US warship 'opens fire in Suez' Breaking News

reply to post by dgtempe


Were you there? Didn't think so. Have you forgotten what happened to the Cole? Seems like it.

I said I JUST HEARD IT ON THE NEWS- You got a problem with that???

Is it ok if i post what i just heard?

Watch yourself.

reply to post by dgtempe


You made moral judgment on something about which you have very limited information. If I don't like it, I have a right to say so.

AS DO I, dude.

So how about you calm down and act in a manner conducive to the T&C's of this forum.

You do not have to come out and attack the poster. YOU have your opinion and I have MINE.

That's how it works.

Thank you.

reply to post by dgtempe



Yes, this does seem to be what his trade was. He was problem thinking, "hey a big ship. Loads of people I can sell to them." I don't know though.

I think there is a lot going on we don't know about. So every one is on the edge!!!!

reply to post by Shar
Shar, its just one of those things that will be investigated and hopefully it was true that they in fact did send up a ton of flares and that other boat just didnt obey our rules- maybe he needed to hustle and make some real money that day.
Its a shame if they were innocents. Can you picture an agressive cigarrette sales person?
I dont know, i hope it was an accident.

reply to post by deltaboy


They where moving SURPLUS military equipment. Which would mean to me somebody bought a lot of surplus gear the military was getting read of and was moving it to sell to someone else. N o one even said this load of gear was US military. All that was said is that the ship went to the Middle East with a load of stuff for the US.

Most ship do this. Take a load for one group to a port and then find a load to take to another. An empty ship is a non-paying ship.

As for the shooting? Maybe this crew has never been in the Gulf before and was a little trigger happy and/or worried. Then this boat comes tearing towards them with guys waving stuff. The newbie gets scared and starts shooting. Blame it on the press and all the hype they feed everybody.

reply to post by LLoyd45


You don’t see people in the US racing up to ships in speedboats “trying to sell things”.

So it never happens here.

Originally posted by dismanrc
reply to post by LLoyd45

 

You don’t see people in the US racing up to ships in speedboats “trying to sell things”.

So it never happens here.

different culture, different rules and customs. I imagine when the whole story is told, it will involve Blackwater mercenaries. They seem to enjoy shooting unarmed people, especially since they have immunity from prosecution.

So if a ship, carrying military supplies, orders a boat in a region that has had a history of using small boats as weapons, orders said boat to stop, the boat DOES NOT OBEY ORDERS and continues to approach the ship, and the ship opens fire, it's got to be Blackwater and they shot because they enjoy it? I would say it's a LOT more likely that it was a ship guaranteeing that the VITAL MILITARY SUPPLIES made it to the war zone. The MRAP that was being carried by the ship is used by the US military, NOT Blackwater. Blackwater doesn't have enough armored vehicles to require a ship the size of the Global Patriot to transport them, and they use a different type of vehicle than the MRAP that is produced in South Africa. The Grizzly APC that is used by Blackwater is produced in North Carolina, NOT South Africa. The evidence is pointing at these being MILITARY supplies NOT Blackwater. And Blackwater wouldn't have anything to do with transporting military supplies. If they are escorted, they are escorted by a US Navy ship, with Marines on board her, NOT with a mercenary group.

[edit on 3/25/2008 by Zaphod58]

Originally posted by Zaphod58
So if a ship, carrying military supplies, orders a boat in a region that has had a history of using small boats as weapons, orders said boat to stop, the boat DOES NOT OBEY ORDERS and continues to approach the ship, and the ship opens fire, it's got to be Blackwater and they shot because they enjoy it?

I read nothing in the news release to support a history of attacks by small boats in the region. If there was, please quote it for me. There's is a history of merchants peddling cigarettes and other items though.

There's also no proof that any attempts made to communicate with the boat. That's their story for now, it'll probably change by tomorrow like the title of the article did.

I say Blackwater is probably involved, since it's now being called a privately owned container ship. They frequently serve as security teams for our military as independent contractors. There's thousands of them in Iraq, and I never said it was their equipment.

I would say it's a LOT more likely that it was a ship guaranteeing that the VITAL MILITARY SUPPLIES made it to the war zone. The MRAP that was being carried by the ship is used by the US military, NOT Blackwater. Blackwater doesn't have enough armored vehicles to require a ship the size of the Global Patriot to transport them, and they use a different type of vehicle than the MRAP that is produced in South Africa. The Grizzly APC that is used by Blackwater is produced in North Carolina, NOT South Africa. The evidence is pointing at these being MILITARY supplies NOT Blackwater. And Blackwater wouldn't have anything to do with transporting military supplies.

AS I said before, never did I say it was their equipment.

If they are escorted, they are escorted by a US Navy ship, with Marines on board her, NOT with a mercenary group.

They use mercenaries like Blackwater all the time over there. We don't have enough troops in the region to fulfill all vital roles. I'd be interested in knowing where the vessel was going with the vehicles.

Maybe it's destination was a secret, and that's the reason why they used a privately owned ship with no military escort. We secretly shipped munitions to Englad during WWI prior to our entry into the war using passenger liners, so it's not that big a stretch of the imagination.



[edit on 3/25/08 by LLoyd45]

I shipped through the Suez during the last gulf war on a white ship.
We were boarded despite our attempts to wave off the locals.
They don't take no for an answer. They (A) just wanted to make a buck selling souvineers and trinkets. (B) Wanted to have a look around on deck. (C) Both.

It's a very poor area. Very sparse too. I think they do not get many customers. They need to sell the copy watch and papyrus scrolls. They were nice folk once the edge was off the meeting.

Did these guys ever hear of shooting over the bow?

It's traditional. You fire a warning shot, then go for the kill.

I hate to think they shot the guy I remember. He was a OK, a working slob boardering on desperate. Just trying to do good by his family..

One thing is completely bothering me with this news. Something is missing from here.

Here is the picture of the M/V Global Patriot, the ship, which was in the incident (Well. The news told this.).



Could anyone tell me where the heck the weapons are on this vessel? It's a standard container vessel, nothing more. No onboard weapons was ever built on these ones.

[edit on 25-3-2008 by Dark Crystalline]

reply to post by LLoyd45


The US military does not have NEARLY enough sea lift, OR airlift to haul military supplies around. That is why they contract with privately owned aircraft and ships to move supplies. Just because it's a private contract ship DOES NOT MEAN that it is a mercenary vessel. It means just what it says, it's a privately owned vessel that has been contracted by Sealift Command to haul military supplies. The US Air Force uses the Civil Reserve Fleet, where they can recall civilian planes into military service to haul freight, or troops. The US Navy uses Sealift Command that contracts RO/RO vessels and similar ships that are privately owned by civilian companies to haul supplies such as ammunition, or vehicles, or whatever else is needed.

As for the region, I am speaking of the entire Middle East region, not just Egypt. Egypt has also had times when there were small boats used as weapons, but I don't have time right now to dig it up and find it for you. Transiting through the Suez Canal is the most dangerous time for any vessel. It's in constricted waters, at a very slow speed. If someone WAS going to hit it, that is by far the best time to do so.

[edit on 3/25/2008 by Zaphod58]

reply to post by Dark Crystalline


As I have pointed out repeatedly through the thread, container vessels such as this all carry small arms for self defense. A small arm will kill someone just as dead as a deck mounted gun.

Originally posted by Shadowflux
I wonder how big the egyptian "merchant" barge was because those container ships are huge. I'd imagine they'd be shooting down on the barge from at least fifty feet.

Not sure if it would change anything but I was wondering that as well. I mean this container ship is friggin huge!

However, had they been suicidal terrorists I suppose they wouldln't have stopped their bomb laiden boat after only one of them had been shot.

That's an excellent observation

The answer to that question just might add a whole new spin to this thread!

As many here are justifying this merchants death soley on the fact that the merchant ship was viewed as a "remember Cole" suicide bomber!

I agree if communication was legitimately attempted (other then radio, since they might have only spoke egyptian dialect of arabic), such as warning shots, and other universal means, then firing at the ship is really the only option they had. Again that's IF real attempts at communication was taken.

What happened right after this merchant was shot though?

if im in an american cargo ship, in the suez canal in the MIDDLE EAST, and some little boat comes at me, and ignores every signal i give them to turn away [and i cant believe anyone thinks we would just blatantly open fire without warning] then you better believe im gonna open fire on that vessel and not take any chances getting a hole blown into the side of my ship and killing who knows how many people. its sad that this had to happen, but the simple fact is it was self defense. the middle east is a dangerous place, even in the ocean [uss cole], no risks can be taken. the cole bombing could have been prevented had this same exact action been taken. i personally applaud the sailors for not giving a crap about public opinion and defending themselves. how could they know it was a small merchant vessel? i still think anyone on this forum would have done the exact same thing if they were in that position.

and to clarify, i know il be called a neo-con or something like that here, well i couldnt be any farther from that. this was just common sense on the sailors part.

Trigger happy cowboys say:

OOOPS - I did it again!

I thought you were a terrorist!

Since you are a Muslim - then I guess you want to blow me up!

Daddy says, I must shoot you then!

That is what FEAR - installed by U.S. government - does to you.

Kill'em and let Al'lah sort them out...

[edit on 25/3/08 by Souljah]

I heard now that one was dead and two more are wounded.

I know its a war going on and people are on edge, i realize the pressure our troops must have on them, but isnt it sad that if indeed it was men trying to sell stuff at sea (as its customary in that area) and they acted hyper and pushy just to bring a couple of bucks home?

Now, Americans and the British tend to be laid back, much much more so than other countries. Peoples customs in lots of areas, though, are diffrent and they will not take "no" for an answer. They're very pushy, but i dont mean that in a bad way, i just mean they will give it their all to sell you something. They were probably illiterate, focused only on selling stuff, thought the flares were a "warm hello"...who knows!!

But we just dont know. I mean if they were threatening, i dont blame our ship for blasting them, but what if they werent? Do you see the humanity here? (or lack of)?

Ever been to an Italians house or a hispanics house? They will force feed you if they have to- literally. Its the custom. Do you get what i mean?

reply to post by Souljah


#1 - The first rule of War Club is, you do not talk about War Club.

#2 - The second rule of War Club is, you DO NOT talk about War Club.

#3 - If someone says stop, or shoots you, you must stop, the fight is over.

#4 - Two ships to a fight.

#5 - One fight at a time.

#6 - No guns, no bombs, except for me

#7 - Fights will go on as short as they have to

#8 - If this is your first night at War Club, you must shoot a muslim.