Brain Implantation..Information is the Modern Day version of Warfare.

I didnt know experiments like that were going on since the 50's. I thought they knew very little about the brain, I mean beside labodemies and psychology. To actually implant a thing in someones concioucness, that monitors vital signs frequencies and activity and could send out voices through electrical mic or satellite feeds. With all the knowledge done since the 50's till now 2008, and for the future maybe it will be possible to have an implant that can read your thoughts send you thoughts and pictures and telepathic/satellite connection with other peoples implants or whoever put them in. Maybe even phones or internet or mech connection like with aircrafts and tanks.

I read more of the links on your thread and this is ... beyond words. Implanting things that can cause hallucinations and voices that are fabricated through technology is total control over comprehension. Can send someone spiraling into madness that they think would be genuine. These things have been researched for a long time and who knows another 50 or 100 years, they can reshape some people or all of humanity any way they like. I didnt know this was possible and their were people who knew that this existed.

I believe some of that, but not all of it.

Implantation of devices intended to affect brain function in humans? That's a given in my mind.

Unknowing implantation? Very hard to achieve, but in very select circumstances, maybe. Few and far between are the people in a position to have even a tiny hole drilled in their skull without their knowledge.

Reading brain waves to obtain specific information? Little to no chance at this point in our technological evolution. It would be very difficult for them to get that far with virtually none of the necessary understanding of brain function becoming public. It would require us to believe that the majority of progress in that field of study is taking place as part of classified research, and that they have been 100% able to keep involved individuals from making any use whatsoever of that knowledge they gained in the private sector after leaving the project.
If they could do that, uploadable knowledge, artificial intelligence, a nearly fool-proof cure for mental illness, and many other things would be within their grasp in the short term, and there would be murmurings of it.

But nothing doing as far as providing stimulii that trigger a few basic psychological imperatives (inducing or inhibiting fight or flight, circadian rhythm, etc). I'd be surprised if they really even needed an implant to accomplish that kind of stuff.

When I was in basic, I remember the effects of exhaustion being different from what I'm used to. I needed a little less sleep than I expected, was extremely easy to wake up etc. At times I wondered if there was something in the food. Probably not, but it crossed my mind, and was well within their capabilities.
Of course the most common rumor is that there's salt-peter in the food. I sincerely doubt that one, and have heard a great deal of anecdotal evidence through the grapevine that supports my doubt.

Originally posted by MemoryShock

A more prolific response tomorrow...

And yes..a complete memory lapse; I chose my screen name for that reason

More please. Sounds like there´s something to learn in this thread.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
So you had a complete lapse of memory on how it occured? That could be a sign of mind control.

Might the alcohol be an aid to further forget?

[edit on 26-5-2008 by Skyfloating]

It is well known that a physical shock response will impair the memory. For this reason, witnesses of a car accident won't necessarily be attributed valid accounts if they were a part of the accident. Same, on a lesser scale, for witnesses to a crime who are asked to repeat the entirety of the experience, complete with specific details. Due to the intensity of the experience, the same occurance will have happened in a variety of ways to different witnesses.

I chose my screenname to remind myself of that and as well to remember that memory can be affected in many seemingly simple exchanges...when I was young, I used to play a mind game prior to falling asleep...if I ever lost my train of thought, I would attempt to recall what 'thought' prompted the previous one so that I could trace back to what initailly got me going in that direction. I don't this as well as I did back then, but it is a memory excercise that I am unsure how I came up with.

The complete lack of memory in the mentioned experience occurred after the eating of the fast food and the gulping of two shots of gin. Keep in mind...only two shots, though no food was ingested after the shots. Seeing as I was in the process of moving out, I set up my 'temporary bed' and that is where memory fails. Memory picks back up in the middle of the walk way in the middle of the apartment complex.

I do not recall leaving my room, much less the apartment. I do not recall hitting the window, which I was told was what happened. I remember picking the memory back up and having a sense of urgency, like I was running aaway from something. I even continued to avoid people as I tried to register the fact that I was indeed bleeding quite profusely (nine stitches).

Now, here are the inconsistencies:

I am right handed. If I were to lash out in a drunken stupor (by the way, I have no history of violent behaviour when I drink; I have been told that I merely get more verbose and happy) then I would have likely lashed out with my right hand. The cut is on my left hand.

There was only one cut on my hand. If I had smashed through the window, I would have likely many more cuts all over the hand. Incidentally, when I returned to the hospital for the check-up a day or two later, A man walked out while I was in the waiting room with his whole hand wrapped up. *shrugs* As well, the single cut was a single line down the center of my palm (not on the outside of my hand) and completely clean; try cutting something with a jagged piece of glass that has lost it's stability...there should have been jagged edges to the skin.

I was told that I had jumped out of the window. Now I can understand that people when they are drunk can walk on broken limbs for a short while because they can't feel the pain. I was only treated for the cut. There were no other bruising and or limps. This last summer I was at the Ren Faire, again, and was considerably drunk when I decided that I was going to follow suit with everyone and swing off the "pseudo pirate ship" that I had helped build. I needed crutches for two weeks and the fall was less than two stories. And I recall every moment of that experience to walking away, despite the fact that I had ingested a considerable amount more alcohol then the experience in question.

What is there to learn? This stuff does happen. There are many other instances and stories I can relate but for the most part, they are just stories. But this stuff does happen and some of us don't get all paranoid and urgent about it. I thought about it alot. I learned what I could.

But I am indeed sugesting that the experience described above didn't occur the way it was related to me. It was completely outside of my normal behaviour pattern and physically inconsistent in many cases. Incidentally, if it matters, my roomamte, when telling me what happened a few days later, didn't even look me in the eyes.

The worst lesson was that some of my friends weren't.

As far as alcohol being an aid to forget...absolutely. But my friends, fake and real, would confirm an amazing sense of functionality while incredibly intoxicated....

Originally posted by MemoryShock


I chose my screenname to remind myself of that and as well to remember that memory can be affected in many seemingly simple exchanges...when I was young, I used to play a mind game prior to falling asleep...if I ever lost my train of thought, I would attempt to recall what 'thought' prompted the previous one so that I could trace back to what initailly got me going in that direction. I don't this as well as I did back then, but it is a memory excercise that I am unsure how I came up with.

For some people that is a meditation that is supposed to lead to hyper-awareness, by the way.

The complete lack of memory in the mentioned experience occurred after the eating of the fast food and the gulping of two shots of gin. Keep in mind...only two shots, though no food was ingested after the shots. Seeing as I was in the process of moving out, I set up my 'temporary bed' and that is where memory fails. Memory picks back up in the middle of the walk way in the middle of the apartment complex.

If you are a habitual drinker, two shots shouldnt produce black-out, right? Right.

I do not recall leaving my room, much less the apartment. I do not recall hitting the window, which I was told was what happened. I remember picking the memory back up and having a sense of urgency, like I was running aaway from something. I even continued to avoid people as I tried to register the fact that I was indeed bleeding quite profusely (nine stitches).

Now, here are the inconsistencies:

I am right handed. If I were to lash out in a drunken stupor (by the way, I have no history of violent behaviour when I drink; I have been told that I merely get more verbose and happy) then I would have likely lashed out with my right hand. The cut is on my left hand.

There was only one cut on my hand. If I had smashed through the window, I would have likely many more cuts all over the hand. Incidentally, when I returned to the hospital for the check-up a day or two later, A man walked out while I was in the waiting room with his whole hand wrapped up. *shrugs* As well, the single cut was a single line down the center of my palm (not on the outside of my hand) and completely clean; try cutting something with a jagged piece of glass that has lost it's stability...there should have been jagged edges to the skin.

I was told that I had jumped out of the window. Now I can understand that people when they are drunk can walk on broken limbs for a short while because they can't feel the pain. I was only treated for the cut. There were no other bruising and or limps.

Sounds like you did not jump out of the window then. Who said you jumped out of the window? On which floor was the room?

This last summer I was at the Ren Faire, again, and was considerably drunk when I decided that I was going to follow suit with everyone and swing off the "pseudo pirate ship" that I had helped build. I needed crutches for two weeks and the fall was less than two stories. And I recall every moment of that experience to walking away, despite the fact that I had ingested a considerable amount more alcohol then the experience in question.

What is there to learn? This stuff does happen. There are many other instances and stories I can relate but for the most part, they are just stories. But this stuff does happen and some of us don't get all paranoid and urgent about it. I thought about it alot. I learned what I could.

But I am indeed sugesting that the experience described above didn't occur the way it was related to me. It was completely outside of my normal behaviour pattern and physically inconsistent in many cases. Incidentally, if it matters, my roomamte, when telling me what happened a few days later, didn't even look me in the eyes.

The worst lesson was that some of my friends weren't.

So you imply that some of the people you know "are in on it". Thats the height of science-fiction-paranoia. Remember the movie Total Recall? You must have loved that.

But you telling it in a sane and calm manner lends credibility to your story.

Any childhood memories of being in hospitals and at military sites with strange people?

Originally posted by Skyfloating
For some people that is a meditation that is supposed to lead to hyper-awareness, by the way.

I didn't know that. I was ~5 or 6 when I last recall having done that on a consistent basis.

ORiginally posted by Skyfloating
If you are a habitual drinker, two shots shouldnt produce black-out, right? Right.

That is my reasoning..supported grotesquely by experience...

I mean it...check the semper debate. I sat dumbfounded in front of the computer during the composition of my closing arguement until I went and bought some Vodka....so I ended up giving the handicap that I had promised semper in one of the discussion threads...

Originally posted by Skyfloating
Sounds like you did not jump out of the window then. Who said you jumped out of the window? On which floor was the room?

My roomate at the time, who wasn't very shortly afterwards. I saw him once after that experience and he essentially showed to express regret towards what had happened. I allowed him his chance to talk and sent him on his way after calling him a liar. Shoe fits...

Second story apartment.

A friend of mine actually has a picture of the broken window. I should see if I can a copy of that...

Originally posted by Skyfloating
So you imply that some of the people you know "are in on it". Thats the height of science-fiction-paranoia. Remember the movie Total Recall? You must have loved that.

I still have a few uncomfortable thoughts regarding how that movie ended...

Originally posted by Skyfloating
But you telling it in a sane and calm manner lends credibility to your story.

Any childhood memories of being in hospitals and at military sites with strange people?

Thanks...I am surprised, and pleased, that noone has confronted me yet on the subjective nature of the story. That would bore me as I am not necessarily here on this thread trying to convince people of my story...merely I am interested in gaining interest and attention to this subject and the fact that humans do take advantage of each other...sometimes in greatly exaggerated circumstances.

And I amm indeed implying that various individuals in my life have been "in on it"....paranoid, I know, but I have actually been of the mindset that I was wrong in interpreting in that way. Mutliple upon multiple coincedences disprove the coincedance, in my opinion.

Not military sites. But I was hospitalized for Panic Attacks ~8 years old. A horrible panic attack that was triggered by a scene in the movie "Inner Space", the part where the eye is "shot at from inside".....an unpleasant memory...

There are other memories....but I am at work now and I can't afford to lose this one...

[edit on 27-5-2008 by MemoryShock]

Today Tuesday 27th 2008 in Newsday I found something you might like...

BRAIN DEVICE MAY ALLAY DEPRESSION- new frontier for psych illnesses: Brain pacemakers that promise to act as antidepressents by changing how patients nerve circuitry fires. Scientists already know the power of these devices to block tremors of parkinsons disease and related illnesses, more than 40,000 such patients worldwide have the implants.

But psychriatric illnesses are much more complex and new experiments with so-called Deep Brain Stimulation, or DBS, are in their infancy. Their are 11 paragraphs on it.

Originally posted by The Vagabond
Unknowing implantation? Very hard to achieve, but in very select circumstances, maybe. Few and far between are the people in a position to have even a tiny hole drilled in their skull without their knowledge.

I would tend to agree, but it is possible. The amount of drugs that we have to stimulate the system and then depress it...as well as every thing in between suggests that we can manipulate to an extent the consciousness and inclination to memory of an individual. Suggestibility of an individual at these physiological states is at a premium and thusly any 'memory' of an individual can be directed into the spiritual realm...in most cases.

The Vagabond
Reading brain waves to obtain specific information? Little to no chance at this point in our technological evolution.

What about sub-vocalization. Even without implantation, it is possible to have a sensitive enough microphone, albeit in controlled environments, to record the subvocalization of a thought pattern. If you have enough experience with the individual's lexicon, you can even make fairly valid extrapolations with accurate enough readings....

Originally posted by The Vagabond
It would be very difficult for them to get that far with virtually none of the necessary understanding of brain function becoming public.

Hhhmm...perhaps some of the information is available...

Objective. The objective of this study was to report our observations on the external electromagnetic field influences on deep brain stimulation (DBS) in our patient population and how these influences affected our patients’ lives and other healthcare-related conditions.

Brain Implant Studies

Originally posted by The Vagabond
It would require us to believe that the majority of progress *Snip*
If they could do that, uploadable knowledge, artificial intelligence, a nearly fool-proof cure for mental illness, and many other things would be within their grasp in the short term, and there would be murmurings of it.

Not necessarily. Murmurings exist. The NeuroHeadset is an interesting case...although it is hardly an implant...

And I have been meaning to present this case...

The Swedish group contracted doctors in Sweden that are familiar in the treating of victims that have been implanted with transmitters in there brain to review Plaintiff's X-rays. Swedish doctors stated that foreign bodies do exist within Plaintiff's head and they are most likely transmitters. Sweden has and is currently passing legislation as to the implantation of humans with transmitters, a practice that has been done in Sweden since the 1950 and 1960's.

Legal Case Implicating the Existence And Treatment of BrainTransmitters

Originally posted by The Vagabond
But nothing doing as far as providing stimulii that trigger a few basic psychological imperatives (inducing or inhibiting fight or flight, circadian rhythm, etc). I'd be surprised if they really even needed an implant to accomplish that kind of stuff.

Agreed. There are many different ways to garner such responses and or impactions. However, there has to be a reason why it is going on...the above referenced medical report and this very recent report..

We knew it was only a matter of time before the government started trying to track us by implanting computer chips in our bodies. And where do you start highly suspicious, Big Brother-esque projects like this? The Pentagon and our Armed forces, of course.

Scarily enough, we're not talking about some conspiracy theory, or some black ops experiment -- this is for real, and the Pentagon has already awarded the first contract. It's a $1.6 million contract, to be exact, and it's with Clemson University's Center for Bioelectronics, Biosensors and Biochips (C3B). The mandate? To develop the chip that the armed forces hope will save lives by giving them instant access to, and constant tracking of, soldiers' vital medical signs and data on the battlefield. The chips are also considered to have potential for tracking astronauts' vitals during missions.

Pentagon to implant Soldiers

I love that the answer is always "for safety"...

Originally posted by The Vagabond
When I was in basic, I remember the effects of exhaustion being different from what I'm used to.

Do you encounter more activity now or then? As well, an authoritative structure could induce this...different physiological states are being induced. My thoughts? Not so much a 'salt peter' type situation as it is more likely an induced recognition of the hierarchy and perceived "penalties"....which doesn't always translate over to the civilian structure.

[edit on 27-5-2008 by MemoryShock]

An interesting read...University Of Pennsylvania/NeuroEthics

And POW... thanks for the reference.

(WASHINGTON) It's a new frontier for psychiatric illness: Brain pacemakers that promise to act as antidepressants by changing how patients' nerve circuitry fires

The whole 'Brain Pacemaker' idea could satisfy the why would implantation be still a viable technique.....

Ive read a lot about this but the topic remains elusive. So excuse me if I take this opportunity to compile a deep-diggers question-list which you might enjoy answering. When (and if) answering, no need to put the questions into quotes.


1. What childhood nightmare do you remember the best?

2. Would you agree that its unusual for an 8 year old child to have panic attacks (considering this is normally a carefree age)?

3. Do you think this panic attack was the psychic pre-view of what would happen in the hospital, the psychic-attractor of strange people meddling with you or were panic attacks the result of something already happening to you?

4. Were you operated on in hospitals?

5. Do you habitually experience chills/recognitions when watching science-fiction involving implants, secret projects, paranoia, friends-are-not-what-they-seem scenarios? (Examples: Total Recall, Coma, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Cypher)

6. What other oddities have you noticed concerning friends?

7. What memories come up that you cant associate with any supposedly real thing that happened to you? (Includes: Displaced memories, memories without any connection to other events, places or people, strangely vivid memories, unrelated violent memories)

8. What about your parents?

9. Might your interest in conspiracy-theories be an attempt to remember something forgotten?

10. Have you had yourself x-rayed for implants? If not, are you going to do so?

11. Have you talked to people who might have experienced the same thing?


12. When and why did "Im probably just paranoid" turn into "Something is happening to me and I want to find out what"? Or do you still toy with the idea of it all being imagination?


13. If this is real, wouldnt it be a great feat to expose and overcome it?


14. Was the first time you wrote down your experience also the first time they were stolen from you (laptop)?


15. Who might your "handlers" be?


16. Why might Britney Spears have experienced something similar?


17. If you havent visited them yet, do you at least have the contact information of some renegade doctors and therapists who specialize in implant-removal and hypnotic regression? And if you have visited them, what came up?


18. If you hazard a guess, what might the purpose be of trying to remote influence you? Why?


19. Have you contacted ATS-member "General Eyes" who claims to have a similar issue?


20. Is the attempt to recover memories associated with unease or pain?




[edit on 28-5-2008 by Skyfloating]

Please allow a bit of time to answer these questions. I can very quickly get in-depth on a lot of them...

Originally posted by Skyfloating
Ive read a lot about this but the topic remains elusive. So excuse me if I take this opportunity to compile a deep-diggers question-list which you might enjoy answering. When (and if) answering, no need to put the questions into quotes.

Let's call it a bit of an OCD organizational thing that I almost feel compelled to do...

I'll compromise by omitting the attribution within the quote tags, as I am sure it is safe for everyone to assume that I am answering your questions...

1. What childhood nightmare do you remember the best?

Two immediately come to mind. FYI, I feel no embarrassment (that I will admit) regarding anything I post. Though believe me, I will have the requisite compunction...

1) A short memory where I was on the ground with a girl that my mom babysat at the time (I have known this girl so long that she is arguable my 'big sister'). At any rate, We were on the ground and we were getting shot by Lex Luthor shooting a kryptonite laser/gun. I was blocking her.

2) I was alone on an ice berg (human sized ice berg) floating through a dark cavern.

Interestingly enough, I cannot bite into a popsicle to this day with my front teeth. I dislike immensely putting things into/taking out of a freezer as the sound of frozen things sends me into a "nails on chalkboard" physical reaction. Indeed, typing that sentence called that physical reaction...*shudders*.

There was also another instance...I was laying alone in the middle of the night in the middle of our front lawn before we got a fence. While I was lying there, a car pulled up to the curb, directly in front of me and a man got out of the passenger side and walked directly toward me. I couldn't move and then finally the memory is gone prior to any 'resolution' of the anxiety. I have woken up multiple times throughout my life in a 'paralysis' and as such question whether or not this was a dream...

It's weird to have those types of questions regarding one's personal experience, for the record.

2. Would you agree that its unusual for an 8 year old child to have panic attacks (considering this is normally a carefree age)?

Yup. I would also agree that a pronounced and repeated panic attack would be unusual were it to happen at 20 years of age and once more in the past year. The last time it occurred, I was driving and was able to visualize a sort of half arsed self hypnosis script (after having pulled over) to calm myself down.

3. Do you think this panic attack was the psychic pre-view of what would happen in the hospital, the psychic-attractor of strange people meddling with you or were panic attacks the result of something already happening to you?

I think that it is more likely the result of something that had already happened. What exactly, I could speculate for quite a bit but it really is a speculation.

4. Were you operated on in hospitals?

Not to my knowledge. I concede that there is a possibility that I was indeed 'implanted' (despite the social stigma I may incur from stating as such) but I can't say for sure.

5. Do you habitually experience chills/recognitions when watching science-fiction involving implants, secret projects, paranoia, friends-are-not-what-they-seem scenarios? (Examples: Total Recall, Coma, Invasion of the Body Snatchers, Cypher)

Inner Space creeps me out...Killer Clowns from Outer Space...to name a few. Regarding your examples...I am mostly fascinated...even with friends-are-not-what-they-seem scenarios. You see, when I first realized the possibility (I call it a possibility for the purpose of online skeptics) I was offended as hell and pissed off that people could pretend to say positive things about me and then behave with a seeming superiority in all other aspects. My questions were treated with percieved disdain. So I worked on learning. Since I never percieved that anyone was actively attempting to harm me (which is why I suspect that this may just be a behavioral modification interest) then I worked on being able to 'talk back' without being talked down to. So it is a very strange relationship that I have and have had with various humans.

6. What other oddities have you noticed concerning friends?

Making decisions without consulting me.

Talking around me. In my early twenties, I never really participated in social discussions...yet I was 'allowed' to be present on a variety of situations. At some point, it occurred to me that it was not only odd that people were taking my silence as an acceptable expression, but odd that noone new seemed to comment on it.

There were also plenty of situations where out of context aggression was experienced...where I would think that I was the subject of a collectiveley held negative notion or emotion (perhaps they were pissed at me, etc).

In my early twenties, I also couldn't seem to live in the same place for longer than three months....halfway house when I lost my job, a friend of a friends house (where the owner was a mystic for her clientele) and in a motel (one room). The motel sucked because I had to live alone, almost literally.

I have also had a conversation with a friend where we were discussing my 'issues' and I pointed out that the flow of conversation and the times when others would interject there thoughts were too reactive to be that of a naturally occurring discussion. He agreed with me.

7. What memories come up that you cant associate with any supposedly real thing that happened to you? (Includes: Displaced memories, memories without any connection to other events, places or people, strangely vivid memories, unrelated violent memories)

It would actually probably be better to answer this question on an ongoing basis because their are literally dozens...I just don't recall them all at the
same time.

*But one would be remembering waking up in the middle of the night with two 'friends' climbing in through the bedroom window...while my 'girlfriend' was telling me to go back to sleep.

*Waking up in the middle of the night while I was living in my one room motel room and hearing a buzzsaw noise very loud in my ears. I was unable to move my arms and legs, torso taut. After a few seconds I moved my neck and regained mobility for the rest of my limbs. Don't remember anything after that.

*Waking up, in a different time and environment (~a year and a half later), and having the same thing as above happen. Moved then too...which pleases me greatly.

*I have gone to sleep on a few occasions and woken up, like, ten minutes later in a violent rage. Most of the time this occurred, I was living alone in a motel room. Each time this occurred, no alcohol. But it felt as if I had been given a huge dose of adrenaline. This has not happened in almost a decade.

*I have various OCD symptoms. I can control them to an extent...but washing hands was out of control at one point.

8. What about your parents?

For reasons I hope are obvious...I will not discuss my parents in a forum where they are unlikely to respond. Not that I would say anything untrue...but I would regret an inaccurrate inference be made.

9. Might your interest in conspiracy-theories be an attempt to remember something forgotten?

No doubt. I came to ATS after all of this had begun and was pleased at the social atmosphere. So I stayed. And learned. I even campaigned for a mind control forum at one point...

My first year was spent looking through the Cisco Wheeler/Fritz Springmeier materials; Mind Control. I still refer to it on occassion, but experience is still my goto for that....I try and not let the online material inflect my perception as much as possible....to what degree of success, *who knows*.

10. Have you had yourself x-rayed for implants? If not, are you going to do so?

I have not, though I have had an MRI....I never got to see it...

I intend to, but I have a bit of a trust problem and would like to know more specifics about the actual machines, how they work, etc...
Besides, every time I think about it, I start the 'doubting' process all over again.


I can attempt to clarify any questions that anyone has regarding the above. I will try and get the last half up there within (at least) a day...

Originally posted by Skyfloating
What I do sometimes wonder is if it is really possible to erase memories and replace them with other ones.

Linking to this ATS thread, as I think it is of interest...

Amnesia Shot?

Originally posted by MemoryShock
What about sub-vocalization.

That's actually quite brilliant. I'd never even thought about it, but a high power microphone would all but give you the ability to read my mind. In fact, being REALLY good at lip-reading might do the trick in my particular case.

Objective. The objective of this study was to report our observations on the external electromagnetic field influences on deep brain stimulation (DBS) in our patient population and how these influences affected our patients’ lives and other healthcare-related conditions.

Brain Implant Studies

If I understand correctly (granted I've had about 8 beers tonight) they're saying that they stimulated the brain with EM to see how the central nervous system responded. I am a believer in this, no doubt. I've even considered the possibility that the higher brain responds quite coherently to EM, consider the common phenomenon (common to me anyway) of somehow knowing what will be playing on my favorite radio station before I turn it on. But that's still a different animal from using the very mild EM generated by normal brain function to determine what the subjects specific thoughts are, which is what I thought was being discussed in your original post.

And I have been meaning to present this case...

As for the situation the Swedes are dealing with, again I am sure that such transmitters are possible, but there remains a question of function. How much information would they be gathering/transmitting? The technology to use such a transmitter to tell somebody when I'm sleeping, when I'm hungry, when I'm thinking dirty thoughts about my Creative Writing professor, etc is probably out there- but it would require some context and I'm not sure if the specific content of the thought could be determined. Knowing that the Vagabond's brain is lighting up in places that indicate wanting to see somebody naked is a completely different animal from knowing exactly which lewd acts The Vagabond imagines them taking part in.

Do you encounter more activity now or then? As well, an authoritative structure could induce this...different physiological states are being induced. My thoughts? Not so much a 'salt peter' type situation as it is more likely an induced recognition of the hierarchy and perceived "penalties"....which doesn't always translate over to the civilian structure.

You are most likely correct. The first week was dominated almost entirely be medical processing, and we were all in an extremely high stress state. In fact they had to send the Drill Instructors out of sight for about 20 minutes before the corpsmen could get acceptable blood pressure measurements on most of us.

So maybe I just spent 3 months "tweaking" on an enhanced adrenaline flow- but I can tell you that I should have been more exhausted than I've ever been in my life, and for some reason I rarely experienced the typical post-exercise soreness or need to sleep in (the exception being during the crucible, but nothing meaningful can be interpereted from that. True it was the only extended period without food from the chowhall, but it was also 3 days of sleeping only 2 hours a night- so there is a perfectly rational explanation for why I finally started getting worn out).


You also mentioned blackouts and the ample memory-manipulation aids available to us, and that did make me think a bit. I do have a persistent problem with my memory of hospital visits as a child. All of them sort of run together. I can't distinguish the events of the night that I was taken to the emergency room with a severe asthma attack from the night I was taken to the emergency room with a broken leg, etc.

More likely than not, it's because both of those events transpired about 17 years ago and I was about 7 years old, but it does make one wonder- would we really know if they were doing it to us, so long as they didn't make a specialized hospitalization out of it, and did it while we were young?

reply to post by MemoryShock


Thanks for your detailed response. Lots of leads and data there. I´ll wait for response until you post the other part.

BTW: You might want to edit the thread-title.

Continued answers from Above...

11. Have you talked to people who might have experienced the same thing?

I have not to my knowledge ever been in touch with people who have gone through what I have. I have talked, at times prolificly, with people who I have more than a an adequate reason to presume are a part of this, but they always seem to be "humoured therapy sessions".

12. When and why did "Im probably just paranoid" turn into "Something is happening to me and I want to find out what"? Or do you still toy with the idea of it all being imagination?

This is a very complicated question. When I said earlier that I had an unusual social experience(s) and situation, it is only upon reflection that I have determined this. I didn't think it was weird or different back then. I can't really say there was any specific instance...it was a gradual realization.

Out of the blue at one point, I called a friend of a friend trying to remember the very long diatribe he had said to me (it wasn't much of a conversation) and it resulted in my extracting the basic concept of "Cause and Effect" as an applicable point of ponderance. I thanked him, said something along the lines of, "I am closer to figuring out what I was trying to figure out," and hung up the phone. His girlfriend, whom we hadn't seen in quite awhile came over to the house almost immediately and I was questioned by my "girlfriend" why I had made the phone call (a relevant piece of information, imo, I was about 20 and she was 7 years onlder than me).

Another night, seemingly out of nowhere, I was asked if there was anything strange that I remembered from my childhood and we had a mild discussion regarding the fact that I never discuss my past and that I really didn't remember too much. I woke up the next morning and recalled an experience (night time paralysis when I was a teenager) and feeling quite disturbed about it. Her mother, who lived only several blocks away and whom we visited quite often, immediately came over and dragged us to the vet regarding something that had happened/was happening to our puppy (whom she was babysitting). We didn't talk about anything like that afterwards in that immediate time frame.

I certainly think that some of the things I percieve and ponder are imagined...and for my amusement, I do toy with the fact that it is all illusory and I am just a disgruntled human who wants to blame other things for my inadequecies...but really, I think those situations are when I may be the most 'delusioned'...

13. If this is real, wouldnt it be a great feat to expose and overcome it?

Absolutely. The drive to understand is the biggest motivator in my life.

Yet it is counter balanced by the fact that I can't just go to people and start describing anything and have it taken seriously. I can't even provide a coherent linear and organized account of this. I would need to do what I am doing here and then go back and rearrange events in chronological order as well as supplement with reasons, etc...and even then...it looks like a well researched story. The implant, if real, would be perfect, but I haven't exactly figured out how to ask a medical professional for the tests...

But these things don't just happen and the penultimate 'they' are more than adequate at what they do. 'Tis why I have no problem with a gradual thread like this.

14. Was the first time you wrote down your experience also the first time they were stolen from you (laptop)?

The laptop that you are referring to, that I referred to in the u2u as a "notebook" was indeed an actual notebook (paper and pen... )

Oddly enough...I forgot the password to the one laptop I do own and have carried that one around with me just because I can't stand the thought of letting go some of the stuff on that HD.

But it was not the first time. I have had other notebooks taken and many trinkets. To go a step further, because I move around alot, I never have a consistent stash of "things".

My thought on that is the stuff I do have carries with it a specific and tangible memory to the time I acquired it, as well as peripheral memory. The less I have, the less actual physical route to memory I have. Makes sense to me. I now have a box or two of things that I refuse to get rid of and go out of my way to ensure storage for if I have to up and leave for the umpteenth time...

15. Who might your "handlers" be?

These days, in my opinion, it is less likely that anyone can be attributed such a status. I have become very opinionated, semi-argumentative and the personality that I have cultivated over the past however long is that of a non-sequiter smart ass. I can derail a 'debunker' and that is what I wanted. To never be told "Yeah Right" again....people now adays say that they were "obligated to say it" when they see my eye-rolling in response to being told there is no conspiracy and that it is impossible, etc...this paragraph hints at a bit of pride I have, but so be it.

There are some in the past that I may venture something of that nature...the "Ex-Girlfriend" is now a licensed hypnotherapist...go figure......but as far as any corporate/government/group attribution or or thoughts, I have no clue. If I did, I would have been researching that to the ends of the earth.

16. Why might Britney Spears have experienced something similar?

She was bred to be a pop star. I am positive that the entire time she was growing up she had a problem meeting people naturally and not being anywhere near able to get through a day without being told how to live it. I imagine that a lot of her dreams are caught up in 'choreography' type attentuations.

Besides, when she turned of age and realized how rich she was...she rebelled. Very unintelligently. As if she were lashing out and making up for lost time. At any rate, I hardly would call myself an expert on Britney's situation and I am sure that I am only a passing authority on the subject at large...and that only because of my perspective.

17. If you havent visited them yet, do you at least have the contact information of some renegade doctors and therapists who specialize in implant-removal and hypnotic regression? And if you have visited them, what came up?

I haven't visited any. I wouldn't know how to contact them, or how to search for such humans. I wouldn't consider the implant removal...unless it was in a location easily accessed. Hypnotic regression, I would require a valid witness, video recording and audio recording. I don't trust anyone of that nature persay because doctors in my experience have been too caught up in tellingme what is up...rather than asking me and trusting my expression beyond the initial stigma usually saved for these topics.

18. If you hazard a guess, what might the purpose be of trying to remote influence you? Why?

I don't think I am that special...

So if I had to hazard a guess...I would say it is a general behaviour modification experiment meant to study a human in it's natural environment. Like on Animal Planet...I think that I was tagged and then released into the wild....not very glamorous.

19. Have you contacted ATS-member "General Eyes" who claims to have a similar issue?

Wasn't aware of this. I will look into this member and as well as direct him here.

20. Is the attempt to recover memories associated with unease or pain?

Anxiety. Lots of it sometimes. It is decidely easier to just not remember. And at this point, there is not much I care to remember.

I would like to remind everyone that this isn't as far fetched as it would seem at first. The principle of dissasociation is a natural phenomena that the human body goes through to seperate the inclination towards positive and negative behaviour. Negative results or experiences will tend to instill, in normal cases as far as I understand, a subtle anxiety or unpleasant thought asspciated with pain or anxiety. This will then be omitted in favor of the course of action that assuages this incurred feeling. This is usually a subtle process and is commonly taken by the individual as a logical process. It is a logical process...just not their own personal logic...

As for changing the thread title...good idea. It won't be a specific reference though...People who are interested in the subject are the only ones I care to have attentive to this thread and/or contributing. I think I'll need one of this forum specific Mod's or a super...easily accomplished though.

Summary of Data so far

Subject: MemoryShock/MK_Renfaire

Issue: "I was a victim of Mind-Control-Experimination by unknown sources"

Approach: Take as real and see what comes up when adopting the attitude of it being real.

Summary:


1. Panic attacks as a child, panic attacks today.

2. Alcoholism

3. Frequent sleep paralysis

4. Dream or Reality of lying on the lawn, car pulling up, stranger approaching...then blank/blackout

5. IceBerg Cavern Dream...since then reactive to freezers/popsicles.

Comment: Events erased from memory can still be recovered (albeit distorted and mixed with fantasy in a sleep/dreamstate.

5. Experimentation assumed to have started in childhood

6. Friends/Relatives behaving strangely, superiour as-if-having-secret.

Question: What "circles" or "social groups" did these friends belong to?

Question: Can you remember how/where/when you first met one of these friends?

7. Friends making decisions about subject without consulting him.

Comment: This is extremely odd. Treating you like an object/animal/child. For me the best indicator up to now.

Question: Did you have any friends/girlfriends that treated you as a sane, mature individual?

Question: Did most of your friends know each other or did some of them dissaprove of you seeing new friends or going to other places than they were?


8. No participation in social discussions and talk despite being present. People accepting this non-communication as if they are "all in on it". New people not commenting on it either.

Comment: Odd.


9. Subject experiences paranoia of being the object of collectively held anger.

10. Frequent moving, living in motel, at some fortune tellers, etc.

Comment: "Handlers" apparently like doing this in order to Dissociate someone from the cozy and safe harbour of a HOME. In de-identifiying a subject with anything and everything the subject becomes easier to implant.

11. Comments of friends when discussing issues too reactive in order to be normal conversation.


12. Two friends climbing into window while girlfriend says "go back to sleep"

Comment: Bingo. If that happened to me I´d know Im being toyed with.

13. Memory Lapse incident and being told afterwards he "jumped out of window".

14. Sudden memory losses after odd incidences (such as that buzzing sound in the Hotel)

16. Waking up in different environments

Question: Really?

17. "OCD" Symptoms

18. Reading conspiracy-related material

19. Has not let himself be x-rayed

Comment: You dont have to tell them why. Or you google up a conspiracy-paranoid-doctor to help you.

20. Has not talked to other MK victims.

Comment: Might be helpful.

21. Telling someone on the phone: "Ive figured something out" then hanging up. A few minutes later girlfriend who hasnt appeared in awhile suddenly appears. Subject is questioned about the reasons for his phone call.

Comment: Good catch.

22. Being asked by "friends" if he remembers anything about his childhood.

23. Memory of childhood possibly impaired.

24. Other incidents in which attention was diverted by relatives/friends when he started remembering something (going to the vet incident)

Question: Who the hell are these weirdos? You´ve been hanging with a strange crowd there


25. Subject willing to question himself as delusional and making things up.

Comment: A sure sign that you are sane. Only the insane do not question their beliefs.

26. Distrust of doctors.

Comment: There are some fringe doctors who believe in MK and will assist in looking for implants. Google.

27. Looses password to laptop and makes no effort to retrieve it or have a computer-shop get it back.

Question: Why not? Go ahead.

28. Written notes stolen.

Comment: A "handler" would understand that writing down ones thoughts is detrimental to mind-control and memory-erasure and would disapprove of that.


29. Owns few objects or "stash" that elicit memory.

Comment: More de-identification / dissociation.


30. Ex-Girlfriend now a licensed hypnotherapist.

Comment: Very telling. Simply amazing. Im dedicated so much time to this thread because this may very well be something dark happening.

31. Subject assumes that MK was a temporary experiment with him as we would experiment with animals and not necessarily a grand government scheme or manchurian-candidate type-thing. Possibly the experiment is over now (and maybe the subject deemed useless).

32. Subject possibly recognizes other MK victims

Comment: This was the purpose of the Britney Spears question.


33. Distrustful of Hypnotic Regression and therapists "telling him what to do".

Comment: Right on.

Comment: Advisable to seek out some more trustworthy and holistic hypnotherapists and then of course include video and audio. This really could be a key for you.

34. Subject keeps implying that he will be ridiculed for this thread.

Comment: Nonsense. Look at some of the other threads here.

Question: Any strange occurences since starting this thread?

Originally posted by The Vagabond

Originally posted by MemoryShock
What about sub-vocalization.

That's actually quite brilliant. I'd never even thought about it, but a high power microphone would all but give you the ability to read my mind. In fact, being REALLY good at lip-reading might do the trick in my particular case.

Now what if you can implant a human with a two way transmitter and not only have the capacity to register the sub-vocalization of the individual but be able to communicate the 'voice of god' as it were?

Originally posted by The Vagabond
But that's still a different animal from using the very mild EM generated by normal brain function to determine what the subjects specific thoughts are, which is what I thought was being discussed in your original post.

There are still studies that have potentially been able to correlate specific brain patterns to specific thoughts and themes/terms. Themes are likely the best application at this point for the general populace, but in certain situations I do not rule out a more thorough and specific adherence to the individual's reality (perceived and exampled)...

The team used high-resolution brain scans to identify patterns of activity before translating them into meaningful thoughts, revealing what a person planned to do in the near future. It is the first time scientists have succeeded in reading intentions in this way.

British Mass media report which unfortunately mostly refers to 'Ethics'...(a trend I have noticed in different aspects of up and coming bio technologies)

And a more scientific source...

ScienceDaily (Dec. 11, 2007) — Following ground-breaking research showing that neurons in the human brain respond in an abstract manner to particular individuals or objects, University of Leicester researchers have now discovered that, from the firing of this type of neuron, they can tell what a person is actually seeing.

The original research by Dr R Quian Quiroga, of the University’s Department of Engineering, showed that one neuron fired to, for instance, Jennifer Aniston, another one to Halle Berry, another one to the Sydney Opera House, etc.

Specific Measurements of Neuronal 'Firing' to Discern a Thought Process Specifically

If you go to my profile, you can click on my link under the heading 'favorite websites and find this source....not that ATS isn't my favorite website...

My point is...if you want up to date material on current neurological sudies and capabilities...then you have to visit the journals. You have to find the industry specific sites that the average and more numerous individual isn't inclined to....

Originally posted by The Vagabond
As for the situation the Swedes are dealing with, again I am sure that such transmitters are possible, but there remains a question of function. How much information would they be gathering/transmitting?

Whatever they are measuring. If an actual experiment were underway, then would it not be irresponsible to omit natural and direct interaction and then attempt to find correlation. Granted, you would still be dealing with subjective reasoning, a problem with the actual vetting of the social sciences, but that could be downplayed by a multiple interpretative social base. I seriously doubt that this isn't possible...it just isn't widespread and the various humans involved would have to be adhered to the cause much like a cult would adhere to an ideology...but the pursuit of science and social security (based on ever evolving technologies and questions) is much more realistic than "god"...

Originally posted by The Vagabond
The technology to use such a transmitter to tell somebody when I'm sleeping, when I'm hungry, when I'm thinking dirty thoughts about my Creative Writing professor, etc is probably out there- but it would require some context..

Which I don't discount..and have attempted to make concession for....as well...the specific 'paranoia' of personal issues as related to social stigmas would be a point of contention for instilling a lack of expression by the ['experimentee' and as well an irrelevant concern for the objective experimenter. The attempt to create a mean or an average is the true pursuit of science, as it can be validated by a third party...more true in the social sciences...

Originally posted by The Vagabond
In fact they had to send the Drill Instructors out of sight for about 20 minutes before the corpsmen could get acceptable blood pressure measurements on most of us.

It was a shot in the dark...but that statement gives me confidence in my assessment. The psyche is a more powerful entity than many of us give it credit for....in my opinion.

Originally posted by The Vagabond
You also mentioned blackouts and the ample memory-manipulation aids available to us, and that did make me think a bit. I do have a persistent problem with my memory of hospital visits as a child. All of them sort of run together. I can't distinguish the events of the night that I was taken to the emergency room with a severe asthma attack from the night I was taken to the emergency room with a broken leg, etc.

I conceded that time and subsequent attenuations make for a dampened recollection. But I would hesitate that such a consideration wouldn't be factored in..especially with the drugs currently available to help dampen 'short term memory'...

Skyfloating...Thanks for your objective perspective to this. It means alot. I will answer more indepth during my lunch break tomorrow...

I feel the desire to keep an objective balance to this thread...and I haven't given the tip of the iceberg, as it were. There is more (much) to communicate and I don't see this ending soon.

But I would like to state that I feel no urgency...as I have been dealing with this for years. So...a prolonged expression is favorite...especially if you can (and should) assume that I am continuing alcoholic imbibement....(a reference that has its' own interesting points of consideration).

I recognize that readers may interpret that as a point of consideration. But I pride my self on straight forward communication and stoic ones at that. My responses to you, therefore, are more suited for my lunch break...as the most I have had to drink is a cup of coffe..

Originally posted by Skyfloating

34. Subject keeps implying that he will be ridiculed for this thread.

Comment: Nonsense. Look at some of the other threads here.

A deep sigh of relief was had when I read that....suffice to say...I am waiting for the other shoe to drop. So I will proceed in as 'organized' fashion as possible.

And I was drunk in all of my responses to The Vagabond......objective reasoning is easier in such a physiological state.