That's It!!! This Anti-Obama Propaganda Has Got To Stop

reply to post by bigbert81


I'll mimic your "Fair Enough"

However, I personally think that in an election, the Candidate voluntarily puts their necks out there... Only someone living in a cave could not possibly know what was coming when you agree to run for any office, much less the single most important office...

You can call it "Swift Boating", "Yellow Journalism" or "Trashing", it all boils down to trying to discredit the opponent in an attempt to win... Been done for years, and will most likely continue in the foreseeable future..

We may not like it, but the phenomenon is nothing new. Look at the popularity of such shows as "Wife Swap" and "Hells Kitchen", you can't honestly say they would be as popular if not for the inherent controversy...

There is an old NASCAR adage... Not much of a race if no one crashes...

It's human nature, not pretty, but human...

Semper

reply to post by _Del_


I think we are debating separate points, Del.

Do I think Obama is a Godsend? No.

Do I think he's perfect and flawless? No.

Do I think he's the best candidate THAT HAS A CHANCE TO WIN? 100% Yes.

That's why my arguments here are not 'ludicrous'. We are on 2 separate pages.

Trust me, brother, I would rather have Paul or Kucinich in there, but we're talking about who has a chance to win, and there's only 3 currently.

With regard to the Obama pastor fiasco, I would like to interject. Even if he was aware what was going on in the racially heated sermons spewed from a person promoting racism, it has been socially acceptable for black people to hate white people until this campaign. People have turned a blind eye to the fact black people hate white people in most scenarios. Walking down the street of a prodominately black neighborhood is more dangeous for a white person than it ever was for a person of color during the civil rights movement.

I wasn't born during the oprression of black people and see without color absolute, but I have seen black people hate me more than I have seen whitey harass the black man. As far as I have witnessed african American racisim is a valid arguement.

Oh yeah also the Republican, primary is over. All those people working for this regime of a party have nothing better to do than sit and make Democrats argue amongst themselves. You can bet most of the arguements were initiated by them. Don't let them pull the wool over your eyes and pull you away from the party for the people.

The President is of less concern to me than the appointees they are responsible for. America needs to realize the Supreme court is what makes the law of the land, they are who we should be voting for!

Originally posted by bigbert81
Do I think he's the best candidate THAT HAS A CHANCE TO WIN? 100% Yes.

That's why my arguments here are not 'ludicrous'. We are on 2 separate pages.

Trust me, brother, I would rather have Paul or Kucinich in there, but we're talking about who has a chance to win, and there's only 3 currently.

No your first post is calling out criticism of Obama. It doesn't say anything about who is the most electable candidate. And it's looking more and more like McCain is going to win the election -- not a democrat. And not only do I think Hillary would do better in the general election, but that she'd accomplish more when she got there -- and I can't believe I just typed it...
Here's her strategy. She draws out the process destroying Obama so that when he loses to McCain she can run again in 2012. If Obama wins the general election she can't run until 2016. So she drags it out spewing as much dirt as she can because she knows she can't win this nomination, so she'll try for the next.
Regardless of the democratic candidate, I'll probably be voting McCain while swallowing my bile come election time.

I do not understand how anyone would think that a man that is running for the leader position of a country cannot pledge himself to it by placing his hand over his heart is ok, and that it should not be looked at when voting for him. If he cannot recite the pledge of allegiance, and love this country, I do not want him leading it. What does he even want the position for if he does not care enough about the country to do this.

On the reverend comments, the small clips aside, how do you explain his comments in recent interviews? How do you explain him saying things like HIV was imposed upon blacks? How do you explain him talking about slavery as if he just tossed his chains off? Why would a man say the government is trying to keep his people down, when there are so many programs that only his people can take advantage of (because they are racist programs that only black people can use).

And then theres the "guilty by association" comment. If these shady people were just acquaintances, so be it, but these are long time associates, friends, spiritual guides, family members etc. etc. etc.

As I have said in other posts, when you go for the highest position in the land, your entire life is and should be under complete scrutiny. There should be valid explanations for any questionable subjects. I mean this for all candidates.

Personally, I would like to toss the dice that are up for election this year back in the cup and get a reroll, but Obama will never get my vote.

Aaron

reply to post by _Del_


Really? So those arguments against Obama are more influential to you than a perpetual war, or the same exact policies we've been seeing over the past 8 years of Satan's...I mean GWB's administration?

Do you not see where this country is going?

reply to post by Aaron_Justin

I do not understand how anyone would think that a man that is running for the leader position of a country cannot pledge himself to it by placing his hand over his heart is ok, and that it should not be looked at when voting for him. If he cannot recite the pledge of allegiance, and love this country, I do not want him leading it. What does he even want the position for if he does not care enough about the country to do this.

You really think this is more important than the issues? Whether a man puts his hand over his heart vs. the issues and honesty of the candidate?

On the reverend comments, the small clips aside, how do you explain his comments in recent interviews? How do you explain him saying things like HIV was imposed upon blacks? How do you explain him talking about slavery as if he just tossed his chains off? Why would a man say the government is trying to keep his people down, when there are so many programs that only his people can take advantage of (because they are racist programs that only black people can use).

I don't need to explain it. Wright does not speak for Obama.

And then theres the "guilty by association" comment. If these shady people were just acquaintances, so be it, but these are long time associates, friends, spiritual guides, family members etc. etc. etc.

What, so 'guilty by association' only counts if you've known a person for x amount of years? I guess you completely believe everything your parents or long time friends also believe.

Obama will never get my vote.

Yes, and why should he? I mean, his opponents support terrible things and have strong records of lying and flip-flopping on issues, but OBAMA DOESN'T PUT HIS HAND OVER HIS HEART. This is truly unforgiveable.

reply to post by bigbert81


You mean the same war that Obama has flip flopped on? You think they made Kerry look bad, just wait. Then you have Rezko scandals, Wright and Farrakhan, the earmarks to his wife's hospital, the pledge to only use public funding until the money came flooding in then he reneged, the "no lobbyist" claim even though he employs Daniel Shapiro and Broderick Johnson who guess what? That's right they're lobbyists for Big Oil. Not only that but he has all the problems that Dukakis had. They are going to smear him with a broad brush, and most of it will be earned.
You haven't even seen the heat yet -- he's still fighting Democrats. Wait til the opposition gets started...

I don't know who is worst! Hillary or Obama. Even McCain for that matter, but thats another thread!.
Obama, with distancing himself even more from Reverend Wright today, has just proved one thing to me. All he cares about is POWER. What kind of man throws his pastor under the bus like that (A pastor whose church Obama has attended for more than 20 years!)? Thats what bothers me.
People who want power badly enough to throw someone close to them to the wolves aren't worth a turd in a bucket to me.
You need to throw the politics aside and look at the person. When you do this, you see that Barack Hussein Obama isn't any better than the rest of them!

[edit on 30-4-2008 by CreeWolf]

I should clarify my use of the word "them". Before I get hit by the race-baiters, I mean "them" as being POLITICIANS, not Blacks.

Also, I'd like to add that "propaganda" generally is not completely true. Most of the points the OP brings up is facts. Pointing out the fact that this "'propaganda' has got to stop" is the problem I have with Democrats in general. Trying to infringe on everyones freedom of speech EXCEPT those that speak in favor of their viewpoint---and they (meaning Democrats) don't even realize they're trying to do it!

I HATE POLITICAL CORRECTNESS.

[edit on 30-4-2008 by CreeWolf]

reply to post by CreeWolf



I can see your point, however, some do not always know their pastors 100%. Heck, I watched a documentary about two parents who knew their priest for 30 years and let their daughter stay with him (other kids there to) while he was sexually abusing them. I think it's safe to say that these parents disassociated themselves from this priest as soon as possible. So, maybe there is a chance that Barry Obama didn't know his pastor was this way?

I just really don't feel that is is disassociating himself for "power". I mean what 'power' is he gaining? He doesn't even have the presidential candidacy nomination for his party yet... I don't remember John Kerry having any 'power' when he was the candidate (unless you want to use that he was a senator, then he had some 'power').

Really, what does the president have single control over? Just one thing, the big button... and only one person comes to mind when I think of someone that is 'power' hungry enough to actually press it (in the present time). (to clarify, supposedly there is a checks 'n' balances system somewhere).


[edit on 30-4-2008 by galatea]

reply to post by galatea


So Obama sat in this church's pews for 20 years and had no idea that Reverend Wright felt the way he did? Now the media is spinning it of course that the Right Wing isn't just attacking Reverend Wright, but black churches in general. (which is funny, because aren't Right Wingers usually labeled "religious wackos" by the MSM?) There are so many contradictions here it isn't even funny.

Of course Obama wants "power". Why would he be running for President? I think this guy will sell our country out as badly as Clinton did if not worse. If not on purpose, at least by negligence because this guy's ideas (going by what he says in speeches because he hasn't really stated his actual proposals for "change") are way off course. He lacks experience. I'd even go so far as to question his patriotism with ---I don't think I've seen this in the thread yet---his refusal to wear an American Flag lapel pin.

[edit on 30-4-2008 by CreeWolf]

Excellent post and I agree 100%. Obama is one of those very rare candidates that only come along once in a lifetime, if at all. The principles he embodies inspires people to become better, and try harder. There is nothing but honesty and integrity from this man.

I for one, am voting for Obama. Choosing Hillary or McCain is just more of the same, tired old depressing go-no-where future. Obama is going to really shake things up.

reply to post by CreeWolf


I'm not disagreeing with you I was just trying to give the benefit of the doubt to Mr. Obama. I mean those people had their priest over to their house, you mean they never noticed him actually doing innappropriate things (looks, carresses, etc) to their daughter? Hindsight is 20/20, and maybe he's figuring out now that being associated with this man isn't such a great idea, better than him sticking with the guy, correct?

This is why I don't like to get into political discussions because I just think that everyone has the right to think what they want about a candidate and vote for whom they choose. I just had to chime in earlier because of the fact that people think he's a terrorist based on his name, I just think that's unfair, plus I have a cousin in law and her last name is Hussein and she is probably one of the coolest people I've ever met. And since I came in here now I am interested lol.. I would like to know about the Lapel Pin.. can you tell me about this? (im not being sarcastic..)...

I also like these types of discussions because they help me in making my decision as to who I am going to vote for in the election. (I just never post because I never really make any sense because I have a habit of rambling.. ok I'll zip it! lol)

Oh, So you mean he just won't wear the pin? Did he publicly say 'no I refuse to wear such a pin!'.. or is he a 'metro' and the pin just didn't go with his suit? lol.... If that is true that he refuses to wear it, that is crazy and I am glad that I have seen both sides in here after all.

Obama's Pastor was one of his leading campaign advisors and long-time mentor. He shares the same views.

These recent stunt of interviews between Obama and Wright are staged to show that Obama has disdain for the Pastor because no one was believing it. It is all an act.

Fact: Obama knows everything about the Muslim religion - said so himself. This means he continues to study it.

Fact: He supports known terrorists willing to do (and having) done harm to innocent US citizens

Fact: He will not wear the American flag pin (a tradition among running canidates) and will not hold allegiance to the flag or what it stands for

Fact: He has only been a Senator for three years

Fact: He attended the Trinity church which stands for nothing but hatred for the US and what it stands for, not to mention the 'White Enemy'

Fact: He pulled in 9 million$ last year, not a Senators salary and outside the scope of donations - personal money

Fact: Pastor Wright lives on a 10million$ property paid for by Trinity church

Fact: Michelle Obama is anti-American, has stated so unknowingly and tried to refute after learning her mistake

Fact: He is strong supporter of engagement with China, even in spite of everything China has done to displace the US economically and will try to soon militarily

Fact: He hasn't said anything about the US National Security (absolutely nothing), about how to better it or prepare for some of the upcoming security challanges

Fact: Obama's leading campaign advisor authored the book "The Grand Chessboard" and is a supreme architect and support of New World Order goals and objectives

Fact: Obama grew up with money, his Grandma is wealthy banker who lives in Hawaii

Fact: Obama defended China in Dec. 2007 on Human Rights Day:

"China stressed the importance of family and reminded U.N. delegates that every right carried with it companion duties," stated Obama.

Fact: Obama's stepfather, his mother's second husband, introduced him to Islam. Obama was enrolled into a radical Muslim teaching school known as Wahabi (Wahabism) in Jakarta.

Fact: Obama's paternal Grandmother from Keyna is a devout Muslm:

In 2005 Obama met his paternal step-grandmoher (whom he calls his grandmother). Sarah Hussein Obama, 85, who lives in Kenya. She told the New York Times that she is "...a strong believer of Islamic faith,"

Fact: In August, 2006 Obama made a special trip to visit a special man in Kenya. The man's name was Raila Amolo Odinga. He is the head of the National Muslim Leaders Forum in Kenya. Obama campaigned for Raila who wants to overthrow the legitimate democratic government and become President of Keyna for life.

Fact: When sworn into political office, Obama didn't use the Bible, he used the Koran!

Fact: Obama served on the Wood's Fund board alongside William C. Ayers, a member of the Weathermen terrorist group which sought to overthrow of the U.S. government and took responsibility for bombing the U.S. Capitol in 1971.

Fact: Obama's choice for top national security adviser, former Clinton aide — Anthony Lake. Lake was a major player in the China-Gate affair where the communist state made off with a long list of space, satellite, and advanced missile technology.

Fact: Obama voted more than five times for USA-PATRIOT's renewal. This is a bill that is patently offensive to most Americans.

Fact: Obama has snorted Cocain and wrote about it in "Dreams of My Father"

Fact: Obama gave $22,500 as a donation to the Trinity Church in 2006 and gave a donation of $26,270 to Trinity Church in 2007!

Fact: While several of Obama’s fundraisers have recent experience working as lobbyists, at least 10 other big fundraisers hold senior positions in companies that have lobbyists under contract or employed lobbyists in the last few years, according to public records. Obama is lieing to the people about not accepting lobbyist money. He indeed still is, but more indirectly then before.

Fact: Obama had an admitted relationship with someone who was publicly identified as a member of the Communist Party USA (CPUSA). The record shows that Obama was in Hawaii from 1971-1979, where, at some point in time, he developed a close relationship, almost like a son, with Frank Marshall Davis

[edit on 30-4-2008 by jetxnet]

reply to post by galatea


I tend to get started on rants too! I like my voice to be heard and I hope you don't think I was attacking you or your views.

Here is the story on his lapel pin:

Obama, No Flag Pin

I suppose I can understand his reasoning for not wearing one when nearly everyone else who was a public figure did, but I still think it stinks. In a day when Anti-Americanism is rampant (even within America) I think he could have shown some Patriotism--instead, he chose the "hey, look at me!" at a time when wearing one would have been better I think. To sum it all up, Obama is in my view just a hippie who happens to be black.

According to the pastor, Mr. Obama then told him, “You can get kind of rough in the sermons, so what we’ve decided is that it’s best for you not to be out there in public.”

www.nytimes.com...

This was written some time ago. It certainly doesn't sound like Obama is unaware of what is preached in his church as of March 2007. Pure politician. They're going to eat him alive in the general election, I'm telling you...

First of all, your list isn't very accurate, and brings up a lot of nonsense that people do not care about to cloud the real issues about the problems with Obama.

Obama and his supporters constantly bash Hillary and McCain on a personal basis, and at the same time cry like a stuck pig when Obama is bashed on a personal basis. This is called hypocrisy, and is the worst of personal flaws. You complain about this list of attacks about Obama, and then bash Hillary on a personal basis. Your credibility is destroyed from the beginning.

Here are the real problems with Obama as a candidate.

First of all he is too liberal, and wants to bring back the welfare state, sorry, bad solution.

Obama's statements about working people in PA tells me he couldn't care less about the working class.

Obama's big plan seems to be to put a lot of liberal arts people through college, and then of course he will give them all government jobs to tell the stupid blue collar people how to live their lives.

Obama is a Muslim, and this is very important. As far as religions go, from reasonable to lunatic fringe, Islam is somewhere just before devil worship. I wouldn't vote for a NAZI, or a devil worshipper, and I wouldn't vote for a Muslim, or a scientologist for that matter.

Obama continues to lie about his faith. Obama was a muslim as a child, schooled as a muslim, and he lied about it. Obama's mother was a Muslim, and he lied about it. How do I know? Obama told a reporter, and there are many links on the internet of the interview, that the opening prayer of Islam is the most beautiful words spoken. The opening prayers of Islam are what a muslim recites to confirm that he is a Muslim and states his loyalty to Mahammad, and Obama then recites those words in perfect Arabic, confirming that he is a Muslim to this reporter.

Obama is a racist, and those who embrace racism are seriously flawed. What makes Obama a racist? His spiritual mentor is a racist. Long ago Obama should have abandoned this man as a spiritual leader, and there is only one reason why he would not, and that is because he agrees with what the pastor is saying. Obama's remarks about PA blue collar voters sealed the deal.

Then there are the numerous lies in Obama's memoir.

Obama is the biggest liar of the three candidates.

McCain is not GW, and will run the country completely differently. The war against terrorism is very real, and we need a president who will fight this threat to the western world. There are many Clinton supporters who were McCain fans long before Obama came along.

There are numerous other very serious problems with Obama that make him completely unsuitable as the democratic nominee, and there is no way he will win the general election.

All politicians are liars, and Obama is every bit as big of a liar, and double talker as Hillary. The thing is, Hillary has beaten Obama in every debate. She is more knowledgable on the issues, and has Bill to back her up. The Clintons are not liked by the DNC, or big media, and that makes me like them even more, and it also means that they are not what these groups want, which means the Clinton's are more likely to look after my interests rather than the interests of the elite far left. I think Hillary is smarter than Obama, more tenacious, and better qualified than Obama. Not only that, but Hillary is much more of a moderate, and will most likely to do a much better job of running the country.

If your only complaint about Hillary is that she is a liar, while trying to pretend that Obama is not, I suggest you stop talking about the splinter in our eyes, and take care of the plank in your own eye.

Originally posted by bigbert81
reply to post by _Del_

 

True; however, his votes for 'present' are actually a noted and popular strategy used in the Illinois senate to basically say 'I'd vote for it if it was revised a little'.

Obama did explain that when he voted for 'present', it was because he thought the bills unconstitutional. Shouldn't that be a good thing then?

In my not exactly humble opinion, NO.
If I were in the Senate (state or federal), and was asked to cast a vote on a measure that I considered unconstitutional, I'd like to think that I had the testicular fortitude and / or character to vote "NO"... or even "*DELETED BY THE CENSORS* NO!", and perhaps even enter a bit of a statement in the Congressional Record about WHY I voted as I did. To simply vote "Present" is to go on record as having sufficient doubts to not vote "AYE", but insufficient character to actually act on my doubts. Far from being a good thing, it's a weak, even spineless thing.

[edit on 30-4-2008 by Brother Stormhammer]