under your definition of skeptic and he did more for the field than anyone else. So, before you go on another one of your tirades about how skeptics are the bane of ufology maybe you should consider that most of the best investigators were skeptics.

I think this is a great place to voice any things that are hard to believe or strange. Why? The exact reasons you stated you would not do so.

Let me explain.

Personally, if I see any information that catches my interest but I am unsure of its "truthiness" (sorry I am a Colbert fan) I would post it here on ATS. I would do this because I know that the people on the other end of their computers will attack it with a vengeance if they have any inkling of hoax/fraud. I figure that if whatever it is I am talking about can make it thru all of the debunkers here, then there is a fairly reasonable chance it could be real/true.

Now this isn't an absolute by any means but I feel comfortable in saying that any issue that is "iffy" will be torn apart rather quickly if it is not accurate and plausible.

Just my 2cents

Regards,

reply to post by weneedtoknow


Wow.

I'm a believer that there are UFOs, and also a believer that SOME UFOs are not from this earth; however, I am also a critical thinker and I look to shoot holes in almost every sighting, even the two I've had....

Why?

Because evidence needs to be scrutinized, down to the minutia, if it is not subject to scrutiny the UFO believers lose credibility as objective researchers.

If you have a sighting, document everything, take a photograph if you can. Make a video. Write everything down. Report it to MUFON or another investigative agency. Post it on whichever board you feel comfortable to do so. But be prepared for a high level of scrutiny, which you should have yourself as well.


Sorry, but I'm critical of every claimed sighting, and I don't normally pay attention to "lights in the sky" videos unless they're corraborated by several remote witnesses and/or radar tracking.

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
i can have a clear as day pic of an alien or ufo right above me and guess what?

If you have evidence like that, everyone here would love to see it.

Fact is, in your time on ATS you have presented little in the way of evidence, outside of the twisted belief that attacking skeptics is a viable substitute.

If you have evidence, it will stand on it's own merits, regardless of any skeptic.

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
youll get the people who wouldnt believe anything even if it was staring them in their face, who`ll go `hoax`! ive seen evidence on here better than anything else yet they still scream `hoax`!

This accusation has no basis in reality.

First, no such evidence, conclusive, incontrovertible and undeniable, has been presented. Since it has not been presented (though compelling evidence has), it is impossible for you to know how any skeptic would react in the face of such evidence. I think I can speak for every skeptic on this board in that we would welcome such evidence; we want such things to be true, but we are not convinced they are.

Second, "hoax" is not the first place any one runs, unless it is a hoax and can be demonstrated as such. And when it can be demonstrated as a hoax, it will be condemned as such by skeptics and believers alike. Disagreeing about the conclusions that can be drawn from the evidence is not tantamount to declaring a "hoax."

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
At the end of the day life isnt about impressing other people or proving things to other people... you know your own truth...

If that is the case, since you have no desire to prove that extraterrestrials are driving the UFO-and-related-phenomenon, and seem to have no desire for discussion or debate, why are you here? If you only want an echo chamber, then it is probably best you never express your views in a public forum; you will always find someone who disagrees with you.

Your admission proves what I wrote about in your previous thread: that your only interest is attacking those who dare to disagree with you.

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
With regards to the skeptics ill say this..... for you to believe that we are the ONLY species with any sort of intelligence is damn right ignorance!

The only person displaying ignorance here is you. At no point has any skeptic said that we are alone, or the only intelligent life. You are confusing a disbelief in extraterrestrials visiting the Earth with a disbelief in extraterrestrials. The ideas are not mutually-inclusive.

In point of fact, we have told you this time and time again. We do not believe we are alone; we are just not convinced extraterrestrials are visiting the Earth. You ignore this because it does fit with the caricature of skeptics you have in your head.

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
And yes i know ill get the usual people with nothing better to do than attack the `o p...

No one is attacking you for your beliefs. The only person attacking anyone for their beliefs is you. Disagreeing with you is not attacking you. Nor is debating you. No is discussing the motives for your attacks on skeptics.

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
ANSWER THIS... PROVE TO ME THAT JESUS WHOM BILLIONS UPON BILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE WORSHIPED FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS EXIST...

If someone had brought up Jesus as proof extraterrestrials are not visiting the Earth, you would have a valid argument. However as with the other thread, you are the only person who has brought up. Jesus is irrelevant to this discussion. Just because millions may believe in Jesus without evidence, it does not prove that extraterrestrials are visiting the Earth. You are confusing faith with fact.

In fact, your argument about Jesus does more to hurt your case than help it. What you have done is prove that people will believe something, despite lacking evidence to validate their belief. Sound familiar?

Originally posted by weneedtoknow
from a very fed up and frustrated member who joined ats because he thought it was welcoming and open minded of alternative subjects... clearly i was wrong

To be welcoming and open-minded, one has to be at least willing to listen to viewpoints contrary to their own. And ATS is; skeptics and believers alike are allowed and encouraged to discuss and debate. Your frustration is born of the fact you have been challenged. You only want to hear from those who agree with you, and wish to silence those who do not. That is the very epitome of closed-mindedness.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by SaviorComplex]

the trick is to ignore the ignorant, subjugated masses of sheep.

if everyone stopped passing on information due to the sheep, we would live in a very closed society indeed.

Originally posted by warrenb
the trick is to ignore the ignorant, subjugated masses of sheep.

if everyone stopped passing on information due to the sheep, we would live in a very closed society indeed.

So, everyone who disagrees with you are unthinking sheep? Such and attitude says more about you, and your own closed-mindedness, than them.

whether you post it here or not yourself... if it's to be found posted anywhere it'll likely find it's way here in the end.

Originally posted by ll__raine__ll
quite frankly i'm sick of those types and if they give up posting it'll be a bloody relief!

Now, now...

Even if we disagree with them and their...enthusiasm...they should be as welcome here as every one else.

The only people we should not welcome are those who only purpose is to decieve.

Originally posted by SaviorComplex
So, everyone who disagrees with you are unthinking sheep? Such and attitude says more about you, and your own closed-mindedness, than them.

The ongoing battle of us vs them.

Millions of examples to choose from, here's one:

When everyone thought the world was flat but a few knew otherwise, how was their news received? With skepticism, mud flinging and perhaps a hoot n' holler.

When one is presented with conclusive evidence or experiences/witnesses firsthand something and then try to relate that to others; there will always be skeptics. You can't try to change everyone's mind's, that would not only be futile but a gross waste of personal time and energy.

So what do you do? Focus on those with an open mind and interest in learning what you have to offer.

Originally posted by warrenb
When everyone thought the world was flat but a few knew otherwise, how was their news received? With skepticism...

Oh, this old canard.

Did you it ever occur to you that the skeptics were the ones who thought the world was round?

Originally posted by SaviorComplex
Did you it ever occur to you that the skeptics were the ones who thought the world was round?

I see you are well versed in the art of twisting conversation.

Actually your best bet might be the mainstream media, who are much more open to it these days. Then let the public decide.

It will eventually get discussed here if it is striking.

Also, NEVER talk about it without posting the picture/evidence with story.

Classic hoaxes involve withholding images and SHOULD BE classified as hoax until the evidence is presented. In fact, posts should be deleted if no pic or mentioned evidence is posted within the original posting.

That's the only way to keep things legit and in order.

If you came to ATS looking for a big giant fantasy land where everyone believes all of the idiotic crap people come up with off the top of their head, I assure you, this is not the place for you.

If you came to ATS looking for a place that discourages those very people from being part of the community in an effort to actually get to some solid evidence of [insert interest here] then this is THE place to be.

My stance on skeptism is simply this..

I would rather disbelieve 100 pieces of genuine evidence than believe in even one fraud.

just as i thought
replies and answers are more or less a imature `if you dont like it leave it` or somebody turning my words against me and accusing ME OF BEING NARROW MINDED!


Removed inflammatory content.

[edit on 29-10-2008 by dbates]

Originally posted by warrenb
I see you are well versed in the art of twisting conversation.

Not in the least. Your analogy does relate to the modern UFO phenomenon, but not in the way you think.

Few people in the past (at least) twenty-three centuries have actually believed the Earth was flat. The perception that our ancestors in the Middle Ages did is not born of truth, but rather the popularity of Washington Irving's Life and Voyages of Christopher Columbus. Among the few who did believe the Earth was flat, they had no evidence to validate their beliefs, and whatever evidence they could claim was obviously misinterpreted. One could draw an analogy to modern believers in extraterrestrial visitation.