The very real conspiracy against Freemasonry

reply to post by freight tomsen


You know what’s funny if you actually would join and go to our meetings you we see exactly that lol

my stated meeting is tonight I already know what we are going to talk about, who is going to serve breakfast on Sunday to the community, and we are going to talk about having a Masonic booth at an event, then we leave

Overall will take about an hour to do so, because some of the elder masons like to argue over what kind of food we should serve and whatnot.

But hey join you'll see that, that is the reality of what we talk about.

reply to post by Amaterasu


I was hoping that the opening post documented the obvious. If you want to know who the "bad guys" are it may be wise to look at the fruits of various groups rather than relying on black propaganda literature.

Ive spent some amount of time with the families and in the gardens of these senior masons and there´s nothing sinister about them at all.

On the other hand, I can tell you a few things that are sinister.

This is why masons are so obsessed with education. Without it there´s genocide of innocents, fueled by propaganda.

reply to post by bushidomason

No he would never do that....he wouldn't want to collapse his world built on conspiracy theories....

Especially with all the books he has written -- denoting masons as the cause of everything that is evil in the world. Or the amount of time spent fabricating mathematical equations to tie everything that has no actual connections together.

It must be nice to peg all ones problem one a single entity, and never have to take responsibility for oneself.....

[edit on 5/1/2008 by Choronzon]

Originally posted by freight tomsen
They'd rather "leave" anything that doesn't make Masonry sound awesome.

Fortuantely we are not a group that goes around having to "evangelize" the world. Neither do we have a hive-mind where each mason agrees with another. You will find all types of beliefs within freemasonry...

...including those masons who joined in order to find out if there´s a conspiracy.

reply to post by bushidomason


OMG, you are sharing masonic secrets! Is it so soon brother, that you forgot your blood oath to never speak to the profane about arguments over meatloaf vs turkey vs hot dogs?

You will most certainly be blackballed for this once I speak to a higher level mason, I'm talking like 34 degree and up.

Considering the outrageous accusiations brought forward all over the internet and here, I think we´re being pretty damn tolerant about it.

No mason I know has even bothered to file legal action. Consider this:

Libel is a crime

In law, defamation (also called vilification, slander, and libel) is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressively stated or implied to be factual, that may harm the reputation of an individual, business, product, group, government or nation. Slander refers to spoken comments, while libel refers to any other form of communication such as written words or images. Most jurisdictions allow legal actions, civil and/or criminal, to deter various kinds of defamation and retaliate against groundless criticism. Related to defamation is public disclosure of private facts which arises where one person reveals information which is not of public concern, and the release of which would offend a reasonable person.[1]

In many legal systems, adverse public statements about legal citizens presented as fact must be proven false to be defamatory or slanderous/libel.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by futureblind

 

When in "conspiracy-thinking-mode" I actually consider stuff like that once in awhile. Interesting to ponder.

But when I look at the 50 000 masons and millions of jews killed due to less-than-proven conspiracy-theories I get back to "keeping it real".

dont get me wrong im not against masons per se because you might be an interesting individual even though you are a mason, im not one to jump on the anti mason bandwagon. but i dont think your argument in itself is strong enough to discount all the evidence against masons of the past. its not the same thing, but the bush admin gambled that noone would point the finger at them considering it was their citizens that were killed. not to discount the lives of the 50 000 but maybe they opposed the direction that the masons were taking. its not out of the question. feel free to enlighten me

Originally posted by freight tomsen

Originally posted by Amaterasu
Heh. Just saying what I "see." Take it or leave it.

[shrug]

They'd rather "leave" anything that doesn't make Masonry sound awesome. But not too awesome, of course ... anytime people talk about what happens behind closed doors with blacked-out windows at lodges, the ATS Masons always say, "oh, we're just planning our next pancake breakfast."

I hope your not against Pancakes, thats how we get all the mind control drugs to the public.

Originally posted by bushidomason
reply to post by freight tomsen

 

You know what’s funny if you actually would join and go to our meetings you we see exactly that lol

I would LOVE to join. But I'm... Not good enough?

Why is that?

Because I had the misfortune of being born with the wrong genitalia.

And in my book, any organization that says I have nothing to contribute because of my biological configuration is suspect at the get go. (And don't go insisting that the Eastern Star is equivalent, or that some lodges do let women in. Fact is that E.S and the few lodges are powerless, for all intents and purposes.)

And the more I study, and the more information I gather, combined with what I look upon in the Consciousness field all bring me to my assessment.

Heh.

[edit on 5/1/2008 by Amaterasu]

Originally posted by Skyfloating
reply to post by Amaterasu

 

I was hoping that the opening post documented the obvious. If you want to know who the "bad guys" are it may be wise to look at the fruits of various groups rather than relying on black propaganda literature.

Many fruits are hidden.

Ive spent some amount of time with the families and in the gardens of these senior masons and there´s nothing sinister about them at all.

I knew a guy once that I worked with in a bank. He was friendly, fun, and I rather liked him (though something nagged at me). When he was arrested for embezzlement... I was surprised and not. My point is... Just because you spend time with someone does not mean they are giving you a clear view of who they really are.

Just sayin'.

On the other hand, I can tell you a few things that are sinister.

This is why masons are so obsessed with education. Without it there´s genocide of innocents, fueled by propaganda.

You say that you can tell us a few sinister things. Please elucidate.

After you say that, with nothing yet behind it, you use it (I think...) as the reason education is important. Without the data, this has little meaning.

Originally posted by futureblind

i dont think your argument in itself is strong enough to discount all the evidence against masons of the past.

I think that my personal experience of masonry + the fact that it is only tolerated in societies that cherish democracy and education weighs more than tracts being published in some underground basement plastered with swastikas or hammer & sickle.

Of course, if you´ve philosophically come to the conclusion that basic liberties are not good for humans, then masons are indeed bad.

its not the same thing, but the bush admin gambled that noone would point the finger at them considering it was their citizens that were killed. not to discount the lives of the 50 000 but maybe they opposed the direction that the masons were taking. its not out of the question. feel free to enlighten me

Yes, Ive read books that state that "jews and freemasons are in league with each other" and that it was THEM that actually orchestrated the Holocaust. When pondering conspiracy-theory one has to see it from every angle, even the most twisted. But this angle is not really "stronger" than the evidence of freemasons actually being men of goodwill.

Originally posted by Amaterasu

Many fruits are hidden.

By fruits I mean results....things that eventually come out into the open. By what eventually manifests for all to see, you can make a good guess about the quality of a group.

Just because you spend time with someone does not mean they are giving you a clear view of who they really are.Just sayin'.

But you, you hasnt spent ANY time with them, surely knows better

You claim to have gained your knowledge by intuition/channeling.

Are you implying that I myself am not equipped with intuition and cant discern right from wrong?

You say that you can tell us a few sinister things. Please elucidate.

Oppresive regimes for example. Genocide. Mass-murder. See the opening post.

Originally posted by lost in the midwest

I hope your not against Pancakes, thats how we get all the mind control drugs to the public.

Haha, that's a pretty good one. Nah, I've got nothing against pancakes or any of you guys personally. I just want freedom. Freedom the likes of which will never exist as long as secret societies do. Sorry guys, your history in undeniable, and all those high-profile figures meeting behind closed doors is unacceptable.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by futureblind

I think that my personal experience of masonry + the fact that it is only tolerated in societies that cherish democracy and education weighs more than tracts being published in some underground basement plastered with swastikas or hammer & sickle.

Of course, if you´ve philosophically come to the conclusion that basic liberties are not good for humans, then masons are indeed bad.

Yes, Ive read books that state that "jews and freemasons are in league with each other" and that it was THEM that actually orchestrated the Holocaust. When pondering conspiracy-theory one has to see it from every angle, even the most twisted. But this angle is not really "stronger" than the evidence of freemasons actually being men of goodwill.

its funny how the so called democratic societies like the U.S. are the very nations rife with upper level conspiracy, and the backwaters that have never heard of them are struggling with their own warlords and dictators, although the conspiracies they face are relatively low level corruption and third world problems. in a society that is so glossed over with 'liberty' the citizens are so fat with excess that for the meantime who would care about a secret society that dosent have anything to do with what breakdown britney is having or what oprah says you should be reading this week.

i didnt say anything about jews that was your inference.

and im not saying your not of goodwill but can you really say you know what is going on above you, the men of 30th degree and the ones above them? and the ones pulling their strings?

Originally posted by Amaterasu


I would LOVE to join. But I'm... Not good enough?

Why is that?

I would never say that you "aren't good enough".

Because I had the misfortune of being born with the wrong genitalia.

Couple of things here:

It has always been my contention that Freemasonry admits only men because it is a celebration of the masculine (Osirian) mysteries. It's not that women "aren't good enough". It's just that the mysteries of Isis, which celebrate the Divine Feminine, are different than the Osirian male mysteries.

Regardless, there are several different avenues. Out of all the mystical initiatory schools, Freemasonry is by far the most exoteric. If you are interested in the more esoteric aspects, there are many organizations to which both genders can join (I've been a member of several of thse as well).

Secondly, you could always join a Lodge of Co-Masonry, which tends to be more esoterically-minded than standard male Masonry as well.

Originally posted by freight tomsen
Sorry guys, your history in undeniable, and all those high-profile figures meeting behind closed doors is unacceptable.

Actually, people are perfectly free in our nation to meet together if they want, and are also free to ignore what you think is "acceptable", and to tell you what they do in private is none of your business. No one has to answer to you, and if you don't like, you're free to hit the road.

Originally posted by futureblind
and im not saying your not of goodwill but can you really say you know what is going on above you, the men of 30th degree and the ones above them? and the ones pulling their strings?

I can never rule out the possibility that everything I think is true is wrong and that behind the scenes of behind the scenes and behind the scenes of behind the scenes of scenes scenes and side scenes...

...something is happening Im not aware of.

However, its much easier to look at the anti-masonic books I have read, compare them to what I have experienced and realize they are full of lie and libel.

Originally posted by Skyfloating

Originally posted by Amaterasu

Many fruits are hidden.

By fruits I mean results....things that eventually come out into the open. By what eventually manifests for all to see, you can make a good guess about the quality of a group.

What I mean by fruits is the results...things that the path to the originator may be obscured, so that it seems others are responsible, or things that "just happen" where the hand that caused them is unseen, or where "good" things are shown to be actually pretty bad (the "War on Drugs" is one of a ton of examples - not saying for sure Masons promoted that, but some of them might have).

Just because you spend time with someone does not mean they are giving you a clear view of who they really are.Just sayin'.

But you, you hasnt spent ANY time with them, surely knows better

Never said nor implied that I "know better" about the specific ones of which you speak. I merely pointed out that spending time with anyone is NOT a valid way to necessarily understand the soul of the one you are with. Maybe (just a hypothesis) you were being used as a frontman. Someone who looked and saw idyllic behavior and would report this to the world...

Please avoid twisting words here. It reduces your credibility.

You claim to have gained your knowledge by intuition/channeling.

No. I reach out and catch a glimpse of a field. I have learned what the data mean, and how to explore at will. Though it is likely the basis upon which intuition manifests, it is much greater than that. "Channeling" is a whole different critter.

Are you implying that I myself am not equipped with intuition and cant discern right from wrong?

Not at all. I am ambivalent about you. It is unclear whether you are motivated to prove this because you believe it or because it is an agenda piece. It may be an unwitting behavior on your part (as my hypothesis suggests might be the case). But I can only give probabilities on that, and cannot state that those probabilities as I see them reach much higher than 50%, and that is then something that is up in the air.

If I could walk into your specific head and read your Consciousness, I would know for sure, but I can only sense patterns within groups thinking similarly. I can't pin it to you or anyone else.

You say that you can tell us a few sinister things. Please elucidate.

Oppresive regimes for example. Genocide. Mass-murder. See the opening post.

Thank you for the list. Pretty vague, even in the OP. But I'll accept that.

[edit on 5/1/2008 by Amaterasu]

im sure you would agree that the average catholic with the love and trust for their great leader the pope would have every idea of whats really going on behind closed doors, as they pledge their devotion (and cash) to the causes and 'truths' that he sees fit to indoctrinate the church with. if you honestly think comparing books to your experience as a low level mason and the fact that another book tells you that they killed 50 000 masons under Hitler is a solid grounds for dismissing the conspiracy theories against the order then continue with your smarmy chuckles with your fellow masons on the thread. im not anti masonic but your self assured irritating manner is making it easier.

As in the other thread. keep comments to the topic, not the personal junk. Thank you.