STOP PRESS - Vast Cracks Appear in Arctic Ice

reply to post by D.Wolf


Exactly.

So:

STOP PRESS - Vast Cracks Appear in global warming caused by humans "theory".

Don't know why there are so many anti-global warmists around here. Even if there is nothing we can do, are you really that against cleaning up the Earth?

So the ice cracked... either we can fix it or we can't. People on this board seem to focus blame in the wrong area. It's policy you should be mad at, not the cause.

The cause is noble, whether it is correct or wrong.

You can tell someone has an agenda when just the mention of Global Warming makes them start yelling smart-ass Al Gore remarks.

Usually I just skip over those posts.

reply to post by Sublime620


The problem is that $hit doesn't get done in todays society unless the enviro's bitch a storm. I agree that the RIGHT thing to do is clean house, unfortunately man has learned to $hit on his own table, eat from it, and enjoy it...

reply to post by Sublime620

Even if there is nothing we can do, are you really that against cleaning up the Earth?

That's not a bad thing in and of itself, but the people in charge aren't going to do anything to clean up the Earth anyway. They're the ones who polluted everything to start with, and now the little guy is supposed to pay for the cleanup?

But I am certainly for a cleaner environment in the long run.

Originally posted by Sublime620

The cause is noble, whether it is correct or wrong.

Usually I just skip over comments such as the above. Reminds me of when people used to say about Nixon during Watergate, "my president - right or wrong".

What it shows is a person so locked into a thought or feeling that they are no longer capable of thinkning about alternatives.

I think most would agree that a cause that is known to be wrong cannot be called noble.

Originally posted by KilgoreTrout

No matter whether carbon emissions are to blame we need to reduce those emissions because they are poisoning the air that we breathe and the air that all the other, non-humans, on this planet have to breathe too. We need to ensure that we help promote bio-diversity to ensure that the from the very bottom up, the food chain is preserved and our means to produce alternative food sources is optimised.

Global warming, natural or otherwise will force us further towards an extinction or to the very least a massive depopulation event. If we allow it to.

You speak in circles of logic. Global warming is bad as it will kill many humans yet the sheer number of humans is making feeding and sheltering all of them too much of a strain on the Earth and helping cause Global Warming. Which is it? Pretty much sounds as if we are all doomed no matter what we do in your world view.

As the Human species continues it's growth, more and more resources will be consumed by us, leaving less and less for other species. You can't have both: maximum bio-diversity and massive growth of the human population. Something has to give.

I'll grant that as humans we do some pretty stupid things but you have to see that you can't have it both ways. As a species, perhaps we are TOO Successful. Nature has a way of taking care of Uber species like that eventually.

reply to post by Sublime620



I agree with you on that. There is nothing wrong with cleaning up our act so to speak. The problem is that this "house cleaning" is being delivered to us through scare tactics and innacurate information, and all the while they are promising that this will "fix" the problem.

But it WON'T fix the real problem. It can't. The problem is outside of our control. People are being led to believe that all that needs to happen to ensure our survival is to go green and put more money into enviornmental efforts. I'm all for cleaning up our mess but the real money needs to be going toward sustainability and survival.

reply to post by centurion1211


Cleaning up the Earth is wrong?

Finding cleaner energy is wrong?

Recycling is wrong?

Protecting ecosystems is wrong?

After all, those are the methods prefered by most advocates of Global Warming.

What is not noble about caring for and cleaning up our planet?

[edit on 23-5-2008 by Sublime620]

reply to post by theRiverGoddess


There has already been ways that people have been thinking of stopping this:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Sounds crazy to me....

Imagine all the mineral wealth Canada is going to have when the ice melts away. Americans stay back. Don't f#$@ around, the Arctic is ours.

reply to post by Sublime620


I never said any of that and challenge you to show where I have.

I was responding to the statement of yours that I quoted - nothing more.

You might want to try reading the posts a little more carefully to avoid these situations in the future.

Originally posted by TheComte
Imagine all the mineral wealth Canada is going to have when the ice melts away. Americans stay back. Don't f#$@ around, the Arctic is ours.

Tell that to the Russians. They are the ones already staking new Economic Zones of influence up there. C'mon, tell them to #@#@#@ off too!

reply to post by centurion1211


I guess we agree then that you dislike the policy, not the cause (which was the point of my entire post).

Folks, decorum please.

Back to topic. Yes ice is melting far faster as it's predicted. I am not blaming sun for our own trash in the air. Climate is changing and we should take big part of responsibility for it. Weather is becoming more and more severe and global temperatures are rising.

It's the fact that we have impact on our climate. First it was shown when we were releasing CFC's in the air. They are main reason for ozone holes. Idea that whole solar system is warmer is funny. How many meteorological sensors do we have on each of them?

Originally posted by Sublime620
Don't know why there are so many anti-global artists around here. Even if there is nothing we can do, are you really that against cleaning up the Earth?

So the ice cracked... either we can fix it or we can't. People on this board seem to focus blame in the wrong area. It's policy you should be mad at, not the cause.

We aren't against Global warming, it's occurring. We are against knee jerk reactions of what is causing it. We are against using unproven models to forecast future results and then basing policy on said uproven models.

No one is against cleaning up our act, so to speak as a Species. Cleaner, renewable sources of energy would be greatly appreciated by the vast majority of people on this planet, save the leaders of OPEC and the Oil Conglomerates. Sadly, even if we had these sources now, Global warming would continue for awhile till the next cycle kicks in, at least according to current models.

The hubris that you think mankind can "fix" the ice cracks bothers me though. Soon you will want to control the weather and plate shifting of the Earth. Some things we REALLY don't have control of. I know that bothers some here.

What if it's not a "policy" that is "causing" the warming and cracking of the ice? There's no one to blame, there has to be someone to blame or else your whole argument falls apart.

reply to post by centurion1211


You are clearly very angered by my comment that being blaze to the fate of hundreds of millions of people who don't have the clout to help themselves sounds like Naziism. (The people in question are as real as whoever is in the house with you now.)

If you explain why your apparent disinterest in the suffering of others was misunderstood, and it is convincing, I will withdraw the comment. I hope that is fair.

reply to post by pavil


That's fine. I understand that some people believe it is not man-made. I'm not so sure I buy that it's man-made either.

However, the cause still remains noble to me. I am fine paying a bit more to drive a cleaner car. I don't mind switching energy sources. I don't mind not drilling for oil in Alaska.

These are a few of the things that the man-made global warming movement is pushing. I don't care if they are right, the cause is still just.

reply to post by Sublime620

Finding cleaner energy is wrong?

Yes, when that cleaner energy happens to be our food supply. But of course "they" intend to profit from another crisis that is actually of their own doing.

There are plenty of methods for free and clean energy that have been shut down, for the simple fact that they cannot profit from them. So instead, we see biofuels coming online now. Next we'll see cars being run on the fermented flesh of those that are being starved to death.

Protecting ecosystems is wrong?

It's a shell game. Shut down the factories in one country in the name of saving the planet, only to reopen them in another country with even lower environmental standards. Not to mention the waste of energy and resources to move a factory.

[edit on 5/23/0808 by jackinthebox]

reply to post by Sublime620



I don't dispute that. We can agree on certain things.

By a cleaner car do you mean a hybrid, E85 or electric? I think that the Ethanol made with formely animal or human consumed crops is one of the biggest mistakes made by us recently. If you are doing that (using E85 made from those crops) you are not really helping the problem, I would contend you are making it worse.

I admire you for trying. I too have done things to conserve or use less energy in our house. All of us anti Manmade Global Warming people aren't wasteful pigs, we see the same problems, just some of the solutions proposed aren't really great ideas in our opinoins.

I hate speaking for others on topics like this.