World's 6th Great Extinction Already Happening!!

Don't jump the "no more GM" gun just yet. There is a chance that, when (if?) biotechnology is "domesticated", that it will be a sort of band-aid to this whole mass extinction problem. We are, for the first time ever, on the verge of being able to not only modify, but actually create species.

What does this mean? Well, an explosion of biodiversity. People's gardens will end up as hosts to a tiny ecosystem of endemic, synthetic life forms. We will also be able to rebuild species lost, or to adapt species to pollution.

However, I do agree that Ecology needs to be taught in schools. If I hear one more person say how useless they think wasps or mosquitoes are, I may just have to freak out.

P.S.
We can only hope that this current AGW mania ends so the funds can be put into something useful. Like conservation.

[edit on 27-3-2008 by SlyCM (work)]

Great post forestlady. I agree the evidence that we are in the midst of a great extinction is overwhelming. As as species we have been taking nature for granted and abusing our environment for way too long, and it was bound come back to bite us in the ass at some point.

However, I also agree with what SlyCM said about GM technology up to a point. What we need to remember is that it is a double edged sword, and it can be used for good as well as bad. I have not seen any evidence that GM crops have harmed the environment, but it it possible.

GM is not that much different to selective breeding, in that we can use it to reduce the time to create domesticated crops or animals that have desirable traits which enable us to feed ourselves efficiently. I think they have their place in our over crowded world, but we should be careful not to rely on them entirely.

We have to remember that humans are just another species, and we are related to all other species here on Earth to some degree or other. We share 99% of the genes of a chimpanzee, and something like 70% of the genes of a tomato (if I remember correctly). Transferring a few genes between "unrelated" species is not really as grotesque as it seems as first glance when you take these things into consideration.

As I said before, GM technology can also be used for bad, but that is no reason to deny its potential benefits - it's just a tool, and it's up to us how it's used.

Originally posted by JoeTheThird

Originally posted by forestlady [Note: the last mass extinction caused by a meteor collision was that of the dinosaurs, 65 million years ago.]

Note: There has NEVER been a mass extinction caused by a meteor collision.

I'm going by what the majority of scientists say. Could you provide some sources that say otherwise? Not just something that's a maybe, but something solid? How can you be so sure?

Originally posted by Masisoar
ForestLady, I don't believe you're correct.

Could you tell us why you think so? I've provided over 300 sources for you to read, (all of them reputable) surely you must have some comment on that...I'm not just making this up, I'm going by what scientists who study these things their whole lives say.

forestlady,

Here’s some evidence that meteorites are not alone in causing mass extinctions on Earth in the past.

www.bbc.co.uk...

Originally posted by SlyCM (work)
However, I do agree that Ecology needs to be taught in schools. If I hear one more person say how useless they think wasps or mosquitoes are, I may just have to freak out.

BTW, ecologically, what are humans good for? (aside from now being able to create Frankenstein)

Ecologically, I'd have to say humans are a mistake. Luckily, a correctable mistake, like the dinosaurs were. I think it's amazing how nature as a whole is so self correcting.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
Taking habitat - where people in third world will live?

On the original lands that were taken from them. Most thrid world countries, before being touched by colonialism and imperialism, had agriculture, small sustainable industry, and a modest way of life.

When the cutthroats and bankers moved in with the sword (followed by the dollar) the people of the third world were reduced to a level of poverty unheard of. Their lands were expropriated in the name of commercial cash crop exports, mining, and logistics construction.

There is ample land in this world to sustain the people, provided it is used properly, and provided the primary concern is the welfare of the people, and not the global capital accumulation process.

Are we in the next big extinction, probably. But i believe with the growing scarcities (clean water, space, food) we will destroy ourselves before nature has the chance.

Afterwards, she will renew herself and start again.

forestlady~ i can't believe you've went off the deep end and joined
with the 'the-sky-is-falling' groups...

all the animals, reptiles & other species which are not somehow in humanities food chain, are destined to be under stress and have a 50/50 chance of extinction.
But, there are 100s of species being discovered every year,
so the ultimate dynamic seems to be some sort of equilibrium
between the growth of the human presence and the demise of
'critters'... all the while there's a shifting in the make up of the
non-human groups of creatures..

there may not be 10,000 species of frogs (for example)
but in their place there are turkey farms which provide habitats
for multi-millions of these fowl which would never survive out here
in the larger world of nature,

that line of thought can apply to pigs, sheep, chickens, cows & steers---
just to list some examples of an exponential growth of some species,(possibly to the detriment of those 'vanishing' species)
far beyond what would naturally sustain that number of those types of animals.



your thread, is thought provoking , but it already has way too many 'stars'...?where's loam on this issue?

reply to post by St Udio


Are you seriously proposing that the few dozen species of domesticated animals will balance mass extinctions and that somehow biodiversity is meaningless?

That turkeys so inbred that they can't even walk can replace frogs? houseflies replace bees? I'm trying to understand this POV. It appears flippant and dismissive. In this reduced ecological future, we can go out and sit on a park bench made of plastic and concrete and feed the cockroaches with GM breadcrumbs as they scurry through the dirt.

Here is a great resource website for our ecological crisis. Its a non-for-profit group called One Planet, One Life & The Sixth Mass Extinction. It has a tremendous amount of information on the present Earth environment.

www.oneplanetonelife.com...

Originally posted by St Udio
forestlady~ i can't believe you've went off the deep end and joined
with the 'the-sky-is-falling' groups...

there may not be 10,000 species of frogs (for example)
but in their place there are turkey farms which provide habitats
for multi-millions of these fowl which would never survive out here
in the larger world of nature,

that line of thought can apply to pigs, sheep, chickens, cows & steers---
just to list some examples of an exponential growth of some species,(possibly to the detriment of those 'vanishing' species)
far beyond what would naturally sustain that number of those types of animals.

your thread, is thought provoking

, but it already has way too many 'stars'...?where's loam on this issue?

First of all, I haven't gone off the deep end. Take your blinders off and actually read at least some of the more than 300 resources I provided that all say the same thing. Scientists have been saying this for at least the last 10 years, but no one is reporting on this issue. It's not what I'M saying, it's what most scientists believe, at least 80% of them, if not more. No person who has thought this through would make the statements you've made, especially if they knew anything about the fact that each creature has its place and usefulness in the food chain. Hogs can never replace frogs in their specific work they do to contribute to the food chain. BTW, frogs are becoming extinct as well.

Here's something else: I've been studying the earth's ecology for about 30 years. I've studied it alot. Loam is not the only one who knows something about ecology. (Nothing against Loam, just saying.) Loam also has a thread about species that are going extinct and it was that thread that inspired me to write this one.

And actually Loam gave me a 500 pt. bonus for this thread! Thanks Loam!


[edit on 28/3/08 by forestlady]

The poor animals habitating the globe have to deal with the endless stream of pollutant's pluming from our stone-aged factories...

They have to dodge the billions of thundering tires rolling our automobiles...

Hunters who assasinate them from Cammo'd limo's...

And if that wasn't bad enough... 5th Ave needs their exotic pelts!

Then there are those people that wish to place animals in a pots or plates. Here a bald guy on the 'Glutton Channel', Andrew Zimmerman, roams the globe to further exstinctify their numbers.

Heres the menu:

Mongolian Bat spleens in butter sauce...
Stir fried Yack blood over shishkabob'd deer penises...
Steamed rolled Panda anuses with brown rice over pickled Whale Aorta's...

and the "Everglades special"... Glazed Croc retna's skewered with blanched Armedillo foreskins...

reply to post by gottago



i'm saying the sheer numbers of living, thriving animals & species
falls into a optimal window of life...

too many of one type of living organism will by necessity lead to a reduction or demise of others... and in the bigger picture this is neither good or bad, it is the dynamic of Nature=Gaia.


In a naturalists ideal world, the full spectrum of bio-diverse species would
inhabit every nook-&-cranny of every niche in both the natural world and the artificial environments we construct around ourselves,

but we can't have a total planet wide Nature Preserve, as you seem to hold up as the 'right way'... without trade offs.


zen

Originally posted by Sickscent
Here is a great resource website for our ecological crisis. Its a non-for-profit group called One Planet, One Life & The Sixth Mass Extinction. It has a tremendous amount of information on the present Earth environment.

www.oneplanetonelife.com...

Thanks Sickscent, great site! Here's one piece of info I forgot to mention that is on that site:

"The Facts are scary, the numbers are truly devistating. The earth is currently losing on average one species every 20 minutes. We are losing in every category of living organisms on the planet at a pace that is somewhere between thousands and tens of thousands times faster than the normal background extinction rate. Due to the great diversity of living biology on the planet today, this current extinction spasm is fast becoming the most devistating loss of biodiversity the Earth has ever experienced. It is occuring at a rate that may far surpass anything seen in the geological past. As Peter Ward says, this is "The Father of All Mass Extinctions. There is a good possibility that losses in diversity in the present will surpass anything in the geological past.. Facing that specter could shake the very tenets of conservation."

Every 20 minutes another species becomes extinct; and it's been been going on at this rate for quite awhile.

Smartie, thanks for the link, great article. To clarify, I'm not saying meteorites are the only cause for extinction. But the vast majority of scientists believe the dinosaur extinction was due to a meteorite. This is what most scientists say, but there's always the chance of discovering something else that may change that. But for now, that's the status quo opinion. The article you posted is very good at presenting other possibilities. For now, scientists are only sure about what caused the dinosaur extinction; they really don't know about the others, though.

(edited to add information; nothing was deleted)


[edit on 28/3/08 by forestlady]

It is sad to see animals die, but its a part of life. I for one would rather see my little brother survive than a frog or even a puppy (if I had to make a choice, and in most cases, we do). same goes from my grandpa who doesn't have that much time left on earth. I'd rather him be happy with his wife for 2 more years than lose out on the resources that he needs, to save them for a furry woodland critter. Like I just said on another post, we need to broaden our horizons. Theres planets out there with more life than our I imagine. so when our plenet is no longer habitable, we can go get started on destroying theirs.

After all, humans are a virus right????

Originally posted by forestlady


First of all, I haven't gone off the deep end.
Take your blinders off and actually read at least some of the more than 300 resources I provided that all say the same thing.




Scientists have been saying this for at least the last 10 years, but no one is reporting on this issue.
It's not what I'M saying, it's what most scientists believe, at least 80% of them, if not more.

i read some, looked at others...
my conclusion -
the consensus view is like a environmentalist Gospel,
and in unison (despite differences), these groups are patting each other on the back, hugging one another, in a weird type of ecology Litergy.
Saying- the sky-is-falling !


now, i won't say that some species are being reduced or have become extinct... the DoDo bird was one early example.
but that wasn't because of pollution it was because of buckshot/ or lead poisining (euphanism or wry humor here)

which was almost the way & method of the Plains' Bison & Buffalo...


so, as this 6th massive / global extinction takes place at Glacial speed,
the proprietary advocates run to the roofs and shout "extinction in progress", while the bleeding hearts are soon parted from their money...


tisk-tisk-tisk...


i understand that you are only 'reporting' what a group of
[attuned, aware, compassionate, illuminated] people seem to uniquely able to discern...

the rest of us are troglodites who cannot 'read-the-tea-leaves' properly

[edit on 28-3-2008 by St Udio]

There's really nothing debatable about this. You can record when species die and it's all about the numbers telling us what's happening. You don't have to agree, many people choose to ignore science. But nonetheless, this entire premise is based on hard facts and numbers.

It is not proceeding at a glacial pace; it is really happening faster than any other extinction ever known.

WOW!stared and flaged!I knew things were dyin off but wow, didn realise it was to this extent!F-ing Great Article man!

Drunvalo predicted years ago that species would be leaving earth. He said it is because they sense something bad in the future. www.drunvalo.net

Well we have been destroying our eco system in the name of progress for quite some time now but this is definitely ringing alarm bells for me! All animals depend on a certain bit of the biosphere and if we destroy it we destroy them-simple as that really. The bee thing worries me more than anything-they play a very specialised role in plant pollination and the more plants that die the more creatures die. A casual look around this site will show you that people seem obsessed and even hungry for the idea of the thinning of the human herd (nwo/niburu/global warming/cooling/pole reversal/2012/suvival/revelations etc)-maybe we want to die because we know that we are destroying our planet and everything on it? Maybe not, you can rest assured that the greediest and most selfish will be riding out whatever comes our way in their underground bunkers while the rest of us deal with the mess they have created. Don't beleive me? The carlyle group ( if you don't know who this is please look it up!) now own qinetiq-the private company that owns and runs many of the uk M.o.D BASES AND UNDERGROUND SHELTERS? All our bases belong to u.s!