Who is behind climate change deniers?

reply to post by jsobecky
Hey, thanks for the link! No one can disagree that there is a larger amount of CO2 in the air than just a decade ago. The difference is I think of it as a plentiful source of carbon to be used. I'm wondering if concentrated CO2 couldn't be used to increase crop growth, so this is very interesting to me...

reply to post by Lethil
I completely agree with you about energy sources changing in the future. They will. but that is a lot different than taxing and financially forcing people to use what some idiot from a tobacco farm says we should do. Plastic is another matter. I doubt we will ever 'outgrow' artificial materials like plastic. It would be nice if we could make trash out of something not so permanent, though.

TheRedneck

Glad to see many people at ATS actually take a closer look at this issue before deeming it "irrefutable".

I would just like to add that as we just saw an example here, there is an almost a zealous, fanatical, blind trust in the story of man made global warming to the point where all deniers are heretics, on par with holocaust deniers (I'm sure you remember that news from the breaking news section).

I mean come on, they keep shouting "show me scientific proof" and when you do you suddenly stop hearing from them. Just like they silenced the group of scientist not agreeing with their propaganda at one of the enviro meetings at the UN

LOL... used to be called "Global Warming" but now there is a shift to "climate change" so that this theory can be utilized no matter what the outcome.

Anyway, here is the deal... man made carbon may or may not be impacting us but as already stated, there is no irrefutable proof.

The whole "religion" is controlled by what? Wait for it..... Money & power.

The entire carbon credit scam is nothing more than empowering more "paper traders" to get rich buying and selling carbon credits. They in turn fund the politicians. The "corrupt" rich get richer and the "people" get stuck with the bill. This is another cover for stealing more taxpayer money and lining the pockets of the "corrupt" elite. Also, look at the power they acquire... to tell everyone what they can and cannot do under the guise of "heresy".. oops I mean environmental impact.

This is the biggest cash cow since the military industrial complex and actually is a much bigger power grab. (Look at all the bribes it will take to get anything done!)

The UN also loves this since they lost the battles of taxing international travel (and many others) and now have a way to increase their corrupt influence into the mix.

Hey, I would love to have a car that utilized electrolysis to burn water but I do not see that happening. Please remember the motivation here. Once they pass these laws, they will never go away… climate change will never go away. There will be to much money in it.





[edit on 2-8-2008 by infolurker]

[edit on 2-8-2008 by infolurker]

[edit on 2-8-2008 by infolurker]

I agree with the OP. There are folks so hell bent on disproving climate change that it makes you wonder what the hell is going on with that. They could fry like bacon and still deny the earth was warming! They sit back and declare that they know more than the 1000's of the worlds top peer reviewed climate scientists. Arm chair scientists they are like Rush Limbaugh and the Fox News crew.

My only thought is there is such a paranoia towards the NWO (or which I too am concerned) that they automatically throw climate change into that conspiracy. Wake up people and start seeing the signs! If you have children or grandchildren, do you not care that the planet may be forever altered due to your stupidity? Man's footprint on this planet is HUGE, and for folks to not see this is foolish and insane.

Originally posted by TheRedneck

Another little tidbit. CO2 is slightly heavier than air. That means it does not rise quickly to the upper levels of the atmosphere. It remains fairly close to the ground (which, incidentally, is where the plants are. Isn't it wonderful how that works out?). Thusly, the 'blanket' of CO2 is nowhere near as thick as the atmosphere in general. It's a very thin, very light blanket that has existed longer than mankind and still hasn't wiped out all life on the planet.

You should stop making sense or the UN will not get their global tax out of everyone on the planet. It also seems like they want us to think humans are horrible beings ruining the planet so that they can be exterminated for the good of the planet.

Rubbish!

Thank you, Redneck, for brining some common sense to this forum.

People need to wake up and see how they are being manipulated. Pollution is a problem but it can be fixed. It can be fixed without killing anyone. There is always more than one solution to any given problem.

As soon as you have terminology like "deniers" you have moved toward the dark side.

Being "green" will ultimately end in "population control" (euphemism for killing people.)

reply to post by whatsup
Then here's a challenge, if you're so sure of your position. Prove it, scientifically. Prove to me that a drastic reduction in CO2 levels will somehow benefit the environment. Prove to me that the planet will continue to warm and that this will somehow disrupt its habitability. Prove to me that the hysteria about carbon dioxide levels is warranted.

State some facts, not opinions. You make a case, I'll accept it. In return, if I make a case, you accept it. Let the facts fall where they may.

I have listened to the climate-related hysteria all of my life, from the coming ice age where we will all freeze to death under a 1000 foot thick sheet of ice, to the coming 200 foot flood due to global warming. Now I see the plan. I will not stand quietly any more on this issue.

Prove it or shut it.

reply to post by xman_in_blackx
Thank you xman. Read what i said above; I am serious. As long as I have time to post on here (and the powers that be in ATS allow, of course) I am making it my personal mission to refute every single GW thread that rears its ugly head.

The motto is deny ignorance, and that is exactly what I intend to do. GW believers beware, your religion is now officially under attack.

TheRedneck


[edit on 2-8-2008 by TheRedneck]

reply to post by manson_322


Well, more than anything, science is behind climate change deniers. But that just doesn't work for the far left, now does it? Welcome to the new world religion of earth worship. Fear her wrath, ye sinners. Ugh.

reply to post by TheRedneck


Excellent post! And I heartily agree. I see it as a religion, as well. If you look at "naturalism," it is very much a religion. "God" is replaced by the planet and nature. Evolution is the creation story of choice, based in a faith in man and his speculation. Environmentalism and humanism provide the moral code. And finally, Global Warming provides both the "punishment of the non-believers" and an apocalypse myth all in one.

Not that I am trying to say anyone's religion is wrong. We all have the right to believe what we choose to believe. But naturalism IS structured like a religion, to include both faith for things that can't be proven, (origins, meaning, or lack thereof, in life,) morality, and an apocalypse to fear. Hopefully someday it's believers can come to terms with this and admit it. Until then, the only things worse than Christians telling me it's their way or the pits of Hell, or Muslims telling me I'm an unclean infidel, are the Naturalists telling me that I'm an uneducated redneck if I don't espouse their belief. See, I don't care if someone thinks I'm going to Hell, since it has no effect on my life. I don't care about someone calling me an infidel, unless they try to include me in their scourging of infidels. But if someone is going to call me unintelligent and uneducated, the least they can do is have the science to back it up...but they don't. They just teach their religion as facts in the educational forums of the world, and effective excommunicate any dissenters. Ironically, the most of them are also rabid haters of religion!

[edit on 8/3/2008 by saturnine_sweet]

And this surprises you how? Have you ever thought that Global Warming is a non event dreamed up by the big oil? Don't you think that big oil knows that oil is finite and they have X amount of time left? I see this as a big ploy by the elite to get us onboard with the new green tech that the big oil will give us to stop us from slurping on the dried up oil nipple.

This is a no-brainer IMHO

Just to make you aware of the issues, follow the money trails. I don't care what side of the debate your on (if you believe in global warming or not) because what is happening is complete corruption!


Carbon credits’ dirty secret Energy companies and speculators make windfall profits while consumers are hit hard

Carbon credits are the main mechanism by which Kyoto transfers wealth from developed nations like Canada to developing ones like China.

They are also the stock bought and sold on carbon trading markets, usually in concert with government "cap and trade" schemes.

By LORRIE GOLDSTEIN, Toronto Sun
www.torontosun.com...

Here is a great example:

Companies are figuring out how to work the ridiculous "Carbon Credits" debacle to make big bucks.

Rhodia, is a French Company, makes adipic acid which is a chemical used in the production of nylon. They have moved their operation to South Korea and Brazil. Why?

A by-product of their manufacturing process is the creation of nitrous oxide, a greenhouse gas that is over 300 times more potent as an atmospheric warming agent than carbon dioxide. Rhodia destroys the nitrous oxide after it has been created and then claims carbon credit reimbursement for the green house gasses it has eradicated.

Rhodia, makes more money from this scam than they do from their primary business, They are raking in around a three hundred million dollars a year - more money than the whole of Africa is from Carbon credit reimbursements!

Also, Al Gore has a very big personal investment into bringing this carbon credit (cap & trade) to America.

www.capitalresearch.org...

Here is the deal, this whole Kyoto protocol is nothing but a money grab. Even many die hard global warming groups are starting to see that this scheme will do little to nothing in reducing carbon emissions.

Call your politicians and VOTE NO to "cap & trade".

daily.stanford.edu...

not who but what you should ask

It really got going when a bunch lords and sirs in England said its all rubbish
now I would of shrugged the old coots off except they made more sense
than anyone one who was a proponent of the silly idea.

the sun is heating the earth and all the other planets are undergoing the same effect.
while Al gore's electric bill tops 400$ a month
and he gets the noble prize proving that even science is corrupt today.

Another scheme to redistribute the wealth of the G8 nations to the poorer nations.

while Haarp is basting us literally .






[edit on 3-8-2008 by solo1]

reply to post by vegno

I mean come on, they keep shouting "show me scientific proof" and when you do you suddenly stop hearing from them. Just like they silenced the group of scientist not agreeing with their propaganda at one of the enviro meetings at the UN

really, wheres the proof then to disapprove of global warming ,
and what group of scientists ,like these:

Another regular piece of evidence in the denial lobby's PR campaign is the "Oregon Petition". This urges the US Government to reject the Kyoto Protocol and claims there is "no convincing scientific evidence" for global warming. It is said to be signed by 31,000 graduates, most of whom appear to have nothing to do with climate science.

lol, we have so much propaganda from NWO ,USa and oil companies in denying climate change , but the truth is exposed that USA/West are responsible for global warming and that now your nations must pay carbon tax to UN and developing countries as compensation for the harms inflicted upon them thanks to Global warming .....

next, we need a SUV tax on americans , who drive inefficient crappy SUV V8 monster engine garbage , Americans and their inefficient SUVs and industries are responsible for pollution

reply to post by jsobecky

GW is a farce.

please prove it , as massive evidence shows that GW is not a farce , and by the way has USA signed the Kyoto Protocol ??? no, it has not


[edit on 3-8-2008 by manson_322]

Look into the UN agenda 21, led by Canadian Maurice Strong the war is against humanity in the name of mother Earth. Please don't get excited about scientific consensus. It doesn't mean it reality. Also look into sustainable development an learn what its really all about. Do a search on the Georgia guide stones.

[edit on 3-8-2008 by Swingarm]

reply to post by manson_322


Here is a link discussing the solar system.

reply to post by Swingarm


lol, from your own source

Earth is heating up lately, but so are Mars, Pluto and other worlds in our solar system, leading some scientists to speculate that a change in the sun’s activity is the common thread linking all these baking events.

Others argue that such claims are misleading and create the false impression that rapid global warming, as Earth is experiencing, is a natural phenomenon.

While evidence suggests fluctuations in solar activity can affect climate on Earth, and that it has done so in the past, the majority of climate scientists and astrophysicists agree that the sun is not to blame for the current and historically sudden uptick in global temperatures on Earth, which seems to be mostly a mess created by our own species.
www.livescience.com...

speculation of some scientists ??? , like those similiar to those funded by exxonmobil
as , i stated in first post of the thread of most of these studies are funded by MNC's like Exxon mobil and Chevron , to deny the Holocaust USA has committed on poor mother earth

[edit on 3-8-2008 by manson_322]

So we have conflicting points of view ,ok, then what should be done is send it off to a committee made up of proponents of both sides , await their findings.

Certainly we should not be acting harshly without a consensus.
the next thing i'll Know is they will be taxing me for exhaling co2
and Prince Phillip will be telling me we cant feed you there are just too many people to feed.
Be careful what you wish for the real story may be that they want to exterminate India, Pakistan ,China etc...

reply to post by manson_322


Damn.... poor sourcing there time to go to bed

speculation of some scientists ??? , like those similiar to those funded by exxonmobil
as , i stated in first post of the thread of most of these studies are funded by MNC's like Exxon mobil and Chevron , to deny the Holocaust USA has committed on poor mother earth

While I must admit i did once have my faith in science, today I do not.It has been corrupted to follow Govt guidelines to enact agendas
you do as your told you you won't work anymore tactics are more likely than not to prevail today.

www.radioliberty.com...

I believe this is the agenda your sources were the guidelines.

all of the planets are heating up and the sun is the cause
now American needs to come out of the dark ages ,It is still burning coal
China and India need to step up to the plate.

ca.youtube.com...
Too many people too feed

America may be stalling on all fronts concerning the issues of Pollution
CO2 should not be an issue .

I would be more concerned with their efforts to make biological weapons.
which have expanded under G W Bush exponentially .One look at Iraq proves they would not even think twice about using them .

I do not say you are wrong but keep in mind likewise I could alternatively be right .
Peace be upon you

reply to post by manson_322


"Who is behind climate change deniers?"

People who are looking for the truth... and wont take the medias talking points at face value...

reply to post by manson_322


You are confusing the output of C02 gas with the horrendous effects of chemical pollution.

PCBs, CFCs and Dioxins etc are banned for a reason. They are bad and cause Ozone depletion. They just don't cause as much damage as the three Nuclear Bombs the United States Detonated in the Atmosphere over Antarctica in 1953 as part of operation Isabella.... No, that had absolutely nothing to do with the Gigantic Hole over Antarctica.

But let us not forget that Global Warming didn't really start until the Rainforests of South America were wiped out in the 70s and 80 via clear-cutting...

...This Clear-cutting was initially supported by those people who were claiming that the earth was going into an Ice Age and Something Drastic just to be done - sound Familiar?

Those same personalities who promoted the End of the World with the coming of the new Ice Age are now promoting Global Warming.

They have been Making money both coming and going.

These same Eco-charlatans also promoted the switch to plastic bags and petroleum based products as a effective substitute to help stop the Destruction of the Rainforests - not taking into account the massive increase in industrial waste output that would be resultant from this profoundly hypocritical plan.

Now the Eco-Charlatans want to Ban plastic bags and Bottles and have already succeed in taxing the waste output of the plants they helped to Lobby into existence. They also take C02 output under Kyoto protocols - but only in the Western world, which cause our economies to tank as all the Jobs move to Asia and Latin America.

Now they want to tax you and me. These very same Charlatans want to tax the very Gas that allows life to thrive on this planet.

Soon, they will be taxing your lawn, trees and plants as vegetation only creates Oxygen and food, which helps sustain the lives of Humans... Who are Considered a Virus by the Likes of Al Gore, Ted Turner, Henry Kissinger et al