Gore's Message to Climate Change deniers

hometown.aol.com...

There are a couple of videos here you might want to watch.

Originally posted by jasonjnelson
Why is it that Al gore can say that we are like those who said the world was flat, when they were the majority, like he is. i still don't see him meeting the actual intellectuals who want to debate him. he has no backing.
[edit on 28-3-2008 by jasonjnelson]

Not true. He gathered his information from top scientists, who vetted his film. He has plenty of backing.

To the naysayers: Many of you sound VERY sure that there is no global warming. How can you be so sure? I've never yet seen one explanation (let alone a decent one) by a scientist as to WHY we can be so sure GW doesn't exist. Does anyone here have an explanation? I'd really like to see that.

And who cares what Dick Cheney thinks? He's not a scientist. In fact, I'm not even sure he's a human, but that's another discussion.

I would like to point out to those who think CO2 is the only element to consider in this debate, that there are far more things that come into play with GW.

reply to post by forestlady


There were at least 35 major errors in the film AIT - that doesn't sound like the work of good science to me, that sounds like someone producing a scare story in order to promote an agenda that is making a very wealthy man even wealthier.

I'm very much a sceptic about AGW, and even climate change as something we can affect.
CO2 does not drive climate, it's the other way around.

Now bear in mind that I've been a member of greenpeace for many years, and I'm all for cleaning up the planet and cutting down pollution - but al bore is full of it. If he wants to stop "greenhouse gas" emissions then he should shut up for a while.

On another note, this is a poor attempt to marginalise those who don't buy into his new religion.

He is, in effect, shouting "BURN THE HERETIC"

Guess the world never really changes...

What's the time-span for these supposed solar cycles? If they're natural and unstoppable, aren't we all just going to die when the world overheats?

Sorry if that's a silly question, I just don't know how they work.

reply to post by Perplexed


Firstly, global warming is a misnomer. Everyone else except Americans call it global climate change; which is much more accurate. The theory is that we will be experiencing wild fluctuations in temperature. Overall the planet is warming, but there will also be periods of extreme fluctuations in the climate. So, the sources you listed, which talk about the last year being colder than usual, actually support climate change. I believe they took the AVERAGE of the world's temperatures and put them all together. Only in some places was it colder than normal. Where we live it was one of the warmest winters we've had. And yes, the snows on Mt. Kilimanjaro and the Alps continues to disappear at record rates. This is proof that it wasn't extremely cold everywhere.

One more thing: I don't really see how ONE YEAR of colder than normal temperatures in SOME places could completely eradicate a century of warming. One year is a drop in the bucket and is only 1% of the total temperatures in the past century.

Originally posted by forestlady
reply to post by Perplexed

 

And yes, the snows on Mt. Kilimanjaro and the Alps continues to disappear at record rates. This is proof that it wasn't extremely cold everywhere.

The melting of snow on kilimanjaro is because the de-forestation of the lower area's has changed the micro climate of the immediate area - it's got nothing to do with climate change.
And the alps is another natural cycle - as some glaciers expand, others contract until during exreme warm periods, of which there have been many, all glaciers MAY experience significant losses, but bear in mind that during 3 out of the last 4 ice ages there was lower ice volume than there is today, and this is because we are in a warming period, at the extreme end of an ice age.

But this glacier extinction propaganda is typical of the AGW scam - no-one really even knows how many glaciers exist on the planet. Estimates range from 100,000 to over 160,000.
There is also the fact that the current glacial melt began in the 1820's, long before man could have affected it.

Originally posted by Stumpy1
Remember that hole in the ozone layer that people thought existed? yeah...those people were wrong about that too.....

You believe there's no hole in the ozone layer?

I really don't know whether man is responsible for the current climate change but the arguments here always seem to be about Al Gore's motives, as if he somehow owns the process. Hellooo... the Kyoto Accord began almost 11 years ago and has 174 countries on board. There has been worldwide concern about the effects of man-made Greenhouse gases since the late eighties and it has nothing to do with Al Gore. He was too busy inventing the Internet then to be making up stuff about global warming and greenhouse gases.

It's pointless trying to deny we're going through climate change. Glaciers, permafrost and ice sheets are all receding, and the evil Algore is not making that up. The Russians just claimed a slice of the arctic seabed for chrissakes, in anticipation of being able to float oil rigs in the area soon.

I keep hearing that "it's a cycle". Well if it's a cycle, you can tell us when it will end, right? Because that's what a cycle is - an event with a predictable interval and duration.

The Sun is warming up? No, it's not.



The Sun's activity has been declining for the last 5-6 years and will increase over the next 5-6 years. At that point it will complete it's 23 year cycle and be at around 1980 peak activity levels again.

China makes more greenhouse gases than the US? China has 1.3 Billion people and produce about 60% of the CO2 levels of the US. That means every US citizen creates the same amount of CO2 as SEVEN Chinese citizens. Source

It's time to face up to the facts at the very least. IF mankind is causing global climate change, you can't continue to have one small group of people using the Lion's share of resources and contributing the most to the problem, while the rest of the world (95%) suffers the consequences. A carbon tax would be the least of our worries in that case, it may just come to the point where their only option is to get rid of the parasite..

Rabble!

Rabble rabble!!

... are acting like the fringe groups who think the 1969 moon landing never really happened, or who once believed the world is flat.

That is so not a good comparison. I mean the flat-earth view was mainstream, not fringe.

reply to post by mythatsabigprobe


The one thing I really disagree with is the length of time al bore has been involved in this - according to the Alliance for Climate Protection website, gore has been involved for over 30 years, long before the kyoto joke.
www.climateprotect.org...

And let's not forget that gore has supported in that time many non-environmental issues, such as the use of DU.

Plus he's a liar and a chancer:
www.gargaro.com...

www.realchange.org...

Yes these sites have a bias, but it's all based on truth - which AIT is NOT.

Originally posted by forestlady
reply to post by Perplexed

 

Firstly, global warming is a misnomer. Everyone else except Americans call it global climate change; which is much more accurate. The theory is that we will be experiencing wild fluctuations in temperature. Overall the planet is warming, but there will also be periods of extreme fluctuations in the climate. So, the sources you listed, which talk about the last year being colder than usual, actually support climate change. I believe they took the AVERAGE of the world's temperatures and put them all together. Only in some places was it colder than normal. Where we live it was one of the warmest winters we've had. And yes, the snows on Mt. Kilimanjaro and the Alps continues to disappear at record rates. This is proof that it wasn't extremely cold everywhere.

One more thing: I don't really see how ONE YEAR of colder than normal temperatures in SOME places could completely eradicate a century of warming. One year is a drop in the bucket and is only 1% of the total temperatures in the past century.

Its not in some places... It was the planet.

"Al Gore says those who still doubt that global warming is caused by man" Its right in the article... The God of "Climate Change" still calls it global warming... You new age tree huggers can call it whatever you want. I stills see no evidence or sources for the man made "global warming"/Climate Change" theory. Prove it... Where are the sources based on science? Just don't spew innuendo....

reply to post by stikkinikki


Um, so at the risk of a one liner...Man induces a cow to fart?

This old hog again. I agree that Al Gore's motives may be questionable. I do however strongly believe that climate change (it is true that only Americans seem to still call it Global Warming) IS undoubtedly happening, just because you don't see it in your own own backyard doesn't mean it is true. Will agree, however, that you could argue on whether or not is it man made. Outright denial it is happening is a reach and is more or less ignorant. Most of the evidence against "Gorism" is that it is all part of the natural cycles, so for those of you denying it is happening, others that are on your "side" are not doing the same.

I live in Calgary Alberta, and within driving distance of the Columbian ice fields. They have marked out each decade of precedence since the 50's, and it is definitely shrinking fast. We seem to get less precipitation than we used to, by a long shot, and when it comes it is shorter and stronger. This can be argued as circumstantial, so I won't continue to agree from that point.

From everything I have seen, the climate on Earth is WITHOUT A DOUBT changing. Faster than most natural cycles. I am not going to say it is mans fault though. That is what I believe, but I can see the other side. All I would ask is those that don't believe it is man made, to be open to our side to. Even if there is only a 10% chance it is man made, is your SUV really worth the gamble? That is what we are doing, gambling on it not being us, when there is at the very least a fair chance it is us.

The theory behind the Greenhouse Effect is pretty sound. Whether we have reached that point is debatable. Gore approaching this the wrong way, don't get me wrong, but like some other posters have pointed out, the rest of the world has been aware of GW way before AIC. I remember learning about it in elementary school, over 10 years ago. This is not something new. The message is one that has been around for a while. Gore is just exploiting it and giving a bad name to a good cause.

Whether you believe in it or not, you can not prove either side untrue. This means however, that the "Gories" could be right. Is it worth the risk?

Originally posted by DisgustedOne
Wow!!! Few subjects stir the passions like the global warming subject. No commenter on this thread has displayed much intelligent debate, not because you guys aren't intelligent, but because you all lose your minds when Al makes an appearance. Take a breath, now... breath... ok.

Well, I am no "Gore-ite", I think his only purpose in life is to remind us occasionally that SOMETHING IS HAPPENING. It doesn't mean that it is a manmade something, but it is SOMETHING. I have watched National Geographic vids of the Greenland glacier retreating at an unprecedented rate. Where is it going? By the tons, into the north Atlantic. Another vid of the poles losing ice at a rate unheard of in written history. Where is the ice going? Into the oceans, by the tons. The Northwest Passage is predicted to be open to shipping in a few short years.

I could go on. Who knows what the end result will be. It may stop just as it began, and no one will notice. But I do believe it is a natural cycle. And I don't think global warming is the real issue. The earth had a mighty warm beginning and has been cooling ever since. This warming trend will be short lived, I think. OK, now throw your rocks, I'm ok with that.

That's my 2 sense.

Note how you say "think" based on what evidence? There are those who say its man made who do so due to what they have actually measured. Those are people who are actually workling on the problem as opposed to sitting at home with an opinion.

As usual the GW skeptics and debunkers are US based....nuff said given the lies they have been fed for years....when does the penny drop folks? Or are you so wedded to the seat of your 4x4 you just cannot bring yourself to admit to being misled for years, wrong for even longer and in denial about your own personel contribution to the problem?

WHY does Al Gore place all the blame on us????

Thats like spilling a glass of wine on a couch and blaming someone else...this guy is "polluting" the planet just as much as we are...Why is he talking about people who discredit an UNPROVEN theory...Yeah you see some birds migrating to different places they haven't before and some ice melting...is anyone that surprised by this that they can't handle it? C'mon people...Another scam, another government scare tactic. The seas will rise no matter what we do, ice will always melt on this planet, animals will always die off...Whatever's going to happen is going to happen- despite Al Gore's hero tactics.

I know of not one single person who likes Al Gore- The man is hated...You put him and bush together and you have the ultimate annoying idiot.

Originally posted by Stumpy1

Open your eyes my friend to the truth that is science. Our planet is heating up very very very slowly...hell our whole solar system is and then it will cool back down, this cycle is nothing new and if the earth and our atmosphere didn't sythesize carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide and CFC's back into the scheme of things then the whole planet would have been shrouded in an impenetrable cloud of smog during the industrial revolution. Jump on Al-gores band wagon and have a fun and convoluted ride in the conformation zone. He smiles and lies and is so damned nice that it is almost believable, oh yeah except that 1 in 10 scientists disagree. Remember that hole in the ozone layer that people thought existed? yeah...those people were wrong about that too.....Our planet adapts to sustain life as needed, it always has and always will if It couldn't then the first major volcanoe eruption would have been a permanent effect not a temporary one. And all that "smog" makes the leaves of the rainforest trees so shiny. hehe

I don't know how old you are, whether you're 60 years old and will die in about 10 years, or whether you're 18 and still rebelling against opinions that are out of your scope of understanding.

I'm 33, and by the time I turn 50, the world will be a MUCH SMALLER place. The atmosphere will be severely thinned out, following about 12 years of "black cloud fallout" caused by years of pollution accumulation on behalf of the ignorant industry's methods. The sea level will have risen to submerge many island-countries, and much of upper Canada will be submerged following the disappearance of the arctic ice cap (as far south as James Bay, which is fed by a spring, the only source of clean water to be found).

There's no doubt that compared to the 1970's.. it takes far less time to get sun burnt from the sun's rays on a hot summer day (just a thought), and this trend will just worsen in the years to come.

You may point the finger and say this is based on pure speculation, but with the growing awareness, I wanted to get the message out there so that people can consider the consequences of unabated pollution while our civilization nears the end of its "grace period".

Originally posted by obilesk
reply to post by stikkinikki

 

Um, so at the risk of a one liner...Man induces a cow to fart?

I had a feeling I would get called on that. Cow farts come from cows. Cows are part of our agricultural system. Cows have been bred over the millenia, in a sense humans created cows as they exist today.

Cows did not evolve the ability to fence themselves in, nor did they train humans to feed and water them.

simply Man did NOT induce a cow to fart (for the sake of arguement) but man is responsible for the huge population of farting cows.

Make sense now?

I don't know what your all's problem is with this man (other than he's setting up the U.S. for a carbon emissions tax - but, who cares ... you're paying for a trillion dollar war - bitch about that).

There is NO denying that the earth is warming. Anyone who says otherwise is totally ignorant. So, you want to make this discussion about whether it's man made or whether is a natural cycle? Why? The fact remains.

Why not slow down our pollution rate anyway. Since you've accepted that it's a natural cycle, does that give mankind the right to blown tons of carbon monoxide and other pollutants into the atmosphere every year? I think not. Just because we're the dominate species doesn't mean we can do anything we want. That's like saying, "Well, I'm rich and powerful ... so I can invade other countries." We have to occupy this planet with other things ... like animals, plants, mountains and oceans. And all play a part in each other's habitat.

Is it right that our grandchildren will never get to see a polar bear in real life just because we said, "Ah, Al Gore is an idiot ... global warming is natural." This is the type of self centered attitude that put this country in a quagmire of a war and on the ropes economically. We've been saying, "Who cares ... it doesn't affect me" for WAY too long. Now it's starting to affect you. But, global warming isn't likely to affect you. It'll affect your grandkids. Do you want them to look back a century and say, "Why were people back then so stupid?"

I don't.

Originally posted by tyranny22
I don't know what your all's problem is with this man (other than he's setting up the U.S. for a carbon emissions tax - but, who cares ... you're paying for a trillion dollar war - bitch about that).

There is NO denying that the earth is warming. Anyone who says otherwise is totally ignorant. So, you want to make this discussion about whether it's man made or whether is a natural cycle? Why? The fact remains.

Why not slow down our pollution rate anyway. Since you've accepted that it's a natural cycle, does that give mankind the right to blown tons of carbon monoxide and other pollutants into the atmosphere every year? I think not. Just because we're the dominate species doesn't mean we can do anything we want. That's like saying, "Well, I'm rich and powerful ... so I can invade other countries." We have to occupy this planet with other things ... like animals, plants, mountains and oceans. And all play a part in each other's habitat.

Is it right that our grandchildren will never get to see a polar bear in real life just because we said, "Ah, Al Gore is an idiot ... global warming is natural." This is the type of self centered attitude that put this country in a quagmire of a war and on the ropes economically. We've been saying, "Who cares ... it doesn't affect me" for WAY too long. Now it's starting to affect you. But, global warming isn't likely to affect you. It'll affect your grandkids. Do you want them to look back a century and say, "Why were people back then so stupid?"

I don't.

Post of the day! Very well put. How can we keep passing off the buck to future generations and our own children? We have to get away from this silly personality problem and focus on the real problems that we are responsible for fixing while we are alive. It's a noble pursuit to fight for the future of a planet and its health.

reply to post by ChocoTaco369


...I don't even know what to say. I realized that some people argue that global warming isn't due to man. I can accept that theory, as there is at least an argument behind it.

But anyone who says that the Ice Caps and Ice Packs aren't melting is really just in denial.

Oh well.

reply to post by tyranny22


I hate to be the pessimist, but if GW is true, it will effect OUR lives, major effects will start being felt in the 10-20-30 year span depending on how much it continues to accelerate. Projections made 5 years from now for 10 or 20 years from NOW, are happening already. This is no longer a "for our grandkids" problem. Like it our not, this is going to be our problem if it turns out to be true.