The Questions "Most Hardcore Believers" Cant Answer

Originally posted by kidflash2008
reply to post by skept!cal

 

1. Betty and Barney Hill:
torn dress
unknown substance on dress
circular marks on car that made compass go crazy (witnessed by many people)
radar confirmation of object in sky near the abduction by Pease AFB
2. Flatwoods monster case:
The boys and Mrs May were physically ill by odor
Pungent odor was detected by police investigating
Oil around area and on Mrs May's dress
No crater made be meteor (which is what skeptics use to explain it)
Craft moved from one point to another
Spot was found where object landed, with a path of the mysterious oil from the landing place to where the being was sighted
The boys and Mrs May were taken to separate areas to draw the alien and produced drawings of the same creature
The boys and Mrs May were terrified of what they saw, no owl could do that.

There are many cases with physical evidence a craft landed.

I'm sorry, where's the physical evidence of an alien craft landing? Smells, oil, torn dress, unknown substance... and you jump to "alien"?

Originally posted by azzllin
Op the questions you are referring too, have been asked and answered the best anyone could, they are just not answered to the satisfaction of those who didnt really want to know the answers, or have already made their minds up and answered it for themselves.

Correct. their not satisfactory because there not proof

Ive always asked the question, why do those who think it is so fantastic that it cant possibly be real, why do they think that way?

And i ask it not to try and prove their existence.

We as a race have a fatal floor which i think holds us back, and that is we seem to think that we are all powerful, and nothing can compare to us as the Human race, maybe its just so fantastic it becomes unbelievable and some Human brains wont accept the fact its true.

What? Why are trying to speak on behalf of the entire human race? We have a FLAW? And you've identified have you? There's a difference between not believing something when their is no proof of their existance and our "brain not accepting it". I think some people just have a little too much fantasy in their brains, the same people whose lives are so dull they feel the need to make up magical worlds where aliens are protecting us from other galatic invaders.



[edit on 29-7-2008 by Hamlin]

reply to post by skept!cal


"where is the evidence"?...

That's something people who have any religious faith and treat it as a truth for all of us have trouble answering as well. There are some things that consist of what some consider evidence and what some don't consider evidence. That's the way the world works on many issues.

reply to post by Hamlin


you may not have seen the accounts of the betty and barney hill case in its totallity. but i wanted to see what you think of betty's star map which she was supposudly shown by the ET on board. the star map was drawn out by betty, 7-8 years before we had the technology to actually observe the stars with scientific equipment. ill repeat in case you may not understand what ive said (not trying to be arrogant here) betty was shown on a holographic screen the star system from where the ET's came from, she drew this map after hynotic regression and the start system was later observed within the scientific community 7-8 years later.

reply to post by LordThumbs


If this was viewed via technology 7-8 years after the fact.....you should post that link also as corrabitive evidence.

Originally posted by skept!cal
where is the evidence?

The EVIDENCE is everywhere, and the evidence proves beyond the shadow of a doubt to anyone without an aversion to believing.

Where's this evidence??

In trials all around the world tire tracks, finger prints, foot prints, and all other forms of TRACE EVIDENCE are used to prove cases daily.

UFOs and Aliens leave a fair amount of Trace Evidence. This "Evidence" has no explanation outside the UFO phenomen. This trace evidence deals in impressions left upon the ground not excluding radioactivity that is unreproducable by humans.

This is only One form of Evidence, but it is more then enough to prove it to anyone whom is looking for the truth of the matter rather then another pointless argumentation.

I don't know what that map was, looked like some connect the dots thing, i guess i'll read into it more later.

As for "trace evidence". Bull#. So it's not immediately identified as human, it MUST be alien? This is the kind of leap you make for you to create proof. All these tire tracks there leaving but not one clear picture or video. Finger and foot prints? Surely they can't be ruled out as inhuman?

You have proof of nothing but your vivid imagination.

You can only do so much.

Some people simply don't want to believe.

Too many people who frequent this website there is already so much evidence that they could not rationally ignore it all. But to one who doesn't want to believe there will always be some other possibility.

They are all lying, it's a giant hoax, it's a secret government technology, the people were brainwashed, the people were drugged, the people were hypnotized, etc.

It is difficult to prove anything to someone who will continually consider any possibility of it not being true as a hole in the evidence.

i'd like to put something here that i posted in the other thread. as far as i can tell i never received an answer, maybe someone posting in this thread has one.

if we're not arguing that something unidentified is flying in our skies, i'd like to pose a question.
what is more improbable:
A: some human agency on earth has technology capable of going from 0(or similarly slow speed say 30mph) to 1900 mph in a couple of seconds, somehow able to negate inertia. however they don't use this technology for anything other than flying over populated, and unpopulated areas to scare people for no reason.
B: some intelligence not of this planet found us and is investigating us in some way(perhaps they found us by accident).
C: some intelligence of this planet is flying around in vehicles we currently cannot duplicate(according to known physics) for some reason we are not aware.

as for A, i'd like to point out that i got the speeds from the recent radar findings of the stephensville event that were backed up by several (i believe 5) radar towers. personally i'm not 100% sure what's being seen, but i'm 90% sure it's not technology we made with what we currently understand of physics and what tech is available. i find it difficult to believe that we (whether our government, someone elses, or humanity in general) have this technology and only use it to cruise around when we could end the wars we're in right now in about twenty minutes with it and conquer the world in a few hours.

i'm not saying it's aliens, i frankly dont know. but i think my question is a good one.

Originally posted by Jezus
You can only do so much.

Some people simply don't want to believe.

Too many people who frequent this website there is already so much evidence that they could not rationally ignore it all. But to one who doesn't want to believe there will always be some other possibility.

They are all lying, it's a giant hoax, it's a secret government technology, the people were brainwashed, the people were drugged, the people were hypnotized, etc.

It is difficult to prove anything to someone who will continually consider any possibility of it not being true as a hole in the evidence.

I'll say it again... what evidence? You want skeptics to NOT consider all other possibilities? You want us to become as close-minded as you and just accept, without judgement, that the light in the sky must be an alien life form. The kids who say some short, white, bald man touched them must be an alien lifeform.

I mean of course, if we didnt consider other possible explanations, you may have proof. But unfortunetly we don't like stretching the facts to suit our wildest fantasies.

As for Betty and Barney etc.

I read a few things, this stood out tho.

The Hills claim to have been abducted by aliens on September 19, 1961. Betty first "remembered" her abduction during a series of nightmares, which she told Barney about. Barney claims the aliens took a sample of his sperm. Betty claims they stuck a needle in her belly button. She took people out to an alien landing spot, but only she could see the aliens and their craft. The Hills recalled most of their story under hypnosis a few years after the abduction. Barney Hill reported that the aliens had "wraparound eyes," a rather unusual feature. However, twelve days earlier an episode of "The Outer Limits" featured just such an alien being (Kottmeyer). According to Robert Schaeffer, "we can find all the major elements of contemporary UFO abductions in a 1930 comic adventure, Buck Rogers in the 25th Century."

[edit on 30-7-2008 by Hamlin]

Originally posted by Hamlin
As for "trace evidence". Bull#. So it's not immediately identified as human, it MUST be alien? This is the kind of leap you make for you to create proof. All these tire tracks there leaving but not one clear picture or video. Finger and foot prints? Surely they can't be ruled out as inhuman?

You have proof of nothing but your vivid imagination.

I don't mean disrespect by this but before you accuse someone of a vivid imagination please do some research yourself. We have a few extremely good cases that INCLUDE very good evidence. I'm talking pictures, witness testimony (over a 1000 in one case), including Air Force generals, other military personel, police officers and civilians. To top it off we have radar images of the craft displaying performance that was literally out of this world.

These things cannot be easily explained away and are NOT just someones vivid imagination like you claim.

Originally posted by Rigel

About the Alien topic, I don't consider myself as a "believer" but as a "thinker".

Universe is 13 bn yrs old, Earth is 4 bn, Mankind (Homo Sapiens) is about 50 000 years old.

Logically, such a process has likely happened elsewhere, and on planets that offered life conditions far before the earth ever existed.

Sometime thoughts are more proofs than facts are...

your baseing your beleifs on logic not evidential facts.

so in other words your theory is as much BS as the bible

reply to post by Scramjet76


Great post as always Scram...i was fixing to do the same thing this morning...i think your totally correct i think alot of ppl mistake the word skeptic for something sinister...good post again and thanks...have a star

Skept!cal

reply to post by skept!cal


Skeptics and disbelievers do not do any research.

See with your own eyes the newspaper archives in Los Angeles regarding the 1942 "Battle of Los Angeles" which were actually printed with many, many, eyewitnesses.

en.wikipedia.org...

Evidence? or pre-weather ballon reality.('')

Who cares if anyone is skeptical except for skeptics.

Look at this. Is it really something OTHER than what it looks like?

www.disclose.tv...

Peace, baby!

[edit on 30-7-2008 by SkeptiksRegoists]

reply to post by SkeptiksRegoists


Well actually it is LOL...i think its funny how you just posted a CGI rendering that has been discussed here at ATS to death trying to pass it as actual evidence...thats the problem MOST hardcore believers they wont even take the time to even find out if the "evidence" that they have seen is even hoaxed....and YES skeptics do research these things...its usually our findings that piss you guys off

Skept!cal

Originally posted by Hamlin

I'll say it again... what evidence? You want skeptics to NOT consider all other possibilities? You want us to become as close-minded as you and just accept, without judgement, that the light in the sky must be an alien life form. The kids who say some short, white, bald man touched them must be an alien lifeform.

I mean of course, if we didnt consider other possible explanations, you may have proof. But unfortunetly we don't like stretching the facts to suit our wildest fantasies.

Close minded? The irony...

I could bring an alien to your house, and you could always say it was a man in an incredible costume.

No matter how much evidence exists someone who wants to deny it can find a way.

If you don't want to believe no one can force you to, but don't pretend you are applying any kind of reason, logic, or judgement to the situation. You have made your decision already, and no matter what evidence exists you will always find a way to deny it.

I could bring a man in an alien costume to your house and you'd go around shouting that the aliens are here.

Also, it's not that I don't believe, there's just no evidence to support it.

[edit on 30-7-2008 by Hamlin]

reply to post by Hamlin


There is plenty of evidence, but because of your personal beliefs you find it easier to believe in other possible explainations for the evidence (that may themselves have no merit) rather than aliens.

Anyone who's capable of impartial reasoning and is not ignorant to the known state of the universe should be able to conduct some thought experiments and come to a few, highly probable, conclusions.


1) The probability that life exists only on Earth is so small it's laughable.

2) The probability that the Human Race is the most technologically advanced species in the Universe is also so small it's laughable.

3) After a certain period of technological development interstellar travel becomes inevitable for all civilizations. -- Personally I expect the Human Race to have achieved interstellar travel within 5000 years if tech development is not arrested in any way. Definitely within 100,000 years at the latest.

4) Civilizations with interstellar capability will therefore have a level of knowledge and technology that means the "discovery" of other civilizations does not take much effort.

5) There will be multiple civilizations with interstellar capability. These civilizations will be aware of each other. In this scenario it's inevitable that there will be some kind of, for want of a better phrase, "Galactic Laws" governing activities beyond their home worlds.

6) Civilizations with interstellar capability who wanted to have their existence known to the full populace of Earth could do it in a blink of an eye regardless of the wishes of any Earth government or organisation.

7) Therefore, the kind of evidence that will completely satisfy all people that ET's are visiting Earth, i.e. an appearance in front of the worlds TV camera's, etc., will really only happen when any ET visitors want it to happen. Until that day, when everyone knows without a doubt, you either know or you don't know. Simple, eh?