[HOAX]Is my Grandfather a time traveler or a joker?[HOAX]

Originally posted by zorgon
So you are saying that you know for a fact that time has no mass?

Documents please

Assuming 'time' does exist, here is your document:
en.wikipedia.org...

Time is a fundamental unit. Mass is a fundamental unit. A fundamental unit is not made up of anything else - that includes other fundamental units.

Fundamental units are abstract, in other words, something scientists made up to make measurements easier. Time was created to record events, nothing more.

For example, instead of saying 'I had dinner 200 seconds ago', I could say 'I had dinner 7.587462E+10 events ago', but it's easier to use the time domain instead of the 'event' domain I just made up.

reply to post by daniel_g


Def a good comeback. But I would think it would take a theoretical physicist to come up with something to prove one way or the other.

I must say some of the science in this is very convincing I am an aspiring particle physicist and there is some highly theoretical science in here. And some that i believe have never been proposed. the whirlpool theory is very interesting to me. also how it supposedly works by using quantum tunneling to bury into deeper dimensions of the universe where time sits while our dimension passes is very plausible. either your a hoaxer with a great deal of background particle physics. or you are telling the truth. either way you should take it off the net.

Been a while since I've posted because during extensive UFO research my computer got bombed with over 50 viruses at once.

Anyway, I think we should all sit back, wait for 2017 and if there has not been a WWIII then book is fake. If a WWIII does occur in that time frame, that's 1 for the manual 0 for the non-believers. lol

EDIT:

So I did some figuring using the estimated times given. If there was a 22 year time of peace until the 2030's(using 2014 as the end date of WWIII and beginning of 22 year peace). Putting the next era of wars at 2036. Sometime after WWIV took place. According to the manual it will before the 22nd century. WWIV will have to end before 2050. The document states that after WWIV "For the next 50 years, humanity expanded throughout the stars..." On the next page it talks about the war between Earth and XYC(hmm XYC-XYZ?). It then states that after this war the 22nd century began.

So WWIV will have to be over by 2049 assuming the XYC war lasted merely one year. Based on the estimated times in the document the XYC war could last 1-9 years. So WWIV would have ended between 2040-2049 and would have began 2030-2039.

Other than the discontinuity between the correct spelling on the first page and the incorrect spelling later of "personnel". I noticed the English used is different from proper English today that would be used in such official documents. It is possible that time and war changed the languages of the world.

One example is in the sentence: "At the end of the 22 years peace, scientific research was once again halted for more military important research."

Please note the phrase "...more military important research..." The placement of "important" is not correct in our proper English. In order to make this sentence correct in our modern English. It would read: "more important military research." Although still this is a very awkward sentence and would be referred to as uneducated speech.

My final verdict. Either the hoaxer does not fully understand proper English especially for such an important organizational document. Or this is really from the future in which the English language has changed. Given about one hundred years this would be possible. Simply read a book written in 1908 and one written in 2008 and the differences should be fairly clear.

[edit on 16-8-2008 by crisrj214]

reply to post by crisrj214


it will come and go and the believers will just say it happened in another timeline.

reply to post by bknapple32


I don't know how to say this without looking like I'm talking down to you and I'm really not but this thread isn't about you or your level of education.

I'm not a document examiner but I am a certified graphoanalysist and even I didn't bring up the matter of the handwriting because there's so much other evidence suggesting that the document in question is not a field manual from the future, that I deemed it unnecessary.

It was a good story and I enjoyed it. Does that mean I believe it really happened? No. I believe a lot of things are possible, maybe even time travel. I don't think this document is any kind of evidence at all of any alleged time travel. Doesn't detract from the quality of the story. It needs work before becoming a best seller or anything but it was a good story all the same.

A new member asked for help proving or disproving a document and I think that goal has been accomplished. I hope he continues to contribute to ATS despite all the rough treatment he's received.

Originally posted by whitewave
reply to post by bknapple32

 

A new member asked for help proving or disproving a document and I think that goal has been accomplished.

So can this one be re-labeled as [HOAX] yet?

Originally posted by zorgon
But if paper ages as it goes forward in time what happens when it goes back in time?

i have no idea

but by your implication - the time traveler would also ` de-age `

so if you wanted an adult operative ` on the ground ready to go ` - you would have to use an octogenarian time traveler - and be limited to no grater than 60 year jumps

you cannot special plead - lol

Why are the edges burnt like a small kids treasure map? Why are there so many words spelled wrong? What good would all of this information do you while you have already time traveled? If the future was so much more intelligent wouldn't they at least be able to create correct sentences and use higher sciences then sending fish to time travel? What does this have anything to do with "space exploration"? None of this should even begin to make sense to the mind of a logical person. Its fake, its a hoax, maybe a project by some teen with a interesting imagination. There is no grandpa, its not even remotely convincing. Sorry but you fail. Also @ everyone who believes this crap.. seriously get a reality check.


Yours,
Anon~

We have no way to prove this one way or another.

Some fuzzy logic I'd like to point out-

-If this book came from another time then bad grammar, paper composition, juvenile-looking signatures, cut-and-paste pictures, type of media mean absolutely nothing. No one knows what kind of stuff the people of that time have or have not, can or can't do. Unless you're from that time and can vouch for authenticity, its all fun and games.

-Just because it looks like a hoax doesn't mean it is a hoax. Just because it looks old doesn't mean it is old. Looks are deceiving. Unless you're seeing it with your own eyes in front of you, it can be altered.

-Whether or not you consider this topic worthy of being here on ATS, you still had the neurons in your brain stimulated in some shape or form in one way or another. I personally found it to be entertaining to say the least.

My theory: a piece of literature that can be expanded to be turned into a good piece of fiction. Or perhaps it can be published as itself in its current state, bad grammar and all.

Edit: And I'm still curious about the science of it. Fictional or not. Also, how can this be labeled a hoax when boiled down to its simplest form this thread is about the science in this piece of writing being based in reality or not? The end result should not be calling this a hoax or authentic. It should be a yes, no, or maybe answer.


[edit on 16-8-2008 by danj3ris]

Could you re-scan a page, but put a ruler of some kind on there as a measurement? I'd like to see it overlap the edge of the page, please.

Interesting, but my gut says a digitally composited fake..

GrandPa was a budding sci-fi fantasy writer and it looks as if he left you a draft he wrote of a story line that he never finished.That is all it is,nothing more,nothing less.

reply to post by whitewave

White, if you have the credentials the way you say, then you certainly could agree you could use the green sheet to determine all the info necessary.

Originally posted by eaganthorn
reply to post by mental modulator

 

dude, click on the image to see the full piece.

[edit on 16-8-2008 by mental modulator]

wow ... good job dude! no seriously. that was well done. those documents are an obvious fake but it looks like you've put some real work into it!

cheers!

I'm skeptical of it all, but if your grandpa really did leave you such a creative piece of work, I believe he would want you to possibly turn it into a science fiction book or something of that nature. Perhaps that was why it was left behind. You could probably profit from such interesting material.

To everyone who is ripping this document for its poor grammar and claiming it fake for this reason I pose this theory ...

Look at how much language has changed from the past to the present. Then take a look at all of this "text speak" and how the idiotic British were going "2" include misspelled words (and Americanisms) in their dictionary. I remember reading an article about it on BBC recently. So "wot" I am getting at is how spelling, grammar "n" language "r" ever changing.
If this manual is "2 b" placed in "d" future "den" maybe future people were just crap "@" grammar and spelling "cos" of this exact reason of ever changing language

Some people asked what his occupation was....

If I was a time traveler stuck in the past my occupation would be "gambler".

But I have a feeling grandpa didn't exist, at least not in reference to this topic.

No offense to the OP if his story is true, but after looking over these documents and reading most of the thread....

It seems to me that the existence of the Grandfather in the hoax is to:

1. Gain sympathy for the hoaxer.

2. Distance the hoaxer from the hoax he is perpetrating.

It's actually a pretty good ploy. Rather than simply saying: "I am a time traveler, here is my manual," like many hoaxers attempt, he adds a buffer between himself and the hoax. The Grandfather isn't around to tell his side of the story. Which leaves only the document, which is pretty obviously fake to everyone except those that display the most "open" minds.

You can smell this one from mile away.

Originally posted by george_gaz
To everyone who is ripping this document for its poor grammar and claiming it fake for this reason I pose this theory ...

The problem is the fact that personal and personnel are homonyms. That's not grammar or spelling evolution. That's a functional change in the use of the English language.

If this were the case it would contain many such discrepancies.

It would be like reading Shakespeare.