Self Defence - advice wanted in regards to knife armed attackers

Long time reader of the forums (nearly two years) and now I need some advice.

I lived in London last year in quite a nice area, but now I'm moving elsewhere same city but unfortunately a stabbing occurred quite near to where I shall be living. So I'm looking for some general awareness/confrontation techniques in case someone placed me into a sticky situation. The likelihood of ever being involved in something like this is as I know very small but I'd much rather be prepared if it ever did happen than dead. (and I hope it never does.)

I've done a little research myself and was considering buying pepper spray but it's illegal to posses it in the UK, but I won't let this deter me from being able to defend myself. So all and any advice will help, but I wouldn't ever consider carrying a knife or other "offensive" weapon myself.

Thanks in advance -Klaus-

Keep your head on a swivel.

Kinda hard to combat someone just randomly coming up behind you in the street and shanking you....if you are that worried about it and are not confident in your ability to defend yourself hand to hand, I would suggest the pepper spray. Better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.

Either that or a pistol.

reply to post by -Klaus-


Pepper spray is illegall ...but fine ground pepper isnt....the little pepper pots with pull off lids...not as good but effective...it used to be an old trick.. a pepper pot and a hat pin!!..

Buy a firearm, oh, UK. Nevermind.

Are tasers legal?

[edit on 7-7-2008 by salchanra]

No pepper spray... no knife... the only thing I would suggest is to not get into a situation. A knife is actually a more dangerous weapon than a gun, and can cause more suffering than a simple hole. It is also better suited to close-range attacks and can be integrated quite nicely with standard fighting techniques.

To avoid such a confrontation, I strongly suggest you be aware of what's around you. It's amazing how much you can tell from things most people never think of. Is someone behind a car? Glance underneath it, to get a glimpse of feet. Watch for bushes moving abnormally. Be aware of shadows that do not belong. Listen. Humans generally make their presence quite obvious through the use of sounds, especially when they're walking. Be aware of what's around you, in front, beside, behind, above. You don't need to walk around looking like an epileptic, just dart your eyes side to side and take quick sideways glances when turning corners, etc.

You can train yourself in things like this simply by practicing at home. When you walk from room to room, try to get a quick mental image of everything in your home: where the chairs are, anything in them, what's lying on the table, where are any windows or furniture or doors relative to you, things like that. Turn it into a habit.

Then graduate yourself to walks in a park or other safe outdoor area. Soon you should be able to know where every bird, squirrel, dog, cat, or other animal is, and what trees and bushes are around you, while looking and walking normally.

Lastly, develop an attitude in your walk. Not one of aggression (that will get you dead!), but one of authority. When you're practicing it, mentally convince yourself that you fear nothing and only wish to be left alone. This may sound foolish, but it works. Criminals get a lot of info on their victims from body language, and usually the victim is not even aware they are sending 'attack me' signals.

I did all this years ago, and I have walked through some of the roughest neighborhoods around the country, unarmed, with no problems. The only problem is that I seem to have done it too good, since every cop who sees me immediately considers me a threat.

Good luck.

TheRedneck

Fortunately most of the knife crime isn't planned murders but confrontations that have escalated, so I wouldn't really expect to be randomly attacked from behind any time soon. It's the the silly confrontations that I'm worried about, oh and being in the wrong place at the wrong time. At least that's the common theme of most recent stabbings in the UK.

Pepper spray is very attractive, apart from the fact it holds a maximum sentence of ten years if you are caught possessing it. I found a spray that marks the attacker with red dye for seven day's but it's not really what I'm looking for.

Thanks for the really good advice TheRedneck, I'd say I'm quite an aware person naturally but the advice about car's and body language I will take in much heed.

[edit on 7-7-2008 by -Klaus-]

A good stout walking stick would be more than a match for any knife wielding opponent. If you need or want a smaller weapon, a baton ,kubatai or Nun-chuks are superior weapons in close quarters than any knife. As your knife wielding opponent tries to stab or slice you, hit their lead leg as hard as you can just above, at, or below the knee. This will usually result in them collapsing or at least wincing in pain and not wanting to attack you any further. I suggest that you find a video on cane fighting techniques many of which can apply to umbrellas.

Originally posted by salchanra
Buy a firearm, oh, UK. Nevermind.

They can get firearms they just need to do all the proper things and pass checks.
Permit to carry one would be hard to get unless you claimed security employment such as a bodyguard.However you could do all the training and get the licenses however if you were found carrying a pistol off duty you would be in trouble.

2 improvised ideas:

Get a long keychain and load up your keyring with as many keys as you can fit on it.

or a

Sock filled with change

Originally posted by Being_From_Earth
They can get firearms they just need to do all the proper things and pass checks.
Permit to carry one would be hard to get unless you claimed security employment such as a bodyguard.However you could do all the training and get the licenses however if you were found carrying a pistol off duty you would be in trouble.

Really??? I was under the impression that even the police in the UK don't have guns.

18 inches of chain. You can do a lot with a chain. Short pipe would work as well. I don't think either are illegal anywhere.

Ok...I'm going to attempt to "shoot you straight"


If some random person comes at you out of nowhere and doesn't draw attn to themselves, such as just walking past you on the street, and decides to stick you....its about a 75 percent chance, that whether you could have whipped this guy like a child if you would have known he was coming or not...that you are gonna get stabbed.

With that being said, I agree with the "know your surroundings" info that was given to you earlier. There's not much you can do, except be paranoid to a fine point.


Now, on the other hand...take same punk and he walks 4 foot in front of you and produces a blade, ....well I dunno about you...but to me, it's fight time.

An unarmed man with proper fighting/self-defense skills , in my opinion, has a HIGH chance of removing the threat from a random PUNK with a boot knife. No joke, I'm not trying to sound like Chuck Norris...but it can be done. All depends on the person, I guess. That's where your self-defense/military training/martial arts comes in. Everyone should know how to defend themselves reasonably.

Now on the other hand, if guy with knife really knows what he is doing, your best bet is to give him what he wants, and get the hell away. He who lives and runs away, gets to catch that guy out and bash him in the back of the head with something, another day.

Good luck. That's why I like America. You pull your knife on me, I stick the barrel of my Glock .40 up your nostril and make your head move all kinds of funny ways, if I don't just blow it off your shoulders.

In a word "RUN"
However assuming you are not able to.
Take it for granted that you are going to get stuck no matter what accept it.
Go in to them limit their thrust range focus on the hand with the knife attempt a firm grasp one hand on their wrist the other on their fist pull and push the hand with the knife across their path and turn, so that your shoulder is a blocker take it to the ground so that they land on their face and pull their knife hand up toward your chest. Keep pulling until you hear a pop. Fact is you don't ever want to tussle with a guy with a knife. But if you know you have to and there is no out for you, do not hesitate make a decision and stick with it don't panic if you get stuck or slashed, its gona be a hell of a lot worse if you let go of that hand once you have it

Hope that never happens to anyone. what a sh@##% thing to do to another human being.
Whishing you safe and well

reply to post by -Klaus-


TheRedneck is right, dont get into the confrontation, keep an eye on everyone who looks shady and keep your ears sharp to keep tabs on whats behind you.

Learning the "walk" is great its not an aggresive walk its just a "you dont wanna mess with me" kind of walk, works like a charm.

Also be prepared to run, if thers a chance you can escape do it, theres no need to fight when you can run and live.

If you get into a confrontaton and there's no way out be prepared to fight, keep a respectable distance from your opponent and use your feet, go for the balls and go for the knees, use range as your advantage and make sure they cant close the gap.

Tried and tested methods above I had some idiot try and do me with a short sword about 4 years ago, a swift heel to the side of the knee and he was in pain and off balance, wrapped my hand round his wrist and give it a good yank and that sword went tumbling to the floor.

Hope this helps

Just to clarify, there are armed police in the UK most carry a variant of the H&K MP5 but they only patrol around high security areas i.e. the houses of parliament. 18 inches of chain intrepid, is quite awkward to carry around and I think could be deemed as an offensive weapon not to sure on this tho.

I quite like the umbrella idea, and I wonder if someone makes an extending umbrella that's disguised as police baton time to google me thinks.

In regards to siFtInG's post

If some random person comes at you out of nowhere and doesn't draw attn to themselves, such as just walking past you on the street, and decides to stick you....its about a 75 percent chance, that whether you could have whipped this guy like a child if you would have known he was coming or not...that you are gonna get stabbed.

Most of the attacks in the UK against matching my demographic are wrong place wrong time situation's and often develop from minor confrontations, these are the one's I'm worried about most.

Most muggers and burglars use these weapons to threaten and coerce rather than to kill, and the most common crime in London is mugging (me thinks.) But I think I'll take your advice of self-defence classes siFtInG, this is something I could do for free and would probably be the most useful skill to posses.

Great advice foremantor on what to do if you are forced to defend from someone with a knife, but you are right. Running is the most logical choice for me to make if I could take it and then I could use the advantage of range like fred3110 recommended, maybe a quick kick in the ball's and then fleeing might be a good idea.

Originally posted by TheRedneck
develop an attitude in your walk. Not one of aggression (that will get you dead!), but one of authority. When you're practicing it, mentally convince yourself that you fear nothing and only wish to be left alone. This may sound foolish, but it works. Criminals get a lot of info on their victims from body language, and usually the victim is not even aware they are sending 'attack me' signals.

I'll second that as the best form of first-line attack prevention

A victim is only ever a victim because they believe they will be a victim...

In addition, make sure you carry a few pound-coins loose in the front pocket of your 'dominant' hand (IE: if you throw with your right hand, keep 'em in your right pocket) as 'mugger's cash' ...pound coins are preferable as they don't jingle unlike smaller denomination coins as you walk, thus attracting attention as a potential target with money

If you are ever confronted and you can't get out of the situation without a possible fight, throw the coins in your assailants face which will stun them for a few seconds as they recoil, and then fight the instinct to go for the money rather than attack.

Originally posted by slackerwire
Get a long keychain and load up your keyring with as many keys as you can fit on it.

..and this as an excellent second-line option...with a small brass padlock on one end, and a bunch of random keys (not your real house keys in case you damage/lose them if you ever have to use it as a flail) on the other...if ever stopped and searched by police, this will pass plausibly as your domestic-everyday-keychain/bikelock rather than a weapon.

and finally, my personal carry choice, a couple of sharpened 4H pencils in the back pocket and a piece of paper...handy for taking notes, but also doubles as a close-in puncturing weapon which will snap inside your 'target'

Originally posted by -Klaus-
I quite like the umbrella idea, and I wonder if someone makes an extending umbrella that's disguised as police baton time to google me thinks.

Depending on where you are in the city, carrying an umbrella will make you stand out and mark you as a potential target, but that said, I posted this vid in one of the other survival threads, but thought i'd post it again as it's particulaly applicable here in terms of urban self-defense...

Carry a nice pocket torch.. You don't have to hit them with it.. just a slight dazzle while you make your escape...


Or this one if you want to give them something to remember you by..like a sunburn..

“It’s not a torch you’d walk your dog with,” he says. “It would probably cook your dog.

www.neatorama.com...

[edit on 7-7-2008 by AGENT_T]

When I was a kid, my karate instructor imparted the wisest words, among them was that 'if someone brandishes a knife, then run!'.
There's absolutely no point fighting empty handed against someone with a knife, especially if they know how to use it. Even if you have a weapon, why risk a knife through the chest? Put the pride to one side and live to fight another day.

If you find yourself cornered with nowhere to run, and with no prospect of talking your way out of it, and you have no choice but to engage the attacker, then attack first. Its a terrible situation becasue you probably will get injured, but if you wait for him to make the first move, you'll have to take evasive action (step back, duck) and you'll be on the back foot from the off, and you'll definitely get stabbed up.
There's no point explaining self defence techniques on the net, so my best advice would be to kick him in the gut/nuts/knee, while using your hands or fists to distract/keep him out of reach, and make your escape.

You could also try one of these...

C.S. Gas Alarm

I got a few of these for my mam and sister for when there out, they make a hell of a noise when you press them in, just throw it at your attacker like a primed grenade and it should be enough to shock them long enough to make an escape. You could also use it like peper spray if there close enough as it releases the gas at a high pressure...thats why it says dont point at face on the side lol