Terra papers : Hidden History of Planet Earth - Now Online!

not sure what the source of Terra papers is however Terra 2 is
in my view incredibly interesting. there are plenty of facts that
have been revealed lately including here @ ATS that do 'fit' the
powerful message of Terra 2. whoever assembled it, or just
published - a well done, excellent job!

best regards.

Originally posted by kshaund

I do know that Robert never bothered with ANY new age type books - EVER - he couldn't stand them - since Sitchin was in every new age bookstore, I didn't question whether or not he'd read them -

And you know this because he told you. Or was it because you followed him around and watched what he read right up until the moment he released his "thesis". Please, you know what you've been told.

and by the way, being an amateur writer I could not begin to read any one of Sitchins books and then piece together a story like the Terra Papers

And that is supposed to be evidence that Mr Morningsky is beyond questioning. OK.

- too much linguistics, too many name changes (Ea/Enki - Tiamat/Earth) so that (for me) gives Robert's work credibility... that as well as excursions to the desert with him and other researchers

Umm....ok, his story is credible because he claims he doesn't read sitchin, because he claims he wrote it in '66. The Terra papers are poorly written with many fictional contempary sci-fi themes and imagery in it. Oh, yeah but it was written in 66. Oh and it was a thesis too.
Sitchin is just one example of how people have used existing archeological evidence from ancient cultures to support the ET hypothesis mainly due to the fact that they have nothing else. Crop circles are like UFO's. We see them, but we don't know who or what makes them. Those that believe in the ET explanation again use this as overwhelming proof tht ET's exist without every showing ET's.

Just another religion. A belief in Aliens, and their alien miracles(ufo's, divine messages=terra papers, crop circles.....hmmm)
BelieveintheAlienReligion

this sounds like an interesting read.i have read some of bill coopers theories,some of it sounded like a mix of truth and speculation.i have to be honest,i get an initial feeling of ''urban legend'' when i read this post,but i will read it with an open mind.thank you for the link!!

Originally posted by theRiverGoddesswith some folks claiming it is hollow and 'rang like a bell for a long time' after a craft landed on it.....

That would be NASA after they crashed the command module into the Moon

Hey any chance you could do a readers digest condensed version of your OOBE thread for me?

Originally posted by welivefortheson
yes but what will earth be like in a 1000 or 50000 years time,a rather larger prize you would think?.

In 6000 Ad the Earth will be a barren desert... there is no record past 52,000



SOURCE: 'Alice' told me

[edit on 18-8-2008 by zorgon]

Originally posted by atlasastro

Originally posted by kshaund

I do know that Robert never bothered with ANY new age type books - EVER - he couldn't stand them - since Sitchin was in every new age bookstore, I didn't question whether or not he'd read them -

And you know this because he told you. Or was it because you followed him around and watched what he read right up until the moment he released his "thesis". Please, you know what you've been told.

and by the way, being an amateur writer I could not begin to read any one of Sitchins books and then piece together a story like the Terra Papers

And that is supposed to be evidence that Mr Morningsky is beyond questioning. OK.

- too much linguistics, too many name changes (Ea/Enki - Tiamat/Earth) so that (for me) gives Robert's work credibility... that as well as excursions to the desert with him and other researchers

Umm....ok, his story is credible because he claims he doesn't read sitchin, because he claims he wrote it in '66. The Terra papers are poorly written with many fictional contempary sci-fi themes and imagery in it. Oh, yeah but it was written in 66. Oh and it was a thesis too.
Sitchin is just one example of how people have used existing archeological evidence from ancient cultures to support the ET hypothesis mainly due to the fact that they have nothing else. Crop circles are like UFO's. We see them, but we don't know who or what makes them. Those that believe in the ET explanation again use this as overwhelming proof tht ET's exist without every showing ET's.

Just another religion. A belief in Aliens, and their alien miracles(ufo's, divine messages=terra papers, crop circles.....hmmm)
BelieveintheAlienReligion

My apologies - I have no idea what point you're trying to make - I can only give my experiences. Whether you believe them or not is irrelevant to me (and this thread). It is not a religion to believe in aliens anymore than its a religion to believe in undiscovered species on earth. It is about pursuing truths wherever they lead, and if you can provide a better one, I'm all ears. Your non-belief in aliens is what? Opposite of religious dogma?

I'm only interested in learning, not defending anyone or their work. Say what you like and it doesn't change the fact that the Terra Papers might just be dead on (pardon the punn).

So why the "oh yeah" it was written in 1966 and "oh yeah" it was his thesis too. Are you calling Mr. Morning Sky a liar? Or me? And have no idea why, if that's what you're doing or for what possible reason, seems counter-productive to me. What's your problem with other peoples experiences (and beliefs). Belief does not make religious. Nor does ufos and divine messages equal Terra Papers as you tried to state as fact.

Either there are aliens, or there are not, period.
Either there are ufos, or there are not, period.
Either you are open minded, or you are not, period.
Either you have a better reason to scoff at answers given to questions, or you dont', period.

reply to post by zorgon


Well I bet I could do a condensed run down from MY POV.......but the really informative and juicy stuff comes from other posters and not me....
That thread is my diary of experiences out of my body......good, bad and extra weird......all true though.
The most INTERESTING fact is.....I made a post on this very site in 2004 asking for any OOBE adept for a hand out, as I had read that yanking someone OUT was possible by a very experienced astral traveler.....and within a couple of hours I was answered via U2U......and later that night I was pulled from my body for an astral tour while I was very much awake and fully conscious.
SOOOO if you can find an adept willing to yank you, it works. I have not gotten good enough to do this for anyone.......I am still, fumbling & tumbling my way around outside of my body, and am not able to 'GO' to the places I want to go.....

(thats a decent short version)

If OOBE is really of interest to you....that big thread is PRICELESS
www.abovetopsecret.com...
in the amount of information coming from so many different travelers and how they make it work for them....it is subtly different for everybody.....

Now that I personally KNOW without a doubt there are other realities and dimensions....I know there are other worlds with life on them......and this brings me to the serious belief that there is SOLID truth in The Terra Papers.

Once many years ago....a phychic channeler told me that this universe is so seriously CLOSE to the very story presented in Star Wars....that I would laugh myself silly......that the Star Wars story was put out here to mislead people into thinking the real history of this planet is nothing more than a fictional sci fi story.
Reading The Terra Papers slammed this juicy tidbit home for me.......
Homerun that is...............it all clicks.
It is an AH HA moment as Oprah would say

[edit on 18-8-2008 by theRiverGoddess]

Originally posted by theRiverGoddess

If OOBE is really of interest to you....that big thread is PRICELESS

DRATS More work then

Originally posted by kshaund

My apologies - I have no idea what point you're trying to make - I can only give my experiences.

No appology necessary. My point is that Mr Morning Sky can say whatever he likes about how and when he wrote the terra papers, all he has is a story. Those that use it to support their beliefs in ET's have to place faith in Mr Morning Sky, and his story. Faith.

Whether you believe them or not is irrelevant to me (and this thread).

Well as you believe in being open minded, you must see the value in any point of view. As you are most welcome to dismiss my view as irrelevant, can i not make the same claim of irrelevance to Mr Morning Sky' claim that he wrote his "thesis" in '66 and has never been influenced by alternative archeological interpretations(Sitchin) and Contemporary Science Fiction(both heavily present in the Terra papers....which this thread is about).

It is not a religion to believe in aliens

I am afraid at the moment it is, but my view is only based on the evidence. So lets have a look at the religiosity of the Terra Papers than. We have a man recounting a story of an Alien encounter, detailing the plight of Humanity. That these words may lead to the salvation of an enslaved peoples.....hmmm, as Mr Morning Sky has no other evidence other than his story, you must place faith in Mr Morning Sky. You have to Believe Mr Morning Sky on his story only. Faith in the story. Religion.

anymore than its a religion to believe in undiscovered species on earth.

And that would put aliens along side these species at the moment: Big Foot, The Loch Ness Monster, Angels, Dragons, Unicorns.

Well It is about pursuing truths wherever they lead, and if you can provide a better one, I'm all ears.

Yes it is. I totally agree with you. But i think that what separates us on this thread is that I do not accept the Terra Papers as Truth. I would hazard a guess that you do, and that you base that belief on your experiences with Mr Morning Sky, and by what he has said. I do not have the same faith in Mr Morning Sky as you.

Your non-belief in aliens is what? Opposite of religious dogma?

Well, perhaps it is more scepticism. Am i to blindly accept the words of a man who offers a story. One that has many flaws in it. One not supported by any other evidence. Words reportedly written in '66, yet strikingly similar to many other individual works.
It is funny that you mention religious dogma, as proper religious dogma is supposed to be supported by material other than solely the writings pertaining to that religion, and it often leads directly to the faith of that same religion. Here we have the Terra papers. With no other supporting evidence, leading to a belief in Aliens. Or a Faith in Alien existence through the writings of Mr Morning Sky. Weak religious dogma. As i am opposed to this dogma, yes, My lack of faith in relation to the Terra Paper make me an opposite. But as Mr Thomas Aquinas wrote in relation to religious Dogma:

"If our opponent believes nothing of revelation, there is no longer any means of proving the articles of faith by reasoning, but only of answering his objections—if he has any—against faith".

It is quite often that all we get here on ATS, in relation to this topic and others in relation to Aliens existence, is good people like yourself questioning my objections to your faith. And all the while espousing open-mindedness.

I'm only interested in learning, not defending anyone or their work.

Me too, but you have defended these papers, which is not a problem for me, nor should it be for anyone else. As it should also be no problem when I question your beliefs in Mr Morning Sky' claims, especially when you only offer personal testimony of Mr morning Star' character in relation to his claims, which you did do.

Say what you like and it doesn't change the fact that the Terra Papers might just be dead on (pardon the punn).

Well, lets look at the facts. The facts at the moment are: that the Terra papers are a story told by a man who claims it was told to him by his Grandfather. They are the facts. Supposing they may be correct is like saying that Revelations may be Dead on. More religious coincidence.

So why the "oh yeah" it was written in 1966 and "oh yeah" it was his thesis too. Are you calling Mr. Morning Sky a liar? Or me?

The "oh yeah" is more exasperation, than accusation. Am i to base my beliefs in relation to the Alien existence defined in the Terra papers purely on Mr Morning Sky's poorly written story. Backed by your character reference.

And have no idea why, if that's what you're doing or for what possible reason, seems counter-productive to me. What's your problem with other peoples experiences (and beliefs). Belief does not make religious.

Faith based belief= religion. Can i not question the source of this threads topic, in this case the Terra Papers and Mr Morning Sky. Can you please explain to me how and what has been produced here on this thread, and how I, by merely expressing my own beliefs in relation to the Terra Papers, am being counter-productive on a public forum that asks users to deny ignorance.

Nor does UFOs and divine messages equal Terra Papers as you tried to state as fact.

And where did i say that it was fact. This is what i said.

quote by atlasastroJust another religion. A belief in Aliens, and their alien miracles(UFO's, divine messages=terra papers, crop circles.....hmmm)

I am simply highlighting the similarities, I personally find between a belief in Aliens/ET with other religion and religious characteristics. Please do not try an cloud the issue with these poor accusations that i am misleading you or other posters.

Either there are aliens, or there are not, period.

Well obviously. But obviously if you believe there is, you have definitive evidence or not, period.
Either you believe in the Terra Papers or not, purely based on the written words as this is all we have to support Mr Morning Sky, than i will continue to see that this is a belief based on faith and is similar to religion and is thus religious in nature, period.
If you believe that the Terra Papers are True , without any supporting evidence, purely on the word of the Author, you are naive at best, and gullible at worst, period.

Either there are UFOs, or there are not, period.

This does not prove anything other than that there are UFO's. Period. When one lands and Mr Morning Skys friends jump out, come and tell me to stop questioning, and i will. Period.

Either you are open minded, or you are not, period.

Yes. But at what point do you entertain something like the Terra papers as being True and possible, and the reality that it may just be a story? At the moment my mind is open to it being a story, but that is just on the evidence I have. Those that are open to it being true and possible base that on their available evidence which supports their beliefs.
Does Open minded mean that I have to believe what everyone else on a thread does?, because if that is your definition, than sorry, no, I won't. Period.
Will i continue to base my beliefs in relation to the Terra papers and the existence of ET's on solid evidence, looked at critically, from any number of angles and possible explanations. I will. period.

Either you have a better reason to scoff at answers given to questions, or you don't', period.

Well, i do have good reasons. To say that his story is undeniably true would only invite scoffs. You want to silence the scoffs, make people gasp with the Truth, real evidence, undeniable stories, impenetrable proof. The Terra papers and Mr Morning Sky are non of these. They aren't even close.
Open minded, please!.

reply to post by atlasastro


Hi Atlas - I'm not good at breaking up quotes so won't bother - generally speaking to your last post, I don't think of myself as defending the Terra Papers so much as explaining some questions some people have - like when they were written. I also don't intend to defend Robert Morning Sky either, just explain my perspective/experience.

No, I was not with him 24/7 to know whether he went in or out of bookstores. But the time I did lived with him and his family (around 1996-1999), in the same house I was able to observe his character and integrity 24/7 over time, which always reveals people (and work) who don't have substance. My only way to discern a lot of authors work (because you can't 'hear' the voice when reading) was to meet them. Most authors I met (and there were many) didn't hold enough interest to keep going with them - Robert's work did when I first heard about it so I went there to find out for myself "if" there "might" be truth in the Terra Papers, because if there is, wow....

What you probably don't realize is Robert has written many books and done workshops 14 hours long talking about all the history etc. - when you only have the Terra Papers, it is more difficult, I understand - which is why I went to Phoenix to find out for myself. And I left my family of three children to do so, it was that important - to me.

So all I can offer after my time with Robert and his family and a few hard-core researchers from across the globe (about 6 of us) is my opinion (not faith). Everyone there researched everything we could - he had a library of over 5000 books on everything non-fiction that he drew from for all his other writings, which again, aren't generally available at the moment.

He is putting up a new website soon (hurray!) and is making some public presentations again in the very near future after not being public for nearly a decade. Many new works will be published there (and I hope his older work, too) - he just forwarded one ten page, referenced paper he wrote for his website and I offer the final paragraph here:

Quote, August 2006, Robert Morning Sky:
"We will suggest during the course of the studies on this website that there are, in fact, extraterrestrial beings and that they have been visiting our planet for some time. We will offer several studies on scientific principles which we believe support our position."

I did not intend to accuse you of trying to derail anything (!) nor do I believe that's your intention - its just that I did start a thread called Terra Papers, I Was There (this one is just that they're available) which is why I commented as I did in that regard.

"A belief in Aliens, and their alien miracles(UFO's, divine messages=terra papers, crop circles" is stated as a fact - eg, 1 + 1 = 2 is a fact (true) - 1 + 1 = 3 not a fact (false). A belief in aliens does not equal terra papers (and crop circles). I still disagree with this - I believe in air and can't see it but have faith it's there every breath - doesn't make it a religion. I have faith the food I eat will satisfy my hunger. My point is using words like faith and belief don't mean anything because they are just that - faith and belief. The Terra Papers should be taken or left as the reader decides. Many people find it fills in years of questions (like myself), others are like yourself and others won't even touch them in the first place.

The word religion is defined (Canadian dictionary) as: 1. belief in God or gods 2. the worship of God or gods 4 a particular system of religious belief and worship (Christian religion, Moslem religion) 4. a matter of conscience (praying religiously; keeping house clean religiously) None of these fit your context here (in my opinion).

Also -
belief is: 1. what is held to be true; something beliefed; opinion 2. an acceptance as true or real 3. faith; trust

faith is: 1. a believing without proof; trust 2. belief in God, religion, or spiritual things 3. what is believed 4. a religion 5. a being faithful; loyalty

When I say I believe there are undiscovered species - I was considering the new kinds of plants still being discovered, new bugs, etc. etc. and not necessarily Bigfoot though I "believe" there is something to Bigfoot, I have no idea what it is. I believe in a lot of things - and that doesn't make any of them "true" which I think is what we're all looking for - ultimate truths -

My contact with et's is virtually non-existant so all I have to go on is forty years of trying to find out "why we're here" and this is where it lead me and where I felt (finally) I had some real answers to the biggest questions out there.

It is/was my journey and experience. What I can say (as will others who have met him), is that he is consistent, brilliant in mind and writing, decisive and one of a kind from where I stand. He also always gives credit to everyone else's work (unlike David Icke and others I've come to know). Add to that he grew up in the desert with his own experiences (I grew up in a tiny town in Canada) and there he is.

Make for a good discussion at the very least!

So yes, please, what better explanation do you have for "why we're here?" - sincere question

Hello kshaund,
Thank you for sharing your personal experiences in relation to Mr Morning Sky with me. The fact that you left your family to follow your search for the truth is both admirable and brave. I guess investing that much time, and sacrificing such importatnt time away from your loved ones illustrates how important this is to you. I hope that those sacrifices, that investment does not mean you equate what has meaning and is true in proportion to that sacrifice and investment.

Originally posted by kshaund
What you probably don't realize is Robert has written many books and done workshops 14 hours long talking about all the history etc. - when you only have the Terra Papers, it is more difficult, I understand - which is why I went to Phoenix to find out for myself. And I left my family of three children to do so, it was that important - to me.

I do know that Mr Morning Sky had been actively giving talks, seminars, convention appearances from around 1995-97 to keep a promise, his "one year promise". His main claim and work is the Terra Papers. I know he has researched alot of ancient history and he gives an alternative account for many aspects of ancient history that help support his Terra Papers, Are interpretations evidence, are writing books and talking about your interpretations in relation to a story passed on by your grandfather any more likely to make your original story true. Should it not stand alone if it is true.

So all I can offer after my time with Robert and his family and a few hard-core researchers from across the globe (about 6 of us) is my opinion (not faith). Everyone there researched everything we could - he had a library of over 5000 books on everything non-fiction that he drew from for all his other writings, which again, aren't generally available at the moment.

That is pretty cool, at least you are lucky enough to have people share your passion for these fringe topics. 5000 books. I am not being condescending, but is that supposed to be significant, the University i attended has hundreds of thousands, and a faculty of Archeology with its own Libarary, so i can support my view that way too. It has no meaning other than to claim that Mr Morning Sky used 5000 books, and 6 people from around the Globe, whom you admit are Hard-core, not impartial. Its like saying the author of the Bible has read 5000 books with six hard-core priests interpreting those same archeological to suit there own beliefs. Surely you can concede that.

He is putting up a new website soon (hurray!) and is making some public presentations again in the very near future after not being public for nearly a decade.

lets hope so.

Many new works will be published there (and I hope his older work, too) - he just forwarded one ten page, referenced paper he wrote for his website and I offer the final paragraph here:

Quote, August 2006, Robert Morning Sky:
"We will suggest during the course of the studies on this website that there are, in fact, extraterrestrial beings and that they have been visiting our planet for some time. We will offer several studies on scientific principles which we believe support our position."

I will await these studies and scientific principle, but i believe Mr Morning Sky may be jumping on the Band Wagon again, as the last few years has seen a surge in interest in the Likes of Ike etc. I believe we will see the same rehashed material that he gave us in the Terra Papers. In fact, I'll wager my house on it. There will be nothing difinitive, nothing new, just speculative interpretations. I mean, an extrordinary claim requires extrodinary evidence, don't you agree.

I did not intend to accuse you of trying to derail anything (!) nor do I believe that's your intention - its just that I did start a thread called Terra Papers, I Was There (this one is just that they're available) which is why I commented as I did in that regard.

No problem then.

"A belief in Aliens, and their alien miracles(UFO's, divine messages=terra papers, crop circles" is stated as a fact - eg, 1 + 1 = 2 is a fact (true) - 1 + 1 = 3 not a fact (false). A belief in aliens does not equal terra papers (and crop circles).

Well if you want some facts in rlation to the topic of Aliens and the religious nature of these beliefs, i can only point you here....Here.

I still disagree with this - I believe in air and can't see it but have faith it's there every breath - doesn't make it a religion. I have faith the food I eat will satisfy my hunger. My point is using words like faith and belief don't mean anything because they are just that - faith and belief.

You can see air, when it blows you feel it, you feel it when you breath it, Science can clearly show you that air exists. Can we do this with ET's, or the Aliens described in the Terra Papers? If words like faith and belief don't mean anything, then you should have no problem with me using them.

The Terra Papers should be taken or left as the reader decides. Many people find it fills in years of questions (like myself), others are like yourself and others won't even touch them in the first place.

I agree, but i also believe that they are also culturally significant and important historical references when we look at the progression and development of beliefs. Especially say if one was to believe that the Terra Papers are evidence of Science and technology influencing society so much so that societies are forced to update old traditional ideologies to fit them into a climate that is heavily difined within scientific and technological paradigms.

The word religion is defined (Canadian dictionary) as: 1. belief in God or gods 2. the worship of God or gods 4 a particular system of religious belief and worship (Christian religion, Moslem religion) 4. a matter of conscience (praying religiously; keeping house clean religiously) None of these fit your context here (in my opinion).

Well, i guess you are making my point, you can always find a book to support your beliefs. Here is a definition that supports mine.

1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.

dictionary.reference.com...

My contact with et's is virtually non-existant so all I have to go on is forty years of trying to find out "why we're here" and this is where it lead me and where I felt (finally) I had some real answers to the biggest questions out there.

How is this any different to say a belief in God, or re-incarnation. people have virtually no experience with these, they get their big questions answered. See the parallels. how is your beliefs diferent. How are your beliefs unreligious.

It is/was my journey and experience. What I can say ..... and there he is.

I have heard a few people within the Feild say that he is a very likeable guy, i have no problem with you or anyone else liking Mr Morning Sky. I cannot agree with you though on his status as a brilliant writer, but we can have different tastes and still eat at the same table.
This is the best thing he has written.

In every workshop, lecture and address, I always begin by advising the audience that I am a "Nobody"...That one must not accept what I say, That I must be challenged and that I must have my work examined carefully. Truth is not an exercise in Faith. Truth is not based on its messenger...Truth stands alone, regardless of who may express it.

Quote by Robert Morning Sky.
Cheers.

reply to post by atlasastro

Hi again Atlas-

As an explanatory note - I too (as one other poster in your other thread explained) now have cognitive issues as I diagnosed with MS about 4 years ago and my short term memory as well as cognitive abilities have been impaired (takes a lot longer to absorb information and respond, generally speaking), so I am at a disadvantage trying to read a long post by you (good info, just way too long for me to get from the beginning to the end and remember where I started) - so with that explanation I will continue to reply to your comments and references.

At the risk of sounding defensive rather than explanatory , a personal collection of 5000 books hardly compares to a universities collection - and it depends on "what books" are in the collection as to their value... most were current and what was available (Jim Keith, Barbara Walker, which I'm guessing were not in the Oxford library, as well as books on genetics, dna, archeology, even history of bees all add value to who we are and where we come from)- other sources for putting a big picture together are people's testimonies and...?? I guess now it would be youtube - but that's a whole new level of discernment...

And I really don't understand if you are trying to indicate alien abductions are a new religion or not - so I will just state again from my perspective that pursuing truths doesn't = religion - it equals pursuing truths. To me religion = dogma (an unbending belief many will carry to wars and personal death to defend or inflict their beliefs). My beliefs do indeed bend and change, so I do not believe I am part of any religion anywhere - I do not have co-members or a common belief/goal to share with others, only my own and if they are similar, that's all it is, similar.

To be a religion requires more than being a seeker - to me it means someone has stopped looking and settled into a nice, comfortable paradigm shared with others of like-mind or (in the case of abductions, I suppose), like experiences.

Personally, I find more value in trying to trace our past through books and other documented work than people's beliefs (all aliens are us in the future, etc.). Terra Papers was Roberts work going back in our history to try and document the star beings accounting of our hidden history - Robert was told the story, then Robert went to books and history to try and find if it indeed showed up anywhere, hence the birth of the Terra Papers. And yes, it will be good to see his new work, which is about prophecy, beings of light, and most importantly establishing our creator was female...

Do I believe it all 100 percent? No. It fluctutes as the information does. I'm just trying to keep up to all the deceptions, misinterpretations, misunderstandings, poor communication, outright lying, etc. etc. that pervade the shreds of 'potential' truths.

I've always had a feeling (like my earliest pre-school memories) that there's something very, very off about this existance and since that time I put my hands on everything I could read, watched everything I could and talked to whoever I though had value to add (or detract). It's an on-going process and doesn't stop! If it does, THEN I believe it's a real risk becoming a 'religion'.

I also belive truth is elusive and changes, except for perhaps that "Great Truth" of which I have no idea what it is, just my 2 cents trying to understand this great muck we find ourselves in -

I'd have to say for a prison planet, it is incredibly beautiful and wondrous and for that I'm grateful - the system sucks, always has, and likely always will - and that's the most disheartening revelation I've ever experienced, that higher beings are no better than us and manipulate and enslave for their own gain and that's just not good enough for me -

I want out of this - I want freedom to choose my next incarnation, if any, and my greatest fear that our very souls 'might' be the prize, the real prisoners, is about as ultimate 'screwed' as one can get...

In regards to the comment about his work re-hashing the Terra Papers - it's my take that the story in the Terra Papers is the point - everything else underneath, between, below, inspit of, etc. is within that story, not different than -

"IF" the Terra Papers are true, then what is a bigger picture than having been created and controlled mentally, physically, financially and spiritually by a race of cold-blooded beings as old as time...? Sorry, I just don't get the point of saying it's probably Terra Papers rehashed - to me the Terra Papers are the story - everything else is just details....

Kindest regards and thank you for your insights -

Originally posted by kshaund

Hi again Atlas-

As an explanatory note - I too (as one other poster in your other thread explained) now have cognitive issues as I diagnosed with MS about 4 years ago....

I am sorry to here of your diagnosis, and wish you all best in living and coping with MS.

At the risk of sounding defensive rather than explanatory

, a personal collection of 5000 books hardly compares to a universities collection - and it depends on "what books" are in the collection as to their value...

That was my whole point, interpretation depends on alot of things. He has 5000 books to use to support the Terra Paper, that is all it means to me. It does not make them any truer than when he just had the Terra Papers in my humble opinion. And remember, the Terra Papers are not an Idea, they are a Claim of direct Alien Contact and an exchange of information which Mr Morning Sky claims is the Hiddens history of earth.

And I really don't understand if you are trying to indicate alien abductions are a new religion or not - so I will just state again from my perspective that pursuing truths doesn't = religion - it equals pursuing truths. To me religion = dogma (an unbending belief many will carry to wars and personal death to defend or inflict their beliefs). My beliefs do indeed bend and change, so I do not believe I am part of any religion anywhere - I do not have co-members or a common belief/goal to share with others, only my own and if they are similar, that's all it is, similar.

I do believe that a belief in Aliens and Abduction experience at the moment has many religious characteristics and similarities. It is new and growing, so to compare all of it to more popular and established religions(ie religious wars etc) is valid, but the fact that no wars have been fought over this growing ideaology dose not exclude it from having a religious nature. BTW, people have died for believing in Aliens and practicing a belief in those aliens(Hale Bopp ring any bells). We are seeing more organised groups that express a specific belief in Being apparently far superior to us, that can help us, may save us, or herald a new era for humanity, yet these groups cannot show us these aliens anymore that the catholic church can show us God. Can you see the resemblence. These observable similarities and characteristic are what i base my beliefs on.

To be a religion requires more than being a seeker - to me it means someone has stopped looking and settled into a nice, comfortable paradigm shared with others of like-mind or (in the case of abductions, I suppose), like experiences.

I think that just because science says alien life is possible, some how people who believe in superior alien life think it sits outside of religion, but my belief is that due to science and technology hypothesising this possibility, people update old traditional views of Gods etc with this "possibility", not the fact that they exist, but a faith in it being possible, given the cultural influence in Pop and Mainstream Culture(which I think the Terra Papers is part of) and Science and Technology, people then attribute experiences to this new possibility which is what we see with alien abductions.

Personally, I find more value in trying to trace our past through books and other documented work than people's beliefs (all aliens are us in the future, etc.). Terra Papers was Roberts work going back in our history to try....

It is funny that you mention Books. As the Bible is a book, so is the Koran, in fact most religions are written down and handed on, and most religions are now investigated by retracing history and looking through disciplines like linguistic and archeology to find supporting evidence as stated in these books and others. So here we have more similarities. There are also many groups studying Religion in general, NAASR, CSSR...just two good ones to look up as they have great books lists. I think you should look at what defines religions and then compare the growing belief in aliens.

Do I believe it all 100 percent? No. It fluctutes as the information does. I'm just trying to keep up to all the deceptions, misinterpretations, misunderstandings, poor communication, outright lying, etc. etc. that pervade the shreds of 'potential' truths.

This is how many people feel about God and organisations that grow around a belief in God, Catholic Church, Evangelists, Extremist Muslims...in these three examples i can point to individuals within a belief system who deceive or manipulate, or misinterpret the words of a book, and those that place a belief in that book etc., can you see the resemblance with a belief in aliens and the Terra Papers. Just because your belief is not some how an acceptable norm or group related activity does not make it non-religious in nature. And as you pointed out earlier, you belief answers a lot of big questions for you.

I've always had a feeling (like my earliest pre-school memories) that there's something very, very off about this existence and since that time I put my hands on everything I could read, watched everything I could and talked to whoever I though had value to add (or detract). It's an on-going process and doesn't stop! If it does, THEN I believe it's a real risk becoming a 'religion'.

The only way a belief in Alien life far superior to ours, that has been influencing us etc. will avoid being compared to religion, is if these beings make themselves known to all of us, not just the believers. That is just my feeling.

I'd have to say for a prison planet, it is incredibly beautiful and wondrous and for that I'm grateful - the system sucks, always has, and likely always will - and that's the most disheartening revelation I've ever experienced, that higher beings are no better than us and manipulate and enslave for their own gain and that's just not good enough for me -

You make a great point, which the likes of Ike and co. fail to explain adequately, if you ask me. It is also interesting to note that since the late 1940's when the UFO and Alien reports first started, the greatest numbers in regards to contact and activity have been near times of great social fear and crisis.....so are some people now praying to aliens to answer mans woes, are they now getting messages from these superior beings where once it was God, Angels or spirits. There has been alot of activity over the last 7 years has there not. Ike is Back from his disasterous 70's period with Mr Wogan, and Mr Morning Sky seems keen to get back in the mix. Interesting!

In regards to the comment about his work re-hashing the Terra Papers - it's my take that the story in the Terra Papers is the point -

When i mean rehash, i mean the Mr Morning Sky has rehashed other peoples ideas and works. I do not believe he wrote it in 66. He only appears in 95.That is just my belief. I believe his new stuff will be just as unoriginal as the Terra Papers. I guess I'll have to wait for the Website.

"IF" the Terra Papers are true, then what is a bigger picture than having been created and controlled mentally, physically, financially and spiritually by a race of cold-blooded beings as old as time...? Sorry, I just don't get the point of saying it's probably Terra Papers rehashed - to me the Terra Papers are the story - everything else is just details....

The Terra Papers are real or they are not. You have to form a belief on what is available. As there is no definitive proof other than the Terra Papers, you must act on a faith in the Papers. The fact that Mr Morning Sky needs to look into history to support the Terra Papers are proof that the Papers themselves do not Stand Alone as a Truth. So the papers are open to speculation and interpretation. You have place a belief in them without proof. That is Faith.

Thank you for your replies.


[edit on 23-8-2008 by atlasastro]

Originally posted by atlasastro

Originally posted by kshaund

Hi again Atlas

I'd have to say for a prison planet, it is incredibly beautiful and wondrous and for that I'm grateful - the system sucks, always has, and likely always will - and that's the most disheartening revelation I've ever experienced, that higher beings are no better than us and manipulate and enslave for their own gain and that's just not good enough for me -

You make a great point, which the likes of Ike and co. fail to explain adequately, if you ask me. It is also interesting to note that since the late 1940's when the UFO and Alien reports first started, the greatest numbers in regards to contact and activity have been near times of great social fear and crisis.....so are some people now praying to aliens to answer mans woes, are they now getting messages from these superbeings.....

I cannot disagree that a rising belief in "anything" can become a "religion" and become fanatical or dogmatic - it becomes a 'personality'. Just like the catholic religion has a personality, so does any group (individuals too), etc. There's no end to the types and degrees of it all, which is why (I think) I'm not getting your point because I keep feeling we're discussing the same thing in the end...?

Yes, if abductees all get together and come to a same conclusion, I suppose it could/would be a religion (depending on what dictionary definition, because first base is to understand what meaning is intended in the word to begin with). If a religion is a common belief, especially in 'god' of course - it can become so - maybe even has to become so by the very nature of a group mind, I don't know.

Trends - yes they change - what we (people at any point in time) are seriously lacking is a total picture - so you can observe a rise of 'this' via google or books, but you have no way of getting all the other instances that might add or detract from that trend - but to me that's all a given in trying to understand the whole pictures, which is why it's difficult for me to ever say I believe 100% in anything. I just don't know what other clues are out there that I'm not getting, which is likely a whole lot more than I have now.

Yes, people can pick points to support beliefs - and people can also pick points to support a story. What other way is there? (serious question to you). But when you find in a science book a reference that says for example that the six digit gene is dominant over the five digit gene, why couldn't that be seen as one example supporting alien dna?

Or you know Jesus is referred to as a rabbi and in another book you learn that a rabbi is always married, can you not deduct that Jesus was likely married?

Not sure why you are sounding opposed to using books as references to life. Like I said before, other than personal experiences, where do we get information from otherwise? Nothing is given to us and in fact it's quite the opposite, everything is hidden or so distorted it's virtually meaningless anymore.

I believe the linguistics speak for themselves (pardon the punn ;-) and do stand alone. That Robert was able to find a history to support Bek'Ti's story doesn't negate the story. If Bek'Ti's story was about a purple cosmic blob able to absorb an entire group of people and transport them from one universe to another, do you think going back in our history is going to support that story? That's my point - can't support a story in history that's nowhere to be found. That's what the Terra Papers were about - and that's been my point here - it's fine to say or believe whatever about their origin and authenticity, but I would also ask what better explanation do YOU have for US being here and who was Ra and Ea/Enlil in the past and Tiamat etc if the Terra Papers are inaccurate?


[edit on 23-8-2008 by kshaund]

PS - Came all the way back to the site to post this! I absolutely believe a call out consciously, sub-consciously, verbal or non-verbal has consequences, one of which is a reply - but from whom or what is the unknown (conjuring Phillip). I believe people can create astral beliefs that become hallucinations or whatever to them or others - and for me that explains about half the things people see as manifested uncontrolled 'flingings' of thoughts in the ethers living on in the thought energy that created it.

Guess that takes the discussion to another place entirely - how much power does thought have - ? Obviously lots - is it omnipotent? Hmm always so much more to question I try not to get bogged down in the details... Regards - K.

This is very interesting in deed.

I will have to make time to read this stuff properly.

Thanks
-BO

I read these a few years ago

as others have said, it not only complements other works it brings them together

The only creation theory I have read that does not begin "in media res"

The cosmic collision concept explains "Pangaea"

Yes, certainly makes for a good conversation !

Originally posted by kshaund
Guess that takes the discussion to another place entirely - how much power does thought have - ? Obviously lots - is it omnipotent? Hmm always so much more to question I try not to get bogged down in the details... Regards - K.

Jesus said...

(Matthew 17:20) “And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.”

Believers say that Jesus' words are gospel... yet they do not believe...
And now many say he was not real...

Yoda said

"Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship.”

[Luke:] I can’t believe it.
[Yoda:] That is why you fail.

Many will say Yoda was only a puppet...


We have documented cases of Telekinesis and Psychokinesis... though only small objects... the Russians and the US Air Force have taken it seriously...

The 'people' however ridicule it and delegate it to the paranormal and fringe science

'The Secret' has been revealed...
But even though it is right before their eyes
Only a few even understand it...

And still the 'people' do not believe...

Andrew Carnegie said "Think and Grow Rich" He did...

Edwin C. Barnes discovered how true it is that men really do think and grow rich. His discovery did not come about at one sitting. It came little by little beginning with a burning desire to become a business associate of the great Edison. he did...

Napolean Hill wrote...

"Truly, "THOUGHTS ARE THINGS" and powerful things at that, when they mixed with definiteness of purpose, persistence, and a burning desire for their translation into riches, or other material objects"

(Sounds like Yoda )

And still the 'people' are poor....

Mankind has the ability to break the bonds...
But the 'people' prefer slavery...

Slavery to governments
Slavery to Alien Masters
Slavery to false gods

We talk about the "End Times' constantly... its one "Doomsday" after the next

Yesterday it was the "2000 End of the Millenium" now it "2012 and Nibiru" yet even Sitchin himself says that the earliest possible return is 2900 AD

Still the 'people' do not listen

Mankind has the latent ability to become a "Creator"...

Jesus said...

"Become like unto me", says our Lord Jesus Christ. Be Holy as I am Holy. (Leviticus 11:44)

Yet the 'people' chose not to take that literally... just do a search and see how this simple statement has been twisted

They go through the motions...

We have a saying "you are what you eat" and this holds true when we receive Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament of the Holy Eucharist. We eat Jesus' flesh and we become like Him who is eternal life. Jesus said unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood, you shall not have life within you (John 6:52). He truly desires to impregnate us with his flesh and blood, to purify us so that we become like Him.

Yet even the Priests do not understand

For 2000 years we have disbelieved...

Perhaps we will have to wait another 2000 years before the 'people' will listen

i do have to ask one question though. and do not jump on me as an attacker, i am just asking. this is a story from one person passed down right? i mean is there is any other evidence or records of any of this aside from the original source himself? anything that can confirm any of this in any way?